# Male or Female



## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

Hi

We have just come down with MHS. Oakley (female) is 18 months old and we totally love her. We have just came back from the breed who has 3 females and 1 male puppy. We definately want another puppy, but can't decide between a male and a female.

Do 2 females tend to get along better together or a male and a female?
Anyone have any thoughts on that.


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

I dunno, in my experience the females tend to be bossier and more territorial, so getting a male might be a better idea because he will be less likely to challenge her. The downside to that is that she might boss him around a lot, especially if she has a strong personality.

Personally, I have one of each and find Roscoe to be a lot more laid back than Maddie, and he's still a little puppy! He's just so much more agreeable and relaxed, he goes with the flow whereas she wants to be in charge of the flow 

Either way, good luck with your new pup! I have MHS, too!


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## Olliesmom (Sep 29, 2006)

hav 2 males!! so not much help...but would do males over and over!!!

rule of thumb....females love you...males are IN LOVE with you! arty:


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## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

We really wanted a male this time, but fell in love with the colouring of the female - she is black with a white stripe on her head, white back leg and with paw. Way too cute. The male is all white with black ears and black eyes - still really cute - but I hear white dogs are hard to keep clean.
.


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## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

Are the male havanese territorial?


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

I think it is more important to match the temparments when adding another, than the sex.

Some males are easy going, some more aggressive...same with the females.

I have one dominate male and one easy going female so it works good...she lets him be the boss...most of the time, not all the time....but it works well for us and I love having a male and female to see the differance in the sexes.

I would really recommend talking with the breeder about the temparment of your new addition.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

I agree about the temperament. If you truly want this to be a bff for your current Neezer, she isn't going to care about color and keeping it clean (trust me on that one- if it is a great relationship, quite the opposite!)

I have a dominant female (my maltese) who has never played with a dog until I got my easy going playful male who is not territorial with other dogs. If you walked up to my home I am sure he would bark at you. I think if your dog walked up, he would open the gate! My breeder honestly selected a better personality for my family than I could have. I never would have guessed they would have become such great friends but it has really changed my maltese in such a positive way. My hav and him also get along wonderfully but I expected that. But within 2 days to see my maltese wrestling with my boy (she NEVER did that with my girl hav or any other dog) was a shocker and to this day, she does that on a daily basis.

On the otherhand, I feel boy dogs are very much in love with you. For the most part, this is across all breeds. I know some people feel the boy dogs are too needy. I LOVE it myself


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## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

Wow 
Thanks for all the input. The only problem is there are a few families wanting the pup I want. I am afraid someone will put a down payment and claim the pup I want, before I can tell their personalities. The pups are only 1 week old. Too young to know their personalities. My Oakley is pretty alpha with the neighbourhood dogs, so I am not sure.


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## murphymoesmamma (Apr 1, 2009)

I love Murphy to pieces but I will never, never, never have a male dog again. He has been impossible to housebreak. He will go weeks without going in the house and then he will decide it is time to mark his territory. He never poops anywhere but outside or in his litter box but he will pee anywhere inside. With that said, Murphy's saving grace is that he is so sweet, outgoing, and friendly. He loves my grandsons and all my customers. I couldn't ask for a better pupster as far as personality goes but his marking his territory makes me nutso! He's mine for life so I have a huge supply of Nature's Miracle to clean up after him.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

But do you think that's male dogs, or specific to Murphy? I haven't read on the forum that male dogs are less likely to housebreak than females. (although left entire for too long, they can start marking, and THAT can be hard to stop) This certainly hasn't been our experience with Kodi. He was started well with his breeder, and continued to do well with potty training once we brought him home. We had a few accidents in the beginning, mainly because WE mis-read his signals or didn't watch him closely enough. At this point he was solidly potty trained.

I haven't had a girl, but I ADORE my boy, and certainly wouldn't hesitate to get another.


