# Nippy and bitey when being picked up



## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Roshi does not like being picked up about 50% of the time. Let's say I put my hand to the side of this chest/waist area to pick him up, he would turn his head back and chomp. Or, he would roll onto his back and nip at the hands. He doesn't bite/nip hard, but sometimes he would not let go of the hand/finger. Yes, he might be teething, but it's not something that can be ignored, and should be corrected - especially being picked up. He should be able to be picked up anytime... in case of emergency, accidents, prevention of something, etc. The puppy school teacher told me to go "uh uh" and give him a little poke. Well, the little poke seems to provoke him even more. I tried time out, but soon time out is over and I try to pick him out of his pen, he nips at the hand. I'm really worried that this nipping will become a hard bite later. How to correct it?


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

Hi Casie,

Given your history with Master Roshi, I think that this is a perfectly normal response. I know that you have been doing everything possible to work with him lately, and to convince him that you love him, but you two had a pretty rocky start. And dogs and puppies tend to be not nearly as logical as humans lol. Probably some other people will have more immediate things that you can do with him as far as training or behavior modification, but IMHO, the best thing you can do is to continue to love him, and to give him some time and space. Havs WANT to love a human, and I feel that Roshi will come around to you fully if you are patient with him. If he was biting every time, that might be a problem, but he is not - he WANTS to trust you, he just is not entirely sure yet whether or not he can. It is up to you to show him that he can trust you, and, that takes time.

Just my two cents...


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Hmm. I thought about that too, however it's only the pick up that's having issues. He likes being petted, tummy rubs, even me picking out his eye boogers (and that's like hand in the face). It just really bothered me that at the "back up" daycare meet and greet, he was nippy with the staff lady. She was quite concerned and was 50/50 about taking him in. They had a pup who was like Roshi: hand nippy during teething time, and it continually to grew worse that it turned into hard bites with adult teeth, and eventually they blacklisted that dog from daycare. I do not want that for Roshi.
Like I said, it's 50/50. The 50% of the time he is ok with being picked up is he wants to be picked up. For example: getting into the car to go somewhere, or get onto the porch to go back inside after peeing in the rain. But the other 50% of the time, it's like he's the boss. For example, not wanting to get back onto the porch to go inside after peeing in the sun. Maybe he's still confused with who is the pack leader of the house?


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I think this is another good one for Dave when he gets back next week. It's not a problem we ever had, so I'm not exactly sure how I'd approach it, except that I am pretty sure it wouldn't be by poking him! You do have to get past the idea of "pack leader". This is a really incorrect and completely out-dated view of dog (or wolf) behavior. 

I think that what I'd try is to have a small toy and treats in my pocket at all times. When I went to pick him up, Have the toy in your hand when you go to pick him up. If he turns toward your hand, put the toy between his mouth and your hand so that he's chewing on an acceptable item. (just like with potty training, the more you can PREVENT (rather than correct) mistakes, the faster progress you'll make) If you pick him up and he doesn't ip, praise him lavishly and give him a cookie.

Another possible problem is that you may not pick him up enough at times OTHER than when he doesn't want you to. Make a habit of picking him up over and over during the day, praise him, give him a treat and immediately let him down. That way he won't think that every time he gets picked up is the end of his fun time.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

I'm not sure, but Roshi also seems to have a "dominance" issue. He is the ONLY puppy, and also the smallest puppy, in puppy school who would go around and hump other dogs. He started the day we got him but now it's worse, except that I push him off my arms and legs. 

But yes, this week I focus one training session on just "picking up". Try to do it about 10 times at least. If no biting, tons of praise. If biting, um, keep holding him in place? Not too sure about that one.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

CrazieJones said:


> I'm not sure, but Roshi also seems to have a "dominance" issue. He is the ONLY puppy, and also the smallest puppy, in puppy school who would go around and hump other dogs. He started the day we got him but now it's worse, except that I push him off my arms and legs.
> 
> But yes, this week I focus one training session on just "picking up". Try to do it about 10 times at least. If no biting, tons of praise. If biting, um, keep holding him in place? Not too sure about that one.


Humping is not a dominance issue. It's an issue of over excitement. (or, of course, it can be sexual if the dog is the right age and not neutered) It's pretty typical puppy behavior. How much of it people want to tolerate is up to them. For us, we didn't want Kodi doing it. period. So we pushed him off and redirected his attention every time we saw him start. It got WAY better almost immediately after he was neutered.

