# 5 1/2 months - lost sanity. Just venting a little.



## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Ever get to the point where you pause in the middle of another crazy day and take a 5 second break, look around and wonder "What the hell did I get myself into?!" I remember feeling this exact feeling when my daughter was about 3 years old. She was no longer easy to take places, she had opinions that could not be changed, she was very vocal about what she wanted and when things didn't go her way and I just stood there and looked at the front door wondering how far away I could get. Obviously I didn't leave and Zoe is the best thing that's ever happened to me and my husband but being a parent is hard. I think I've hit that point with Indy. Six months in puppy years = three years for toddlers.

My house is ignored most days because he has serious separation issues (not to the point of hurting himself or excessive drooling but the pacing and whimpering and if I actually leave the house he'll start howling after about thirty minutes). I don't think I've been in the upstairs floor in as long as we've had him. The living room and kitchen are constantly decorated with bits of sticks, grass or whatever he's brought in from the backyard so even though I sweep daily it never looks clean. I miss the area rug that was moved out of the living room when Indy moved in. I used to go to the gym for classes daily and now I'm lucky if I get there once every two weeks (and I'm sure the lack of exercise doesn't help with my mental state).

The couple of times Indy has gotten free reign of the house (I thought he was downstairs with my visiting Dad) he went all the way upstairs and shredded an entire roll of toilet paper. He doesn't walk on a leash well and wants to play with every dog and kid that walks by so he's pulling on the leash when we walk past anyone so walking really isn't very enjoyable. He's mastered Sit, Lay down, Shake, Dance, Off and will Go Potty on command but Stay, Here, Out (from one room to another) and Drop It are all struggles. I don't enjoy training like I know so many people do and at this point I'm sure my frustration is showing through.

The past few days his poop has gotten softer and softer which means a half bath at least once a day (he HATES being combed out so that's always fun). He's been on the same food for almost exactly a month now but I'm wondering if it's a little too high in protein (http://www.platinum.com/index.php/en/our-products-dry-dogfood/puppy-chicken.html). They just recently started carrying Blue Buffalo at the PX so I'm contemplating switching him to that to see if it helps. It just feels like every time I turn around we're taking him to the vet (ear infection followed by kennel cough = 3am vet visit and the three visits for antibiotics).

I just need a place to vent where people will understand that I'm frustrated but that I don't want to "get rid of him" (I was complaining to a friend and that was the advice I was given - mental note to not complain about my kid or husband to this person). Kind of like when the toddler has pulled all the books off the bookshelf for the 324237th time and you need to complain to another Mom who will smile, tell you it does get easier and remind you to take pictures anyway. I love my dog, he's just making me bat****crazy at this particular point.

It's a real good thing these fur balls are so cute.


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## Tuss (Apr 22, 2012)

welcome to puppy adolescence! this is why god my puppies so cute! When Gemma was this age i think i said out loud about 10 times a day "it's a good thing you're cute"... They start testing their limits at this age and starting trying to see what they can get away with. You need to be firm with them and let them know what is allowed and what isn't. Lots and lots of positive reinforcement for good behaviours. Don't be afraid to use a "time out". The howling may be separation anxiety, but it might just be a learned behaviour that the puppy has used to get your attention that he wants. he has learned that he howls and you come running back to him. You might have to ignore the howling and the second he stops run back and give him lots of love. He will learn that howling doesn't get him attention but quiet does! you might also need to just put him in the x-pen/crate for an hour, put in some ear plugs, put the radio on loud on a talk-radio station so he doesn't feel all alone and then get your housework done. don't feel guilty about it. You can't let him totally take over your life. he has to fit into your world somewhat!

I also did obedience training and started around that age. These dogs are extremely intelligent and really want to please their human. Obedience (or agility or any sort of training) is mentally very stimulating to them and a great bonding experience for both of you. It exercises their brain and tires them out (and keeps them out of mischief). After a training session my puppy is completely exhausted and just collapses for a long nap. 

Also, lots of exercise will help, a tired puppy is a happy owner. While your puppy is napping you will get a break to get some much needed work done!

it will get better, but you have to train him and don't let him totally train you. I'm sure Dave will chime in with better advise and an appropriate article for you like he always does. Soon he will be all grown up and you will wonder where your cute little puppy went!


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

As my mother used to say to me ALL the time - and I found to be so true

"this too, will pass" 

No one can ever tell me that dogs are not like kids! They go thru the same phases!!


