# Listen to the intuition of kids!! (fish related)



## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

A few days ago I did a major aquascape in my aquarium, and then went to add some new fish and shrimp yesterday. When I opened the aquarium to start the drip-acclimitization, I felt the water and it was coooold... it was 16C by the thermometer .. yikes! I realized that my heater was unplugged! Brrrr! I plugged it in and slowly warmed it up. Got it back warming, finished acclimitizing the fish and let them in.

This morning my 7yo was looking at the pleco (weird typing that out..back in the day typing it out was a myth that it would kill it), and commented that it looked pale and was going to die. I brushed it off. After all - it's a yellow blue-eyed bristlenose pleco. Not exactly the brightest of fish. But, she was right. This afternoon it was gone. I only had it for 2 years, so I am sad for it - but I guess it just had too much stress with the aquascapring, temperature fluctuations and new tankmates. I feel so bad for him  (I did my water tests and they were fine.. I did a 25% WC just to be safe though).

On the other hand, this is my first time keeping shrimp, so it'll be a new experience 

(In this tank I now have 15 harlequin rasboras, 6 kuhli loaches, and 6 red cherry shrimp). Medium planted under med-low light. I need to find more plants though.. I love having the bottom covered by some form of grass, but need to see if I can find a moss or something that would thrive on lower light.


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## Vartina Ancrum (Oct 10, 2019)

I enjoyed maintaining an aquarium for several years then I got too lazy. They are so calming and relaxing.


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

I love aquariums so much - I currently just have the one. But sadly the only place in my house that can hold the large ones I really want (I want oscars, my kiddo really wants goldfish and those require large tanks) is in the basement and since we spend 95% of our time upstairs, I just don’t feel like it’s worth it.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Wulfin said:


> A few days ago I did a major aquascape in my aquarium, and then went to add some new fish and shrimp yesterday. When I opened the aquarium to start the drip-acclimitization, I felt the water and it was coooold... it was 16C by the thermometer .. yikes! I realized that my heater was unplugged! Brrrr! I plugged it in and slowly warmed it up. Got it back warming, finished acclimitizing the fish and let them in.
> 
> This morning my 7yo was looking at the pleco (weird typing that out..back in the day typing it out was a myth that it would kill it), and commented that it looked pale and was going to die. I brushed it off. After all - it's a yellow blue-eyed bristlenose pleco. Not exactly the brightest of fish. But, she was right. This afternoon it was gone. I only had it for 2 years, so I am sad for it - but I guess it just had too much stress with the aquascapring, temperature fluctuations and new tankmates. I feel so bad for him  (I did my water tests and they were fine.. I did a 25% WC just to be safe though).
> 
> ...


Look into Marsilea hirsuta for your ground cover:

https://www.floridaaquatic.com/lysimachia-nummularia-aurea

(I know the link above says a different plant, but it GOES to the right page)


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

krandall said:


> Look into Marsilea hirsuta for your ground cover:
> 
> https://www.floridaaquatic.com/lysimachia-nummularia-aurea
> 
> (I know the link above says a different plant, but it GOES to the right page)


That looks perfect.. everything I was looking at (including mosses) mostly needed CO2 supplementation and I'm doing a low-tech tank.  Now to see if I can track this down from one of my suppliers!

Tropica has it, so if I can't find it from my LFS as a regular plant, at least I can get it that way


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Wulfin said:


> That looks perfect.. everything I was looking at (including mosses) mostly needed CO2 supplementation and I'm doing a low-tech tank.  Now to see if I can track this down from one of my suppliers!
> 
> Tropica has it, so if I can't find it from my LFS as a regular plant, at least I can get it that way


Tissue Culture is really the way to go with this anyway... It's WAY easier than trying to pick it out of rock wool!


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

I hate rock wool. So so so much.


