# SECOND HAV A LOT OF WORK?????????



## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Just checked in and read the amazing adventures of Cooper thread. Thrilled beyond words!!!!
But my reason for checking in was to quiz Karen and others re what it's like to add a Hav puppy to the fam. Biscuit is now 2 and I've had puppy fever for sometime. Today I encountered a N. Cal. breeder with a puppy I LOVE and am really tempted. . . . but, how much harder is it to start all over again?

Biscuit sleeps in a crate alone downstairs for up to 10 hrs at night (never in the day). So where would I put the 14 wk old pup~~in the crate with him? in his own crate? 
How hard is it to integrate the toilet training with the existing dog? Will the older dog regress? (Biscuit is perfect, god forbid he regressses).

Will the older dog become jealous?
Will the puppy bond to us, or to Biscuit more?
What do you all think??? I want it to be fun, not frustrating. . . :frusty:
Would you say it's twice as much work with two, or less, or more??????
Thanks for you input! Amy, Biscuit, and ?????


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

I should also add that I would LOVE to get a rescue Hav, but it seems to be akin to winning the Lottery. And they are always so far away from N. California where I live. The 49 rescues were adorable, but does anyone here have an "in" to them or to the Havanese Rescue dogs??? I've never even heard back from Hav Rescue, after applying for adoption. ;-( Seems like the impossible dream. I've tried for at least 6 dogs and never even been close. . .


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Hi Amy!!
I was so happy to read your post!! How excicting for you. I think that you will find it much easier with a second Hav as you have experience, you know signals and what their needs are. Depending on how old the pup is, you might need to keep them in a crate with you at night, or the pup might connect with Biscuit so quickly that you could put the pup in his own crate next to Biscuit.
It will take Biscuit a little time to adjust but they will become fast friends. 
All three of mine,love to be together, but when Mommy or Daddy enters he room, we are the favorites. I dont think you will need to worry about that at all. 
Yes, two is more work - in the beginning, but later on it is the best thing ever!! You will make a perfect 2nd Hav Mommy!!! YOu already are a perfect 1 Hav Mommy!!!
Laurie


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

PS - on the HRI question. Your application stays with HRI and is brought up every time there is a pup that might fit your criteria. I think that Dugan was an unusual circumstance, as you usually dont see puppies in Rescue (I was just LUCKY to foster him!!!) But there are some great adult pups if that is what you want.


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Going through the puppy stage causes one to ask....why did I do this? LOL!! But, that being said, once you have them trained.....for us, it hasn't been harder at all. They entertain each other and us. It is harder to take them with you places, but we didn't do much of that anyway. I think dogs adjust to the lifestyle of the home. Ours can be great couch potatoes, that's why I wanted to get part of our yard fenced in so they could get some exercise.
Izzy accepted Doc without issue. He is bonded to me more than he is to her, but he is a boy. Izzy has always been GREAT at potty issues, Doc is another issue, but again, he is a boy! LOL! Izzy turned two on Wednesday, Doc is 14 months. They both sleep with us, but Doc is in the expen when we are gone. He ate our couch so can't be trusted. 
It is really hard to say what your "issues" will be as each do is different. But, bottom line, it isn't "harder", maybe more time is needed for grooming, but the joy of two outweighs any negative issues.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Welcome back. I think it is a lot easier IF, the first dog is fully trained. I think it becomes a lot more work if the first dog isn't potty trained, gets away with pulling all over on the leash, etc. As to the bonding. Dash LOVES the girls but he is a mommy's girl first. I think this comes down to how much individual time you interact with each dog though. I really try to do this all the time. Just the other day I went to a parade and took just Dash with me. 

I will say with 3, there is some jealousy. Belle honestly gets jealous when Dora plays with Dash too much. They really don't play with all 3 of them. Dora and Belle never wrestled much. It took Dash coming into the household to get them to do this. But Belle will bark and bark and run and get Dasher's toys if she thinks he is having more fun with Dora. But I dont think the girls really get jealous of him nor each other with me. They will all try to get on my lap but I think they honestly just have more of a pack feel where if I go on the couch to watch tv, they all come with me! Okay they do get jealous of training time. I do try to work one dog at a time and put the other two in the pen- Dash barks non stop to get my attention, Belle paws at the pen or climbs it, Dora just jumps up and down. But to be hoenst, I want them to be jealous of each other at this time, because boy they have attention when they come out!

Good luck and I hope to see pics soon!


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## Paige (Sep 12, 2006)

Amy, I can tell you that I will never be a one dog family again. After going from one dog, to five in three years, I can tell you that dogs are much happier having another dog around. 