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## murphymoesmamma (Apr 1, 2009)

Karen, I think you are right. I think that is just my frustration coming out. Murphy is such a sweet little guy and I guess I just think he has to be perfect. Not very bright of me. Anyway I am working on getting this marking thing nipped in the bud. He is litter trained but also likes to potty outside. I am going to post on how to use belly bands because that may help the situation but I am not sure how to use them properly.


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## Renee (Mar 27, 2008)

I vote for a male puppy to go with your female. Especially since it will be hard to tell personalities at 1 week old. Your chances of getting an easygoing, loveable guy are higher with a male, in my opinion. I was going to get 2 females due to the problems of "boys marking", but I've read females can be just as guilty of marking. I haven't had a problem with marking with my male or female. We had them "fixed" early...not sure if that makes a difference? But Copper is my cuddler. Miley likes to be petted on HER terms, and prefers to lay at the end of my recliner. It's fun to see the differences between males and females. And I think they complement each other very well.
Just my 2 cents....


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## AKathy (Mar 15, 2008)

I have a girl and I would love, love, love to get another hav and I would get a boy for sure. Sadly, I just don't have the yard room or situation for another.
Stella is a love but she is very independent and has a HUGE attitude. Not complaining, just sayin'. She's not velcro in the least! I think I'd love a little velcro-ness. Plus I don't think she'd handle it well if another dog came in and tried to be the Alpha. She'd definitely need a passive one if she were to get a "sibling"


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## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

We had originally wanted a male - but like I said fell in love with the markings on the female. The male pup is white with black eyes and black ears (definately cute) but we camp alot and he would get very dirty. I know that should not be the deciding factor, and it may sound shallow - but luv luv the female pup. Just a little worried how 2 females would get along. Oakley (female) is very cuddly but on her terms - very cat like actually. I hope that given time she would adjust. Not sure


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Well if that breeder won't work with you, I am sure there is a breeder that will wait and temperament test and find the perfect male pup for you  I wouldn't be comfortable putting down money on a week old pup for me and my pups either.


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## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

Thank you

All helpful comments - I guess I am just impatient - I have seen the pups and can't wait to get another one. It is not the breeder that wont work with me, it is me wanting to make sure I get a pup before they are all spoken for.


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## susieg (Aug 28, 2009)

If the puppies are only 1 week old, their markings will change. Lola is black & white and although she is still black and white, her markings have changed and she has more black coming through in different areas.

I rushed into getting Lola and she turned out to be a very shy and difficult puppy. Although I got her from what I thought was a reputable breeder, she was the last puppy left and my breeders description of her as outgoing was so far from the truth. I did so much research on breeders, but then got puppy fever and didn't want to wait for the breeder I loved to have a littler. So I settled on the breeder I just liked & didn't get to choose my pup based on temperament. I love Lola to death, but kick myself in the butt everyday for making this mistake.

I've worked through a lot of Lola's issues to the best of my ability....but it was tough [still is in some areas]. My first puppy turned into more of a stressful experience than a fun one and I couldn't wait for her to "grow up" and make progress instead of enjoying her puppyhood.

If I had it to do over again I would choose solely on temperament, not sex or color. My husband was stubborn about not wanting an all white dog....but in hindsight, I'd rather have an all white dog that gets dirty or has tear staining than a dog with a personality that I had to work to change. And I would also rather wait a long time to get a dog from a breeder I felt 100% comfortable with. My second hav will come from the breeder I loved when doing my research, even if I have to wait a year!

Take the time to choose the right breeder and the right puppy. I agree with Amanda, that I wouldn't feel comfortable choosing a pup at a week old. Good luck!!