I would not focus a training session on picking him up. Ten times in a row would aggravate any puppy! That's just proving to him that this whole picking up thing is a major interruption in his otherwise busy play schedule. Instead, I'd pick him up as often as you think of it, ONCE at a time, throughout the day. (ask your day care person to do the same) And, no, I definitely wouldn't keep holding him in place. I'd redirect his teeth toward something acceptable to chew, say something like "Roshi's chew!" and put him down again with the chew item.

And remember, not just praise for not biting, I'd be giving him a high value (small) treat, that he only (for now) gets when you pick him up, so he starts to associate getting picked up with something worth his while. Right now, he's telling you in the only way he knows that getting picked up is not something he values. You want to change that.

I don't think Roshi is a "dominant" puppy, based on what you've said. I DO think he's a "busy", high energy puppy who is on the "strong willed" end for a Hav. He sounds almost a bit more terrier-like in personality. That's not necessarily a BAD thing, but you DON'T want to get in a power struggle with a dog like that. You'll just prove to him that there is no good reason to work with you. You want to convince him that working with you is absolutely the most fun, awesome thing ever, and he'd rather do that than anything else. Once you've changed that dynamic, and taken the whole "dominance" thing out of the equation (whether it's him or you) you'll have a dog who is in your pocket and will do ANYTHING for you. 

Higher energy, think-for-themselves puppies can be a bit more of a challenge than the Kling-on, lap puppies when they are little, but they have SO much to offer.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Good advice Karen. Well, this morning I tried another tactic. After he "belly-upped", refusing to be picked up, and started nipping. I then hid a treat in my hand. Let him sniff. He immediately went into a sit. Treat. Pick up (with no bite) and tons of praise. Hmm. now reading this... should I pick him up first and then treat, since he may relate "belly up" gets treated. But I don't think it will be comfy for him or me to pick him up with only one hand, which can only make things worse. Ahhh. 

And yes, he is indeed strong willed. If he doesn't want it, he doesn't want it. A good one is going down the stairs. He is very capable, but he ALWAYS stop at the top. He will stop in his steps, lay flat, and bite onto his leash. He has to be lured EVERYTIME with a treat. Same thing for the humping, and nipping during play. You push him away, or try to redirect him to something else, doesn't work. He is absolutely determined to go for the original object: the arm to hump, or the hand to bite. 

Patience Casie. Patience. I think I need to banner that up on my wall to remind myself.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

CrazieJones said:


> Good advice Karen. Well, this morning I tried another tactic. After he "belly-upped", refusing to be picked up, and started nipping. I then hid a treat in my hand. Let him sniff. He immediately went into a sit. Treat. Pick up (with no bite) and tons of praise. Hmm. now reading this... should I pick him up first and then treat, since he may relate "belly up" gets treated. But I don't think it will be comfy for him or me to pick him up with only one hand, which can only make things worse. Ahhh.
> 
> And yes, he is indeed strong willed. If he doesn't want it, he doesn't want it. A good one is going down the stairs. He is very capable, but he ALWAYS stop at the top. He will stop in his steps, lay flat, and bite onto his leash. He has to be lured EVERYTIME with a treat. Same thing for the humping, and nipping during play. You push him away, or try to redirect him to something else, doesn't work. He is absolutely determined to go for the original object: the arm to hump, or the hand to bite.
> 
> Patience Casie. Patience. I think I need to banner that up on my wall to remind myself.


My goal would be to "catch him being good" BEFORE he goes " belly up". Tell him to sit and give him a treat. (assuming he knows that command). I'd do that ogre and over for a couple of days WITHOUT picking him up. Then I'd ask him to sit, give him his treat, (I'd have a few more treats in my pocket) THEN slide one hand under his middle, and one hand under his haunches and lift him up. Then I'd quickly tell him what a great boy he is and give him another treat.

Another thing that occurred to me is that it could be that he doesn't feel comfortable being lifted a long distance. It might be worth kneeling on the floor beside him and picking him up just that far and see if he objects as much.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Here's what I meant by strong willed... especially at the stairs. He rather sit there by himself in the dark than to come down. He only goes down stairs if he wants/needs to (go for a walk, car ride, or desperation for potty).

I know these stairs seem high, but he has went down no problem and willingly for a few times. But I had to take this picture. He may be stubborn, but he is very cute just sitting there in the dark! LOL.


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## StarrLhasa (Jun 6, 2010)

Hi, Casie:

He IS cute sitting there. He also has been training you while you have been training him. They all do. 

Bringing up children and training puppies are very similar, especially with regard to consistency. If you let a child get away with something you don't want him/her to do, the child may try it again and again.

