# Best Dog Foods



## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

We currently have two active threads discussing various dog foods that are either being recalled or making dogs sick. What foods are recommended? Are there any universally acclaimed to be among the best. Let's try to break it down into catagories:

Wet Adult
Wet Puppy
Dry Adult
Dry Puppy


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## Ruth4Havs (May 13, 2013)

Puppy Chow has corn in it. We are on Small breed puppy Natural Choice and Chester is doing great on it. He really likes the taste and stuff.


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## Regina (Mar 9, 2013)

Wellness and Fromm would be my choices,...to be even more sure I like to home cook with a diet from Sabine.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

You really don't need to divide it between "dog food" and "puppy food". That is a marketing tactic. Good nutrition for a dog is also good nutrition for a puppy.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

Regina said:


> Wellness and Fromm would be my choices,...to be even more sure I like to home cook with a diet from Sabine.


DITTO!


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

I don't know wet.

Raw- I like Primal or Steve's Real food. Primal is better but my guys love the taste of Steve's.
Best dry in my opinion- Fromm, Acana, Orjens. These companies don't use ingredients from China.


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## DebW (Jun 11, 2013)

My breeder recommended Earth Born Puppy Vantage, so that's what we're using right now.


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## jabojenny (Sep 18, 2011)

Primal Raw
Frozen and Freeze Dried (for when we travel)


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

if you want commercial and an unbiased opinion on which company , I would consult with Sabine,. I you want raw or home cooked consult with Sabine. Here' her list from top to bottom 

Food quality scale Fresh food, raw
Fresh food, cooked
Frozen fresh prepared or raw, freeze dried, dehydrated
Canned food
Dry food


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## puppy-love (Nov 9, 2012)

Canned Wellness and canned Natural Balance

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## MonkeyLove (Aug 3, 2013)

I really like Royal Canin- was on small bites. 
Then i switched to Solid Gold.
Right now we're making the transition back to Royal Canin Hypoallergenic RP to see if its food flaring up his allergies.


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

I have 4 dogs ranging in age from almost 15 years down to Leo's 5.5 months. They range in weight from 70lbs down to Leo's 9.4 lbs. They all eat Fromm Grain-free kibble which is for all life stages. I rotate the various protein sources. All four dogs are doing well on this diet. No allergy, skin, or tummy issues. They all eat reasonably well, Leo being the only one that prefers late evening eating over breakfast and supper. All have beautiful coats and maintain a good body weight - no overweight doggies here.


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## MarinaGirl (Mar 25, 2012)

ZiwiPeak


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## littlebuddy (May 30, 2007)

Glad to hear positive things about Fromm. STarting my dog on pork and applesauce next week.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

MarinaGirl said:


> ZiwiPeak


Just discovered Ziwipeak - I think it's only just made it to the UK; I've been round the houses re food; used raw for my first Coton, Pamba, couldn't get Tycho (second Coton) to touch it with a bargepole, and have since given up on raw. I'm obsessed with the awfulness of wheat, both for dogs and humans, so now use Orijen, which is high protein and with NO grain; dogs don't need grain, it's a cheap filler to enhance profit-margins, not dogs' health, ditto with humans - huge cheap buns with tiny bits of hamburger! I'm boringly evangelical about wheat, I know, sorry! (Read Gary Taubes, if you want to know why!) I tried Ziwipeak treats at class the other day - my trainer is a raw-feeding person but seems impressed by this product. Cuba loved the treats, pure beef or lamb jerky, so I've sent for some of the daily food, both wet and dry in small trial packs to see how we go. Orijen and Ziwipeak are, on the face of it, expensive compared to other foods, but a) I'd save on my own food if it meant getting something good for my dogs (seriously), and b), they seem to eat far less on these high protein foods so I think, in the long run, it probably works out pretty much the same. Far less poo to clear up, too, which is a nice by-product (so to speak!). Both Tychy and Cuba love Fish4Dogs, too.