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## Oaks_Mom (Jan 1, 2009)

The picture of Lola is soo cute. That is exactly the same colouring as the pup we are looking at. Really good info about the breeder. I didn't like the breeder we got Oakley from - she seemed all helpful and full of info, but once we got Oakley she didn't want anything to do with us. It seemed more like a cash grab. We had some issues and she was unreachable. I like this breeder and we share the same vet, so I am hoping this is a plus. We got really lucky with Oakley she doesn't really have any issues, besides the adorable hav shredding. I guess I have puppy fever too. Thanks for the advice.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Renee said:


> I vote for a male puppy to go with your female. Especially since it will be hard to tell personalities at 1 week old. Your chances of getting an easygoing, loveable guy are higher with a male, in my opinion. I was going to get 2 females due to the problems of "boys marking", but I've read females can be just as guilty of marking. I haven't had a problem with marking with my male or female. We had them "fixed" early...not sure if that makes a difference? But Copper is my cuddler. Miley likes to be petted on HER terms, and prefers to lay at the end of my recliner. It's fun to see the differences between males and females. And I think they complement each other very well.
> Just my 2 cents....


I made sure we neutered Kodi as close to 6 months as possible (he had that Pyoderma infection, so we actually had to wait an extra week, but it was close) specifically because I wanted to make sure he was neutered before he had any chance to develop and "big boy" tendencies. He still doesn't lift his leg to pee, nor does he ever mark. I also, however, don't let him "visit" along vertical surfaces where he might get the idea of adding his "calling card" to those who have gone before.<g> So maybe it has just never entered his mind.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Oaks_Mom said:


> We had originally wanted a male - but like I said fell in love with the markings on the female. The male pup is white with black eyes and black ears (definately cute) but we camp alot and he would get very dirty. I know that should not be the deciding factor, and it may sound shallow - but luv luv the female pup. Just a little worried how 2 females would get along. Oakley (female) is very cuddly but on her terms - very cat like actually. I hope that given time she would adjust. Not sure


Kodi is mostly white (... well, everywhere that is likely to get dirty!<g>) and we camp with him regularly. We just hose him down or take him in the water to get the dirt off. Then we wrap him in a towel and don't let him walk back to the campsite over dirt roads wet. (dirt magnet!<g>) Once he's dry, he doesn't look bad at all. It's actually amazing how much dirt brushes off even a white dog once they are dry. He definitely needs a REAL bath when we get home, but I don't worry about him getting dirty. I let him be a dog.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Oaks_Mom said:


> The picture of Lola is soo cute. That is exactly the same colouring as the pup we are looking at. Really good info about the breeder. I didn't like the breeder we got Oakley from - she seemed all helpful and full of info, but once we got Oakley she didn't want anything to do with us. It seemed more like a cash grab. We had some issues and she was unreachable. I like this breeder and we share the same vet, so I am hoping this is a plus. We got really lucky with Oakley she doesn't really have any issues, besides the adorable hav shredding. I guess I have puppy fever too. Thanks for the advice.


If the puppy you want because it's got less white looks like Lola... she's still white in all the places that get dirtiest. I don't think Lola would be any easier to keep clean camping than Kodi, or an all white hav, for that matter!<g>


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## oohbetty (Mar 2, 2009)

I have a male and he never marks. He was neutered at about 4 or 5 months so that might have helped. He is aggressive to the other male terrier across the street though.


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

I would walk away from this breeder if she's not willing to evaluate the puppies and place them based on their personalities.

I put down a deposit on Roscoe the day he was born, based on the fact that I wanted a male with his coloring. However, his breeder, Janet of Yuppy Puppy Havanese, ensured me that she would evaluate his personality and if he turned out to be not what we were looking for we could transfer our deposit to a puppy with a more suitable temperament. Luckily, he developed into just the little puppy we had hoped so he's happily at home with us 

Maybe you should discuss your concerns with the breeder and if things don't work out, it's OK to walk away. At the end of the day, you want a puppy that will fit in with your family and bring you years of joy, not years of stress!