It is a lot more work in the beginning. Starting over and potty training, having to watch the puppy all the time, another to groom. But it is worth the extra work and most of the extra work is short lived. Believe me, hav puppies mature ALOT quicker than other breeds, i have had. Plus the older dogs teach them alot, it is amazing to watch. 

I found that whenever I brought a new puppy home he would first bond with one of my other boys. But he soon would learn from them, that I was someone that they all wanted to be near and get attention from. Soon the puppy will be following you around and vieing for your attention, just like the rest. 

I wouldn't use the same crate at first, let them get to know each other first, and make sure the puppy won't pee the crate, as that would not over well with Biscuit. But you could put their crate next to each other, once the puppy is sleeping all night. 

Good luck, I promise you won't be sorry, but wonder why you didn't get another sooner. Be careful it could turn into a hav addiction. :biggrin1:


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## iluvhavs (Jul 21, 2008)

I agree with those above. It definitely is a lot of work. The second pup is always much more hyper than the first, because they have another dog to play with. My first was, and still is a gentle, quiet boy. Our little girl, Lucy, is a Tasmanian Devil dog! 

You forget all the trouble potty training was, and then you have a new little pup, BAMM! But once the training is done, they are great for each other and lots of laughs. I am definitely glad we made the jump!


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## Brady's mom (Dec 1, 2006)

Hi Amy,
Well, Dugan is a little over 4 months now and has been with us for a month. There have been a few days where I thought, "what did I do?" and I think Brady thought the same thing. But, for the most part, having Dugan has been great! Brady is 2 1/2 and perfectly potty trained, etc. He has not had any regression issues. He had a little bit of a hard time with sharing (still does sometimes) but for the most part loves his little brother. I have to work with Brady again on leash training as I had let that slack a little, and Brady pulls. It doesn't make it easy to walk 2 when one is pulling at you. Fortunately, Dugan is perfect on the least (unless he decides to sit and take a break) so that helps. My DH and I usually walk them together. We put up a temporary fence area in the back yard so we can also just let him out to pee on his own. Brady sleeps in bed with us. Dugan sleeps in a crate next to me in bed. I have tried to let him sleep with us, but he seems to want to be in the crate. Dugan is almost perfect with house training (last time I said he was perfect, he had an accident, so I now say almost perfect). Laurie did a great job working with him, so the house training was easy. I think Brady also helped. We have 2 crates now in the den (next to eachother) where the boys stay when we are out. Brady wouldn't want to share his crate. At some point, I want to eliminate the crates completely, but we will wait a while. Brady loves to wrestle and play with Dugan, and I see them getting closer everyday. Brady still loves us just as much, and Dugan loves us too. I think he has bonded to all us equally, including Brady. 

As for HRI, I applied many many times for dogs through them before Dugan worked out. I did go through the foster process so I had a homestudy and all done before Dugan came into the picture. I think this helped. To be honest, I probably wouldn't have gotten him if he wasn't with Laurie and I didn't get very persistent. I was a real pain to Laurie and HRI, but for good reason! I had applied to many rescues and without a fence, I wouldn't ever hear back from them. The temporary fencing seemed to help with HRI.

Amy, if you have any questions, feel free to PM me or let me know. It is a little more work and a little harder to take them places, but it is worth it!!


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## suzyfrtz (Nov 12, 2007)

Are two more work than one? Definitely! Are two more fun than one! Definitely! I am almost 61 years old and I was asking myself, what did I get myself into, when we got Chelsie this summer. She was 5 months old. I am the main caregiver. She was not potty trained and loved to chew chew chew. She was shy and would stand hunched over when scared, not moving a muscle. She didn't know what a leash was. I had just gotten over the puppy stage with Cazzie. Honestly, I was tired and frustrated. There were times when I wanted to scream, and even thought about finding a new home for her. But she would look up at me with those big almond shaped eyes....
DH was smitten with her from the get go and said, oh we can't give her up, she's been through so much already (meaning she was mainly crated for her first few months and was very shy.) 
So here we are almost 5 months later. Her potty training is going extremely well. She is growing up and getting mellow and not so shy. She and Cazzie play so well together and love each other, although he makes sure he maintains the upper hand. They give us so much love and laughter! 
Then again, when they get me up at 3 in the morning for a potty run, and I have to get my shoes on and their halters on...(groan.) I can't take one out without taking the other! 
All said, I think I was too old (LOL) to get another puppy, but now we're through the rough spots, we couldn't imagine being without her. It's like having two toddlers. But things get better!
Best wishes in your decision! (How can you resist those cute appealing faces saying, Please love me!) 

Suzy


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Amy, Yes to all your questions. But worth it in the long run. I will always have to two now. 

You will teach number two to fit into your life. If Biscuit sleeps in his crate, so will little two (after the time when he is sleeping next to your bed.)

