# Puppy Deposit



## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

I have found a wonderful breeder im my area but they require a large deposit up front to hold a puppy. The breeder will pick the puppy when the temperaments are developed but my question is - What if the breeder doesn't have a puppy of the right sex or temperament?? I may be waiting months for the breeder to have another litter and the deposit is NON-REFUNDABLE!! Anyone know of any reputable breeders in the Ohio area? I am looking for a breeder that does all the appropriate testing and possibly has been breeding for a few years. Thanks so much for your help!! What an awesome forum!!


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## Cosmosmom (Jan 12, 2007)

I would be interested to hear what other breeders have to say about this one .. 
A large deposit up front .. Hmnn.. 
I only put up $100.00 for Asta . I did wait a long time for him almost 6 months but it was not easy to find a breeder in those days in those days . The breeder seemed fair and said she did not require more as a deposit for exactly the reason you cited . She also picked the dog but she did ask me a lot of pertinent questions and we were a good fit . 
I do not know what you are buying the dog for - show or as a companion .
Some of the breeders I dealt with were so rude others would not return my calls and and one literally hung up on me .


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## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

You speak of rude breeders etc... This breeder is awesome!! Really cares for the dogs! Totally trustworthy etc... The ONLY problem I have is the deposit. If a dog doesn't fit my requirements (sex and temperament) than I will have to wait until they have one that does which could be quite a long time. Alot can change within that time frame.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

First, welcome to the forum! Why not tell the breeder you are uncomfortable with that? You are about to make a 15 year commitment with a new family member, you should feel totally comfortable with this breeder-enough to talk about the deposit!

Amanda


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

Cosmosmom said:


> I would be interested to hear what other breeders have to say about this one ..
> .


I don't require a deposit and if they send one, I cash it after they have the puppy. 
I would have made a fortune off of MyKee if I took deposits like that! I had a list of people who wanted him but either it wasn't a good fit in my opinion or they had something come up in their life. I won't take money from someone who is dealing with a large problem already.
On the other hand, you could have people tie a puppy up and when it came time to pick the puppy up then they back out and then you've turned down a bunch of other people so I guess I can see why deposits are taken. 
We all do things our own way and it's up to you to find a person you're really comfortable with and trust. Remember that this isn't a one way street. We delve into your life and check you out from head to toe and by golly you have the same rights. Breeders will ask you a ton of questions and you also have that right. If they get snippy with you or you feel there isn't a good connection, walk away even if it means waiting for another puppy. A puppy isn't an impulse buy, they're a bundle of love to enjoy for many years.


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## Brady's mom (Dec 1, 2006)

I was going to suggest the same thing as Amanda. Can you explain the the breeder that you are okay with giving her a deposit so long as if a puppy out of this litter does not work out, she refunds your money? My breeder did collect a large deposit, but she actually did not deposit the check until we took Brady home. Brady was the only one in his litter, so the deposit was clearly for him and was refundable if he did not seem like a good fit for us.


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## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

I actually did and the breeder basically told me this was the policy. If I wanted a dog of a certain sex and temperament than a deposit was required up front to make sure I got that choice.


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## CinnCinn (Mar 30, 2007)

Neither of my breeders required a deposit upfront. I got one of my Havs from Washington State and one from Florida. I agree with Amanda & Karen. Have an open, honest conversation with your breeder. The right puppy is out there for YOU! It might be with this breeder, it might be from another.

I'm so glad you chose a Havanese! They are such wonderful pups!


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## susaneckert (Sep 7, 2006)

I agree talk to the breeder there is no reason why they can not give you back the depoist if you dont get the one you would want out of this lilter normally I have heard with a depoist you can get the depoist back or wait for the next lilter to have it should be your choice not theres. I would like to hear the out come on that keep us posted


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## Kathy (Nov 9, 2006)

Take A Chance said:


> I have found a wonderful breeder im my area but they require a large deposit up front to hold a puppy. The breeder will pick the puppy when the temperaments are developed but my question is - What if the breeder doesn't have a puppy of the right sex or temperament?? I may be waiting months for the breeder to have another litter and the deposit is NON-REFUNDABLE!! Anyone know of any reputable breeders in the Ohio area? I am looking for a breeder that does all the appropriate testing and possibly has been breeding for a few years. Thanks so much for your help!! What an awesome forum!!


