# loose poopy wellness food



## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Ok, so Harry 4.5 m old was on eukanuba puppy, and I thought I needed to switch to something better quality, now it seems like he has loose stools or definatley not very firm. He has even started pooping in his crate overnight. So, I am thinking it is the wellness? Any one else have this experience, or suggestions? Maybe I should switch to a different high quality but I don't know what is exactly in the wellness that could be causing it, so I know what to avoid in a future brand. Was thinking of Canidae, solid gold, innova...
What does everyone out there think? I am really disappointed, I thought I found the one, maybe he just does better with the cheaper stuff?:brick:
wellness info-
The optimal balance of nutrient-rich whole foods to fulfill the unique health needs of your growing puppy.

Natural Source of DHA - Supports Brain Development

Supports Bone & Muscle Development

Smaller Kibble Size for Smaller Mouths

Holistically formulated for the complete health of your developing puppy. Provides whole-body nutritional support during the important foundation year.

ENERGY FOR GROWTH & PLAY

Carbohydrates provide energy. We use oatmeal, barley and brown rice because they're easy to digest and full of nutrients.

DHA - SUPPORTS BRAIN DEVELOPMENT

We guarantee the level of DHA on every bag. Research suggests this important fatty acid helps support cognitive development, vital to learning and training.

STRONG TEETH & BONES

Puppies need the right mineral balance to ensure bones grow at the proper rate. We guarantee our levels of calcium and phosphorus on every bag.

HEALTHY MUSCLE GROWTH

Puppies need increased amounts of protein. We use high quality sources including deboned chicken and salmon meal.

OPTIMAL NUTRIENT ABSORPTION

We ensure excellent nutrient digestibility through our Digestool™ confirmation studies - less nutrients in the stool, means more nutrients stay in the body.

GUARANTEED GREAT TASTE

With satisfaction guaranteed, we use deboned chicken and salmon meal to provide a taste that puppies love.

In addition to our quality protein and wholesome grains, this Super5Mix® recipe includes a unique mix of complementary ingredients for overall wellbeing. We call it our 5 for Life™ Supplement System.

Fruit & Veggie Antioxidant Rainbow

WellCoat® Omega 3 & 6 Mix

Botanical & Herb Blend

Essential Vitamins & Minerals

ActiCoat™ with Live Micro-organisms

Thoughtfully Made with Whole-foods: Deboned Chicken • Oatmeal • Carrots • Spinach • Sweet Potatoes • Apples • Blueberries • Ground Flaxseed

Never Any: Meat By-Products • Wheat • Corn • Soy • Artificial Colors or Flavors • Artificial Preservatives

Product Ingredients | Ingredient Index | Vitamins/Minerals 
Deboned Chicken, Chicken Meal, Oatmeal, Ground Barley, Salmon Meal (a natural source of DHA - Docosahexaenoic Acid), Canola Oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a natural source of Vitamin E), Ground Brown Rice, Tomato Pomace, Rice Bran, Tomatoes, Natural Chicken Flavor, Rye Flour, Carrots, Spinach, Sweet Potatoes, Apples, Blueberries, Ground Millet, Ground Flaxseed, Potassium Chloride, Minerals [Zinc Sulfate, Zinc Proteinate, Iron Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Proteinate, Copper Sulfate, Manganese Proteinate, Manganese Sulfate, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite], Vitamins [Beta-Carotene, Vitamin E Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C), Vitamin A Supplement, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin, Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Folic Acid, Biotin, Vitamin B-12 Supplement], Choline Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Dicalcium Phosphate, Taurine, Mixed Tocopherols (a natural preservative), Chicory Root Extract, Garlic, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Green Tea Extract, Dried Lactobacillus plantarum, Enterococcus faecium, Lactobacillus casei, Lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation products.

This is a naturally preserved product.

Guaranteed Analysis 
Crude Protein Not Less Than 28.0% 
Crude Fat Not Less Than 17.0% 
Crude Fiber Not More Than 5.0% 
Moisture Not More Than 11.0% 
Calcium Not Less Than 1.30% 
Phosphorus Not Less Than 1.00% 
Vitamin E Not Less Than 150 IU/kg 
Omega 6 Fatty Acids Not Less Than 3.0% 
Omega 3 Fatty Acids Not Less Than 1.0% 
Beta Carotene* Not Less Than 5 mg/kg 
DHA* Not Less Than 0.13% 
Lycopene* Not Less Than 0.25 mg/kg 
Taurine* Not Less Than 0.09% 
Total Micro-organisms* Not Less Than 20,000,000 CFU/lb

(L. plantarum, E. faecium, L. casei, L. acidophilus in equal amounts)

* Not recognized as an essential nutrient by the AAFCO Dog Food Nutrient Profiles.