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## wynne (Apr 30, 2011)

Halo. Never been on a recall list


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## sandypaws (Aug 8, 2012)

i was working at a dog event last weekend and a Fromm rep was there talking about their products. He mentioned that Fromm has never been recalled and is manufactured in the US without products from China. I have not personally used it but did get some samples for Tyler to try.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

sandypaws said:


> i was working at a dog event last weekend and a Fromm rep was there talking about their products. He mentioned that Fromm has never been recalled and is manufactured in the US without products from China. I have not personally used it but did get some samples for Tyler to try.


for sure. Tillie can't have it because of her extreme food allergies, but if we ever get a 2nd Fromm is what I will feed a newbie.


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

sandypaws said:


> i was working at a dog event last weekend and a Fromm rep was there talking about their products. He mentioned that Fromm has never been recalled and is manufactured in the US without products from China. I have not personally used it but did get some samples for Tyler to try.


This played a major role in my switching to Fromm. I chose the grain-free varieties and have been pleased.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

MarinaGirl said:


> ZiwiPeak


My two dogs just LOVE Ziwipeak; I'm switching them over to it slowly, slowly. So far no problems and they wolf it down...so to speak. As far as I can ascertain, and having now talked to a few raw-foody friends, it is the nearest thing to raw without the hassle (and in my case, without the turned up, disgusted noses - dogs' noses, not mine!!) that you can get. It looks completely different to usual kibble, more like jerky. It's really easy to use, and although it appears, on the face of it, to be very expensive, the amount you dish out at each meal for a small dog like a Havanese is tiny. So a pack will go a long way. I haven't yet tried the wet food, only the jerky dry. Might do so, but I'm so happy with the dry that it may not be necessary to ring the changes like that. We'll see. The only thing for small dog owners is that you couldn't buy the largest size bags, (which presumably although a lot of money would work out cheaper in the long run) because you are supposed to use them for 8 weeks only once opened, and couldn't possibly get through the larger bag in that time.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lalla said:


> Just discovered Ziwipeak - I think it's only just made it to the UK; I've been round the houses re food; used raw for my first Coton, Pamba, couldn't get Tycho (second Coton) to touch it with a bargepole, and have since given up on raw. I'm obsessed with the awfulness of wheat, both for dogs and humans, so now use Orijen, which is high protein and with NO grain; dogs don't need grain, it's a cheap filler to enhance profit-margins, not dogs' health, ditto with humans - huge cheap buns with tiny bits of hamburger! I'm boringly evangelical about wheat, I know, sorry! (Read Gary Taubes, if you want to know why!) I tried Ziwipeak treats at class the other day - my trainer is a raw-feeding person but seems impressed by this product. Cuba loved the treats, pure beef or lamb jerky, so I've sent for some of the daily food, both wet and dry in small trial packs to see how we go. Orijen and Ziwipeak are, on the face of it, expensive compared to other foods, but a) I'd save on my own food if it meant getting something good for my dogs (seriously), and b), they seem to eat far less on these high protein foods so I think, in the long run, it probably works out pretty much the same. Far less poo to clear up, too, which is a nice by-product (so to speak!). Both Tychy and Cuba love Fish4Dogs, too.


I would feed Ziwi Peaks if I could afford it. Here in the U.S., for a 16 lb dog, it comes out to about $5.50 per day! I do use it for training treats and have a lot of faith in the company.

I agree completely about grain in dog food... wheat and corn in particular are bad, but I want to avoid grain in general. I am currently feeding Nature's Variety L.I., but am soon switching to a modified home cooked diet using "Balance IT". I'm also going to try Sojo's, (which is another product you mix with fresh, local meat (in my case, it will be local organic chicken and/or turkey) but I think, in the end, I'm going to be happier with the Balance IT, where all the veggies you add are fresh and local too. Sojo contains freeze dried veggies, which are all grown in the U.S., but are not necessarily organic.