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Fish and kids reminds me of an early childhood memory of mine. I don't remember how old I was but I was probably not old enough for kindergarten yet so I was quite young. Mom had a goldfish bowl. I can remember dipping my hand into the bowl and grabbing goldfish. They were so soft and smooth! Felt so good to me to touch them, but obviously not so good to the fish. After I realized they weren't doing well, I hid them behind the sofa. Mom always blamed it on the cat. I didn't fess up until I reached adulthood!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> Fish and kids reminds me of an early childhood memory of mine. I don't remember how old I was but I was probably not old enough for kindergarten yet so I was quite young. Mom had a goldfish bowl. I can remember dipping my hand into the bowl and grabbing goldfish. They were so soft and smooth! Felt so good to me to touch them, but obviously not so good to the fish. After I realized they weren't doing well, I hid them behind the sofa. Mom always blamed it on the cat. I didn't fess up until I reached adulthood!


LOL! I've heard more than one story about kids waking up in the morning VERY upset to find that a prized pet fish didn't do very well after it got "taken to bed" for the night!


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

OMG, that is hilarious.....

.. my kiddo has been asking for goldfish for a year. We had some at her swimming class (that were not kept awesomely), but she loved them so much. After a year of asking..I'm starting to price out a tank and all that goes with it. The pricetag hurts. LOL. Might have to put her off again for another year or ten.


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

(never wanting to be left out of the conversation ...)

I have an aquarium DVD. It's very relaxing ...


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Wulfin said:


> OMG, that is hilarious.....
> 
> .. my kiddo has been asking for goldfish for a year. We had some at her swimming class (that were not kept awesomely), but she loved them so much. After a year of asking..I'm starting to price out a tank and all that goes with it. The pricetag hurts. LOL. Might have to put her off again for another year or ten.


Gosh, as kids we just had a fish bowl. I think we had marbles in the bottom, some kind of aquatic plant and ceramic treasure chest on the bottom. No filter or aerator. Had to clean it frequently but the fish made it. (once I was older anyway)


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> Gosh, as kids we just had a fish bowl. I think we had marbles in the bottom, some kind of aquatic plant and ceramic treasure chest on the bottom. No filter or aerator. Had to clean it frequently but the fish made it. (once I was older anyway)


My only fish story involves me figuring out how gross it is to clean a fish bowl. Or maybe it just seemed gross to me? I bought a fish bowl, my first pet in college, thinking it was no big deal, isn't this what everyone does? I did not enjoy that. I think it's really sweet your mother did this for you! Looking back and realizing how many mothers cleaned fish bowls for their children is really sweet.


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> Gosh, as kids we just had a fish bowl. I think we had marbles in the bottom, some kind of aquatic plant and ceramic treasure chest on the bottom. No filter or aerator. Had to clean it frequently but the fish made it. (once I was older anyway)


I think a lot of kids had this!! Fish keeping has come a LONG ways since those days. Basically, that's like taking your havanese dog and putting them in a xpen and expecting them to be happy. LOL. It's possible, but it's a pretty sad quality of life. I mean, today, it's the same thing with bettas that they sell in the cups. They sell teeny bowls because "they live in puddles in rice fields" with neglecting to say that they jump puddle to puddle.... When really those guys need more than a 1gallon cube.

Those comets (the goldfish you normally see with a single tail)... yeah..those actually need at least 125 GALLONS of water, preferably a pond. They're part of the carp family and can get HUGE if they're not stunted in bows and need the space.

So yeah.. I'm looking at getting a 40 gallon breeder tank for 2-3 fancy goldfish and it's looking like about $1100 CAD. That will have to wait until after I get a new computer. 



EvaE1izabeth said:


> My only fish story involves me figuring out how gross it is to clean a fish bowl. Or maybe it just seemed gross to me? I bought a fish bowl, my first pet in college, thinking it was no big deal, isn't this what everyone does? I did not enjoy that. I think it's really sweet your mother did this for you! Looking back and realizing how many mothers cleaned fish bowls for their children is really sweet.


My kiddo is the same about ANY sort of poop. So yeah, I'm expecting that she will do the fun parts of feeding and gawking, and I will be the one cleaning the tank


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Wulfin said:


> Those comets (the goldfish you normally see with a single tail)... yeah..those actually need at least 125 GALLONS of water, preferably a pond. They're part of the carp family and can get HUGE if they're not stunted in bows and need the space.


