# Puppy is home!!



## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

Picked her up yesterday and she came bounding right out of crate. Too cute. She is currently being hidden at my sister's house until Christmas so will post pictures tomorow. I do have a question though She appears to have an underbite. I bought her for showing so is this likely to correct itself? There is alot of conflictin info out there  She is going to vet this afternoon but just wanted to know if anyone's pup had an underbite correct itself.....


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Congratulations what a great Christmas surprise. It depends on how much of a under bight it is . The upper and lower jaw grows a different rates. The jaw stops growing at about 5 mo. It is better to have a perfect scissors bite especially for a show puppy and if your breeder sold your pup as a show puppy she shouldn't have picked that puppy . that being said Zoey had a under bight that corrected itself not totally she doesn't have a perfect scissors bite and can be a flaw for showing. she has what is called a even bite. 
I would talk to your vet and ask him about having the bottom baby teeth removed I wanted to do that with Zoey and regret I didn't I was told that could help. With a show puppy you also wanted to have the puppy soaped down to view the legs. Their are many other things a show pup needs in order to be successful in the ring. Like stance and how their back looks. The slite rise should be prominent and obvious . The chest is important. 
I'm just learning myself so I hope others with better knowledge step in. I think if you really want a good show puppy I would rethink if your breeder sent of a dog with an under bite and didn't evaluate your pup as a show potential. The competition is so stiff you will just be wasting your time and money with a dog that may not be a show pup.


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## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Congratulations on your new puppy and welcome to the forum. :wave:

If it's your puppy in the picture, she is adorable. As far as underbite goes, here's what the standard calls for. This is a quote from the standard on Havanese.org

"A scissors bite is ideal and a full complement of incisors is preferred." 

I have never seen an underbite fully correct itself, nor have I seen Havanese with an underbite in a competition. I know a breeder pulled a show puppy prospect from showing because the bite went off.

Best of luck with your new puppy.


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## whimsy (Apr 3, 2010)

congrats!! How exciting!!! Whimsy has a slight underbite..her breeder let me know about that from the get go. I wasn't looking for a show dog so it didn't matter to me. She is full grown now and still has it.


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## mamacjt (Aug 23, 2011)

A dog with an undershot bite is not a show prospect! And....even if it passes for perfect someday by having teeth pulled, what happens when you eventually breed the dog? Do you want the undershot bite to be passed onto offspring? I'd talk to your breeder immediately!


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## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

Hyperventilating over here. 
Puppy got unfit for sale certificate :Cry: :Cry:
:Cry: sob sob sob

First let me say she's adorable and has already wormed her way into my heart. However her teeth are badly aligned and vet gave her unfit bill of health I was overwhemed by all the surgery recommendations and the idea of the fortune in vet bills I will be facing.

This pup was supposed to be my daughter's show dog and now she will never be a show dog. I am waiting to hear from breeder but I don't know what to do I can't give her to my daughter tomorow becasue she'll never give her back but will have to pass on showing her if nothing else. But if I don't give her to my daughter hoiw will I explain the dog toys leashes and dog paraphenalia that are wrapped unfer tree for her????????
 

Must continue crying now


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## bellapico (Nov 29, 2009)

Wow! I am so sorry to hear that, only you know what is best for you and your family. I think you can explain to your daughter that the dog is still not ready to come home...... and you hopefully find a more reputable breeder. I don't even know what to day.


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## mamacjt (Aug 23, 2011)

I'm so sorry to hear that your vet gave her an unfit bill of health too. You would have thought that the breeders vet would have noticed the things your vet noticed. It seems to me that you have two options. You either ask the breeder for the difference in $$ between what you paid as a show dog prospect and pet price, and have her spayed and keep her for a pet only, or you return her and wait for an appropriate show prospect (based on your vet's approval as well). As far as your daughter, you need to explain what happened. If she is bent on showing, she needs to have something that is show worthy and should settle for nothing less!


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

I can not even imagine a reputable breeder selling you a pup that is unfit health wise,has an underbite as a show dog. Is this person a REPUTABLE breeder? I would send the puppy back,insist on a refund and seek a reputable breeder who knows what they are doing.

