# Healthy Training Treats



## 31818

Here is a helpful article from Darwin's suggesting healthy training treats http://www.darwinspet.com/all-natural-training-treats-for-your-dog/

Lo siento (I'm sorry) for the advertisement in the article but I think the suggestions are good and I LOVE every one of the treats suggested. Popi let's go do some training so I can get some of those delicious treats! :hungry:

besos, Ricky Ricardo


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## davetgabby

I think Darwins would be better served with someone that has credentials in pet nutrition and training writing these sort of articles.


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## krandall

Yeah, while there's nothing particularly bad about any of the treats they suggest, many are not very effective as "training" treats. And what they describe as "training" is not, really, and CERTAINLY not HOW you use treats when doing "real" training. They describe basic good manners, which I HOPE would have been instilled in the first few weeks of the puppy's life. I don't hand out treats for basic "house manners", nor do I have a treat in my hand, then wait for them to behave.


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## jabojenny

Tim and Mae are anti fruit eaters. It's so funny how all our pups like different things. My pups are pretty finicky about their treats, boiled chicken and string cheese top the charts for training here although dad sneaks in bacon and pizza sometimes which I'm sure would be their choice if given that option. :frusty: The funniest thing that Mae LOVES is edamame, she can't get enough. My training center is stringent about no "crumby" treats which makes sense.


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## davetgabby

krandall said:


> Yeah, while there's nothing particularly bad about any of the treats they suggest, many are not very effective as "training" treats. And what they describe as "training" is not, really, and CERTAINLY not HOW you use treats when doing "real" training. They describe basic good manners, which I HOPE would have been instilled in the first few weeks of the puppy's life. I don't hand out treats for basic "house manners", nor do I have a treat in my hand, then wait for them to behave.


agree, and what turns me off is this statement of "calm submissive state" . No such thing . It's an oxymoron.


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## krandall

jabojenny said:


> Tim and Mae are anti fruit eaters. It's so funny how all our pups like different things. My pups are pretty finicky about their treats, boiled chicken and string cheese top the charts for training here although dad sneaks in bacon and pizza sometimes which I'm sure would be their choice if given that option. :frusty: The funniest thing that Mae LOVES is edamame, she can't get enough. My training center is stringent about no "crumby" treats which makes sense.


Kodi LOVES fruit and veggies&#8230;blueberries topping the charts. But most fruit does NOT make good "pocket treats"&#8230; way too messy. I do use a handful of blueberries to do a set of quick fronts and finishes in the kitchen from time to time. Pixel, at least so far, doesn't seem to be much of a fruit/veggie lover.

I use a HUGE variety of different training treats, rotating through, so they don't get tired of any one thing. There are a couple that I reserve JUST for trials, because they aren't particularly good for them, and because they are particularly high value. So I want to preserve that value for when we need it. Turkey meatballs and liverwurst are two of these "special" treats. Both are too salty to use regularly or in large amounts.

My current go-to rotation for serious training (subject to change at a moment's notice!  ) are pork loin roast, Pet Fresh Vital Grain Free Turkey Formula (which cubes nicely and holds its form) and roast chicken, and a lamb roll that I can get at the agility trials around here with all natural ingredients, no preservatives and grass fed lamb.

Oh, and cheese for certain exercises with Pixel where she needs to be able to find the treat on the training room floor quickly. Kodi is off dairy because of his allergies, so I throw pork roast for him if we need something light colored.


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## 31818

The point of the article is that bananas, apples, carrots, and blueberries are healthy, natural foods that MIGHT be a good alternative for training SOME doggies whose digestive systems can tolerate these foods in a NON-COMPETITIVE home environment when used on a LIMITED BASIS and are NOT meant to be a SUBSTITUTE FOR A HEALTHY DIET. :sorry: if I was not being precise enough in my first post.

Mi Vet warned mi Popi that he would prefer that Popi not use cheese and peanut better as training treats. He said that there are canine medical studies that SUGGEST that these high fat foods MAY promote disease in the canine pancreas in SOME doggies. Mi vet also does not like "milkbone" type of treats because of questionable ingredients. Mi vet suggested some natural foods to use as training treats that included the 4 above.