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

To clarify on the howling, the reason I think it's a separation issue is because he ONLY howls when he's alone. My computer has been moved into the living room/kitchen area so there's something else to do while keeping an eye on Indy and we use a sound/motion activated camera to keep an eye on him while he is alone. If we didn't have that set up we'd have no idea he has such a hard time when we're gone. He's always excited to see his people again but there's never a mess and he isn't wet with drool. Because of the camera we know about the whimpering and random howling. Without that proof we'd never even know he was capable of making that sound.


I use the "this too shall pass" saying with my daughter all the time (yea for 11 year old emotional time bombs?) and have started using it a lot more often since bringing Indy home 


Indy also goes to a puppy kindergarten once a week (although last weeks was canceled) but it's more free play with other puppies. We also have a trainer that comes to work with us but after our last lesson we were supposed to get a hold of her after Indy was reliably walking on a leash so we could move on to riding trains (it's a German thing, dogs on trains all the time) and we haven't gotten to that place yet. I'm thinking of getting a hold of her anyway just to see if there's anything else I can or should be doing with the leash work.


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## Atticus (May 17, 2011)

Yes getting the leash work down will help a lot. In my experience many dog issues can be solved with exercise and it's hard to get exercise with out good walks! At home on rainy days I did lots of ball throwing. It is so hard and frustrating but you will get through it!!!! He is adorable!!! Hang in there!


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Atticus said:


> Yes getting the leash work down will help a lot. In my experience many dog issues can be solved with exercise and it's hard to get exercise with out good walks! At home on rainy days I did lots of ball throwing. It is so hard and frustrating but you will get through it!!!! He is adorable!!! Hang in there!


We have some amazing paths to walk around here. We are right off the vineyards so it is possible to walk for a mile or so without running into anyone. However, it is (finally) spring so it's constantly raining and it's too cold to walk around in the wet (but man does this dog LOVE mud puddles!) so we've been stuck inside a lot the past few days. Fetch is only so amusing after an hour...


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## PiedPiper (Apr 30, 2013)

Indy is adorable!  I have only had Piper for 2 weeks so I have absolutely no advice to offer, but fwiw, I know exactly how you feel. We planned like crazy before we decided to get a puppy and I thought I knew what I was getting myself into...but nope. It still hit me like a ton of bricks. I definitely am not a fan of the puppy stage. I don't want to give my dog away, but I am definitely counting down the days until she's older. 

I hope whatever phase Indy is in that it passes quickly for you!


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## jabojenny (Sep 18, 2011)

Been there done that  it does get better.

Keep working on leash skills. I was very persistent with Tim learning how to walk nicely on a leash. Exercise is key in getting this age dog to expend energy and get some mental stimulation. One of the reasons I got a dog was to get my rear off the couch but I wanted to keep my gym schedule as well. If you know Indy isn't upset when you leave why don't you turn off the camera when you're gone? I used to use a camera but found that I was obsessing over every little thing and worrying unnecessarily so I scaled back, which helps. You need your time alone and Indy needs to learn you can't be around all the time. I know Tim complains but he eventually calms down, sometimes I come home and he's in such a deep sleep he doesn't even wake up, but that's because I'll usually take him for a brisk walk before I go out. I'm sure you're trainer has given you some good advice about leash walking, and I know it's pain to have to go through these steps when all you want to do is go outside and just walk, but in the long run if you keep up with this training Indy will learn to walk on a leash. I dreaded having to bring treats, target sticks or whatever else was needed in the beginning training Tim to walk nicely on a leash, but now he's a gem and it's one of my favorite things to do.

Keep your chin up. We're here to listen to "venters" trust me I've vented here plenty of times.

Just an FYI though Timmy is now about a year and a half, my house is still trashed, my area rugs are not back down (I just found them the other day ound, Tim's toys are everywhere etc... I just changed my priorities which in some ways has made me appreciate a lot more of the little things.


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## swaye (Mar 28, 2013)

Our Sofie is 4 1/2 months and she tests us already. We all have our mental, physical, geographical,and financial limitations. It seems most have to through these trying and testy times. I would be at a lost without walking. FETCH is good for maybe 10 minutes and then she loses interest. She knows all of the basic commands and tricks (still go through them daily although it is mundane). She knows and does leave it command, but Hastert do it outside of training session. Drop it she does sometimes we have those yet to master. I was wondering what kind of harness you were using for walks Krandall advised me to get a Sensi-ble or Easy Walk harness to minimize pulling. What a difference!! Walks are improving daily. She still gets very excited and loses all focus if she sees people or another dog. Most times when I turn het around and stop and she will get refocused and we can continue. I too think you should get to your gym gym class. Howling is distressing to hear, but isn't hurting her. We had a German Shepherd that bent her crate with her teeth and broke part of her tooth. She had severe separation anxiety and we had to give meds in addition to desensitization training. Good luck.