Biscuit may be jealous at first...but he will love his new playmate sooner than later. 

The only thing I will play devils advocate on and not try to nurture your mhs is that everything is double! double the food, double the baths, double vets, double the boarding when you travel. (traveling has become much harder with two-- it seems I am always looking for a better solution) double the walks...and even if you walk them together there are times you have to walk them seperately. I say double both in monetary terms and time (grooming being the most time consuming) But it is also double the love and fun.


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## suzyfrtz (Nov 12, 2007)

I want to add a little something about our experience with Rescue. We were looking for a rescue dog but don't have a fenced in yard. That was a big barrier. We thought we would never be approved by a rescue organization but to our amazement, one of the small breed rescues in Michigan approved us after getting a glowing recommendation from our vet. (Didn't hurt that he had been our friend for 30 years.) This rescue also had one Havanese. Just mentioning this because there are many rescue organizations. We didn't end up with a rescue puppy, but Chelsie had her own story and her own appeal "Please love me!"

S.


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## Paradise Havs (Sep 25, 2008)

More cost, more noise, more mess, more poop, more puddles, more vomit, more trouble going for walks, more feet to wipe, more worry, more grooming, more hair! 

But I can't imagine having just one Hav! More fun, more love, more kisses, more laughs, more cuddles! 

I don't have any experience with rescue, but I think that either way picking a puppy with a personality that compliments your first dog is really important. Try to get one with less dominance to avoid power plays.

I love my three!


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## Renee (Mar 27, 2008)

In regards to having more than one Hav, I have a question....do they bark more when there is multiple dogs? My in-laws have 2 dogs, and they ALWAYS are setting each other off, barking. If one hears a noise, he'll bark, and get the other one going. Drives me crazy. Miley is pretty good about not barking...don't want to add another one and regret all the barking.


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## suzyfrtz (Nov 12, 2007)

Renee said:


> In regards to having more than one Hav, I have a question....do they bark more when there is multiple dogs? My in-laws have 2 dogs, and they ALWAYS are setting each other off, barking. If one hears a noise, he'll bark, and get the other one going. Drives me crazy. Miley is pretty good about not barking...don't want to add another one and regret all the barking.


Unfortunately, the answer in my case, is yes, they will set each other off. Cazzie has very serious separation anxiety and will carry on something awful when he thinks we're leaving. Chelsie is picking up on Cazzie's vibes and is now running around, looking anxious too, when he goes into his anxiety-barking frenzy. On other occasions, he will bark, she will bark; she will bark, he will bark. The solution is to be firm with each one. No excess barking allowed! So it's not really a problem that would keep us from having two dogs. Just a little extra training required.


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## mckennasedona (Feb 20, 2007)

Amy, it is more work having two but like everyone else says, it is also double the fun. Sedona slept in her own crate on a chair beside our bed for a time. By the time our girls had free access to the house she was trained.
It was actually easier to house train the second one because she followed McKenna out the door when McKenna would go. 
McKenna never displayed any jealousy and thought that we had brought her home the most wonderful squeaky toy ever!
Grooming two is a bit of work and it's really a mess when they both get the runs at the same time but far and above all of that, the simple joy of watching them play together, nap together, etc. makes it all worth it. 
Adding a third, different breed, to the mix changed the dynamics a lot but it has worked out very well.


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Amy,

As you know, Milo was one year old when I broke down and let Bailey find me. I jumped in with both feet, without even checking to see whether there was water in the pool, but it was absolutely the right thing to do. I already had three, with the two older girls but Milo needed a young puppy to play with. It was kind of like him trying to engage grandma for fun and games when all she wanted was to relax in the sunshine.

We had a few days of adjustment when none of the current residents of the house were happy to invite this cute little invader into their midst. After that, having Bailey here was so positive in so many ways. He always enjoyed being clean so training him was a slam dunk compared to the utter frustration I felt at Milo's constant mishaps. The boys are best buds and do most everything together. 

I would have it no other way and actually am thinking about adding a girl to the mix at some point. Amy, I'd definitely say go for it. You'll wind up wondering why you didn't do it sooner.


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

Amy, I love having two and wouldn't have it any other way. Except for the grooming and a little on traveling, I actually think it's easier to have more than one. Vinny taught Lulu about the doggy door and almost did the potty training himself.
The big thing for me is when I leave I never feel guilty that one is lonely. They are so bonded. They both sleep on the bed with us and always have, no crates here.
No, I really think two is easier than one.
Carole


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

If you can get through the potty training again, then it is so well worth having two. I can't imagine not having two. They are so much fun to be with. They always make me smile. Watching them play and interact is amazing. As for grooming, I do both of mine myself and they are in full coats. I don't find it a challenge anymore. I think you will find your own schedule to make it easy for you.