Dogs are the same way. If you feed a puppy from your dinner plate because s/he is looking up at you with those big brown eyes, you are letting yourself in for a dog that begs at the table. The dog has an expectation that your behavior [feeding him/her] will repeat.

The same expectation may be true in the situation of Roshi waiting at the top of the staircase for you to carry him down because you have carried him many times before. His little doggie head may be saying, "If I wait long enough, she will come, and I won't have to go down these long, scary steps."

When I was house training my two Lhasa Apsos, I offered a treat upon returning from going outside to potty. After a very short time, I had dogs who didn't really need to go out to potty [no pee or poop outside] but who lined up in front of me, sitting very politely, waiting for their treat as soon as we walked back into the house. Even after stopping treating them for going outside to potty, they still had an expectation they'd get a treat - for years! ound:

I wish I had a solution for you. It is a very high staircase for a short-legged puppy. does he go up the stairs willingly? He may be more inclined to going down it after he's grown some more.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

StarrLhasa said:


> His little doggie head may be saying, "If I wait long enough, she will come, and I won't have to go down these long, scary steps."


I think "long scary staircase" is the operative phrase here. I told Casie before that just because he has done it on his own a few times doesn't mean that there STILL isn't a level of anxiety over it. And yes, a need or desire, like being hungry or thirsty or needing to pee can override this anxiety. This has nothing to do with being stubborn or even strong willed. This is just a small puppy and a long, steep flight of stairs. The problem will eventually resolve itself as he gets bigger IF he doesn't get really freaked out over them in the mean time by being forced to do it when he's not ready.

Casie, this is another place where patience will get you there faster than anything else. While it DOES sound like he's got a mind of his own, be VERY careful not to attribute EVERYTHING to that. He's still a little puppy with a lot of growing and learning to do. And really, you've only had him a very short time. So even though it seems like FOR EVER to you, you've got to give him more time.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Yes. Patience. Something I had long ago, but no more. 
Not sure if you have seen the movie Up or not... but sometimes I wish that "translate to human language" collar exists. Creepy, but life would be so much easier.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

LOL, that would be awesome to have that collar... although I think Tillie's would be on repeat, "iloveyou, iloveyou, iloveyou... feedme feedme feedme.... iloveyou, iloveyou, iloveyou... CAT CAT CAT CAT CAT ..." LOL


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

TilliesMom said:


> LOL, that would be awesome to have that collar... although I think Tillie's would be on repeat, "iloveyou, iloveyou, iloveyou... feedme feedme feedme.... iloveyou, iloveyou, iloveyou... CAT CAT CAT CAT CAT ..." LOL


Not, "SQUIRREL!!!"?:biggrin1:


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

ha ha ha ound:


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Well, I have started the pick-up "training". So just whenever, I'll put Roshi into a sit position first, treat, and then say "pick up" and pick him up. No biting! Then tons of praise! Hopefully it will get into his brain that pick up is fun and loving!
Also, I am starting to OVER praise when he licks my hand just to overemphasize mom loves licks and not bites. However, the praising only gets him to lick like he never lick before. I have to pull away. Too ticklish!!!! ound:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

CrazieJones said:


> Well, I have started the pick-up "training". So just whenever, I'll put Roshi into a sit position first, treat, and then say "pick up" and pick him up. No biting! Then tons of praise! Hopefully it will get into his brain that pick up is fun and loving!
> Also, I am starting to OVER praise when he licks my hand just to overemphasize mom loves licks and not bites. However, the praising only gets him to lick like he never lick before. I have to pull away. Too ticklish!!!! ound:


Yeah, some people don't mind dogs licking a lot, but it's not for me. Kodi will give a quick little lick now and then, but he doesn't keep it up, and that's fine with me. So be careful what you encourage... Be sure you really want that behavior!

Glad to hear that he's doing so much better letting you pick him up, though. That sounds like GREAT progress!


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

He "belly up" once (lol... sounds like a dead fish). But I notice he really goes for the bite when I'm either in a hurry to pick him up, or he's in an excited state of mind. So I think that "sit" gets his head to another state. Practice, patience, and consistence. We will get there. Go Roshi Go!


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## littlebuddy (May 30, 2007)

have you tried other ways to pick him up? django was funny about how we picked him as a puppy. i have to slide my arm under his belly thru the chest and between his front legs. he then picks up his back leg and puts it over the back of my arm and i pick him up. his body is vertical with my arm. the other way i pick him up is one hand under the chest and the other picks up the bottom. he likes to be carried around on my shoulder.


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