I know that many people use and are very happy with Sabine's recipes, but I want something that is fairly easy, while still a step up from the (very good) kibble I'm feeding now. This is not much more trouble than canned, (in some ways less, since I don't have to lug a bunch of cans around) and you aren't paying a premium for all the water in canned dog food. It also means I can divide it up and freeze it in single serving size portions, rather than having open cans of dog food sitting in the refrigerator getting crusty and yucky.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

sandypaws said:


> i was working at a dog event last weekend and a Fromm rep was there talking about their products. He mentioned that Fromm has never been recalled and is manufactured in the US without products from China. I have not personally used it but did get some samples for Tyler to try.


When I switched from Natural Balance Organic, I first bought Fromm's for all the reasons mentioned. But since we were trying to sort out some allergy problems (which in the end turned out to be seasonal, environmental) my vet wanted him on a single protein and single carb food. Fromm's doesn't offer this, which is why I went with Nature's Variety. It, also is completely sourced within the U.S.

As far as recalls are concerned, I respect a company that does VOLUNTARY recalls, and wouldn't hold that against them, if it doesn't happen often.


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## MarinaGirl (Mar 25, 2012)

krandall said:


> I would feed Ziwi Peaks if I could afford it. Here in the U.S., for a 16 lb dog, it comes out to about $5.50 per day! I do use it for training treats and have a lot of faith in the company.


Krandall - I think your estimate of $5.50 a day is too high. When I calculate the cost to feed a Highly Active 16 lb dog I get $3.60 a day - this is using ZiwiPeak's feeding calculator which recommends more than you need to feed (4.7 oz a day), plus I used their cost, which is higher than you would typically pay for a bag of air dried food. I believe the true cost would be $2.50 a day for Kodi.

For me, since Emmie weighs less and is not as active as your dog, the cost is approximately $1.25 a day.

-Jeanne-


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

krandall said:


> I would feed Ziwi Peaks if I could afford it. Here in the U.S., for a 16 lb dog, it comes out to about $5.50 per day! I do use it for training treats and have a lot of faith in the company.
> 
> I agree completely about grain in dog food... wheat and corn in particular are bad, but I want to avoid grain in general.


I'm so confused now since we English went into kilos (I know it's been a few decades, but hey, old habits...) that I can't work out the 16lb/$5.50 a day - it seems an awful lot, I must do my sums and work out if I really CAN afford it!! I hope so, because they do seem to LOVE it, and I think we are past the honeymoon 'yippee, something new' stage. Perhaps I'll just cut out the glass of wine I have with dinner and put the money in a doggy bag...! Very glad you agree with me re grain and corn, Karen; I know I drive some people nuts but it drives ME nuts that people don't get it. There's a truly excellent book on the subject, for humans, by Gary Taubes, as mentioned in an earlier post of mine, (American investigative journalist who has throughly looked at and summed up the research) called "Why We Get Fat" - which is not just about why we get fat, but also why we are so often so unhealthy; I cannot recommend it highly enough, and it has implications for any animal, so is partly why I feel the way I do about dogs eating grain. That, and separate research specifically on canids. ONE day people will wake up to the harm they are doing themselves and their animals. I think it's beginning, and lots of people on this forum seem to be really clued up and clever about it already.


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

We finally decided upon Primal Raw Frozen and it was the best thing we've done. We defrost and refrigerate 3 days at a time, and simply take it from the refrigerator and put it in his bowl. He devours it within 5 minutes as if he's getting people food.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

MarinaGirl said:


> Krandall - I think your estimate of $5.50 a day is too high. When I calculate the cost to feed a Highly Active 16 lb dog I get $3.60 a day - this is using ZiwiPeak's feeding calculator which recommends more than you need to feed (4.7 oz a day), plus I used their cost, which is higher than you would typically pay for a bag of air dried food. I believe the true cost would be $2.50 a day for Kodi.
> 
> For me, since Emmie weighs less and is not as active as your dog, the cost is approximately $1.25 a day.
> 
> -Jeanne-


Gee, it would be great if it were that cheap. If I decide to go back to a store-bought complete food, I'll look into it again.