Calories Analysis 
This food contains 3,800 kcal per kilogram or 450 kcal per cup ME (metabolizable energy) on an as fed basis (calculated


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

I've had a lot of trouble with loose stools, too. Still haven't found a 100% solution. But, if you search on this site for thread on this subject you'll find an abundance of threads on the topics. I can tell you though that apparently Canidae changed their formula a couple of years ago, and I've been warned away from it. I guess that there is a lot of variety in what dogs do best on, food wise.

Good luck. I know this is one that affects daily living so much because of all the messy backsides!


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Hi-
what do you feed, I noticed that on the food poll, Innova won, was wondering if that produces good tootsie rollsuke:


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

check this site out http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=feeding_puppies

every dog is different. It is important to switch gradually The best $22 I ever spent was on a consultation (on line) with Sabine at The Dog Food Project. You won't regret it.


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

Did you do a slow, gradual switch over the course of 4-5 days? Or did you just give him a bowl of Wellness? You need to switch them over to a new food very slowly, or it will upset their stomaches-
I have feed Wellness for a couple years now and I love it. My puppies get the puppy food, my adults the adult food.


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## Eva (Jun 20, 2008)

I think that not one food works for all dogs. 
Todd used to eat Orijen but he had soft poop on it and so I switched him to Innova EVO. 
He's had wonderful results with EVO.
I would try it and see if it works for you...if not there are TONS of good foods out there and I'm sure that you'll find one that works well for Harry.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Yes, I did a gradual switch, and he has been on it exclusively for about a week now... not diarreah, but soft or loose blobsuke:
I am leaning towards solid gold or innova


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

you are right Eva ,like I said every dog is different. Orijen and Evo are two of the best foods out there but one of them might not be right for your dog. I would disagree however , I don' think there are many "good" ones out there. After getting my consult. from Sabine I am switching to canned food from Evo. There are many benefits of canned over kibble.


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## bella lugosi (Nov 9, 2008)

*great puppy food.*

We use FROMM"S we love it. Family owned out of Wisconsin. Our 6 month old has been on it for several months and does well. We just got her little brother who is 2 months old. THe breeder was doing soft mixed w/ dry. So we are using the Wellness canned puppy and our little one has blobby poopy. We are going to switch him over to all dry over the course of the next month. I don't know if it is the richness of the canned or bc it's wellness. But I would really check out the FROMM's. Ours is so picky we have 4 flavors and switch them daily.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

bella lugosi said:


> We use FROMM"S we love it. Family owned out of Wisconsin. Our 6 month old has been on it for several months and does well. We just got her little brother who is 2 months old. THe breeder was doing soft mixed w/ dry. So we are using the Wellness canned puppy and our little one has blobby poopy. We are going to switch him over to all dry over the course of the next month. I don't know if it is the richness of the canned or bc it's wellness. But I would really check out the FROMM's. Ours is so picky we have 4 flavors and switch them daily.


The most common cause of soft stools is overfeeding. There generally is no difference between canned food and kibble when it comes to stools. The problems quite often occur when the transition is too quick. For problems with soft stools ,you can add a little canned pumpkin -no salt ,not the type for pie fillings. When transitioning from kibble to canned it helps to start with a lower fat content variety.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

I did not know overfeeding can cause loose stools, but my Harry usually doesn't even finish his food... He also does not get a ton of treats, thanks for the pumpkin info!


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Good thread....I too am trying to switch over. Have tried transitioning several brands and by the time we get to 1/2 - 1/2 the loose poops begin. They are on 2 different foods and I want them both on the same high-quality food. I just bought 2 bags of Fromm brand, salmon and chicken. I am starting on the salmon, 2nd day, 1/4 Fromm to their current food. Bentley is actually on Flagyl for pudding stools that is just not clearing up (even with chicken/rice meals). I didn't have good luck with Wellness (stools)...so this is my last resort and I will definitely take Dave's route and go with a consult. It's a lot less $$$....I am looking for a shelter to donate all this uneaten brands of dog food I have.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Sam375 said:


> I did not know overfeeding can cause loose stools, but my Harry usually doesn't even finish his food... He also does not get a ton of treats, thanks for the pumpkin info!


yeah the pumpkin works well . A number of our members at IPDTA have used it with good results. And the bonus is that it is low calorie and dogs seem to love it. But this is only a temporary remedy. It is also very healthy.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Evye's Mom said:


> Good thread....I too am trying to switch over. Have tried transitioning several brands and by the time we get to 1/2 - 1/2 the loose poops begin. They are on 2 different foods and I want them both on the same high-quality food. I just bought 2 bags of Fromm brand, salmon and chicken. I am starting on the salmon, 2nd day, 1/4 Fromm to their current food. Bentley is actually on Flagyl for pudding stools that is just not clearing up (even with chicken/rice meals). I didn't have good luck with Wellness (stools)...so this is my last resort and I will definitely take Dave's route and go with a consult. It's a lot less $$$....I am looking for a shelter to donate all this uneaten brands of dog food I have.