Popi and I are beginners and non-experts. Neither of us have expertise in doggie nutrition. Neither of us were "trained" in good manners during the first few weeks of life. We are best friends and still working very hard together to become as good in manners as some doggies on this forum. We are still learning. Fruits and vegetables are an extremely good, inexpensive, high value training reward for mi while at home....maybe not for all doggies, but certainly for some.

I think the article is helpful and provides good advice (other than the commercialism) for those of us who are beginners and still learning.

paz contigo, Ricky Ricardo


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## Milo's Mom

Estamos con ustedes, Ricky y Popi. Comemos muchas frutas y legumbres. Creemos que que el artículo era muy interesante. Muchas gracias por compartirlo con nosotros. No somos expertos tampoco pero estamos siempre aprendiendo. 

Joyce, Milo (apodo por Milagro), y Brookie


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## krandall

davetgabby said:


> agree, and what turns me off is this statement of "calm submissive state" . No such thing . It's an oxymoron.


Yes, WAY too "CM" for me.


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## krandall

Ricky Ricardo said:


> The point of the article is that bananas, apples, carrots, and blueberries are healthy, natural foods that MIGHT be a good alternative for training SOME doggies whose digestive systems can tolerate these foods in a NON-COMPETITIVE home environment when used on a LIMITED BASIS and are NOT meant to be a SUBSTITUTE FOR A HEALTHY DIET. :sorry: if I was not being precise enough in my first post.
> 
> Mi Vet warned mi Popi that he would prefer that Popi not use cheese and peanut better as training treats. He said that there are canine medical studies that SUGGEST that these high fat foods MAY promote disease in the canine pancreas in SOME doggies. Mi vet also does not like "milkbone" type of treats because of questionable ingredients. Mi vet suggested some natural foods to use as training treats that included the 4 above.
> 
> Popi and I are beginners and non-experts. Neither of us have expertise in doggie nutrition. Neither of us were "trained" in good manners during the first few weeks of life. We are best friends and still working very hard together to become as good in manners as some doggies on this forum. We are still learning. Fruits and vegetables are an extremely good, inexpensive, high value training reward for mi while at home....maybe not for all doggies, but certainly for some.
> 
> I think the article is helpful and provides good advice (other than the commercialism) for those of us who are beginners and still learning.
> 
> paz contigo, Ricky Ricardo


Hi Ricky and Popi, the reason I gave the list of treats I use most often is specifically because they ARE good quality, nutritious, species appropriate foods. The "worse" things, I save for once-in-a-while treats. Just like us, something that is not great nutrition is not going to hurt them if given once in a great while, and in moderation. I agree with you vet completely that I don't give my dogs (love saying that!  ) "treats" like Milk Bones that have ingredients that I don't fully understand. Milk Bones, honestly make TERRIBLE training treats also, because they are big and hard. Training treats should be small and soft. IMO, things like Milk Bones are "hand outs", not training treats, and I don't use them at all. (and I KNOW you were NOT advocating their use!!!)

I suspect that I, like Dave, was reacting mostly to the "training" advice and "tone" in the article, which smacks WAY too much of Cesar Millan terminology. I would much rather have people talking about "calm confident" handlers and "calm, confident" dogs&#8230; Because THAT is the state of mind I want in my dogs when they clearly understand the behavior expected and WANT to do it because it's FUN to "play" with me!!!


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## Naturelover

krandall said:


> Yes, WAY too "CM" for me.


I love that I can read that article, think all this, keep reading the thread, and see that what I had planned to say has already been wonderfully explained by others. That's why I love this forum!

That being said, I appreciate the spirit in which the link was shared.


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## 31818

davetgabby said:


> I think Darwins would be better served with someone that has credentials in pet nutrition and training writing these sort of articles.


It is the same guy who formulates the Darwins diet...which you have said you would use if it were available to you!



davetgabby said:


> agree, and what turns me off is this statement of "calm submissive state" . No such thing . It's an oxymoron.





krandall said:


> Yes, WAY too "CM" for me.


