# Liver Disease



## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Does anyone have any experience with any Liver illness. I have just had a bomb dropped on me out of the blue. I had my Maggie scheduled for a teeth cleaning 3 weeks ago and they did the pre-op blood work and it showed her ALT to be slightly elevated. They sent her home to be checked again this past Monday. The levels tripled in that short of time and they did more testing and found that her liver is not function properly and that she needed an ultrasound. They have put her on a medication in the meantime until her appt. with the specialist. They can't give me a prognosis until the testing is done to see how much damage there is and how it can be treated. I am sure since the #'s have tripled in that short of time that the results are not going not be good. I have been reading all the info I can find on liver conditions in dogs and the more I read the sadder I become. Does anyone out there have any pets with a liver codition. Lola is my Havanese and Maggie is the Bolonka. Unfortunately the breed is so rare that I can't locate too much health information on her. I am in the process of contacting the breeder for some additonal info. So if anyone has any info they are willing to share, I would be grateful.


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## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

I am so sorry to hear about the liver problems that Maggie is having.  
Has your vet offered any opinion on what liver problem it might be, or do you have to wait for the specialist to find out? 

Does Maggie exibit any visual symptoms of her liver problem? Is she acting different, has her eating changed, how's her energy level?


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Poor Lola - I dont know anything about the Liver diseases but we are sending you guys lots ov love!!!


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Julia,
The doctor is waiting for the ultrasound to make a specific diagnosis, but she did say that the x-ray they did in the office did show a slightly smaller liver than she would expect for a dog of her size. With that in mind she suspects that it could be a congenital problem but only the ultrasound with the specialist will confirm that. As far as a change in her habits, the only thing that I am noticing is that she is more tired than usual but she is still eating well.


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## havanesebyha (Apr 25, 2007)

I'm so sorry to hear about little Maggie and her liver. It sounds like the vet is going through all the right tests though and sounds like she is in good hands. How old is Maggie? We're thinking of her and they find out soon how to help her.

Kisses & Hugs,

Libby & Kohana


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I'm sorry to read about Maggie's initial report. I hope you get some good information. I know that at least one person here has gone through liver disease with her Havanese on this board. Maybe she will be able to offer you some encouraging words.

Have you found a specialist in your area?


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I doubt you would be giving this to her, but I just found it interesting that if you supplement with Tylosin/Tylan/Angel Eyes that any of the liver tests can have false high readings.


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## Olliesmom (Sep 29, 2006)

You should Private message Maddies Mom...I believe her first hav had liver problems!!


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

I'm so sorry to hear about Maggie. Try not to get too upset until you have the full diagnosis. Elevated ALT can be from bacterial infections, toxins, certain medications, etc. I'm sure your vet will rule these out if he hasn't already. 

I did lose my first Havanese from liver disease at age 8. We went through the ultrasound, biopsy, specialist, medications, and I learned alot. Please PM me and I'll give you all the info I have. There are several non-prescription meds that can be given to support the liver and are not harmful to the dog. Plus, there are some great support groups that are full of information. I'll be more than happy to share whatever resources I have.

Jeanne


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Hope all goes well.:grouphug:Best wishes! Get Well Soon! :hug:


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## Cosmosmom (Jan 12, 2007)

Our kitty had liver disease Pinot had liver disease . It is very scary . We wish the best for you and your little one and we hope all goes well . I know they recommend Milk Thistle for humans with liver disorders I do not know if they use it in dogs . I guess you would have to consult a holistic vet - not that easy to find .. 
Keep us updated and we will think positive thoughts -


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## Cheryl (Mar 17, 2007)

My heartfelt wishes go out to you and Maggie. I knew that Jeanne would come through to offer her assistance. I hope that she is correct and that it is just an infection, or something small and fixable.


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

When you say High, what were the numbers? I know I freaked when Goldies was high, and emailed everyone. After hearing from Joan and Doc I felt a lot better. Some Havs just have higher levels in general and are still healthy dogs. I know an egg a day has helped MANY havs bring the numbers down a long with Milk Thistle. I guess it depends on what the numbers were. Just make sure to talk to a vet who is familar with Havanese as this comes up a lot with them, and sometimes isnt as bad as it seems.


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## judith (Dec 15, 2006)

i am so sorry to hear of maggie's problem, i hope tomorrow brings good news.


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

128 then 3 weeks later 308. But she is a Bolonka not a Havanese. I am now thinking about having my Havanese Lola checked just to be informed. Especially since you say Hav's have a higher count. I did not know that, that is interesting. Thank you Melissa.


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

She did not have any of the food, Kara, but that thought did come to my mind as well.


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Thumperlove said:


> I'm so sorry to hear that
> 
> Is there any chance she ate any possible contaminated Dog Food? There are still news stories popping up all over the place about liver damage from food, Sadly...the effects of the toxins are not over.
> 
> ...