hi Sharlene ,yeah you might be in need of some help. I would really recommend a consult with Sabine. When you do email her your questionaire just make sure to give all the details ,the more info the better. It's a small price to pay for solving the problem. She is very good with feedback even after the consult. Worth it for sure.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Question....how does one know if they are over feeding. I give the quantity listed on the bag, never more and most times less. Their treats are boiled chicken or part of their daily kibble.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Thanks Dave, I am at the point. Yesterday's delivery was $28.00 so $22 per consult seems modest in comparison. Fromm's brand may be my answer, too soon to tell. But if this doesn't work, I'm stumped and need help. Evye loves pumpkin. Bentley I have to literally take a gob and put it inside on the roof of his mouth.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Evye's Mom said:


> Question....how does one know if they are over feeding. I give the quantity listed on the bag, never more and most times less. Their treats are boiled chicken or part of their daily kibble.


not an expert but basically go with what your vet says .They can tell by their exam whether the dog is overweight. My Molly has to lose a couple of pounds too. Don't forget two pounds for a dog that should weigh about 11 is a fair bit. That's why I have decided to do something about it. Yeah it is so easy to overfeed these little guys just like it is ourselves. Here is an interesting study on FEEDING LESS . http://www.news.cornell.edu/chronicle/02/12.12.02/dog-diet.html


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Thank you for the link.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Here's a question...
Do you go by the bag, as to how much to feed puppy food? Like feed the amount on the bag and if he doesn't eat it, even after the last feeding of the day then take it away? I am thinking that I am not overfeeding my little guy but then again if he is not eating everything in his bowl during his feedings then maybe I am? But I go by what is on the bag....
I fed less today so I guess well see what he produces as a result.
I have only found Fromm at 1 place locally and I like to be able to have at least 2 local retailers to get food from, in cas one is out then I can always get from another.... which is why I am leaning towards solid gold. I was reading on their website that they recommend feeding the adult small breed for puppies rather than the puppy formula....confused about that! Mayb I will start a new thread on that and see what sort of feedback I get.


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

Are you giving him any type of treats or chews?


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

He gets maybe 1 biscuit a day, and he does have a rawhide that lasts him forever to chew on, but he doesn't get a ton of treats or even chew on his rawhide all the time either.


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

Evye's Mom said:


> Good thread....I too am trying to switch over. Have tried transitioning several brands and by the time we get to 1/2 - 1/2 the loose poops begin. They are on 2 different foods and I want them both on the same high-quality food. I just bought 2 bags of Fromm brand, salmon and chicken. I am starting on the salmon, 2nd day, 1/4 Fromm to their current food. Bentley is actually on Flagyl for pudding stools that is just not clearing up (even with chicken/rice meals). I didn't have good luck with Wellness (stools)...so this is my last resort and I will definitely take Dave's route and go with a consult. It's a lot less $$$....*I am looking for a shelter to donate all this uneaten brands of dog food I have.*




I went though this with Missy...the loose stools and putting her on Flagyl. Start reading all the ingredients in the dog food. With Missy is was the oats and corn that caused the loose stools all dogs are different, but something for you to think about.

With Wellness some of it has oats some does not. If I keep Missy away from those two things (corn and oats) I never have a problem with the loose stools. I just have to really read the ingredients in all the dog food and treats


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

HHHM, so this morning I am confused...
He did not have a mess in his cage overnight:whoo: And he just went potty and it was normal although not the usual size. Well, I did do a few things different yesterday...not sure which one helped...
I blocked off his crate making it smaller, and eventhough I was feeding what the bag stated I gave him less and what he did not finish I picked up the bowl and did not feed him anymore after 3 oclock. 
someone had stated that the pudding pies are a result of OVERFEEDING.
So, eventhough the bag states feed x amount, don't think that he absolutely needs to eat that amount? I guess to be continued...

And, of course some dogs would be bothered by certain incredients, but maybe not mine?


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Sam375 said:


> Here's a question...
> Do you go by the bag, as to how much to feed puppy food? Like feed the amount on the bag and if he doesn't eat it, even after the last feeding of the day then take it away? I am thinking that I am not overfeeding my little guy but then again if he is not eating everything in his bowl during his feedings then maybe I am? But I go by what is on the bag....
> I fed less today so I guess well see what he produces as a result.
> I have only found Fromm at 1 place locally and I like to be able to have at least 2 local retailers to get food from, in cas one is out then I can always get from another.... which is why I am leaning towards solid gold. I was reading on their website that they recommend feeding the adult small breed for puppies rather than the puppy formula....confused about that! Mayb I will start a new thread on that and see what sort of feedback I get.