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## Flynn Gentry-Taylor (Jan 17, 2008)

m0rg4n said:


> Ever get to the point where you pause in the middle of another crazy day and take a 5 second break, look around and wonder "What the hell did I get myself into?!" I remember feeling this exact feeling when my daughter was about 3 years old. She was no longer easy to take places, she had opinions that could not be changed, she was very vocal about what she wanted and when things didn't go her way and I just stood there and looked at the front door wondering how far away I could get. Obviously I didn't leave and Zoe is the best thing that's ever happened to me and my husband but being a parent is hard. I think I've hit that point with Indy. Six months in puppy years = three years for toddlers.
> 
> My house is ignored most days because he has serious separation issues (not to the point of hurting himself or excessive drooling but the pacing and whimpering and if I actually leave the house he'll start howling after about thirty minutes). I don't think I've been in the upstairs floor in as long as we've had him. The living room and kitchen are constantly decorated with bits of sticks, grass or whatever he's brought in from the backyard so even though I sweep daily it never looks clean. I miss the area rug that was moved out of the living room when Indy moved in. I used to go to the gym for classes daily and now I'm lucky if I get there once every two weeks (and I'm sure the lack of exercise doesn't help with my mental state).
> 
> ...


I understand your frustration, and I am not faulting you for being impatient. But your post made me think that perhaps a full grown, already trained dog would have worked better for you. I only say this because I do think ALL people seem to want a puppy, but then realize a puppy is a lot of work. And true, some of the things you are talking about will not change with age...the sticks on the floor (he has to walk somewhere there are not sticks for this to change)..mine still bring in all kinds of trash on their feet. There are certain things which come with a dog or puppy, food and water bowls, paw prints on floors and sliding glass doors, gates to keep them in range so you can watch them...on and on...
Yes, this too shall pass, but also the cute things puppies do will pass too, try to enjoy those more and concentrate on some age appropriate training which will make these next few months easier and more rewarding for you both...i.e, "go to mat"...:wave::wave:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

m0rg4n said:


> Ever get to the point where you pause in the middle of another crazy day and take a 5 second break, look around and wonder "What the hell did I get myself into?!" I remember feeling this exact feeling when my daughter was about 3 years old. She was no longer easy to take places, she had opinions that could not be changed, she was very vocal about what she wanted and when things didn't go her way and I just stood there and looked at the front door wondering how far away I could get. Obviously I didn't leave and Zoe is the best thing that's ever happened to me and my husband but being a parent is hard. I think I've hit that point with Indy. Six months in puppy years = three years for toddlers.
> 
> My house is ignored most days because he has serious separation issues (not to the point of hurting himself or excessive drooling but the pacing and whimpering and if I actually leave the house he'll start howling after about thirty minutes). I don't think I've been in the upstairs floor in as long as we've had him. The living room and kitchen are constantly decorated with bits of sticks, grass or whatever he's brought in from the backyard so even though I sweep daily it never looks clean. I miss the area rug that was moved out of the living room when Indy moved in. I used to go to the gym for classes daily and now I'm lucky if I get there once every two weeks (and I'm sure the lack of exercise doesn't help with my mental state).
> 
> ...


Ha! I LOVE this post! I think it should be on a sticky, right up there with how to find a breeder. It should be called, "Are you sure you REALLY want to get into this!?!?!" 

Yes, I think we've all been where you are, both with kids and with puppies. There are actually a couple of GREAT thing about puppies as opposed to kids. First, if it really gets to you, you can always stick them in their crate and LEAVE for a few hours without getting arrested. Second, they DO grow out of it MUCH faster than human kids do!!!.


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## Tia (Nov 28, 2012)

I'm sure things will improve. I'm glad your being honest about what your going through because we can all relate in some way.

I agree that the exercise may be a key to intersecting into some other issues. Do you have a harness? I found this much better as a collar I was concerned with hurting Dougs neck. A harness will give you more control without hurting.

Also try some fetch or some form of exercise before walking that might help her be more obliging. Also I found when I walked Doug that I would let him have a few good sniffs when first going outside and from there it was my pace.