Havtahava said:


> I doubt you would be giving this to her, but I just found it interesting that if you supplement with Tylosin/Tylan/Angel Eyes that any of the liver tests can have false high readings.


Kara,
What are those supplements? I don't give her any vitamins only the flea and tick and heartworm meds., which I am now a little worried about giving.


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Thank you to Jeanne and everyone else for their well wishes, info and especially prayers. I will let you all know how my Maggie does with her ultrasound in 2 weeks.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Lola, the Tylosin (and other names under that medication - Tylan, Angel Eyes, etc.) are usually used for treating eye staining, but since Maggie is black and that is the most common use among pet owners, I assume it is unlikely for her to be getting it. However, it is also used for bringing down inflamation in the intestines.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

I hope the vet finds out what the problem is and can help Maggie. I've never experienced liver problems with a dog. I did have a parrot with liver disease though. We gave him the milk thistle seed to aid his liver. One thing I learned is that the liver has good strong recooperative abilities. Hang in there and keep us posted.


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Maggie had her ultra sound yesterday and some blood work. The ultra sound showed that she has a congenital liver condition. She has a very small liver and needs to take medication and some dietary changes. The good news is that she does not have any disease or shunt requiring surgery. Things could certainly be alot worse. With changes in diet and the medication she shoud be fine. I think we came out ok. Thank you to everyone for their kind words and advice. I will keep you posted.


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

SOOOO glad to hear the news. With a little TLC she will be good as new!!eace: 
laurie


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## Cheryl (Mar 17, 2007)

I am glad that Lola got the best news she could under the circumstances. Keep us posted on how her treatment goes. What dietary changes do you need to make?


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## LuvMyHavanese (Apr 13, 2007)

:cheer2: :whoo: :cheer2: :whoo: :cheer2: :whoo: :cheer2: 

I am so glad for you all!!! Keep us posted. :biggrin1:


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

So glad to hear Maggie is going to be OK. I was feeling very happy that you had this forum to bounce the questions off of. I would have been so frightened and I think having Maddie's mom and Mellisa's info probably helped while you were waiting for the results.


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## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

:drum: :clap2: :cheer2: :lalala: Wonderful news.


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## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Great news!!!! :whoo:


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

That is great news!I hope she continues to do well!:hug:


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## Pearl Menashe (Jun 27, 2007)

Lola, I am so sorry you and Maggie have to go through this. I found this article on this website about Havanese and Liver disease. 
Liver
During my time as HCA president, an article was published stating Havanese was one of the breeds who had a very high incidence of liver issues. We were surprised as that was not something borne out by our club's health survey, the health foundation's ongoing research or by personal experience by most breeders. In looking at the data used for the article, it was found that the author used data only submitted through veterinary school clinics, which often require a referral (and a serious situation) in order to be seen there. The resulting numbers that came in for Havanese represented a very small population of the breed...so small that it was statistically meaningless. Nevertheless, you will read on some websites that all Havansese should have an SA320 blood test (paired bile acids) as a way to screen out liver disease prior to breeding. This claim is simply not borne out with facts. Antech labs (who run the SA320) states in their documentation that both the sensitivity and specificity for this test is low in both areas and that there are many factors which can influence test results. In addition, as part of the health foundation's research, SA320s were run on over a hundred Havanese and did not seem to relate at all to liver disease in Havansese who were otherwise asymptomatic. The same Havanese could have the SA320 test run several times within a week or two and would have vastly different results from the labwork. Some results would be in the normal range, others would be abnormal. If this test were used for routine screening in our breed, it appears that some Havanese who do not have liver disease would be labelled wrongly as having a problem and other Havanese might be seen as being normal when in fact that is not the case. What problems that could cause for breeders who are simply trying to do the "right" thing. Again, at this time I do not perform this test nor do I recommend it as a screening tool. Of course, if your Havanese is small for its age or if it exhibits other signs of liver abnormality you should check first with your vet to see if this is part of further testing that may be needed.


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

I am *SO* thrilled that Maggie's condition is treatable!! That's great news! It was so good you got her in quickly to get this diagnosed and treatment begun. Usually you put a liver dog on a lower protein diet, but not in all cases. Many specialists advise the use of milk thistle (Marin) and Sam-e (Denosyl) as they support the liver, are natural supplements and are made in canine formulas, but I'm sure your specialist will advise you if this is recommended. Give Maggie hugs from all of us, and we're here for support anytime you need us! :grouphug:


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## Olliesmom (Sep 29, 2006)

That is such GREAT news!!! Take care of that cute lil baby!!


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## Doggie Nut (Oct 20, 2006)

Pearl, love your pic of your "cool" hav!!:mullet: :rockon:  So happy to hear that Maggie is going to be ok!!


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Sounds like good news on Maggie. With a change to her diet and the new meds, I hope she is 100% her ole self again in short order. I know she is in good hands with you!