If you can handle double the food, double the vet bills, double the toys, then I say YES to two!


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## Alexa (Jun 17, 2007)

Do you think you could possibly do a test visit? I think it was Poornima that was very hesitant about adding the second and the breeder let her "borrow" the second one for a weekend first to see how the two reacted. Maybe that would be an option for you, too?


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## Renee (Mar 27, 2008)

mellowbo said:


> The big thing for me is when I leave I never feel guilty that one is lonely. They are so bonded. Carole


This is a big reason why I want another one. I hate leaving Miley by herself, and if she had a buddy, I would have less guilt. Not sure if that's the right reason for getting another one, but after reading everyone's posts on this subject, it sounds like having a 2nd one is very well worth it, for so many reasons!
Of course, everyone on this board suffers from MHS, so opinions may be biased here. Hee Hee...


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Paige wrote: *"Believe me, hav puppies mature ALOT quicker than other breeds, i have had."*

Really? Paige, I found that when talking with other dog owners that the Hav took FOREVER to housetrain than the other breeds, esp. larger breeds. :frusty: It took us 6 months to feel o.k. with Ricky not peeing in the house and it was a lot of hard work, esp. for me. I wanted another Hav, but just couldn't imagine doing the puppy thing over again any time soon. As it happened, we got Sammy at the age of 7.5 months and though he wasn't 100% trained, after a couple more months, things were pretty good. It's true that Ricky taught Sammy to go outdoors and that was the easy part, but it was still rough.

I think you had a great experience with all of your puppies because of YOU, Paige. Because you were and are consistent and sure, housetraining hasn't been a nightmare for you. I think that's great! I honestly don't know if I could do the puppy thing again, though I can easily picture us having another dog, just an older pup that is 6 months+ or something...

Amy, two Havs is the best thing we could have done! Sammy was an older pup, like I said, so that was the reason we jumped at the opportunity of adding him to our family. No regrets whatsoever. :biggrin1:


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Missy said:


> The only thing I will play devils advocate on and not try to nurture your mhs is that everything is double! double the food, double the baths, double vets, double the boarding when you travel. * (traveling has become much harder with two-- it seems I am always looking for a better solution)* double the walks...and even if you walk them together there are times you have to walk them seperately.


Missy, I agree about the traveling.  It is harder to find someone to care for two Havs when we go away (it's only happened once so far) than if we had only one. The cost of a pro kennel/boarder would be double and they are not cheap!! Traveling with both Ricky and Sammy would be a challenge, for sure.

Friends and family don't always want you to visit with two dogs, but some of them are fine with one.

On the other hand, we've found, like Renee said, that it is much easier leaving them together when we go out, than leaving one home alone. We dont' feel guilty, and we feel they are okay... though I do still look at the time and start thinking of getting back after 4-5 hours.


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

Renee said:


> This is a big reason why I want another one. I hate leaving Miley by herself, and if she had a buddy, I would have less guilt. Not sure if that's the right reason for getting another one, but after reading everyone's posts on this subject, it sounds like having a 2nd one is very well worth it, for so many reasons!
> Of course, everyone on this board suffers from MHS, so opinions may be biased here. Hee Hee...


Yeah Renee, I'm having a real struggle with stopping at two! DH, however, isn't. lol
Carole


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## Paradise Havs (Sep 25, 2008)

"I hate leaving Miley by herself, and if she had a buddy, I would have less guilt." 

Too funny! That is one of the reasons that I got a third! I hated leaving one alone, so I would always take both to the vet, the store, for walks. So I figured that if I had three, I could take one and leave two at home to keep each other company! It is working....

If you have MHS, you can justify just about anything!


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## Renee (Mar 27, 2008)

Paradise Havs...you are TOO FUNNY! I'll make sure my husband doesn't read that post...he'll think I'll want a 3rd after the 2nd. LOL....


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

THAT is exactly one of the reasons I got my third. I didnt like leaving one at home alone while I took another out!! 
Great minds think alike ound:


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

Paradise Havs said:


> "I hate leaving Miley by herself, and if she had a buddy, I would have less guilt."
> 
> Too funny! That is one of the reasons that I got a third! I hated leaving one alone, so I would always take both to the vet, the store, for walks. So I figured that if I had three, I could take one and leave two at home to keep each other company! It is working....
> 
> If you have MHS, you can justify just about anything!