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## Nancy Collins (Mar 20, 2013)

FYI- I used Sojo's several years ago and was upset to find out they get the ingredient, celery, from CHINA! If they can get it from another source at a reasonable price they do, but if not they get it from China. It took me ALOT of direct questions to get them to finally give me a completely honest answer. The boutique in town where I bought it was equally shocked and she confirmed this information herself. Maybe this has changed now, but I would certainly call/write the company and ask them.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Nancy Collins said:


> FYI- I used Sojo's several years ago and was upset to find out they get the ingredient, celery, from CHINA! If they can get it from another source at a reasonable price they do, but if not they get it from China. It took me ALOT of direct questions to get them to finally give me a completely honest answer. The boutique in town where I bought it was equally shocked and she confirmed this information herself. Maybe this has changed now, but I would certainly call/write the company and ask them.


Thanks for the heads-up. As I said, I think I'm probably foing to end up withBalance-IT, but I'll also check more deeply into the Sojo's.


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## emichel (May 3, 2012)

Lalla said:


> I know I drive some people nuts but it drives ME nuts that people don't get it. There's a truly excellent book on the subject, for humans, by Gary Taubes, as mentioned in an earlier post of mine, (American investigative journalist who has throughly looked at and summed up the research) called "Why We Get Fat" - which is not just about why we get fat, but also why we are so often so unhealthy; I cannot recommend it highly enough, and it has implications for any animal, so is partly why I feel the way I do about dogs eating grain. That, and separate research specifically on canids. ONE day people will wake up to the harm they are doing themselves and their animals.


It kind of drives me nuts when people get fanatical about whatever diet de jour they are into. Paleo seems to be the big thing these days, but it too shall pass. Re: carbs, I think it is foolish to equate donuts and other refined white wheat flour products with natural whole grains. In my view, and that of many others, (not bothering to cite sources here, but if you're really interested I can provide them), a primarily plant based diet made up of beans, whole grains, fruits and veggies, and a bit of dairy and lean animal protein, is optimum for both humans and the environment. A lot of people seem confused by the fact that although dogs don't _need_ carbohydrates per se, they can still benefit from the nutrients provided by whole grains provided that there are no allergies. As much as I love my dog, I am also an ardent environmentalist and am extremely alarmed by the impact that the meat industry has on the environment. Although of course organic sustainably raised meat is much better and preferable to what I would call industrially raised meat, it is still resource intensive and very expensive, and in my view should be used as a supplement rather than a primary dietary source. I am not vegan or even vegetarian, but am trying to eat more plant based and less animal based food myself. I eat a lot of whole grains and am quite healthy and not fat. Getting a dog has been eye opening for me. Of course they love meat, but can benefit from other food sources as well and for me the health of the whole planet has to be factored in along with my love for my dog. I am feeding Benjamin a home cooked diet created by the one and only Sabine  and it includes some whole grain brown rice and oats, at my request, due to the above mentioned concerns. He is doing great on it. I don't think it's helpful to imply that people who don't subscribe to our exact same dietary beliefs are clueless and need to "wake up". That having been said, I guess I do think that people who eat a lot of processed food, meat, and refined carbs also need to wake up, so call me a hypocrite. Ha ha. The point is... refined carbs and whole grains are entirely different things, and too often people lump them together and declare that all carbs are evil. Also, mainly I think that people eat too much, especially Americans! and feed their dogs way too much as well. OK, rant off. Peace.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Rants could run and run, couldn't they. So I'll stop.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I'd like to clarify my views and what _I_ am doing. I took grain (not all carbohydrates) out of Kodi's diet while we were tracking down an allergy problem. Because he has shown signs of allergy in the past, (though most likely seasonal environmental) it makes most sense to keep him on a limited ingredient diet, at least for now. BTW, that means limited protein sources too, not just carbs.

As far as I am concerned for myself, I do not avoid grains in general. (I start many mornings with a bowl of oatmeal! ) I DO buy organic food as much as possible, and avoid GMO food sources. I, personally, have removed WHEAT from my diet because I have RA, an autoimmune inflammatory disease. Wheat is a known cause of inflammation in some people (it doesn't matter whether it's non-GMO, organic, etc... it is the wheat itself) so I keep wheat out of my diet as much as possible. 