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

I do have a lot of experience with liver problems. My 3 year old dog HAD a liver shunt. I am not sure if that's what Maggie has, but they are common in small breeds. The havanese group actually did a lot of research with Texas A & M on this very thing. The breeder who was very involved in the research is Diane Klumb of Bydand Havanese. Cornell University is the best at dealing with liver shunts. Is Maggie small? Livershunts can stunt the dogs growth and MOST dogs that have them are tiny. Did she have any symptoms? 

My Bella is very tiny. She is 6lbs at 3 years old. She never really had the classic symptoms of a shunt. I forget what they are, but you can google it. I think after they eat they tend to space out and get sick. Normally they show up in puppy hood, but Bella's didn't show up until 1.5 yrs old. I notice she drop weight and was drinking tons of water. I told the vet i thought she had a shunt. I knew a lot about them because I do a lot of reading on the health problem in havanese. They did a BILE ACID test. This is an all day test. Her liver levels were off the charts, so she had to go for an ultrasound. That's when they discovered the shunt. A shunt is were the blood bypasses the liver and goes straight into the bloodstream. I then took her to a specialist and she had surgery within a week. She is totally fine now. If Maggie does have a shunt, please research the surgery. At the time bella has surgery there were 2 types and the one was no good. Do not get the BAND procedure. That's were they take this ring and put it around the shunt and it closes slowly over time. If you need to talk call me 215-601-9016. Do not give her any protein. Talk to your vet about getting her on HILL LD diet. It is a low protein diet. Some shunts do great on special diets alone. I hope everything goes well. Please keep me posted. Try not to worry, she will be fine.
Good luck,
Linda


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

I am new at this and just read the later replys. I am glad Maggie does not have a shunt. Great news!


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Linda,
She does not have the shunt that was the good news. She does notneed the surgery only the diet and denamarin. The specialist said she did not need a change in her diet but my vet is choosing to put her on Royal Canin Hepatic formula. She feels it can only help not hurt her. If the Royal Canin does not do well for her I will try the Hills you reccommended. Also her immunizations will change. She will have to have blood titer done to check her immunity levels. So with this course of treatment things should go well for Maggie.
Chris


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

I am so glad to hear it was not a shunt. Yes, the titers are the best thng. I don't do any shots except rabies at this point. My guys have had their puppy shots and now I only do the titers. Even if the titer reads LOW, you do not need to boost.

Good Luck!


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Thank you Pearl, I will make a note of those tests. Maggie has to have a follow up test in 2 months and I will see if those tests are included.


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

Something we used and had great sucess with was SAM-E. You can buy it at a health food store or in the vitamine section of the grocery store ( I think ) We had a number of dogs on it and all of them did pretty well with a special diet and the SAM-E. I am glad the news was good...good luck


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## Lola (Mar 22, 2007)

Update, Just wanted to let all of you know that Maggie has been on her treatments now for 2 months and she had her repeat blood study and all the test came back normal. No amonia in her blood and the alt's dropped from 325 to 40. That was wonderful news. We were very lucky. Hopefull, we will continue on this same path until the next set of tests in 4 months. Thank you to everyone for sharing info, advice and support.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Great news about Maggie.


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Glad to hear Maggie is doing well! I'm sure she's gone through the worse and will now be on the right track permanently!


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

:clap2:GREAT NEWS!:clap2:
:whoo: :whoo: :whoo:


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

Chris- I just PM'd you, but just want to say again how wonderful it is to hear this news about Maggie! What a great improvement! Keep up the good work and give her lots of hugs from us.


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Phew....glad to hear the good news.


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## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Wonderful News!!!

So glad to hear that little Maggie is back to normal.


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## dboudreau (Jan 12, 2007)

It's great to hear some good news. Thanks for the update.


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

VERY HAPPY TO HEAR MAGGIE IS DOING WELL!!:whoo: :whoo:


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I'm so, so glad to read about Maggie!


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Thank you for letting us know. That's wonderful news!! eace:


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## Lisa Patton (Jan 16, 2020)

MaddiesMom said:


> I'm so sorry to hear about Maggie. Try not to get too upset until you have the full diagnosis. Elevated ALT can be from bacterial infections, toxins, certain medications, etc. I'm sure your vet will rule these out if he hasn't already.
> 
> I did lose my first Havanese from liver disease at age 8. We went through the ultrasound, biopsy, specialist, medications, and I learned alot. Please PM me and I'll give you all the info I have. There are several non-prescription meds that can be given to support the liver and are not harmful to the dog. Plus, there are some great support groups that are full of information. I'll be more than happy to share whatever resources I have.
> 
> Jeanne


Hi Jeanne, my Ziggy who is only 8 months old, has had two ALT test that were elevated at 247. We are about to go through futher testing. I'd love to have any information you have. thank you for your help on this forum.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

Lisa this is a very old thread from 15 years ago.


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