With the separation anxiety I used to be in the shower and could hear Doug howling. I followed tips from the forum from everyone. I found what worked was consistency. Not letting Doug out until he was quiet. Ignoring him when I first came home (I think this is really important), giving him awesome treats when going out - he knows these particular treats he only gets when I leave and they last ages to occupy him, some hard exercise before heading out. I opt for a run around the yard Doug will chase me for much longer then he will play fetch.

I agree with turning off the camera. You can't be home all the time and you can't be stressed the whole time your not there. Dogs can be left home. Doug is left a couple of days when we are both at work all day at first I had people checking in on him but he just spent the day sleeping. Now I have just asked my neighbours to let me know if they hear any distressing crying otherwise I am comfortable leaving him because I know he has plenty to do and it's not all the time just when DHs roster changes.

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## Tia (Nov 28, 2012)

Sorry he not she!! My bad 

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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

m0rg4n said:


> To clarify on the howling, the reason I think it's a separation issue is because he ONLY howls when he's alone. My computer has been moved into the living room/kitchen area so there's something else to do while keeping an eye on Indy and we use a sound/motion activated camera to keep an eye on him while he is alone. If we didn't have that set up we'd have no idea he has such a hard time when we're gone. He's always excited to see his people again but there's never a mess and he isn't wet with drool. Because of the camera we know about the whimpering and random howling. Without that proof we'd never even know he was capable of making that sound.


Whether it's separation anxiety or demand behavior, you need to slowly work through it, by leaving him for longer and longer periods (starting very short) I'd turn the video camera OFF! This is his problem to work out! 



m0rg4n said:


> Indy also goes to a puppy kindergarten once a week (although last weeks was canceled) but it's more free play with other puppies. We also have a trainer that comes to work with us but after our last lesson we were supposed to get a hold of her after Indy was reliably walking on a leash so we could move on to riding trains (it's a German thing, dogs on trains all the time) and we haven't gotten to that place yet. I'm thinking of getting a hold of her anyway just to see if there's anything else I can or should be doing with the leash work.


I actually like that your puppy K is mostly play, though at Indy's age, puppies have usually finished that kind of puppy K. But it is invaluable social skills training, and as long as he's benefitting from it (enjoying it) and you are allowed to do it with him, I'd keep it up. At our training center, puppy classes are only for dogs under 6 months. Then they go into "continuing education" classes. The reason being that older dogs and puppies play very differently. Also by 6 months, some are starting to mature sexually, which changes the whole dynamic.

But I would DEFINITELY get in touch with your private trainer again. Loose leash walking is NOT an easy or quick thing to teach, especially if you have a very active and/or distractible pup, and ESPECIALLY when they are entering adolescence. The trainer may be able to help you get him over the hump more quickly.

I'll be honest, Kodi is great on the leash now, but he was COMPETING, doing good heeling in the performance ring, well before he was RELIABLY walking on a loose leash under all conditions on the street. The more distractions, the more likely he was to lose his mind and start to pull. He was over a year before we could go on a walk without me working on it almost constantly, and over two before he wouldn't need reminders from time to time. By his third year, though, all that work had REALLY paid off. He and I are a total team now. I never have to even think about the leash... We can just enjoy each other's company. And since we could very likely have another 12 years of walks ahead of us, it was well worth the persistence it took to get here.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

PiedPiper said:


> Indy is adorable!  I have only had Piper for 2 weeks so I have absolutely no advice to offer, but fwiw, I know exactly how you feel. We planned like crazy before we decided to get a puppy and I thought I knew what I was getting myself into...but nope. It still hit me like a ton of bricks. I definitely am not a fan of the puppy stage. I don't want to give my dog away, but I am definitely counting down the days until she's older.
> 
> I hope whatever phase Indy is in that it passes quickly for you!


We have a member who coined the term, "Post Pup-dom Depression"


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

jabojenny said:


> Been there done that  it does get better.
> 
> Keep working on leash skills. I was very persistent with Tim learning how to walk nicely on a leash. Exercise is key in getting this age dog to expend energy and get some mental stimulation. One of the reasons I got a dog was to get my rear off the couch but I wanted to keep my gym schedule as well. If you know Indy isn't upset when you leave why don't you turn off the camera when you're gone? I used to use a camera but found that I was obsessing over every little thing and worrying unnecessarily so I scaled back, which helps. You need your time alone and Indy needs to learn you can't be around all the time. I know Tim complains but he eventually calms down, sometimes I come home and he's in such a deep sleep he doesn't even wake up, but that's because I'll usually take him for a brisk walk before I go out. I'm sure you're trainer has given you some good advice about leash walking, and I know it's pain to have to go through these steps when all you want to do is go outside and just walk, but in the long run if you keep up with this training Indy will learn to walk on a leash. I dreaded having to bring treats, target sticks or whatever else was needed in the beginning training Tim to walk nicely on a leash, but now he's a gem and it's one of my favorite things to do.
> 
> ...