That is all beside the point of the article. Are bananas, carrots, apples, and blueberries good healthy training treats or not.......(for occasional use, if your doggie can tolerate them, etc., etc.)? I think they are. Let's keep the thread on topic :focus:

besos, Ricky Ricardo


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## 31818

Milo's Mom said:


> Estamos con ustedes, Ricky y Popi. Comemos muchas frutas y legumbres. Creemos que que el artículo era muy interesante. Muchas gracias por compartirlo con nosotros. No somos expertos tampoco pero estamos siempre aprendiendo.
> 
> Joyce, Milo (apodo por Milagro), y Brookie


Verdad, esso si, gracias

besos y abrazos fuertes, su amigo por siempre, Ricky (el Cubano loco)


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## davetgabby

Ricky Ricardo said:


> It is the same guy who formulates the Darwins diet...which you have said you would use if it were available to you!
> 
> That is all beside the point of the article. Are bananas, carrots, apples, and blueberries good healthy training treats or not.......(for occasional use, if your doggie can tolerate them, etc., etc.)? I think they are. Let's keep the thread on topic :focus:
> 
> besos, Ricky Ricardo


I doubt he formulated their diets , here's his credentials "Marketing Manager at Darwin's, Social Media Specialist, Community, Blogger, Customer Advocate, Music, Outdoor Enthusiast, Animal Lover."

Nothing wrong with these items except some need cooking or pureed to be of much health benefit.
I don't recall saying I would use Darwins?


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## 31818

davetgabby said:


> Nothing wrong with these items except some need cooking or pureed to be of much health benefit.


On what basis do you say that? Are you a credentialed canine nutritionist? I am not talking about a substitute diet. I am talking about a training treat, something better than say, milkbones.



> I don't recall saying I would use Darwins?


Here ya go.



Molly120213 said:


> Darwins does not ship to Canada.





davetgabby said:


> nope, or I'd be using them.


besos, Ricky Ricardo


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## davetgabby

"On what basis do you say that? Are you a credentialed canine nutritionist? I am not talking about a substitute diet. I am talking about a training treat, something better than say, milkbones.

This is well documented with a little research . I consult with a nutritionist on a weekly basis for years now. Sabine Y eah I guess I did say that , my memory slipped. me.


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## krandall

davetgabby said:


> I doubt he formulated their diets , here's his credentials "Marketing Manager at Darwin's, Social Media Specialist, Community, Blogger, Customer Advocate, Music, Outdoor Enthusiast, Animal Lover."
> 
> Nothing wrong with these items except some need cooking or pureed to be of much health benefit.
> I don't recall saying I would use Darwins?


That may be true in terms of being a health BENEFIT, but for training treats, that's not a huge criteria&#8230; IMO, you're looking for something that dogs really like that won't harm them. All of the foods listed fit into that category. Cooked or pureed fruits would be pretty useless as training treats.


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## davetgabby

krandall said:


> That may be true in terms of being a health BENEFIT, but for training treats, that's not a huge criteria&#8230; IMO, you're looking for something that dogs really like that won't harm them. All of the foods listed fit into that category. Cooked or pureed fruits would be pretty useless as training treats.


yes Karen I am just talking nutrition wise.


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## 31818

This tread has taken a really weird turn! BOW WOW.



davetgabby said:


> "On what basis do you say that? Are you a credentialed canine nutritionist? I am not talking about a substitute diet. I am talking about a training treat, something better than say, milkbones.
> 
> This is well documented with a little research . I consult with a nutritionist on a weekly basis for years now.


Well, it is well documented with a little research that bananas, carrots, apples, and blueberries in their raw form are good, healthy training treats for dogs who can tolerate them. Why do you criticize the person who wrote this article for not being a trained nutritionist when you don't have to be a trained nutritionist to give good advice when it is based on "well documented" information. I don't know, maybe he consults with a nutritionist on a weekly basis for years now two! I hope he does since you have given Darwins diet your seal of approval.

besos, Ricky Ricardo


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## davetgabby

here is from Sabine five minutes ago ..."Dogs can't break down plant cell walls in their short digestive tract very efficiently at all. Herbivores do this by bacterial fermentation, where the bacteria digest the plant matter and make fatty acids, which are then absorbed by the host animal.

So in order for plant matter to be digestible, we need to break down the cell walls, either by mechanical force (pureeing), chemically (enzymes), or temperature. When fruits and veggies are overripe and soft/mushy, a natural chemical breakdown process has already taken place, so this is not an issue and they can be digested."

I told you already the part I had issue with. It was poor choice of training methodology and he missed telling you important nutritional info
I have no problem with you posting this, just the article itself.