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

Kipling is also male. He was neutered at 6 months. We have no marking issues, nor do we have potty training issues. He was very quick to learn. He's adventurous, easy-going and very sweet but no where near needy. We did what you are talking about and picked him early - at 3 weeks- and it was how he looked....we're very lucky that he turned out to be just what we hoped he would be.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Also since this has been brought up- marking isn't just a male thing! I think some attribute it since it happens in the home more often? My maltese is my biggest marker and she was spayed at 6 months and an only dog for several years. She is very dominant and I think it just happened naturally with her.


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## mybella (May 16, 2008)

Bella marks too - only outside. When she has to "go" she squats. But, the rest of the walk she lifts her leg after sniffing - too funny. The trainer pointed it out to me - I hadn't noticed before.

Bella is a velcro dog but on her terms as others have said. My brother has two males - that are much bigger than her and she bosses them around. So I do think the female Havaneses may be a bit stronger in personality than the males.

Marie


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KSC said:


> Kipling is also male. He was neutered at 6 months. We have no marking issues, nor do we have potty training issues. He was very quick to learn. He's adventurous, easy-going and very sweet but no where near needy. We did what you are talking about and picked him early - at 3 weeks- and it was how he looked....we're very lucky that he turned out to be just what we hoped he would be.


Except for the eating passports part :bolt:

How was your trip? Great, I hope!


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

galaxie said:


> I would walk away from this breeder if she's not willing to evaluate the puppies and place them based on their personalities.
> 
> I put down a deposit on Roscoe the day he was born, based on the fact that I wanted a male with his coloring. However, his breeder, Janet of Yuppy Puppy Havanese, ensured me that she would evaluate his personality and if he turned out to be not what we were looking for we could transfer our deposit to a puppy with a more suitable temperament. Luckily, he developed into just the little puppy we had hoped so he's happily at home with us
> 
> Maybe you should discuss your concerns with the breeder and if things don't work out, it's OK to walk away. At the end of the day, you want a puppy that will fit in with your family and bring you years of joy, not years of stress!


I have to totally agree with Natalie here....since I have two havanese dogs that personalities are so different, it is really everything. One of my dogs is aggressive towards other dogs and people and the other dogs loves everyone. And reading on the forum here it seems that there can be quite a bit of difference in the temparments of the havanese dogs.


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## susieg (Aug 28, 2009)

krandall said:


> If the puppy you want because it's got less white looks like Lola... she's still white in all the places that get dirtiest. I don't think Lola would be any easier to keep clean camping than Kodi, or an all white hav, for that matter!<g>


You've got that right!!! Her feet, tummy, tush and beard are all white. So I may as well have a white dog. The other day my mom asked me "Is Lola tri-colored, is that gray on her belly?" No, mom.....that's just dirt. LOL!


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

krandall said:


> Except for the eating passports part :bolt:
> 
> How was your trip? Great, I hope!


OMG LOL!!! See how quickly we forget these little 'indiscretions'?



Trip was wonderful - warm, sunny, no pressure. Really nice - we missed Kipling though. He had a ball with his puppy trainer and a pack of about 4-5 dogs.


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

Male and female is better because females are the alpha. I like the males better. Love my Bella, but my boys are more loving.


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## Wildflower (Dec 6, 2009)

Oaks_Mom said:


> Thank you
> 
> All helpful comments - I guess I am just impatient - I have seen the pups and can't wait to get another one. It is not the breeder that wont work with me, it is me wanting to make sure I get a pup before they are all spoken for.


Is it possible to put the money down and then you'll have a choice but when they get older? We told our breeder we wanted a puppy before they were born and I get first choice from the four puppies and waiting until 8 weeks will be no problem. Everybody else has to pick after me.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

In my experience, the only time I've seen a territorial male is when he was unneutered and there was a bitch in season near. Otherwise, the neutered males have all been wonderful and sweet.

The only time I've ever seen two Havs fight, it was two females. Both had wonderful, sweet dispositions, but females just tend to get "bitchy". There is a reason why they call them bitch fights.