When we were out walking this morning Indy wasn't even paying attention to the treats I had grabbed. They work for when we're at home but I need to find something far more tasty for outside the house.

I also know that the house will always have a little extra nature inside and that puppy toys will be everywhere - much like toddler toys. You can put them away but they never stay there for long and in the grand scheme this is my smallest issue but when you feel like you're losing on all fronts it seems important. I'm also mentally looking through the house to find a new home for the area rug - it's nice and Indy hasn't had an accident but he really enjoys chewing on the edges of the rugs he can get to. I also LOVE how fast it is to mop the entire main floor!


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Flynn Gentry-Taylor said:


> I understand your frustration, and I am not faulting you for being impatient. But your post made me think that perhaps a full grown, already trained dog would have worked better for you. I only say this because I do think ALL people seem to want a puppy, but then realize a puppy is a lot of work. And true, some of the things you are talking about will not change with age...the sticks on the floor (he has to walk somewhere there are not sticks for this to change)..mine still bring in all kinds of trash on their feet. There are certain things which come with a dog or puppy, food and water bowls, paw prints on floors and sliding glass doors, gates to keep them in range so you can watch them...on and on...
> Yes, this too shall pass, but also the cute things puppies do will pass too, try to enjoy those more and concentrate on some age appropriate training which will make these next few months easier and more rewarding for you both...i.e, "go to mat"...:wave::wave:


A full grown trained dog would have been fantastic! However finding a full grown dog here that isn't a rescue from another country is pretty much impossible - especially if you aren't a local so you don't speak the language or know where to start looking. Our choices were through a breeder (and finding one that would deal with Americans too a looong time) or from someone on base who was moving and couldn't take their dog for whatever reason - this option usually involved a dog that had little to no training and was being left behind because the family either couldn't deal with the time necessary or they were moving somewhere that didn't allow pets (the joys of living in the military). My husband and daughter wanted a puppy for a few different reasons but it took a long time to talk me into it simply because I'm the one at home so I knew I'd be the one in charge. Indy is part of our family and I wouldn't trade him out for the world, he's just making me a little crazy.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

m0rg4n said:


> When we were out walking this morning Indy wasn't even paying attention to the treats I had grabbed. They work for when we're at home but I need to find something far more tasty for outside the house.
> 
> I also know that the house will always have a little extra nature inside and that puppy toys will be everywhere - much like toddler toys. You can put them away but they never stay there for long and in the grand scheme this is my smallest issue but when you feel like you're losing on all fronts it seems important. I'm also mentally looking through the house to find a new home for the area rug - it's nice and Indy hasn't had an accident but he really enjoys chewing on the edges of the rugs he can get to. I also LOVE how fast it is to mop the entire main floor!


Kodi was AWFUL about chewing the fringe on my oriental rugs. (which are in every room) It would probably have been easier to pull all the rugs up for the duration, but I figured he needed to live with them and leave them alone eventually, so he might as well start from the beginning. After trying many different methods to keep him from chewing the fringe, I hit on one that worked... FAST and permanently. I got strips of cloth and pinned them to the edges of the rugs, covering his favorite chew spots. Then I dabbed the cloth with the HOTTEST hot sauce I could find. (I did the same with electric and computer cords, since he was going after them at about the same time) ONE TASTE was all that was needed. He cried and wiped his mouth all over the floor. I felt a LITTLE bad, but OTOH, he was ruining expensive rugs, and in danger of killing himself on cords. After that ONE taste, he would back away and go WAY around anything he smelled hot sauce on.  After fighting with him about chewing things for a couple of months (he laughed at that bitter apple stuff!!!) he TOTALLY stopped inappropriate chewing in less than a week. Yes, my house looked kind of funny for a week, with pieces of cloth pinned to things, but it was WELL worth it.


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

krandall said:


> Ha! I LOVE this post! I think it should be on a sticky, right up there with how to find a breeder. It should be called, "Are you sure you REALLY want to get into this!?!?!"
> 
> Yes, I think we've all been where you are, both with kids and with puppies. There are actually a couple of GREAT thing about puppies as opposed to kids. First, if it really gets to you, you can always stick them in their crate and LEAVE for a few hours without getting arrested. Second, they DO grow out of it MUCH faster than human kids do!!!.