It sounds harsh--but no one should be taken advantage of and I personally do not believe in giving a dog as a gift for any reason. Why not give your daughter the leash and dog things and have her meet a reputable breeder and wait for the correct havanese. She will learn from a breeder such as this and be more prepared for the ring a bit later (by being educated about the breed).


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Thats a drag Its a bit late for my input being Christmas day. Look in to seeing if there is a Havanese club near you . Join with your daughter that way she can meet local breeders that show. Its fun just to go watch for awhile. That way she can learn what look she likes. I never really new it but their are several looks in a Havanese. It was also fun for me because some breeders actually needed my help while at the show.


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## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

We did end up giving my daughter the pup as we spoke to her before hnad to let her now what had happened. My daughter is currently taking classes at a local club for junior handling as has done very well with our other havanese so she is somewhat knowledgeable about the show world. This pup was supposed to be her big break into real confirmation though since our other hav does not qualify because of improper pigment. So although I am still upset about the whole deal the breeder has offered a partial refund which we will take to use toward future medical bills. 

And for those who would like to know why we didn't return for a full refund and. or exchange for new pup (breeder did not have any available anyways);

When I told her the pup was not perfect and it might be best to return her and wait for another to come that would be able to be shown my old soul of a daughter said 'I wasn't born perfect but you kept me so I will keep this pup. " So she basically knows she will never be able to compete with her but accepted it anyways. She has been through many medical procedures and several open heart surgeries which I think have made her extra empathetic to those with any disabilty. So it may be years before she will be able to find a dog to compete with in conformation but hopefully she will be interested in agility and maybe rally competitions.


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## Kirby (Mar 7, 2011)

I think you have a gem of a daughter.....and a beautiful little pup! Merry Christmas to all of you!

Reenie


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Awwww... A Merry Christmas to you and your daughter!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

unjugetito said:


> We did end up giving my daughter the pup as we spoke to her before hnad to let her now what had happened. My daughter is currently taking classes at a local club for junior handling as has done very well with our other havanese so she is somewhat knowledgeable about the show world. This pup was supposed to be her big break into real confirmation though since our other hav does not qualify because of improper pigment. So although I am still upset about the whole deal the breeder has offered a partial refund which we will take to use toward future medical bills.
> 
> And for those who would like to know why we didn't return for a full refund and. or exchange for new pup (breeder did not have any available anyways);
> 
> When I told her the pup was not perfect and it might be best to return her and wait for another to come that would be able to be shown my old soul of a daughter said 'I wasn't born perfect but you kept me so I will keep this pup. " So she basically knows she will never be able to compete with her but accepted it anyways. She has been through many medical procedures and several open heart surgeries which I think have made her extra empathetic to those with any disabilty. So it may be years before she will be able to find a dog to compete with in conformation but hopefully she will be interested in agility and maybe rally competitions.


I feel bad for you and your daughter over what the breeder did did. But you have raised a wonderful girl to make the decision she did. While conformation showing is fun, it is mostly about "proving" breeding stock. Typically, dogs are only in the conformation ring for a few years at most before they retire. Your daughter can enjoy her partner for YEARS competing in agility, rally and if she chooses, formal obedience. I have a tremendous amount of respect for those who show in the conformation ring, but I have to say, I wouldn't trade it for the performance ring for a moment! I LOVE the feeling of partnership you have with your dog while doing performance sports.


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## Cindi (Sep 5, 2011)

unjugetito said:


> When I told her the pup was not perfect and it might be best to return her and wait for another to come that would be able to be shown my old soul of a daughter said 'I wasn't born perfect but you kept me so I will keep this pup. "
> 
> "Old Soul, indeed!" That one sentence says it all about the wonderful child you are raising. Well done!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Now we need pictures ( for making us cry). What a wonderful Christmas story.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I was also wondering what you found out is wrong with your pup. While there are LOTS of things that keep a dog from being a candidate for the conformation ring, many of them are inconsequential in a pet or performance dog. You mentioned that your daughter might want to do agility or rally with Latte, so I'm guessing that from a physical perspective, he should be sound?

And Missy is right... WE - MUST - HAVE - PICTURES!!!:biggrin1:


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## morriscsps (Aug 17, 2010)

Good job, Mom!  

We need pics of Latte but only after you catch the hamsters first. (eek!)