OMGosh! That's the exact line I've been feeding DH. And it's true! So many times I want to take just one with me but I just can't leave the other one home alone!! It's the three hands that I'm having a hard time figuring out. And, I will need a bigger lap!
Carole


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## Paradise Havs (Sep 25, 2008)

Its good to know that my rationalizations do make sense to others! It did take a couple years to convince DH. All he ever wanted was a little peace & quiet! That would be a great thread: "How to convince DH that you need another Hav"!!!


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

You guys are the best. Thanks for all of your advice and insights, both wise and practical. 

I think the cost of two is probably one of the biggest barriers~~everything where we live is very very expensive. And I will only do a limited amount of grooming myself. 

We also travel a lot and do have a great fab reliable dog sitter/friend whom Biscuit adores going to, but that cost would double. egads! 

Unfortunately, with the market down and being in our 60's, it's something I have to seriously consider. It's a longterm committment. Plus DH is out of town and I hate to do this w/out his knowledge. But this puppy looks so right to me, I've fallen in LOVE. Someone else is also very interested so I need to decide today probably.
Will keep y'all posted! Thank you all again! xo amy


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Let me add what has motivated me this time, and ask you if you think it's weird . It's pretty personal. When we got Biscuit almost 2 yrs ago, my 33 yr old daughter had just been dx with breast cancer. I immediately got that darling puppy, and he saved my sanity and kept us all focused, smiling, and in the moment. And we got through that difficult time. Now my mother has died last month, I am feeling truly bereft, esp. at the holidays, and I am having that same impulse, like I need to do something life-affirming. Of course, I have also wanted a second dog for awhile. Thanks for listening. . .


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

Amy,
We got our second Hav and I am over sixty.
It was a bit of an adjustment at first. Chico was a bit jealous, but it worked out very well. Cali was easy to housebreak (for a Hav) and that time flew by and I hardly remember it. Now she is 18 months old and a great dog.

I like having 2 for all the reasons mentioned already. 
Another important benefit for me is that the 2 exercise themselves all the time. They RLH a few times up and down the steps and they play several times a day. That really drains their energy and makes them content.
We do walk them, but don't feel too guilty if it's raining or we can't do it ,as they get lots of exercise.
I think the key here is the temperament of the dogs. Hopefully the one you are considering is sweet, kind of laid back and not too dominant.

So the economy stinks and you are 60, I say follow your heart and your gut.
Enjoy your life.

My husband and I are crazy about these dogs and we've never regretted getting a second.
Good luck with your decision.


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

Amy, I too am over 60 and age just doesn't seem to matter. The economy is another thing but only you can tell if your budget is close to the wire. Usually pet sitters give a discount for the second one. They eat so little. Groomers once a month is more, but is it too much more? What would be too much for you, only you know. 
As for your emotional reason for getting another one, well, it worked before didn't it. Not that you should ever get a puppy for temporary reasons, because you shouldn't, but it sounds to me like your full time heart is in it. 
Can you post pics???


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

mellowbo said:


> OMGosh! That's the exact line I've been feeding DH. And it's true! So many times I want to take just one with me but I just can't leave the other one home alone!! It's the three hands that I'm having a hard time figuring out. And, I will need a bigger lap!
> Carole


HAHAHHAA! I just said to DH the other day... if we had 4, when I wanted to take two, I could!!! I wanted to take Dora out, it was her turn but I was going some where that would be overwhelming with people and Dora doesn't like that on her own so I wanted to take either B/D. But I couldn't leave one home!!!

Amy- I would say the cost is something you definitely have to take in consideration and you are really smart to think about that. The vet will still charge you two office visits if you take two dogs at once! If you can do the grooming yourself that really helps, I learned after two, an hour of my time each week was worth more than I was paying. It takes awhile to get decent at grooming but it comes along. Hey you could always move to SC, it is a lot cheaper for everything here <BG>


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## mckennasedona (Feb 20, 2007)

Go with your heart Amy. Sometimes if we are too practical we miss out on wonderful things. 
Are you geographically close to the breeder? Would he or she let you have a test week with the puppy? I suppose not if there is someone else waiting in the wings.


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## trueblue (Jan 22, 2008)

I have to agree with everyone else...go with your heart. You only live once .


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Amy, I am excited for you for even getting this close to getting a second!  I can understand how scary the whole potty training thing (AGAIN) must seem, but I do think that having had the experience with Biscuit really will help you feel more in control and better prepared. I hope to hear that you will be getting a new cutie soon... maybe I'll get one eventually too!