Since I started doing that early last fall, my joints have been consistently better, and I am close to weaning completely off prednisone for the first time in 7 years!!! I've been doing well enough that I brought my horse home a week and a half ago, and have started riding again. (I'm hurting all over, but it is muscle aches from lack of use - my joints are holding up fine! )

So I am NOT anti grain, nor anti-carb. (though I have avoided refined carbs for many years... I think most will agree that refined carbs aren't good for anyone or anything!) I think that people who have allergies or any type of inflammatory disease should at least TRY taking wheat out of their diet, and see if it makes them feel better. If not, it's easy to add back in again. Dairy is another problem food for many people, though, thankfully, not for me. I'd have to slit my wrists if someone took my cheese away. :laugh:


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## emichel (May 3, 2012)

Lalla said:


> Rants could run and run, couldn't they. So I'll stop.


Good. This is not feeling very friendly, and in spite of what you might think I am neither stupid nor uneducated on the issues. Anyone have any cute puppy pics?


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## MarinaGirl (Mar 25, 2012)

Emmie at Volunteer Park (Seattle) last weekend.


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## emichel (May 3, 2012)

Wow, Jeanne, I didn't know Emmie had magical anti-gravity powers! Ha ha. That is a great picture of her, thanks for posting it.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

emichel said:


> Good. This is not feeling very friendly, and in spite of what you might think I am neither stupid nor uneducated on the issues. Anyone have any cute puppy pics?


I'm completely mystified as to why you think I was saying or thinking that YOU are 'stupid [or] uneducated'???!!!! How can you possibly have taken personally a reply to krandall where, in totally general terms, I say that people often don't read research?! Or that they don't get it! They don't, often! I didn't say YOU don't get it!!! In reply to YOUR mention of 'rants' (you ended your post with the words 'rant off', so I was picking up on that, I simply stopped MYSELF from ranting!!! This food business does bring out some strong opinions, but that's fine, isn't it? I am truly sorry if you should for one moment think that I was being unfriendly! But I honestly don't understand how you reached that conclusion. Forgive me anyway.


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

emichel said:


> Wow, Jeanne, I didn't know Emmie had magical anti-gravity powers! Ha ha. That is a great picture of her, thanks for posting it.


That's nothing - check out these two:

http://www.havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=29058


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## Ruth4Havs (May 13, 2013)

emichel said:


> Anyone have any cute puppy pics?


Here's one to make you smile.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Ruth4Havs said:


> Here's one to make you smile.
> View attachment 62322


Love that boy!


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

What a cute smiling pic of baby Chester!


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## sandypaws (Aug 8, 2012)

Sideways Emmie and Chester's big sleepy smile made me smile. 

What else made me smile was the fact that Karen has her horse back home and she can ride again :cheer2: I know it's been a long time coming, Karen. Hope you enjoy every bounce. Totally off subject here, what does Kodi,think of his new playmate?


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## Ruthiec (Jun 18, 2013)

Thanks Ruth. We can't help but have happy thoughts with a picture like that.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

sandypaws said:


> Sideways Emmie and Chester's big sleepy smile made me smile.
> 
> What else made me smile was the fact that Karen has her horse back home and she can ride again :cheer2: I know it's been a long time coming, Karen. Hope you enjoy every bounce. Totally off subject here, what does Kodi,think of his new playmate?


Kodi has been a PROBLEM in terms of his new "playmate". He WON'T stay out of the paddock. So far, Oliver has been very good about being chased by a small dog, and has just graciously moved out of his way. But one kick... So one of the chores for the weekend is finding and installing some type of mesh onto the wooden fence that will keep Kodi on THIS side!

Back to the food subject...

I cooked Kodi's food with Balance-IT for the first time today. Chicken and potato with kale and blueberries (both cooked) added. He ate like he'd never been fed in his entire life.