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## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

*Pics*

She is a great pup overall and has had no accidents in the house *cross fingers* so her momma must have taught her well LOL Its funny to see her stop in her tracks while playing and race to her open xpen to pee on the puppy pads. SHe does cry a bit when we lock her in but soon resigns herself to being able to see us walking around. Im not sure how well she sleeps in crate at night because it seems that she mysteriously disappears and wakes up in my daughters bed :biggrin1:

Here are some pics of my daughter with Latte on Christmas Eve


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## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

*Jealous*

And so my other wont get jealous of not having her picture posted heres Vanilla patiently waiting her presents :biggrin1:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Cute!!!


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## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

I agree with all that has been written: Great Christmas story! You must be so very proud of your daughter - you have obviously done a wonderful job in raising her! Darling pup! And you chose a very fitting name. Best wishes to you and your family - human and fur!


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## busymom (Nov 25, 2011)

So cute! I love her name! I assume she is a brown/chocolate havanese? Love this happy ending. (Makes me worry about what breeder to get our puppy from, though... It's hard to really know who a great breeder is!)


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

busymom said:


> So cute! I love her name! I assume she is a brown/chocolate havanese? Love this happy ending. (Makes me worry about what breeder to get our puppy from, though... It's hard to really know who a great breeder is!)


While we certainly don't know of every good breeder, there are enough of us on the forum to have a pretty good smattering of experience with breeders in different parts of the country. If there is a breeder you are wondering about, just ask. If you see a website and are wondering about it, even if we don't know the breeder, we can usually look it over for you and mention anything we think you need to discuss with the breeder before making a decision, or how to steer clear of the sometimes well-comouflaged puppy mill sites.

There are also several very good threads on the forum that explain what you should be looking for in a good breeder, and what questions (at a minimum) you should be asking before purchasing a puppy from anyone!


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## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

After speaking to the vet and several friends at our daughters club I do not believe the breeder is entirely at fault. Bites that start off fine do go off sometimes and it is impossible to evaluate for show quality in tiny puppies who have not reached full maturity. This breeder has been more than fair with us offering us a full refund plus shipping back if we chose to return her. As it is she is giving us a partial refund to use toward any medical expense the underbite may cause later on and to make up the difference between a show pup and pet quality pup. So although disappointed that she will not be able to compete we are not upset with breeder. 

Latte will be much loved and adored in our house and if the last few days is any indication she will be a sure win in rally LOL Fast little thing :biggrin1:


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Your incredible daughter brought tears to my eyes with the wisdom beyond her years she showed. Her sheer joy in the second photo from Christmas eve says it all. Lucky girl, lucky pup. I think Latte will bring much joy to your family.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

unjugetito said:


> After speaking to the vet and several friends at our daughters club I do not believe the breeder is entirely at fault. Bites that start off fine do go off sometimes and it is impossible to evaluate for show quality in tiny puppies who have not reached full maturity. This breeder has been more than fair with us offering us a full refund plus shipping back if we chose to return her. As it is she is giving us a partial refund to use toward any medical expense the underbite may cause later on and to make up the difference between a show pup and pet quality pup. So although disappointed that she will not be able to compete we are not upset with breeder.
> 
> Latte will be much loved and adored in our house and if the last few days is any indication she will be a sure win in rally LOL Fast little thing :biggrin1:


When you said the vet had not passed her health-wise, I thought there was more going on than just her bite. There are many, MANY dogs who live their entire lives without having any problems with a bad bite. It's just that you don't want to breed them, which means that they probably won't do well in the show ring either. It certainly sounds like your breeder has dealt with the situation fairly.

Oh, and she doesn't have to be fast to win at Rally. It is done, for the most part, at a (human) walking pace. She just has to be very obedient, learn to heel well, and learn the moves!


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## whitzend (Dec 1, 2011)

I am so impressed with your daughter and you. You have done a great job in bringing her up. What a wonderful family Latte has been welcomed into. Beautiful pictures!!

Linda


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## unjugetito (Jan 2, 2011)

Then I guess I better try her at the greyhound races ound:


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## Lsprick (Jul 8, 2010)

Do agility!


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## Carefulove (Mar 20, 2009)

Both Vanilla and Chocolate are adorable! and your Daughter is gorgeous!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lsprick said:


> Do agility!


Yup! That's fun too, and speed DOES count there!:biggrin1:


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