Before we moved about 12 years ago, we had a large koi pond. After putting in the pond and before investing in koi, we bought a couple comets and black moor to see if they survived our pond environment. Well, they did more than that. We ended up with so many goldfish! I didn't know they breed like rabbits! :surprise:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Wulfin said:


> I think a lot of kids had this!! Fish keeping has come a LONG ways since those days. Basically, that's like taking your havanese dog and putting them in a xpen and expecting them to be happy. LOL. It's possible, but it's a pretty sad quality of life. I mean, today, it's the same thing with bettas that they sell in the cups. They sell teeny bowls because "they live in puddles in rice fields" with neglecting to say that they jump puddle to puddle.... When really those guys need more than a 1gallon cube.


And that's really an old wives' tale too. believe me. I've been there. MAny times. and Collected them in the wild. They don't live in puddles. If they get CAUGHT in puddles during the dry season, the puddles dry up and they die. The next "puddle" would be far, FAR away. They are NOT killifish. (which actually DO sometimes move from puddle to puddle, depending on the species) And rice paddies are typically ACRES in size... and over knee to thigh deep in water. So the nonesense about them needing "shallow water" (that you read all the time) is ALSO just that... nonsense. They don't make commercial size/shape aquariums that are "too deep" for Bettas. 

(oops. sorry, got me started... Just don't ask me about PETA or HSUS! LOL!)


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

I've turned my dining room into a useful room. It's now a JigSaw Puzzle room. The most that room has ever been used. I had never put together a JipSaw Puzzle until a couple of months ago. Husband loves them. He lived on a dairy farm and back in the day his family worked 300 piece puzzles every night while listening to the radio. They worked through a stack of puzzles then start over. He does 1,000-1,500 piece puzzles. Me I like Big puzzle pieces - 400 -500 piece puzzles. 

Working a puzzle is as good as Meditating or watching Fish Swim around in an aquarium.:nerd:


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

ShamaMama said:


> (never wanting to be left out of the conversation ...)
> 
> I have an aquarium DVD. It's very relaxing ...


*LOL!!!*


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Mikki said:


> I've turned my dining room into a useful room. It's now a JigSaw Puzzle room. The most that room has ever been used. I had never put together a JipSaw Puzzle until a couple of months ago. Husband loves them. He lived on a dairy farm and back in the day his family worked 300 piece puzzles every night while listening to the radio. They worked through a stack of puzzles then start over. He does 1,000-1,500 piece puzzles. Me I like Big puzzle pieces - 400 -500 piece puzzles.
> 
> Working a puzzle is as good as Meditating or watching Fish Swim around in an aquarium.:nerd:


I love jigsaw puzzles! The only place I can put one together is my dining room table so I rarely do one. I also find them rather addictive!


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

We had a salt water aquarium for years, back when our kids were small. We enjoyed it a lot, and were able to keep fish for years by quarantining any new ones in another tank, and going through treatment processes for anything they could get, or pass on, before they went into the big tank.

It finally got to be too much trouble, keeping it in the middle of the house, and after we starting having dogs in the house.

We gave it away, and decided that we would like to have another one in the future, built into a wall, but only with its own room behind it to maintain it.

Then we got sidetracked raising Havanese.......................


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Tom King said:


> We had a salt water aquarium for years, back when our kids were small. We enjoyed it a lot, and were able to keep fish for years by quarantining any new ones in another tank, and going through treatment processes for anything they could get, or pass on, before they went into the big tank.
> 
> It finally got to be too much trouble, keeping it in the middle of the house, and after we starting having dogs in the house.
> 
> ...


I'm so glad you got sidetracked!