In some states keeping a deposit and not returning it when you haven't gotten anything in return is illegal. I don't take any money until the puppy is ready to go home. I might decide that a home I had originally thought would be good, might not be after all and I as an ethical breeder, don't want to be committed on my end either. I know of a Havanese breeder that use to take refundable deposits until she was sued by someone she gave their money back as she decided they wouldn't be a good fit for one of her puppies. The puppy buyer won the suit!!!

Would you give a non-refundable deposit for a new car you are buying or a beautiful diamond ring?


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## The Fussy Puppy Gang (May 21, 2007)

Just my .02 worth...I don't understand the NON-refundable part of this deposit. You're putting money down without knowing whether any of the pups will fit your criteria. I thought it was normal to simply go on a waiting list at this stage. So what you're doing, basically, is buying a spot on the waiting list? Is that ethical? 

I don't mean to slam anyone's practices, but this sounds excessive. 

If the breeder says this is their policy and that's that, then I'd keep looking. 

Wanda


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

I agree... if you ask for your money back, why would they not want to give it. Most breeders have a waiting list for puppies. If this person must keep someones money because they changed their mind, I would worry about their practices. I agree with Kathy, in some states its illegal.


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

I never put a deposit down for Kubrick, though I did offer one, my breeder was against them. I should hope that if she didn't have the puppy you wanted that she would refund you the money. If she really can't understand why you would want your money back if that happened, then I personally wouldn't do business with her.


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## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

Thanks for all the wonderful comments!! I thought I was on the right track with my thinking. Yes, the breeder would apply the deposit to the next litter but when that litter will be born is unknown and a lot can change within that time. Anyone have any breeders that they would recommend??


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

My breeder would only take a deposit (1/3 the full cost) after the pups were born. She would reserve a certain pup for you once a deposit was received. I dont like the idea of putting down $ when the pup doesnt even exist yet.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

I think it should be refundable for many reasons, even some to protect the breeder from the purchaser. I guess if you talked to him/her about this and they still feel differently, this is probably not the breeder you are going to mesh well with!

I would spend some time on the Havanese Club of America site. Send and email to breeder referral. Be patient- as this can sometimes take some time. In the meantime, maybe there is a havanese club near your location where you can meet breeders in person. This is probably the preferred way.
http://havanese.org/hcaBreederRef.htm


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

I went through the same thing when buying my 3rd. I was very specific on temperament and color. I needed a passive male to join the pack. One breeder wanted 1/2 the cost as a deposit and the pup was only 1 week old. If the pup was not a good fit as it got older, I would have to wait for the next liter. I was not willing to wait and got Scudder. He is the most mild mannered pup and a perfect fit. If I went with the other breeder, I would not have had any regrets, as she is a great breeder. It would just stink to have to wait so long if that pup turned out to be Alpha. 

If you can't find a great breeder in your area, it just might be worth the wait. Talk to her and tell her that's the only reason you are hesitant.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Take A Chance said:


> Thanks for all the wonderful comments!! I thought I was on the right track with my thinking. Yes, the breeder would apply the deposit to the next litter but when that litter will be born is unknown and a lot can change within that time. Anyone have any breeders that they would recommend??


I can understand your concern, You're right...alot can happen in a year and that goes for the buyer and the breeder!

I would ask the breeder if she would consider a special contract for you that you could get a "refund" on your deposit if the match isn't made regarding sex and temperment within whatever time frame you deem 'reasonable'.

Alot of breeders are different in their policies, that's for sure!

Kara


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

I would find another breeder. I think this topic was hit upon a few times. If I remember, Tom said he doesn't take a deposit, and most of the other breeders said the same thing. I think if you are put on a list for a pup of a certain color/sex, once the litter is born, then you could send in a deposit to hold a specific puppy. But the deposit should be refundable. 

I understand the desire to get a puppy and not have to travel too far to get one, but I would check with your state to see if this is legal. If it is not, then you could go back to the breeder with the info and try to work out a new contract.


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## Alexa (Jun 17, 2007)

I can understand if a breeder wants a deposit if she she is holding a particular puppy for you, but not beyond the litter that you are focusing at at the time. There is no conceivable reason I can see why she would not at least give you the option of either returning the deposit OR applying it to the next litter. I would ask her again why that is and if her only answer is because it is her policy, I think I would walk away. 