 I would try to figure out how many calories he needs per day. And then go from there. Divide it by two if you are feeding twice daily. Subtract any treats in this equation. The problem arises when you free feed and they do not finish the bowl. It gets difficult to calculate. That is one reason why I am switching to canned food. Generally they devour the whole thing at once and there is not food left. Therefore it is easier to figure measurement out. Besides ,canned is healthier. I would recommend a consultation. For 22 dollars ,it is well worth it.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Sam375 said:


> someone had stated that the pudding pies are a result of OVERFEEDING.
> So, eventhough the bag states feed x amount, don't think that he absolutely needs to eat that amount? I guess to be continued...


I questioned this on the Forum a couple months ago, (don't remember the name of the thread,) and the consensus was that everyone that replied to me --and there were several!-- fed their dogs up to 1/2 LESS than the recommended feeding amount listed on the bags.

I am happy if Tucker (adult) eats 1/2 cup kibble a day. He still goes without eating hardly anything periodically, though, which I sure wish I could figure out.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Okay, I found the thread...I'll try to add it here.

http://http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=7094&highlight=eating


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Oh, wow...very good information. I am no doubt over feeding then.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

When you think about it, of course they are going to recommend higher amounts than neede/should....so you have to buy more!
I was reading and they are saying 1 1/4 on my bag. I gave him half a cup this am, and may only give a handful this pm, here I was ready to give up and switch and it may NOT be the food but the AMOUNT? Very interesting for all those having pudding pies maybe we are unnecessarily switching foods and giving meds unecessarily!


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

*poop scoop*

So here is the latest poop scoop...
He went again, and it was not as firm as the first one from this am, but it wasn't real sloppy.... maybe I should just take pics and post emuke:ound:

So, anyway I was so hopeful after this am and now not as much, but I am thinking of giving it another day of the wellness brand and see how that goes. He defianetly has not gone poop as much today as the other days, definately leading me to believe he was over fed, especially since it is a higher quality food then he shouldn't need to eat as much, right? Or poop as much...


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

The thing about canned food that bothers me, it is soft. I would be afraid of dental problems.


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Oh! Another thing, the feeding amount on the dog food package has always concerned me because, it said feed x amount and there is no way that Dexter would eat all that food every day. There are some days, that Dexter will only eat about 1/2 cup day x 2 and this amount is not even near the recommended amount suggested.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

meet too, I would think their teeth would fall out...


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

HavaneseSoon said:


> The thing about canned food that bothers me, it is soft. I would be afraid of dental problems.


actually canned food results in less tartar probems. It is the sticky sugar like things in kibble that stick to the teeeth that cause problems.


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## TShot (Jan 16, 2009)

Petunia started out on Eukanuba Puppy Formula. No problems, but she didn't seem to like it. She is now 15 weeks old and 6 lbs, two weeks ago I made the switch to Wellness Puppy, the first few days mixing with the Eukanuba, I'm now feeding her all Wellness. She does eat about a 1/3 less then the feeding chart on the bag suggests. She is doing perfect on it, she seems to like it better and eats it quicker. Her poop is very firm and dry, in fact she has never had loose stool. Every now and then I'll boil a chicken breast chop it up into small pieces and mix a small amount in with the Wellness. Throughout the day she get 4-6 blueberries, several reward treats and about 6 Natural Choice Crunchy Treats. No loose poop.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Wow- Petunia seems to have perfect poo, you shoudl be so proud!ound:

why do you supplement with the chicken since the wellness is chicken first ingredient? Just being extra good to her?
Your very fortunate, glad to hear someone out there is doing good on the wellness...


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Sam, how did it go today? I tried feeding a little today less and they definitely ate ravenously. Can't report on a firmer poop yet. It was still soft but definitely turd shaped. They are still 1/2, 1/2 new food/old food. I am taking the transition very, very slowly.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

davetgabby said:


> actually canned food results in less tartar probems. It is the sticky sugar like things in kibble that stick to the teeeth that cause problems.


Dave, you are such a wonderful source of good information. Please....keep it coming, especially us newbies. My felines were on 95% wet food, grazed their dry food. They lived 12 years, 15-3/4, and 17-1/2. Two of the 3 had to have their teeth cleaned once each. One NEVER did, never needed to (the 17-1/2 y/o). Any hints on what wet food. I know this goes along with a personal consult but is there one that was recommended over another?


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

P.S. They did get their teeth brushed at least once a week. Good weeks, twice.