If he could just come to the gym and grocery store with me there'd be no problems! ... because I'm sure that wouldn't bring a different set of issues with it. I'm sure Indy would really enjoy a yoga class


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## PiedPiper (Apr 30, 2013)

krandall said:


> We have a member who coined the term, "Post Pup-dom Depression"


I actually googled (I google everything! LOL) a couple days after we got Piper because I was sure I was losing my mind. There are tons of posts out there for "Puppy blues" and "puppy depression". It helped to know that I wasn't alone!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

m0rg4n said:


> If he could just come to the gym and grocery store with me there'd be no problems! ... because I'm sure that wouldn't bring a different set of issues with it. I'm sure Indy would really enjoy a yoga class


I bet he would! But I also suspect he might be a WEE bit of a distraction. OTOH, he could always demo "Downward Dog" for everyone!


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Tia said:


> I'm sure things will improve. I'm glad your being honest about what your going through because we can all relate in some way.
> 
> I agree that the exercise may be a key to intersecting into some other issues. Do you have a harness? I found this much better as a collar I was concerned with hurting Dougs neck. A harness will give you more control without hurting.
> 
> ...


We started with this harness: 








but he would just pull and pull so when he'd outgrown it we picked up a sensible front lead. We've only been working with it for about a week now so it's hard to say there's been a drastic difference. He's also started marking everything so it feels like he's stopping to pee every five feet (even after thirty minutes of walking - he's just lifting his leg but nothings happening!). I try to just keep walking but I feel bad "dragging" him.

We just picked up a new treat that he loves but he ONLY gets it when he's in the crate with the door shut. He won't even touch it the entire time I'm gone but then grabs it and wants to eat it when I'm home and he's out (another sign of anxiety). Before we'd let him have it but with this new treat (and a new larger crate) he only gets it when he's inside and it disappears when he comes out. I've also been putting him in at random during the day when I am home, give him the treat and shut the door and leave him for a bit - then let him out and take the treat up. This is new from today so I don't know how it'll work but so far he still won't touch the treat while he's locked up but he doesn't howl when I'm home and he just watches me walk around with a little whimpering if it's longer than five minutes.


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

krandall said:


> Whether it's separation anxiety or demand behavior, you need to slowly work through it, by leaving him for longer and longer periods (starting very short) I'd turn the video camera OFF! This is his problem to work out!
> 
> I actually like that your puppy K is mostly play, though at Indy's age, puppies have usually finished that kind of puppy K. But it is invaluable social skills training, and as long as he's benefitting from it (enjoying it) and you are allowed to do it with him, I'd keep it up. At our training center, puppy classes are only for dogs under 6 months. Then they go into "continuing education" classes. The reason being that older dogs and puppies play very differently. Also by 6 months, some are starting to mature sexually, which changes the whole dynamic.
> 
> ...


At nearly 6 months Indy should be moved up to the older dogs group but he's just so tiny I think they let him stay in the puppy class. The other dogs in the older group are almost all large breeds so he wouldn't be able to play with them as safely and so far he still is so gentle with the little ones that it hasn't been an issue at all Plus even the "puppies" are mostly labs, standard poodles and other larger dogs so he's just about par in terms of weight. I do think he'll be moved up to the next class in the next week or so.

I'll be sure to give the trainer a call this week. I love walking out here because it's just so pretty and there's so much space so it's something I really want him to ~get~. I also know it will be easier for him to learn this in the middle of the vineyards as opposed to the middle of maryland. He can be a spoiled german puppy for the next two years.


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

krandall said:


> Kodi was AWFUL about chewing the fringe on my oriental rugs. (which are in every room) It would probably have been easier to pull all the rugs up for the duration, but I figured he needed to live with them and leave them alone eventually, so he might as well start from the beginning. After trying many different methods to keep him from chewing the fringe, I hit on one that worked... FAST and permanently. I got strips of cloth and pinned them to the edges of the rugs, covering his favorite chew spots. Then I dabbed the cloth with the HOTTEST hot sauce I could find. (I did the same with electric and computer cords, since he was going after them at about the same time) ONE TASTE was all that was needed. He cried and wiped his mouth all over the floor. I felt a LITTLE bad, but OTOH, he was ruining expensive rugs, and in danger of killing himself on cords. After that ONE taste, he would back away and go WAY around anything he smelled hot sauce on.  After fighting with him about chewing things for a couple of months (he laughed at that bitter apple stuff!!!) he TOTALLY stopped inappropriate chewing in less than a week. Yes, my house looked kind of funny for a week, with pieces of cloth pinned to things, but it was WELL worth it.