Alexa


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## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

My breeder would apply the deposit to the next litter but I would not be able to have the deposit returned. My concern is - what if there is no puppy for me (sex and temperament) then I'm out of luck. I just sent an e-mail to the havanese breeder referral and hope to hear back from them.I know many breeders don't like to ship their puppies. I'm hoping there's at least one breeder relatively close by. Thanks again for your advice


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## Beamer (Jan 29, 2007)

Where in the US do you live??

Ryan


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

How far are you willng to travel to look into another breeder? I would go to breeders.net and check there to see who is by you. I would not put down a non-refundable deposit .....like alot of people have said on here alot can change. Keep us posted on what you decide.


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

I started another thread on this a while back but don't remember the title of it.

We don't take or even want a deposit from people until we have the puppy that will work for them. 

I can't see how any such deposit is anything but a method to lock the buyer in to that breeder. Havanese puppies have become quite a business for some now. We we decided on the breed over a decade ago there were around 400 in the country. Now there are 400 plus born every month-if you only count the AKC registered ones.

Our waiting list merely keeps all the information from the person and what type of puppy would work best for them. Some can wait. Others cannot. Some tell us they only want a puppy from us and then when the time comes for us to contact them they may have gotten one somewhere else. That's okay. We don't produce 15 or 20 or more puppies at one time and we have never had to run some on that we didn't want to.

Such requirements vary but you have to make up your own mind. The chances of having the exact puppy you want right now are slim but in the past two litters we have had there were a couple that the wait from contacting us to pickup was only a few weeks. The wait is not nearly as long as it was even a few years ago.


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## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

Wow !! You guys are wonderful!! I have gotten so many responses on this topic and I so appreciate it! I have received a few private messages but cannot figure out how to reply. I'll keep trying. I will definitely take all this information and put it to good use. I will get my puppy when the time is right


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## Lilysplash I (Jul 19, 2007)

This topic has been addressed before so for more responses, type in DEPOSITS FOR PUPPIES in the search forum on the left hand side of the opening page. I definately believe that if it is truthfully all about the dogs, deposits should be refundable. Someone that gives a deposit is showing that she is serious but you don't know if the litter has what you are looking for until the litter is born. Non refundable locks people in to something that they really weren't looking for or want which is not in the best interest of the puppy or the buyer. Non refundable definately benefits the seller only. I wish breed clubs would take time to seriously discuss the ramifications of not refunding deposits.


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## Kathy (Nov 9, 2006)

Anyone have any breeders that they would recommend??[/QUOTE said:


> There are a lot of great, ethical breeders nationwide. I would suggest you go to a couple of dog shows and see the dogs and meet some breeders. You can look up upcoming shows by state either on the AKC web site or at www.infodog.com.
> 
> Check out the health testing that each breeder is doing also. Ask them if they show their dogs. Are the parents AKC Champions? Unfortunately, this breed has become too popular too fast and many are breeding just to sell puppies not to improve the breed.
> 
> There are many good, ethical breeders all around you, and they won't ask for a non-refundable deposit. I bet that breeder wouldn't buy a puppy from a breeder that had that rule!


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

The more I think about this, the more I'm against this policy. This "deposit" should be refundable at your discretion, you shouldn't be locked into waiting for a match to be made. 

Does this breeder have a litter available?

I would certainly bet that she doesn't have very many people sending her $500 to keep indefinately, the economy is pretty rough right now and from what I can tell, the supply has exceeded the demand a tad for pet Havanese.

There are still some breeders with waiting lists, but word around is that they aren't as long as they were a year or two ago. So, I would just hold out if I were you and keep your checkbook closed until she has a puppy available that meets your criteria.

Keep us posted!
Kara


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## ChristineL (Aug 31, 2007)

I didn't have to pay a deposit for either of mine. If I hadn't liked the pup the breeder had chosen for me I could have walked away on the day, no problems. I would have given a deposit if it had been required, but not with the circumstances you're describing. Is that even legal? I would only agree to leave a deposit if the money was guaranteed to be returned if there wasn't a suitable pup in the next litter. Surely there are more breeders out there who don't require this who you can get a puppy off?