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Thanks again, everyone, for your thoughtful advice and taking the time to share your experience. Still mulling it over and will keep you posted. And, by the way, the prospective puppy is really really mellow, like Biscuit. A lover boy, who really bonds with the human. . . just like Biscuit. I'm way too old for a hyper puppy. .LOL 

I know Biscuit would LOVE the exercise and play, because he so loves going to the dog sitter's and being with her Bichon. He starts pleading and quivering with excitement the minute we get to the freeway exit~~he knows! So he's very compatible I think w/ a puppy. . . Will update when I make my decision. DH comes home late tomorrow. Don't know whether to wait for him or, risk divorce, and go for it today. . . LOL


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## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Amy,

You've got a lot of great advice already. I agree with all the extra expenses with two vs. one. But the benefits are priceless, I couldn't imagine having just one dog. I always had two...or more.  

I've been always told to listen to the voice of reason and have always gone with my instinct/heart. 

Good luck,


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## Renee (Mar 27, 2008)

mckennasedona said:


> Go with your heart Amy. Sometimes if we are too practical we miss out on wonderful things.


Wow...well said. I tend to be OVER practical. I need to post this on my wall!!


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Amy R. said:


> Thanks again, everyone, for your thoughtful advice and taking the time to share your experience. Still mulling it over and will keep you posted. And, by the way, the prospective puppy is really really mellow, like Biscuit. A lover boy, who really bonds with the human. . . just like Biscuit. I'm way too old for a hyper puppy. .LOL
> 
> I know Biscuit would LOVE the exercise and play, because he so loves going to the dog sitter's and being with her Bichon. He starts pleading and quivering with excitement the minute we get to the freeway exit~~he knows! So he's very compatible I think w/ a puppy. . . Will update when I make my decision. DH comes home late tomorrow. Don't know whether to wait for him or, risk divorce, and go for it today. . . LOL


Amy,

I hope you can get this little fella because he feels so right for you. Having two is truly the joy doubled (or more). However, don't beat yourself up. In the end my advice is go with your gut feeling. That pit of the stomach advice the universe gives you is never wrong. I can't wait to hear.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Amy, I'm so sorry to hear about your mother! Like you, I started wanting a dog after I was diagnosed with an incurable disease, and it really did help me, honestly, I may have slid into a big depression had I not gotten Gucci, so I know exactly where you are coming from.

I think there are pros and cons to just about everything these days, but I think when you go with your heart, you can't go wrong. 

Miss you, girl.

XOXO~


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## Paradise Havs (Sep 25, 2008)

Amy,

If you are concerned about going through the puppy craziness, getting an older dog from a show home is an option. We just added our third about 8 weeks ago. She is a retired show dog that the owner decided not to breed. She fit in from minute one and I love her as much as I would if I'd got her as a baby. There was about a month of acclimation to new family and new potty facilities but nothing too dramatic. Also it is a bit cheaper since all the first year vet care is over. You might ask around if this appeals to you. I am somewhere between 50 & 60 and didn't really want to have sleepless nights!


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Yes, that is an idea I have definitely considered. But just haven't encountered the right older dog. I don't mind the potty part, it goes pretty quickly, but sleepless nights aren't fun at my age. Love the pic with the TP shredded! Interestingly Biscuit is not a shredder, has never looked twice at the TP!


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Hey, Kara! Good to hear from you and Happy Holidays to you and the clan. Yes, I recall how you got Gucci as a comfort and distraction for your chronic illness. They are truly better than any medicine, right? and help us to go forward. 

Thanks for condolences re my mother that several of you have sent. She was almost 97, so I thought I'd be more philosophical when the time came. But she was like a sister/peer/girlfriend~~~~had her memory, wit, humour, a girlish enthusiasm and a great intellect totally intact. Perfect hearing & vision, too! She was astonishing. 
So there is this great hole in our lives. We had a lovely memorial the day after TG with our entire clan present. Her grandchildren gave the most touching tributes, and I gave the eulogy. The holidays feel very sad. . . Ok, enough therapy time. Sorry & thanks for listening. ;-)


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

I am sorry to hear about your mom. I too just two weeks lost a very dear friend, she was 98. I thought I would be "prepared" when her time came, but I find myself feeling sad and thinking of her often~
What breeder in No. Ca would you be getting your puppy from?
Oh, and I say go for it!! :biggrin1:


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Amy R. said:


> Hey, Kara! Good to hear from you and Happy Holidays to you and the clan. Yes, I recall how you got Gucci as a comfort and distraction for your chronic illness. They are truly better than any medicine, right? and help us to go forward.
> 
> Thanks for condolences re my mother that several of you have sent. She was almost 97, so I thought I'd be more philosophical when the time came. But she was like a sister/peer/girlfriend~~~~had her memory, wit, humour, a girlish enthusiasm and a great intellect totally intact. Perfect hearing & vision, too! She was astonishing.
> So there is this great hole in our lives. We had a lovely memorial the day after TG with our entire clan present. Her grandchildren gave the most touching tributes, and I gave the eulogy. The holidays feel very sad. . . Ok, enough therapy time. Sorry & thanks for listening. ;-)


Amy I'm so sorry about your loss. It really doesn't matter how long they live, it's never long enough. How wonderful for your mother that she had all her faculties to the end. That in itself is a great gift. They do indeed leave a hole in our lives. After all, they're so much a part of who we are. As for the girlish enthusiasm, etc., my father, who died way too early always used to say aging was life's cruel joke because you felt just the same inside as your body started to fail you (or in my case when I go to sleep they take nice firm body parts and leave used up, flapping in the wind replacements in their wake) ound:

There's a lot to be said for puppy breath to make you smile.