Sorry, it's a Hav forum but I just had to show 2 of the 3... (doing a picture search for the flame point). Posting this, makes me wonder, do we ever truly get over our losses? One from hypercalcemia, one from kidney disease and one from pulmonary fibrosis (as a result of heart worms). A TOTALLY indoor cat, never stepped outside...so just FYI, if you think felines don't need heart worm preventative...tsk...get em' on it. And they have thicker hair than our Havs. What are the odds of an infected mosquito getting into the house and infecting a thick, long-haired pet...it happens !! Imagine the risk for indoor-outdoor felines. 

Apologize for the drama....I wished they had a forum such as this BEFORE this happened.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Wow, such beautiful kitties, and the bedding looks gorgeous too! My husb LOVES long haired cats, which is funny because you think most men prefer dogs...
I was ready to run out and switch and so glad I didn't and just drastically cut back instead. I am feeding 1/2 cup in the morn and one handful around 4-5. He of course as a result is pooping MUCH less still today, and the same thing happened today as yesterday... a tootsie roll in the morn and a little less firm the rest of the day, but he has also STOPPED doin the butt scoot on my tile floor. Which would leave a wet streak, nice huh?uke: So, I still have enough food for the rest of the week and I will probably wait until sunday to evaluate whether going to go get the solid gold food.

He does seem like he is hungry in the eve, he follows me around more, staring at me, wondering why he doesn't feel stuffed to the hill I guess. But I am thinking to give him some time to adjust for the week and then see if I can add a little more to it.

I should also add that when I was feeding the original amount that he had a LOT of gas and that has cut back also, and I would hear gut noises too, and that has cut back too.

Maybe you should consider cutting back just a little more? I figured it would be easier for me to add rather than take away.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Happy to report Bentley had a tootsie roll stool. A soft one, but its much better than the pudding pile. I have reduced their feedings somewhat (not drastically) but when they do get their meal, they have been eating it right up. 

The only thing that confuses me is Fromm's recommends 1/2 cup for 5 lbs and 1-1/4 for 15 lbs, much less compared to other brands. So I am figuring 1/2 c daily for Bentley and maybe 3/4 c for Evye, minus a few pieces of kibble. But makes it hard to transition. For those using Fromm's, can you share how much per day and wt of your pup.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

someone had said about trying to figure out the dogs calorie needs. the Fromm feeding guideline sounds more accurate than the wellness. Harry is around 7 lbs and am give the 1/2c in the am, and a handful in the pm. He had a not perfect one again last night late, but it was a shape, but not a perfect solid tootsie roll. So, he is NOT consistent, I still don't know if I should switch him.

Maybe do the 1/2 c for the one and do 1c for the other and see what chocolate making you get from that?

I'm not sure if what chocolate Harry is producing is good enough or if I should have mostly tootsie rolls...


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Maybe start a new thread with how much do you feed, what is the weight of your dog, and what brand of kibble?


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## sweetlotus (Nov 26, 2008)

I didn't want to post earlier until I was sure but I think Wellness caused loose stools in Mochi. It was only towards the end of the bag that this occurred though. Once I switched her over the Merrick Puppy Plate, her stools are nice and firm again - thank goodness. It was getting to be a chore to clean up. So yes, as an answer to your original post, loose stools may be cause by Wellness. However, other owners seem to get such good results from this brand!


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

sweetlotus-
Were you feeding the recommended amount on the wellness bag, or less than what was on the bag, if so how much?


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## sweetlotus (Nov 26, 2008)

I was giving her about 1/4 cup 3 times a day. However, even thought she no longer has poopie butt, a new problem cropped up today.... she is eating her poop!!!! Soooooo GROSS.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Welcome to the wonderful world of poop eaters. I have one too. It stops grossing you out after a while. So many good suggestions on the forum to discourage poo eaters. None were effective for me...I just try to grab it as quickly as I can. They get very creative when they learned their prized possession will be snatched up...Evye turns in circles as she is pooping so she gets first dabs. She does not eat Bentley's thank goodness or vise versa.


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## sweetlotus (Nov 26, 2008)

Sharlene, please don't welcome me into this world... I want to try to get out of it as fast as I can!! I will douse her whole roll in tobasco sauce if I have to. I am so shocked b/c she didn't go near her poop at all until today. 

Evye sounds so cute but it's also so gross that I don't know whether to laugh or to cry!


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

I think I have you all beat....
I just caught Harry coming out of the woods, with borown in his beard and it smells like SKUNK, licking his lips! He must've been eating skunk poouke::frusty:ound:

Now, which would you rather have?