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Mikki said:


> I've turned my dining room into a useful room. It's now a JigSaw Puzzle room. The most that room has ever been used. I had never put together a JipSaw Puzzle until a couple of months ago. Husband loves them. He lived on a dairy farm and back in the day his family worked 300 piece puzzles every night while listening to the radio. They worked through a stack of puzzles then start over. He does 1,000-1,500 piece puzzles. Me I like Big puzzle pieces - 400 -500 piece puzzles.
> 
> Working a puzzle is as good as Meditating or watching Fish Swim around in an aquarium.:nerd:


Mikki, your puzzle reminds me of a painting we have by local artist Kim Norlien. He's turned some of his work into puzzles. Here's his website.

I also wanted to share the website of this Minnesota company who makes puzzles "with a twist." The picture on the box is slightly different from the real puzzle!

I see a lot of their puzzles are sold out. I did recently hear that it's hard to find jigsaw puzzles these days. They're a great family activity during a pandemic!

(Sorry for going off-topic, Michelle! I hope you don't mind too terribly!)


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> I love jigsaw puzzles! The only place I can put one together is my dining room table so I rarely do one. I also find them rather addictive!


That IS THE problem working puzzles but Puzzle Boards or Puzzle Tables solves the jigsaw problem. You can easily pick up and put the puzzle away when you need the dining room table for something else and get back to it later. Amazon has LOTS! of options. I now own several puzzle boards and purchased the puzzle table below which is currently out of stock but there are many other puzzle board options. The puzzle table can be collapsed down and put away keeping the working puzzle intact and later gotten back out. I never realized how much fun (additive) jigsaw puzzles were until I tried it.

*@ShamaMama *...._"I see a lot of their puzzles are sold out. I did recently hear that it's hard to find jigsaw puzzles these days. They're a great family activity during a pandemic!"._... There are still lots of puzzles available on Amazon. Bits n Pieces - Buffalo Puzzles - Ravenburger are all good puzzles. :smile2:

Still haven't figured out how to do the Multiple Quote option on this website. :frown2:

Amazon.com: Puzzle Storage for Up To 1000 Pieces: Toys & Games

Amazon.com: Bits and Pieces - Portable Puzzle Table & Puzzle Storage - Fold-and -Go Jigsaw Puzzle Table w/Felt Surface: Toys & Games


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> My only fish story involves me figuring out how gross it is to clean a fish bowl. Or maybe it just seemed gross to me? I bought a fish bowl, my first pet in college, thinking it was no big deal, isn't this what everyone does? I did not enjoy that. I think it's really sweet your mother did this for you! Looking back and realizing how many mothers cleaned fish bowls for their children is really sweet.


I once rented an apartment to a college student who asked permission to have fish in the apartment. I had a NO PET policy. I agreed THINKING fish would not be a problem.

OMG!!! The girl ended up with fish bowls lined up and down both sides of every hallway, around all living area walls and kitchen cabinets. It was a stinking mess.

No Fish ended up on my No pets List.

Same issue with Birds. Thought that wouldn't be a problem until a tenant turned their apartment into a Big Bird Cage. :frown2:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Mikki said:


> I once rented an apartment to a college student who asked permission to have fish in the apartment. I had a NO PET policy. I agreed THINKING fish would not be a problem.
> 
> OMG!!! The girl ended up with fish bowls lined up and down both sides of every hallway, around all living area walls and kitchen cabinets. It was a stinking mess.
> 
> ...


People can be stupid and slovenly (and stinky and filthy!) with or without pets of any kind! LOL!


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

ShamaMama said:


> (Sorry for going off-topic, Michelle! I hope you don't mind too terribly!)


Hahaha, don't mind! 



Mikki said:


> That IS THE problem working puzzles but Puzzle Boards or Puzzle Tables solves the jigsaw problem. You can easily pick up and put the puzzle away when you need the dining room table for something else and get back to it later. Amazon has LOTS! of options. I now own several puzzle boards and purchased the puzzle table below which is currently out of stock but there are many other puzzle board options. The puzzle table can be collapsed down and put away keeping the working puzzle intact and later gotten back out. I never realized how much fun (additive) jigsaw puzzles were until I tried it.
> 
> Still haven't figured out how to do the Multiple Quote option on this website. :frown2:


I use a roll up mat for my puzzles 

Multi quote instructions: 
- click multi quote on the ones you want to quote EXCEPT one.
- Then on that last post, click "quote" and all of them will appear


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Wulfin said:


> Hahaha, don't mind!
> 
> I use a roll up mat for my puzzles
> 
> ...