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

I agree with you Kimberly!! I love my Jillee to pieces but she can be very "bitchy" at times. It is all on her terms. I have three females and one male in the house. I have a 14 yr old lab,a 11 yr old cocker and two havanese..male and female. They all get along well. I will have to say that my boy is way more loving and cuddles more than my female havanese. I was really nervous about getting a male dog and I would not have it any other way. If the breeder is willing to work with you I would wait to see how there personalities are. I understand wanting to make that decision but you want to make the best one for you and your family!


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## murphymoesmamma (Apr 1, 2009)

krandall said:


> I made sure we neutered Kodi as close to 6 months as possible (he had that Pyoderma infection, so we actually had to wait an extra week, but it was close) specifically because I wanted to make sure he was neutered before he had any chance to develop and "big boy" tendencies. He still doesn't lift his leg to pee, nor does he ever mark. I also, however, don't let him "visit" along vertical surfaces where he might get the idea of adding his "calling card" to those who have gone before.<g> So maybe it has just never entered his mind.


That is funny Karen!!! Murphy just loves vertical surfaces. I have been working with him all weekend and he hasn't had even one episode. I have been taking him out instead of having him use his puppy pan. I want to keep the puppy pan as an option especially during heavy rain, thunderstorms, and ice but it seems that Murphy likes going outside better than using his puppy pan and if going outside stops the marking I will galdly make the switch. I wonder if Murphy will decide to mark when the time is right for another Hav puppy or rescue? If I can get this marking under control I would gladly have another male and I really don't care about the coloring as the most endearing physical feature to me is how they change!!!


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## murphymoesmamma (Apr 1, 2009)

Oops I forgot to add that Murphy was neutered when he was 6 months old also. I wanted to do it sooner to avoid the leg lift thing but the vet wanted to wait until he was 6 months as Murphy is a small Hav. Actually it wouldn't have mattered cause the little stinker started lifting his leg when he was about 4 months old.


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## TheVintageVamp (Oct 14, 2009)

lol, my female yorkie weighed 4.5-5 lbs all her life. We had other dogs in and out of the household throughout her 14 years and she never failed to let any of them know she was alpha. She marked wherever we went, hiked her leg and the whole 9 yards...She was so dominant over our male shih tzu that there were times she never let him eat all day while we were at work. We would have to make sure he got to eat in the evening when we were there to supervise. He was 3 times her size!

Temperament would outweigh color or sex for me.


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

We've had two dogs at a time twice - one male & female combo that got along great - another 2 female combo that only fought once but basically just co-existed not BFFs like we had hoped. I think it hard to generalize because in the end I'm sure personality should be the deciding factor. I agree with Kimberly, though, about the "bitch factor" with the females!


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## murphymoesmamma (Apr 1, 2009)

TheVintageVamp said:


> lol, my female yorkie weighed 4.5-5 lbs all her life. We had other dogs in and out of the household throughout her 14 years and she never failed to let any of them know she was alpha. She marked wherever we went, hiked her leg and the whole 9 yards...She was so dominant over our male shih tzu that there were times she never let him eat all day while we were at work. We would have to make sure he got to eat in the evening when we were there to supervise. He was 3 times her size!
> 
> Temperament would outweigh color or sex for me.


Sally, my little Princess KoKo (actually my daughter's Yorkie) is 4.5 to 5 lbs also and is definitely the Alpha when she and Murphy are together. He tries to get KoKo to play but she doesn't want any part of it.


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## TheVintageVamp (Oct 14, 2009)

Holly,
We used to call Kira Princess of the known universe or She who must be obeyed, lol...and she was. Lordy, I miss that dog. Not the way she was the last two years, but when she was spunky and full of life. She kept us on our toes. 

Don't get me wrong, I adore Murray and wouldn't trade him for anything, but it is a completely different experience. Kira knew no fear and everything was on her terms, whereas Murray is content as long as he can be near one of us and chase the kitties from time to time. He never gets in a snit the way she did and the closest I have seen him come to pouting is when the granddaughters were here and Raine had his spot on the sofa, by Papa's hip.


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