I have heard that the pills you can buy either online or at the store do help with the poo eating, I have also heard many reasons as to why they do it and I am not sure how accurate all the theories are.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Try both, laugh and cry. Imagine my amazement when I first saw her do her poop, went back to clean it up and it was gone. Thought I misjudged her spot. When it kept happening...saw the squat but not the result, I finally figured out where it went. So many of us here have coprophagia issues. Some have tried pineapple, pineapple juice, over-the-counter poo pills, I think tomoto juice and some just outgrow it and lose interest....so many good threads on this topic. Hopefully you can find a solution that works...in the meantime, know that you are not alone....I'm just trying to out smart her in the clean up.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Sam375 said:


> I think I have you all beat....
> I just caught Harry coming out of the woods, with borown in his beard and it smells like SKUNK, licking his lips! He must've been eating skunk poouke::frusty:ound:


Harry keeps us laughing.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Mochi's Mom....we just had a successful !!!!  Potty call. I had bag in hand ready to snatch and she just turned around and walked away from it. I do notice she is doing it less and less. Hopefully I am one of the lucky ones and she will outgrow it....God knows I've tried everything else. Yes !!! I feel very grateful its not skunk poo. :brushteeth:


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## sweetlotus (Nov 26, 2008)

Sharlene, how old is Evye now? I am very very happy for you!


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Evye is 5 months old. Mochi is an absolute doll...how old is she?


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Sharlene, 

Have you tried the pineapple trick to get your pup to stop eating the poop? 

Dexter has always had formed stools and we must of changed his food at least 4 times already. Oh! Sometimes, I give Dexter treats (Cheese) to practice doing tricks.....still trying to do the rollover.............Anyway, cheese can be constipating, so maybe that is why the stools are good looking. 

Oh! Dexter did eat some poop once! It wasn't his own though.....NASTY BOY! It was a prized find, Dexter would not let me take it away....of course, here I am trying to take away SOFT stool away from Dexter with my bare hands!


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## sweetlotus (Nov 26, 2008)

Honestly, never in my life did I think I would touch poop with my bare hands. In a few short weeks, not only have I touched poop, I have also stepped on it too. The things we are willing to put w/ for our furkids...

Oh, Mochi is 4 months old. I just updated w/ some pictures


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

[QUOTE....of course, here I am trying to take away SOFT stool away from Dexter with my bare hands![/QUOTE]

I know the feeling :frusty:

(of what it's like poo picking up with bare hands, yes stepped on it too). Thank goodness I have had kids/grandkids to prepare me for this.


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

I haven't figure out the food amounts yet! It is very confusing and Dexter never eats the amount the bag says. I gave him 1/3 cup this morning and more than 1/2 of it is still left in the bowl. 

Dexter eats what he wants and then walks away. I only feed Dexter in the morning and at night.


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Sharlene, the reason Fromm's is less than other bags is because it's a higher quality food and has less fillers than the other foods. I feed Fromm's but actually give less than on the bag for Kubrick (he's 14.5lbs and gets about a cup a day) as he'll stop eating it after 1 cup anyway. He also gets 1/2 tablespoon of wet food with dinner and some treats during the day. Hitchcock gets the recommended amount for his weight (he's almost 7lbs and gets 2/3 cup per day) because he's a puppy and still growing, plus he eats it all and has perfect stools (way better than Kubrick most days), so he's doing well on that amount. I would start with feeding what it says on the bag and see how your pups do and then go down if you feel like it would be best for them. I wouldn't go OVER the amount, though!


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Thanks Lina. I am transitioning slowly and it gets tricky. The old brand calls for 1 cup a day and Fromm's 1/2 cup for 5 lbs. The balancing act is confusing. Today they each are getting 1/3 cup of Fromm's and a wee less than 2/3 cup their prevoius, and held out some of that for training treats. I will keep them on 1/3 c for a few more days because after that the next step will be just about the day's quota. Evye's stools are for the most part fine but Bentley's are still loose...after pumpkin, kaopectate, rice and 5 days of Flagyl.

One more question, I was giving Evye 1/2 pump of Salmon oil but with the Salmon A La Veg, I wonder if I should continue...do you feed Fromm's Salmon or Chicken? Or other?


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Well this am he had more of a tootsie but the color is way off, like a blond....hmmm, guess I still need to give it til the weekend to figure out whats going on, wonder is the skunk poo for some reason made it the white color, would think not though....


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

He was bad this am, so it doesn't llok good for the wellness....


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Sorry Sam...you have given it a good go. Sorry to hear Harry is still having loose stools. Bentley is too but they are firming up, not enough to my liking though. Two more days he will be entirely on Fromm, so we'll see how that goes.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

*check this list out...*

whole dog food journal 2009 list
http://www.geocities.com/rottndobie/wholedogjournal2.html


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

I would completely stop all treats, bones, buscuits and chewies for at least 3 days before you switch his food again. If it's the treats, you could switch his food and still have the same problem. Let him be on just kibble to see if it's really the food.
Another suggesting if you do decide to switch his food, is to maybe try a different protein source. If he is on a chicken based kibble now, maybe try lamb or salmon-
I am sorry you are having poop problems! 
Thats why I love Wellness, it it working so well for all my dogs! But I know it may not be the right food for every dog.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Evye's Mom said:


> Dave, you are such a wonderful source of good information. Please....keep it coming, especially us newbies. My felines were on 95% wet food, grazed their dry food. They lived 12 years, 15-3/4, and 17-1/2. Two of the 3 had to have their teeth cleaned once each. One NEVER did, never needed to (the 17-1/2 y/o). Any hints on what wet food. I know this goes along with a personal consult but is there one that was recommended over another?