The Sojo's arrived too, but I haven't tried that yet.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

MarinaGirl said:


> Krandall - I think your estimate of $5.50 a day is too high. When I calculate the cost to feed a Highly Active 16 lb dog I get $3.60 a day - this is using ZiwiPeak's feeding calculator which recommends more than you need to feed (4.7 oz a day), plus I used their cost, which is higher than you would typically pay for a bag of air dried food. I believe the true cost would be $2.50 a day for Kodi.
> 
> For me, since Emmie weighs less and is not as active as your dog, the cost is approximately $1.25 a day.
> 
> -Jeanne-


Do you find the Ziwipeak calculation of amount needed to be right, MarinaGirl? It seems an incredibly little amount to me, and I worry that my dogs aren't getting enough food! Probably silly of me....?


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## MarinaGirl (Mar 25, 2012)

FYI - my first name is Jeanne. 

Emmie is fed moist/canned food in the morning and air-dried food in the evening. The ZiwiPeak calculator says to feed her approx. 1 full can per day (so 1/2 can per meal), which is more than what I give her - she gets 1/4 can for breakfast. But the calculator for air-dried seems about right. I feed her 3/4 scoop for dinner.

Their dog feeding instructions are helpful.: http://www.ziwipeak.com/dog-feeding-instructions/

_Calculating an exact amount to feed every individual dog is a very difficult task as every dog is different. The amounts you feed are dependent on many key issues such as:

- The dogs level of activity
- The metabolism of the animal
- The climate and living conditions
- The owners perception of the correct weight for their own pet

Our Feeding Calculator will provide you with a safe and trusted starting point. Once you have been feeding ZiwiPeak for a little while you will need to fine tune the amount you are feeding.

- Adjust the amount you feed if your dog gains or loses weight beyond its desirable weight range.
- If your dog is losing weight please feed it more food, if it is gaining weight then feed it less food._


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

MarinaGirl said:


> FYI - my first name is Jeanne.
> 
> Emmie is fed moist/canned food in the morning and air-dried food in the evening. The ZiwiPeak calculator says to feed her approx. 1 full can per day (so 1/2 can per meal), which is more than what I give her - she gets 1/4 can for breakfast. But the calculator for air-dried seems about right. I feed her 3/4 scoop for dinner.[/I]


Thank you, Jeanne - as soon as I'd posted it I realised it was "Jeanne"! I'll have another look at the website. I haven't yet tried the canned food - I got three half tins to try, but was getting them onto the air-dried first; cans obviously contain a lot of water, so I guess that's why you can give rather more that way; I think it's just a sort of anthropomorphic sense that it seems a rather miserable little meal that's over with in a thrice, but I don't suppose dogs particularly want to dawdle over three courses like us!! And at least, with ZiwiPeak, for the first time in 6 years with Tycho, my Coton, it actually IS over with in a thrice! No dawdling, he loves it. So does Cuba. I think the worry that there is not enough is that I'm shocked to see it all disappear!!


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

*Switching Leo to Ziwipeak*

So I got tired of watching Leo pick at his food. I have been reading about raw feeding for awhile, however, I'm not quite ready to take the plunge for all my dogs. Commercial raw would simply be too expensive for my budget for 4 dogs and I'm still researching local options for prey model feeding. I have decided to give Ziwipeak air-dried a try with Leo. He has been eating less of his kibble and had started losing more weight than he needed to. So we started at supper tonight with half a scoop which he inhaled. It was gone so fast! He looked around for more but I decided we would stop there for tonight and try more in the morning if he seems to handle the new food ok. Normally, I would mix in a bit of a new food and slowly transition but Leo has pretty much stopped eating his kibble so a different approach was called for. Hopefully, he will eat the Ziwipeak at least until I decide if and how I want to go to raw for all our dogs. All the choices hence decisions about our furry kids diets is exhausting!

Update - Leo ate quickly again this morning and really seems to love the Ziwipeak Lamb. No tummy issues. Smaller firm stool this morning. I think this might work. Yay!


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