What a fantastic idea! We'd decided to leave the area rug in the basement until at earliest this fall because it's just so much easier to clean without it but as soon as it gets cold we'll really want that extra warmth. Indy really doesn't like the apple bitter stuff but the Top Paw version doesn't even phase him so all the cords (the two that couldn't be moved) have had many coatings of that ... and the wall (which I still really don't understand).


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

m0rg4n said:


> We started with this harness:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


He won't stop to try to mark if you don't let him approach and sniff vertical objects. I NEVER let Kodi sniff if he's on leash for a walk. This is WALK time. I give Kodi the opportunity to potty before we leave the yard. When Kodi was learning, he had two basic choices as far as where he walked. If he could maintain a loose leash and maintain a steady pace in the same direction I was going, I didn't mind if he was slightly ahead or slightly behind. If he pulled off the path or got over excited and started to pull, all freedom was curtailed, and I expected him to maintain position at my left leg. (not formal, "heads up" heeling, but in that spot) You have MUCH more control with them there. It was sort of what I did with my kids when they were little. "You either stay right with me and pay attention, or you have to hold my hand!" 



m0rg4n said:


> We just picked up a new treat that he loves but he ONLY gets it when he's in the crate with the door shut. He won't even touch it the entire time I'm gone but then grabs it and wants to eat it when I'm home and he's out (another sign of anxiety). Before we'd let him have it but with this new treat (and a new larger crate) he only gets it when he's inside and it disappears when he comes out. I've also been putting him in at random during the day when I am home, give him the treat and shut the door and leave him for a bit - then let him out and take the treat up. This is new from today so I don't know how it'll work but so far he still won't touch the treat while he's locked up but he doesn't howl when I'm home and he just watches me walk around with a little whimpering if it's longer than five minutes.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

(((HUGS)))) just know it WILL pass and all the hard work and frustration WILL pay off ... and we've ALL been there.


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## misstray (Feb 6, 2011)

Oh, I can so relate. I know I posted a couple of times when I was feeling overwhelmed because I thought it was important for people to know that sometimes it really IS frustrating and that's OK too. When you are going through it all, sometimes it feels like everyone else has these perfect pups that are a joy 100% of the time. Looking back on it, I realize that's not the case, but at the time I thought it was just me!

One of my major issues was showering. Brody was terrible when I wanted to shower. He'd cry and carry on (and this was while he was IN the bathroom with me). For ages I had to have the quickest showers on record! He's good now, and now I can have long showers when I want to! He still prefers to lay on the mat by the shower rather than outside, but he's quiet. Periodically he'll peak his head around the shower curtain just to make sure I've not been nabbed by the shower monster! ha ha

Like everything, it takes time and patience (which isn't always my strong suit). And it's totally OK to feel overwhelmed from time to time!!


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## notaeb3 (Feb 15, 2011)

Sorry you are going through this toddler age with Indy... it will pass. Just a note on repeated ear infections. This was a problem with my dog as well,.. I switched to grain free kibble, and he has not had an ear infection in 3 years.


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## swaye (Mar 28, 2013)

krandall said:


> Ha! I LOVE this post! I think it should be on a sticky, right up there with how to find a breeder. It should be called, "Are you sure you REALLY want to get into this!?!?!"
> 
> Yes, I think we've all been where you are, both with kids and with puppies. There are actually a couple of GREAT thing about puppies as opposed to kids. First, if it really gets to you, you can always stick them in their crate and LEAVE for a few hours without getting arrested. Second, they DO grow out of it MUCH faster than human kids do!!!.


I loved this post and your response! As much reading as I did did BEFORE deciding on a Hav (and my cousin had a Hav), none of the reading prepared me for this...and I have had raised puppies all of my adult life (of course, I am older now). The good times are becoming more frequent and make it all worth while. I must also add, this site has been a support system I wouldn't' have wanted to do without.


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Thank you for ALL the responses! I think just knowing that it IS a stage that will pass is a huge help. It's good to know your dog isn't broken and that you aren't a horrible puppy parent. Today the sun is shining so we were finally able to get out for a walk and we only passed two other dogs so there weren't constant pulling sessions (and both dogs were on a leash - unheard of out here - so passing them was a quick process). One mile done and as long as it doesn't cloud over and start raining we'll take another at lunch time. Indy makes me absolutely nuts some days but his lopsided smile where you can't see his eyes (he's going through an awkward stage in facial hair) just cracks me up.