I will let Sabine recommend a food for you. Like I said every dog is different. Canned is definitely better overall. You are right about giving canned to cats. Sabine stronly recommends it over kibble. The problem with cats is that they don't get enough water with the kibble and they can develope kidney stones because of this. There has been a strong recommendation from vets to get cats on canned because of this issue. Unfortunately dogs have not been encouraged to do likewise. Sabine says that in the last number of years ,since kibble has become the norm, that dogs and cats have suffered more urinary and such type of problems. Even with dogs they don't instinctively know enough to drink with kibble . Because kibble is so dry it causes problems with flushing the waste products away and causes the kidneys to overwork. That is why ,if you do decide to go with kibble that she recommends moistening it. Canned food has unfortunately fallen out of favour because of the expense , it is not as easy to prepare and keep etc etc. Too bad.


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## kelrobin (Jan 21, 2008)

Sam (and Sharlene), 
Sorry you are having so much trouble with the poos! I have been very lucky with Jackson. I tried a few different ones until I settled on dry Merrick Puppy Plate, and now he is on Adult Merrick and we have never had loose stools. He is 14.7 pounds and has a 1/2 cup put out in the AM (dry), and then whatever is left over and any extra needed for another 1/2 at night. Then I mix about 1/6 of a can of Merrick wet on top of that. There are lots of canned Merrick flavors, and the only one that seemed to give him a little trouble was the Turducken. He has always been a good eater, and the 1 - 1 1/4 cup guideline came from his breeder. I have always avoided anything with corn, and I have also noticed that he will not drink water that has been sitting all day . . . he wants fresh cold water from the fridge (picky little bugger).

We tried Canidae (then some questionable reports came out), and he picked the blue bits out of the Blue food. It takes some time to find it, but keep trying . . . I just hope he doesn't have some weird allergy. There are plenty of them out there!


> In a few short weeks, not only have I touched poop, I have also stepped on it too.


And I would like a nickel for every time I have stepped in dog poo in my lifetime (I could retire to the islands!)


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

He doesn't really get much treats, and today was the WORSe. .. dropping off a chocolate sample tomorrow at the vet, then I think I will probably switch to solid gold pending sample results, I will check protein source first. thanks


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

*switching to solid gold*

Today was better, but going tomorrow to Petco ($5. coupon) for the solid gold food, I guess I'll get the wee bit. I emailed thema bout coupons and they said they don't make coupons, sucks.
I did get canidae coupons in the mail today, but I am leary since there have been bad posts about it. I wish the wellness was good for him, I really liked the ingredients. I think the dog food project, and the whole dog food list, along with the forums poll is really helpful in deciding, even petco's site has ratings next to the foods...


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## PepperToast (Oct 27, 2008)

Poor little puppy (and you!). How frustrating!!!!!

Are you determined to feed kibble or would you consider other types of food? 

Meeka


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

What are you suggesting? I like the convenience of kibble, but would consider other options if needed.
Thanks


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## PepperToast (Oct 27, 2008)

Well, what I might suggest isn't nearly as convenient but... after you are used to it, it is no trouble at all. I am talking about feeding a raw food diet... Something that you definitely have to research before you start. The only reason that I would suggest it in this case is it is very very easy to eliminate food as a cause for soft stool. Because you have complete control over what ingredients they eat. Plus an added bonus is raw food poops are, for the most part, very firm and, well, powdery. 

You can't just start him off right away. You need to research how to do it and prepare his gut with probiotics, especially if he is having soft poop but it is a very good way to feed.

But before that, have you considered putting him back on the food he was successfully eating up until you decided to switch and let his system stabilize before you try another new food? That way you can know if it is food related or potentially another issue. Just a thought. I know how stressful this type of thing is.

Meeka


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

That is a good thought, to go back to his original food. Maybe What I will do is try the solid gold, and then if that doesn't work go back to his old food. I would really hate to put him on the old food, I didn't like the ingredients. It was euk puppy. But that is maybe a good idea for after the solid gold. I was reading some one said oatmeal and corn use to do it for their dog and the wellness has oatmeal. Another said that chicken did it, and wellness has chicken. 
I also heard lamb & rice formulas are good for sensitive tummies, and that puppies have sensitive tummies. So, anyway I will consider the raw if the standard kibble doesn't work. Was even thinking a grain free kibble/ meat based only kibble or even go straight canned food might end up being a better option than the euk puppy. I find it amazing that the lesser quality (in comparison to wellness) is the food giving him problems.
I think I would do Raw as a last resort, it sounds like a great way to feed your dog though!