So...those roll up mats work. Good to know.

Thanks for the Multi Quote Instructions....how did you know that? :nerd:


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## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

Mikki said:


> Thanks for the Multi Quote Instructions....how did you know that? :nerd:


Hahaha, I used to run boards on this software a long time ago. Lol.


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Mikki said:


> That IS THE problem working puzzles but Puzzle Boards or Puzzle Tables solves the jigsaw problem. You can easily pick up and put the puzzle away when you need the dining room table for something else and get back to it later. Amazon has LOTS! of options. I now own several puzzle boards and purchased the puzzle table below which is currently out of stock but there are many other puzzle board options. The puzzle table can be collapsed down and put away keeping the working puzzle intact and later gotten back out. I never realized how much fun (additive) jigsaw puzzles were until I tried it.


I've actually looked at some of those puzzle tables or boards. I'm tempted. But that doesn't solve the addiction. If I did puzzles, I couldn't spend so much time on the forum!


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Mikki said:


> I once rented an apartment to a college student who asked permission to have fish in the apartment. I had a NO PET policy. I agreed THINKING fish would not be a problem.
> 
> OMG!!! The girl ended up with fish bowls lined up and down both sides of every hallway, around all living area walls and kitchen cabinets. It was a stinking mess.
> 
> ...


We had birds for awhile. Had parakeets when I was a kid. Grandma had roller canaries. Loved those. As an adult I've had a cockatoo, love birds, parakeets, canaries and finches. Not anymore. If I ever did get another bird I would get a couple of canaries. Our house is kept too cool for them though. Our neighbor had a whole room dedicated to her birds. She had several parrots and did not keep them caged. They had the freedom of their own room. Was kind of cool but OMG was it noisy with all the squawking! It would have driven me nuts (or may nuttier).


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Listening to this story (Polly Wants a Cracker) and meeting a student's bird who will live to age 80 made me so glad I'd never considered owning a pet bird.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> We had birds for awhile. Had parakeets when I was a kid. Grandma had roller canaries. Loved those. As an adult I've had a cockatoo, love birds, parakeets, canaries and finches. Not anymore. If I ever did get another bird I would get a couple of canaries. Our house is kept too cool for them though. Our neighbor had a whole room dedicated to her birds. She had several parrots and did not keep them caged. They had the freedom of their own room. Was kind of cool but OMG was it noisy with all the squawking! It would have driven me nuts (or may nuttier).


The cool house problem kept me from having birds for quite a while. Then my son had a green rumped parrotlet for 17 years. She had a BIG cage, and we had one of those ceramic heat emitters that they use for lizards over one side of her cage, so she could decide how warm she wanted to be. It worked really well. We even made sure that the outlet by her cage was one of the ones that was on the generator if we lost street power in a storm. She was a cute little thing, and I miss her in some ways, but even TINY parrots are a TON of work and need TONS of attention. (which he gave her) But he doesn't live here anymore. I don't think I'd want to put that much time into a bird at this point in my life.

I do think, now and then, of getting some finches or other "cage birds", that like each other's company and are not interested in coming out of the cage. I do enjoy the sound of birds in the house. But... It's one more critter to care for.


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> I've actually looked at some of those puzzle tables or boards. I'm tempted. But that doesn't solve the addiction. If I did puzzles, I couldn't spend so much time on the forum!


I hear Ya! Puzzles are taking precedence over some of my other activities. But....it's so! relaxing and Fun.



Jackie from Concrete said:


> We had birds for awhile. Had parakeets when I was a kid. Grandma had roller canaries. Loved those. As an adult I've had a cockatoo, love birds, parakeets, canaries and finches. Not anymore. If I ever did get another bird I would get a couple of canaries. Our house is kept too cool for them though. Our neighbor had a whole room dedicated to her birds. She had several parrots and did not keep them caged. They had the freedom of their own room. Was kind of cool but OMG was it noisy with all the squawking! *It would have driven me nuts (or may nuttier)*.