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## suzyfrtz (Nov 12, 2007)

Amy R. said:


> Let me add what has motivated me this time, and ask you if you think it's weird . It's pretty personal. When we got Biscuit almost 2 yrs ago, my 33 yr old daughter had just been dx with breast cancer. I immediately got that darling puppy, and he saved my sanity and kept us all focused, smiling, and in the moment. And we got through that difficult time. Now my mother has died last month, I am feeling truly bereft, esp. at the holidays, and I am having that same impulse, like I need to do something life-affirming. Of course, I have also wanted a second dog for awhile. Thanks for listening. . .


Amy, Although we thought about getting another puppy a year ago last summer, when Cazzie was a puppy himself, it wasn't until my cancer surgery this spring that I decided to really go for it. I had cancer, I was whole now, and I was going to get a puppy...no matter who criticized my choice. I didn't realize it at the time, but it WAS indeed life affirming.

My heart is with you in the loss of your mother. No matter how long a time they are with us, a little piece of our hearts goes when our moms leave us. May you have a blessed Holiday season with all good memories.

Hugs,
Suzy


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## lcy_pt (Aug 17, 2007)

Amy R. said:


> Let me add what has motivated me this time, and ask you if you think it's weird . It's pretty personal. When we got Biscuit almost 2 yrs ago, my 33 yr old daughter had just been dx with breast cancer. I immediately got that darling puppy, and he saved my sanity and kept us all focused, smiling, and in the moment. And we got through that difficult time. Now my mother has died last month, I am feeling truly bereft, esp. at the holidays, and I am having that same impulse, like I need to do something life-affirming. Of course, I have also wanted a second dog for awhile. Thanks for listening. . .


Not weird at all...I'm a great believer in Karma. Hugs to you in whatever you decide.


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

I'm so sorry to read about your mother Amy. My condolences to you and your family.:hug:


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Thank you all for your kind condolences. And Suzy, I am thrilled to know you are doing so well. xoxo


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

Amy,
I was so sorry to read of the passing of your mother. Even though we may be prepared for something, that doesn't necessarily make it any easier. It's perfectly normal to miss, grieve and mourn your mother, that being said, there's nothing wrong with considering a second dog to change the tone of life around your house during the holidays.

As for multiple dogs, I will always have more than one. Once you get past the house-training, it's all good in my eyes. If you're budget can handle the extra vet and food bills, and you're willing to do some extra grooming, I honestly don't think you would ever be sorry.
Best of luck, you know we're all behind you and want the best for you.

Beverly


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## Maxmom (Jul 22, 2008)

Amy, thank you so much for starting this thread! I've been considering a second havanese for some time now and it helps to see all of these replies. 

Go with your heart and I look forward to pictures of your new baby!! :wink::decision::drum:


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Amy, we will always miss those who've passed that we love, but we always hold on to their 'spirit' and teachings, I was a wreck when I lost my Grandmother (who is like a mom to me) and it still hurts, especially around the holidays or when I see something that reminds me of her, but I'm grateful for the time I had.

I'm anxious to see what you decide on a new puppy. Have you mentioned it to DH yet. I can see where there are certain pros, especially when you travel and Biscuit will still have a lil' brother or sister to keep him entertained!

Most people I know say the more Havs the merrier, believe me..I still have the whole playgroup in town trying to talk my DH into another one, lol, but I just can't do it unless he is totally on board.. and if Gucci keeps being so extremely high maintenance and manipulative (of him) like she has been, that won't be anytime soon! ound:

Her new game is to throw her toy off the bed 25 times at night and whine for him to go 'get it'. lol and he WILL! ound:


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## suzyfrtz (Nov 12, 2007)

luv2havs said:


> Amy,
> We got our second Hav and I am over sixty.


I think we should start a Havanese support group for those of us over 60!



Suzy


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## Maxmom (Jul 22, 2008)

> I think we should start a Havanese support group for those of us over 60!


:couch2:

Only 57, but I'm in!