You gave me a good idea to store away, thanks.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Well, I got the wee bits solid gold today, wish me luck! Still concerned over how it doesn't say puppy, the puppy formula is lamb, so I wonder if it would be gentler on tummy rather than bison based protein....hmmm


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## swtxsweetie (May 16, 2008)

wee bit solid gold is not bad 

i am feeding momo evo chicken small bits now and he has loose stools with the red meat one. it's so hard to figure out what's good for them. good luck!


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Wishing you luck too. I know it was hard for me to overcome my apprehension feeding puppies adult food. I received enough reassurance on the forum and from others that puppies don't necessarily need puppy formula and do well on adult food. Wishing you tootsie roll results. :whoo: Bentley's are firming up somewhat. At least he is making soft tooties.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Ok, so I have been ever soooo slowly switching food, and I thinkit is ever soooo slowly working. Keep your fingers crossed that he continues to improve.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

I sure will keep my fingers crossed it is a successful switch. I understand the frustration.

I've been thinking of Harry and wondering how he is doing. Other than loose poopy, what's going on with Harry these days?


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

I still have like 1/4 of a bag of wellness mixed with the solid gold to go through until he is straight solid gold. It is taking forever, especially since I cut back on the amount of food I also was feeding. I did notice that after I cut back on his wellness food he got more streamlined and he seems to wander around watching me or searching the floor for crumbs. I am thinking that once he is on straight solid gold then I will feed the recommended amount and then go up or down based on his out put of feces. I do not want to go back to the pudding pies I had before. It does bother me that he got leaner as a result of me cutting back on the amount since I believe that was one part of the problem.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Awwww....look at Harry. He is such a cute little guy. Way too cute for ugly little poops. Sounds like you are on the right track....Poops in this house are an ugly topic. Give Harry big HAV HUGS from me. I am also becoming an advocate for probiotics and digestive enzymes for these loose poopy problems.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

BTW....Harry does not look to overly lean in photos, which looks can be conceiving. Go by what the experienced folks say on this wonderful forum based on their body frame. You are supposed to be able to feel the ribs, but not overly prominent. If you cannot feel them you have an overweight pupster.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Hi thanks!
You can feel his ribs, and down his spine, and there is that bone in the front middle of his chest that sticks out. I think he may be a little underweight but not by much, he's usually pretty peppy so it's not like he's starving to the point of weakness or anything. I have been giving him just over 1/2 cup a day.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Sam375 said:


> Hi thanks!
> You can feel his ribs, and down his spine, and there is that bone in the front middle of his chest that sticks out. I think he may be a little underweight but not by much, he's usually pretty peppy so it's not like he's starving to the point of weakness or anything. I have been giving him just over 1/2 cup a day.


Hmmm....I can feel Evye's ribs left and right side with careful palpation. I cannot feel the sternum (bone in between the ribs) unless I use heavy compression nor can I feel her spine with any clarity. There is a happy medium. Maybe get your vet's opinion as far as thin, overweight or normal.


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I think he's probably a little thin. Although he has been boney since the day I got him! I upped his food this morning to 3/4 cups. I'll see what he produces as a result, but the old wellness food along with the new is in their. I can't wait to be rid of the old and onto the new, I hate being in transisiton.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

I know what you mean about the transition, especially when the feeding guidelines are so different. Evye is finally transitioned 100% and Bentley had to back to crap food (for now...its what works).


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Ok, so all the wellness was finished up yesterday. Today starts the real test of tootsies, from today on it'll be the wee bits solid gold exclusively, to be continued.....


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

I missed this thread, but I am a big fan of Orijens. I just switched from Evo and the pups love it!


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## PepperToast (Oct 27, 2008)

:cheer2: GO HARRY GO :cheer2:

We await the good poop news!


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Well, I am sort of ho hum ... His first poo of the day is perfect but there after not so good, so I went from one cup to 3/4 cup to now today 1/2 cup of the solid gold wee bit food. Of course I caught him eating his poo last night. I think he is hungry but I feed less and that seems to help with the pudding pies:frusty:but now hes hungry:frusty:


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## bamagirl92 (Jun 6, 2009)

We had an excellent Natura Rep here that recommended Innova to me. We use Innova Puppy, the Evo line has much more Protein (43% or so) whereas the Innova Puppy is 28%. She said the Evo was too much protein for our puppies now and to start with the Innova line. My 8 month puppy has done excellent on it and we slowly transitioned Stella our new Hav to it and she has done great so far.

So for puppies I would say the Evo is too much protein b/c my breeder said anything above 28% is too much. Check out Innova.


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