I'm glad you decided to get a Havanese! Get ready for the ride of your life 

Christine


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## Take A Chance (Oct 3, 2007)

I will keep you posted on my puppy search! Thanks again for all the advice! I guess I was against having to travel too far, but I can see that might be the way I need to go. The non-refundable deposit is the ONLY thing that is holding me back. This breeder has everything any buyer could ask for. I'll check back later


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## Cosmosmom (Jan 12, 2007)

I don't know if this works with buying Havanese these days but it sures works with buying a car ( unless the demand for a certain model is not being met of course ) just leave the showroom ..
My husband is always telling me he cannot negoiate price if I sit there yearning for the car so he makes me leave the showroom .
Now I know we are talking about apples and oranges and this is a dog here but I just wonder how many people are actually putting down $500.00 these days . Times are hard people are losing their homes the stock market is unpredictable . There are more Havanese than there used to be and there are also a lot of other cute llittle dogs out there..that may cost less.. 
Also lets get so business prespective on this - ? what happens to the deposit - is she putting it in the bank and gettting interest .. on your money . You have nothing but a commitment for a dog when she is willing to produce on for you . Or does she just put the check on hold in a locked drawer as they say . and no one gets the interest ( not that it is that great this days) but this is just to make a point . 
This is not cost effective use of your money and you may need to draw this to her attention .
Maybe you can negoiate on this deposit maybe not -. This is something only you can find out and then decide . ? Are you willing to try and negoiate and possibly lose the puppy . Is this the nly breeder for you or are you willing to try (another dealer )or breeder .. You may have to get a different model .. 
It is all how you are approaching the transaction how much you want one of her dogs or are you ready and willing to look elsewhere . You also have to factor in all the time this negoiating is taking not to mention the physological effect it is having on you.. and perhaps your family 
I may be off the mark here and maybe in the scheme of things it is not that important . You really want to buy from this breeder and eventually she will have her way .. 
Anyway I am presenting a different perspective . I am not trying to be cold or calculating but remember she is running a business as well as breeding wonderful animals .


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## Lilysplash I (Jul 19, 2007)

When I was searching for my first Havanese over a year ago, I was only looking for those who show their dogs and it seemed to be pretty common practice for these breeders to charge a deposit so the first time out I just assumed that was the way it was in the Havanese world. I also assumed that if the breeder showed their dogs and were well known, I had a better chance of their being ethical because their reputation would be at stake. WRONG at least in one case! I lost a $250 deposit and had no dog to show for it because I was not interested in the dog offered and she was so rude in the process that there was no way I was going to wait for another dog from her. She said she would refund my money but never did! I have asked politely multiple times. If it is true that Havanese breeders have limited litters a year, the buyer is truly out unless she wants to feel under compulsion to get what she does not want.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Lilysplash, I was hoping you would get some resolution to your deposit situation.

In regard to this being an earlier topic, here is the link to Tom's original post on the subject.

My personal choice is that I wouldn't pay a deposit on any puppy until it was closer to 5-10 weeks old and it would be done in good faith to the breeder. As a breeder myself, I refuse to accept any deposits until I've been in a mutual relationship with the buyer _and_ the puppies need to be at least 5 weeks old. By that time, I've already had time to tell others that I've not been able to provide a puppy for them and have had time for the puppies mature. I have no desire to get into the legal and ethical issues of tying up someone else's money.


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## Cosmosmom (Jan 12, 2007)

The woman I bought Asta from never cashed the deposit check .. I think she just wanted to make sure I was serious .. i was a referral and she just wanted to make sure ..
I felt she was honest and honorable and she made sure I got what she promised me - her idea of the pick of the litter . He was a wonderful guy and we miss him ..


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## Greg (Oct 25, 2006)

I take deposits exactly the way Kimberly does. I refund them as well. My wife helps out now too. Before anyone can get a pup, they have to pass the Jennifer test. Although I don't think she knew what was involved when she volunteered. With a litter coming she's on the phone almost every night. HA HA. Daddy gets to watch the game now.