Have I mentioned recently how amazing this forum and the members are?!!
Now I think it's nap time.


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

I'm in my mid-fifties and Leo makes the 18th puppy I have raised (we typically have 3-4 dogs at one time) since my teens. I don't think I have made it through many of them without a WHAT WAS I THINKING moment or few. One thing I have learned is that a tired puppy is a good puppy! Two thoughts - could you find Indy a playmate. Two dogs that play well together can expend more energy than ANY amount of walking you can do with them. And do you have a place where you could use a long line and let Indy run around a bit more than he can on a regular leash? Hang in there! If you are consistent with your training, Indy will grow through his adolescence and you will have a lovely dog on the other side.


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Pucks104 said:


> I'm in my mid-fifties and Leo makes the 18th puppy I have raised (we typically have 3-4 dogs at one time) since my teens. I don't think I have made it through many of them without a WHAT WAS I THINKING moment or few. One thing I have learned is that a tired puppy is a good puppy! Two thoughts - could you find Indy a playmate. Two dogs that play well together can expend more energy than ANY amount of walking you can do with them. And do you have a place where you could use a long line and let Indy run around a bit more than he can on a regular leash? Hang in there! If you are consistent with your training, Indy will grow through his adolescence and you will have a lovely dog on the other side.


We live farther out of town that most of our friends so finding puppy playdates are a little difficult. Most of our friends also have older dogs that don't find Indy's antics amusing for very long 

I do have a 10 meter leash that we use for some of the leash training that gives him a lot of space. I haven't used it recently as we were trying to get him used to a normal length lead for use in town but I should break that out and give him more room to run on our next walk. They have also put in a dog park on base that we try to get to at least once a week but the last two times we've been there were a handful of much larger dogs that made both Indy and I a little nervous so we haven't gotten back. The plan is to stop by there after picking my daughter up from school tonight to let him (and the kid) run off some energy.

I would do backflips to have some of the forum members close by!


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

m0rg4n said:


> Ever get to the point where you pause in the middle of another crazy day and take a 5 second break, look around and wonder "What the hell did I get myself into?!" I remember feeling this exact feeling when my daughter was about 3 years old. She was no longer easy to take places, she had opinions that could not be changed, she was very vocal about what she wanted and when things didn't go her way and I just stood there and looked at the front door wondering how far away I could get. Obviously I didn't leave and Zoe is the best thing that's ever happened to me and my husband but being a parent is hard. I think I've hit that point with Indy. Six months in puppy years = three years for toddlers.
> 
> My house is ignored most days because he has serious separation issues (not to the point of hurting himself or excessive drooling but the pacing and whimpering and if I actually leave the house he'll start howling after about thirty minutes). I don't think I've been in the upstairs floor in as long as we've had him. The living room and kitchen are constantly decorated with bits of sticks, grass or whatever he's brought in from the backyard so even though I sweep daily it never looks clean. I miss the area rug that was moved out of the living room when Indy moved in. I used to go to the gym for classes daily and now I'm lucky if I get there once every two weeks (and I'm sure the lack of exercise doesn't help with my mental state).
> 
> ...


 I had those same white tiled floors when the sisters were that age and its the hardest floor to keep up. It helps to get the paws and legs cleaned up before they come in. Although anything shows on that floor. I leave the separation anxiety up to others.


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## m0rg4n (Feb 8, 2013)

Suzi said:


> I had those same white tiled floors when the sisters were that age and its the hardest floor to keep up. It helps to get the paws and legs cleaned up before they come in. Although anything shows on that floor. I leave the separation anxiety up to others.


Yep. Especially with the wonderful spring rain, mud and murdered flowers. I sweep daily so it doesn't get ridiculously out of hand, mop at least once weekly (spot clean in front of the door more often with rain). I've learned not to clean before company until ~right~ before they get here and most importantly ... I'm learning to let the little things slide.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

m0rg4n said:


> I've learned not to clean before company until ~right~ before they get here and most importantly ... I'm learning to let the little things slide.


Ha! When my kids were toddlers, when we were leaving on vacation, I used to strap them into their car seats before I did the last quick pick-up of the house. There was no way I could pick up as fast as they could pull things out. Puppies are like that, yup!


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