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

*support group for over sixties*

Yeah, Suzy,

I too, think we should have a support group.
I've run into several older women and some "senior"couples, who have added puppies to their lives, when most people want to be "free' to travel etc.
These people adore their dogs, just like we do.

There are issues that we don't want to face. We are in our 60's and have young dogs. Will we be healthy enough and live long enough to see them through their lives? Havs can live to the age of 17.
Will we have to make decisions if our health fails and need to re-home them?

In retrospect, that could happen to younger people who have dogs and who suffer setbacks, like poor health, bad economic conditions etc. so maybe I'm over-reacting with the age issue.

On the plus side, our darling furkids keep us on our feet, exercising them, feeding them, talking about them -lol.

There are several "over sixty year olds" doing therapy dog work in our group. One very active therapy team partner is in his 70's and visits several places with his dog, even going to D.C. to George Washington University Hospital and NIH in Bethesda with his dog.

More power to us senior dog-lovers!


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

Amy R. said:


> Plus DH is out of town and I hate to do this w/out his knowledge. But this puppy looks so right to me, I've fallen in LOVE. Someone else is also very interested so I need to decide today probably.
> Will keep y'all posted!


Yikes, you're going to make about a 15 year committment without his knowledge? I'm pretty easy going but that wouldn't fly with me as a breeder.
This thread has been really interesting to read as a breeder, especially the potty training part. I send my puppies out potty pad trained and if the person follows what I do, the dog stays potty trained. If they don't listen, it's up for grabs. 
I have 5 dogs and each get a lot of love and they all sleep with us. Vacation planning is harder with a gang but we work around it. Moving to another state with 5 dogs is what I worry about. That's going to be a challenge!!


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

Well personally I dont think one should just go with their heart in a situation like this. Too many times people do just that and then somewhere down the road realize it was a mistake and end up giving up their dog to the shelter. Go with your heart, brain, and wallet. 

I have two and wouldn't change it for the world but, it is more costly. More than anything it's the groomer bills that kill me. I avoid the vet and only go unless necessary. I stay away from the yearly vaccinations so going to a vet isn't really an issue financially.

Keep in mind that if you need someone to watch your Havs when you are on vacation or something becomes more difficult as well when you have more than one.


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## mckennasedona (Feb 20, 2007)

Going with my heart has always worked out for me but I tend to be practical anyway so nothing I do in terms of animals is really "spur of the moment." I also know my DH pretty well after 18.5 years and I know that if I am truly in love with a puppy and willing to do what it takes to care for said puppy, he'd be okay with it, even if I did surprise him. We've both had multiple dogs all our lives so adding number two and three was not really a big deal. Number two was a surprise birthday present for me so that's how I know DH would be okay with a surprise. 
DH was the one who decided he wanted Rumor (#3) and that was 30 minutes after setting his eyes on her! Talk about spur of the moment! Of course, we waited a month to actually get her. Neither of us has regretted it for a second. I guess we've been lucky in going with our hearts.


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Yes, Susan, I think you are right, you just KNOW when it's a fit. Your gut never lies. That's different from being impulsive, and making the wrong choice, irresponsibly, I think.

I do know it will be more work and $ and am thinking that part through. I asked my dog sitter what she would charge for two: one is $25 a day , and she said a TOTAL of $ 30 for two! Wow!! That's the biggest hurdle, so that's good news. DH was open to it, though not thrilled, but he loves Biscuit so much, and didn't want him at first. This time he was actually much more amenable. I did decide I refuse to be pressured by the fact of another interested party~~it either works out or isn't meant to be. 

Enough ruminating, will keep ya posted.


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

ta da.....fingers tapping......LOL


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## Cheryl (Mar 17, 2007)

My hubby was the one who fell head over heals in love with the idea of bringing a second Hav into the family after I brought it up. He now says it is the best idea I ever had.:biggrin1:

Two dogs are more work depending upon your life style, but it brings more joy and laughter than I ever could imagine!!!!!

I have always been a dog owner, but have never owned more than one until now. Now I can't imagine just owning a single dog.


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Amy, I am so very sorry for your loss. I have been very behind and had no idea your mom had passed away. It is a challenge for sure, but hopefully, with love and support from family and friends, you'll get through the holidays. Having a pet is a wonderful therapy and distraction. There is little choice but to get up and let them out, feed them, play with them and they pay us back with cuddling, lovey dovey eyes and loyalty. I think whatever you decide to do will work out for you and only you.


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

Amy- I'm sorry to hear you lost your Mother. I think that losing one's parent is one of the hardest things in life. I still think of my Mom nearly every day. And you've been ill on top of this. I just read that your hopes for a new pup didn't work out, but I'm sure you'll find the right pup. Just take your time and make sure the time is right in your life. :hug:


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