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## Lilysplash I (Jul 19, 2007)

I agree with the posts that followed mine. I respond to puppy deposit threads because I want breeders to have a buyer's perspective and to perhaps rethink a non-refundable policy. Since I had a bad experience with a puppy deposit, I also hope that my thoughts might possibly help a future buyer. If I had known about this forum, I would not have thought that this is just what one has to do in order to get a Havanese. Although, I must say that even with the hassle I went through, I got a terrific Havanese male through another breeder. Stuey, Stuart Little, will be a year old in November. In mid-September, my husband and I completed our Havanese family with a female, Sadie who just turned 4 months. Pics to follow when I can figure out how to post and when life settles down a little. I am a very busy "mom" keeping track of two energetic furbabies. I think they are winning!!!


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## ironman (Nov 12, 2007)

Just before we found Holly, we found another puppy we were interested in and sent an email off to the breeder, that night at about 1:00am in the morning the breeder called?? I was half asleep and because I thought my wife and kids really wanted this dog I logged on my computer and sent a deposit of $300.00. Not more than seven hours later after I woke up and realized we all hadn't made a final decision so I emailed and then called to say I made a hastily decision and although we weren't ruling out the puppy we needed more time. The lady was rude and said she had to turn someone else down and would be keeping the deposit...I again tried to explain that our family dog died 2 years ago and we just wanted to be sure of our collective decision...again she was rude and said thats the policy?? Well live and learn I guess, everything happens for a reason and our reason was Holly!!! I just wish I found this site a few weeks earlier and I could have learned about do's and dont's and what to look for in breeders...I guess I was naive.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Yikes!

A breeder called you at 1:00 AM!!!!??!! Sheesh, If my phone rings at 1am, it had better be an emergency! lol

I can't believe that happened to you! 

That sounds like something my husband, Rich, would do. And he is NOT naive, he's one of the smartest people I've ever met, but he would do it to 'make his family happy', It wasn't naive, its just a shame that we can't trust people! 

Is there anyway you can stop the wire transfer?

So, she has to turn away people between 1 AM and 7 AM? B/S!!  

Kara


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## elregalohavanese (Jun 20, 2007)

*deposits*

We take deposits once the buyers have picked out the exact puppy they want. We took deposits on 2 pups last week and are keeping the pups until after this thanksgiving holiday and working on leash and crate training in the meantime. We would refund the deposits should they change their minds but I can certainly understand why some breeders don't. Advertising gets very expensive and if you turned a buyer down because you already have a deposit on a pup and someone backs out, your cost of advertising again could be quite high. Of course, the ultimate goal is to produce healthy dogs and that is not cheap with all the testing so most breeders understand there is very little money in raising dogs anyway. It is the satisfaction of breeding the best dog possible and finding the best homes for the ones you do not keep. Susan


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## ironman (Nov 12, 2007)

Thumperlove said:


> Yikes!
> 
> A breeder called you at 1:00 AM!!!!??!! Sheesh, If my phone rings at 1am, it had better be an emergency! lol
> 
> ...


No the transaction is complete, there was no way to stop it. I did send her a email and we'll she what she says. But I do believe in what comes around goes around....so good luck to her!!


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## The Fussy Puppy Gang (May 21, 2007)

ironman said:


> ...that night at about 1:00am in the morning the breeder called?? ...


Good heavens, what person in their right mind would call someone at 1:00 a.m. to talk about buying a puppy? If she were ethical, she would return your deposit.

Thank goodness you found Holly.

Wanda


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## Cosmosmom (Jan 12, 2007)

Well there might have been a time difference and she forgot .. 
I do that occasionally as i live on the west coast and my family lives on the east coast . That is why I like e mail - you do not make a mistake and wake people up .. There is a short window that you can communicate .. I am busy most of that time . 
As to the deposit I agree but she is charging for her time .. One thing I have learned is that you get nothing for nothing these days .. There is no free lunch .. 
I was amazed at what some of the people tried to pull when I was involved in the kitchen remodel .


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## ironman (Nov 12, 2007)

It's only a 1 hour time difference so she called after 11:00pm her time, still a little late imo. As far as charging for her time...what did she do, she hung up with me at about 11:30pm her time and we called, and emailed her at about 7:00am her time? Lesson learned but I see no logical reason for her to keep the deposit except being a greedy person that cares more about money than her puppies going to a good home...I made a mistake and learned from it, but I won't let her justify being a mean, greedy person. If I see someone ask about them I will be sure to tell them to steer clear. 

Rich


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