We have a friend who has four or five Parrots. Parrots live so long you need to put them in your Trust and Will so they are taken care of when you're gone. Some live to be 75yrs old and older. Our friend's Parrots have a custom room built just for them on the second floor of their home. They have big windows to look out of.


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

ShamaMama said:


> Listening to this story (Polly Wants a Cracker) and meeting a student's bird who will live to age 80 made me so glad I'd never considered owning a pet bird.


ShamaMama..... This story is Priceless about WHY you don't want a parrot. Make me LOL!!! when the Parrot made dinosaur sounds.


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Mikki said:


> ShamaMama..... This story is Priceless about WHY you don't want a parrot. Make me LOL!!! when the Parrot made dinosaur sounds.


Everyone should listen to this story. It's so poignant. The woman loves her bird, and her bird loves her, but the bird doesn't like her husband or children. There's no solution.

Here are two photos to tie everything together (fish and puzzles, that is, no birds ...) The painting that Mikki's puzzle reminded me of, the aquarium DVD that I've played on the big lower level TV when we have people over, my new Shama pillow that my in-laws gave me for my birthday (that will eventually be looking out our front window, but our small Christmas tree is there now - look, tying this photo to another HF thread), our Shama portrait that a local artist painted (we met her at the farmers' market), and, last but not least, Shama!

I think it's fun when threads go a little bit away from Havanese (just a little bit though). Mikki, have you started your own thread of wildlife photos yet?


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

ShamaMama said:


> Everyone should listen to this story. It's so poignant. The woman loves her bird, and her bird loves her, but the bird doesn't like her husband or children. There's no solution.
> 
> Here are two photos to tie everything together (fish and puzzles, that is, no birds ...) The painting that Mikki's puzzle reminded me of, the aquarium DVD that I've played on the big lower level TV when we have people over, my new Shama pillow that my in-laws gave me for my birthday (that will eventually be looking out our front window, but our small Christmas tree is there now - look, tying this photo to another HF thread), our Shama portrait that a local artist painted (we met her at the farmers' market), and, last but not least, Shama!
> 
> I think it's fun when threads go a little bit away from Havanese (just a little bit though). Mikki, have you started your own thread of wildlife photos yet?


The Parrot Loving mother story is hysterical and a bit weird. I do wonder how the family is going to put up with this bird for eternity since it could outlive all of them. The kids Hate the bird. One of these days - after they get older - the front door may accidentally get left opened. Bye-Bye birdie. I believe that's what happened to a couple of birds we had as little kids after my mother got tired of the mess.

Any one of those items in your photo would make a Good Puzzle. The DVD Aquarium with the Pillow Dog looking in. Shama's Portrait Picture. And what looks like a Christmas Picture on the wall.

I do have a lot of bird photos from when I was feeding them. I miss the birds but not the mess and other critters. Birds learn where to feed and will return and bring more of their friends. I might try moving the bird feeders a long ways from the house.  Crows are my favorite because they are Smart! Very Smart. I use to feed them and when I walked in the mornings they followed me flying from house to house. When I came outside I heard them calling each other because the knew I had something to eat. The Crows Favorite food was my sister-in-laws Fruit Cake she made us every Christmas. :grin2:

*My favorite birds are Outside Birds.*


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Mikki said:


> Crows are my favorite because they are Smart! Very Smart. I use to feed them and when I walked in the mornings they followed me flying from house to house. When I came outside I heard them calling each other because the knew I had something to eat. The Crows Favorite food was my sister-in-laws Fruit Cake she made us every Christmas. :grin2:
> 
> *My favorite birds are Outside Birds.*


I agree crows and ravens are incredibly smart. Have you seen this article about crows bringing gifts? https://www.boredpanda.com/8-year-o...oogle&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> I agree crows and ravens are incredibly smart. Have you seen this article about crows bringing gifts? https://www.boredpanda.com/8-year-o...oogle&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic


I have not seen this story but I have read similar stories like this. There's a video that shows a Crow - creating a Tool - to fish a piece of food up a cylinder. They live in Family Groups and each group has their own Crow Dialect. They speak Crow but each group is a little different. They're a fascinating and entertaining bird. They look black but their feathers shine an iridescence blue/purple/green sheen when you have the right lightening. Blue Jays and Magapies are cousins of sorts.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

The story about the person and her macaw is fascinating. DS tried to talk me into a bird but it was easy to say no because I know so little about birds. My friend’s mother had small birds and they “lived” in a beautiful birdcage in their large, enclosed entryway. The sound was really inviting entering their home. I truly admire birds and aquariums in people’s homes, partly because I admire the people taking care of them!

I’m so glad I wasn’t really aware of some of the gross and unavoidable aspects of owning a puppy, like diarrhea and vomit. I’m especially glad my Havanese will snuggle up on my lap after I clean it up (or after I beg DH to do it).


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Love the pictures of Shama. She's one gorgeous Little Lady.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> The story about the person and her macaw is fascinating. DS tried to talk me into a bird but it was easy to say no because I know so little about birds. My friend's mother had small birds and they "lived" in a beautiful birdcage in their large, enclosed entryway. The sound was really inviting entering their home. I truly admire birds and aquariums in people's homes, partly because I admire the people taking care of them!
> 
> I'm so glad I wasn't really aware of some of the gross and unavoidable aspects of owning a puppy, like diarrhea and vomit. I'm especially glad my Havanese will snuggle up on my lap after I clean it up (or after I beg DH to do it).


We got our parrotlet after dynasties of hamsters. My teary-eyed 11 year old came to me after the last of his very sweet hamsters died and said, "I want a pet that lives longer". I asked what he had in mind. He showed me a bunch of computer print-out about this small S.A. parrot I'd never even heard of, that lived 15 years or so was only approximately parakeet size, but much smarter... that actually NAMED their babies in the nest in the wild. How much they cost... (not TOO much) What was I to do? We started researching breeders and went and got Sunny!

We had her for 17 years and she really was a most excellent, tiny pet for him, from middle school through last summer when he finally lost her. And while 17 years is a good long time, it's not the overwhelming commitment, of the 70-80 years for the large parrots! Nor was she as destructive as a big parrot, and while she was still capable of giving a good nip if she didn't like you (and she was very particular about who she liked!) she also wasn't big enough to take off body parts the way big parrots can. THEY scare me!


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

krandall said:


> We got our parrotlet after dynasties of hamsters. My teary-eyed 11 year old came to me after the last of his very sweet hamsters died and said, "I want a pet that lives longer".


I remember my brother had a hamster. We also had a cat. One day all we had left were hamster feet.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> I remember my brother had a hamster. We also had a cat. One day all we had left were hamster feet.


OMG! My son had problems with anxiety as it was. THAT would have sent him over the edge!!!

I have to tell you another funny hamster story though... My cousin and his family were visiting from Italy, and stayed for a few days with a family friend in NYC. The apartment wasn't big, so they were sleeping in sleeping bags on the living room floor. During the night, they heard something scurrying around on the floor, and having heard the stories of NYC rats, my cousin took his huge, size 13 shoe, and smashed the thing over the head.

...In the morning it turned out that it was a hamster that had escaped from a neighbor's child, and everyone in the building had been on the look-out for it! Oops!


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

krandall said:


> OMG! My son had problems with anxiety as it was. THAT would have sent him over the edge!!!
> 
> I have to tell you another funny hamster story though... My cousin and his family were visiting from Italy, and stayed for a few days with a family friend in NYC. The apartment wasn't big, so they were sleeping in sleeping bags on the living room floor. During the night, they heard something scurrying around on the floor, and having heard the stories of NYC rats, my cousin took his huge, size 13 shoe, and smashed the thing over the head.
> 
> ...In the morning it turned out that it was a hamster that had escaped from a neighbor's child, and everyone in the building had been on the look-out for it! Oops!


Oh no! :surprise::crying:


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