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## 31818

davetgabby said:


> I told you already the part I had issue with. It was poor choice of training methodology and he missed telling you important nutritional info
> I have no problem with you posting this, just the article itself.


This thread was not about training methodology or nutritional info. It is a thread about bananas, carrots, apples, and blueberries as healthy training treats. So what are you saying? I am not supposed to eat these for training purposes? What should I be eating around the home for simple, inexpensive training rewards - cheese, peanut butter, hot dogs, or milkbones? What are YOUR suggestions for good, nutritional training treats? How about steamed cauliflower or steamed brussels sprouts or steamed carrots? We little doggies are curious. Maybe Sabine should answer that.

besos, Ricky Ricardo


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## davetgabby

nothing wrong with many of these things. You missed my point . Whatever works for you. Nutrition is a dog specific thing. I use freeze dried liver .


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## 31818

davetgabby said:


> Nutrition is a dog specific thing. I use freeze dried liver .


GREAT! Muchas gracias, now we are getting someplace! Positive comments work better than negative comments. I'm going to stare at mi Popi with mi mesmerizing eyes and tell him to get mi some of those freeze dried livers for training treats. Sounds good to mi! :hungry:

su amigo, Ricky Ricardo


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## krandall

Ricky Ricardo said:


> GREAT! Muchas gracias, now we are getting someplace! Positive comments work better than negative comments. I'm going to stare at mi Popi with mi mesmerizing eyes and tell him to get mi some of those freeze dried livers for training treats. Sounds good to mi! :hungry:
> 
> su amigo, Ricky Ricardo


Another yummy training treat/meat product is freeze dried lamb lung. Most dogs do NUTS for it. We actually use a number of different freeze dried meat products from time to time. The problem it that these are usually expensive, commercial treat products, and we go through a LOT of treats. (And, as I mentioned before, we need to rotate pretty often). Another thing we put in the rotation is Ziwi Peaks air dried lamb dog food. This one is nice because it isn't as hard as many freeze dried meat products, so is easier to break, and faster to chew.


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## Naturelover

Lamb lung seems to be the trainer's treat of choice. Both of my training mentors here carry large bags of lamb lung when they go to private or group sessions. The Merrick ones are nice because they can easily be broken into any size for any size of dog, and as Karen says, dogs typically go nuts for them.

I have been able to get Archer to work for teeny apple bits once in a while, but they certainly don't motivate him unless he is super hungry, and he won't eat any of the other listed fruits/veggies on their own. However he goes nuts for steamed yam, but that is only useful if you're training in the kitchen next to a plate of it because it can't go in pockets. I have found dried apple rings and he likes those when they are cut into tiny pieces but again that is a lot of sugar, and they aren't high value enough to use on a walk.

Freeze dried meat (turkey liver, chicken breast, beef liver, lamb lung, etc) is the best and I find dogs are most consistently interested in these, so we use those regularly. Cheese/hot dogs/steak/bits of hamburger are reserved for difficult environments like training class or a trial.

Real meat like roast chicken and cubed beef or pork loin is great, but I just don't eat a lot of plain meat on my own so I don't find myself with extra of that type of stuff very often. When I do though, I certainly set some aside and use it.

I like to use dehydrated raw dog food when I can, such as Stella & Chewy's patties broken up, ziwipeak as Karen suggested, and also have found a product here called "Smack" which is dehydrated and really high quality that can even be used as a meal. Lots of great options out there these days!

Another recipe which has been going around for those interested in making their own treats is called "tuna fudge". Many dogs (including Archer) really like this and it is inexpensive compared to commercial treats. You can also change the flour, the meat or any other ingredients to best suit your dog. The ones I tried were perfect training treats as they were stinky but not messy or oily and broke up perfectly into little, non-crumbly pieces much like those wellness bites do.

Here's a link to a recipe: http://moderndogmagazine.com/articles/diy-eat-tuna-fudge/29925


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## davetgabby

just a caution on the tuna treats, http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/01/03/fish-as-a-protein-source.aspx


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## 31818

Gracias everyone for getting this thread back on track. All the suggestions are MUY helpful. I am going to give many of the suggestions a try. opcorn:

besos, Ricky Ricardo


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## SJ1998

I really like the freeze dried (pure bites is a brand I like and stella and chewys make something called carnivore crunch - only issue with the stellas is it can get a little crumbly, not in a milk bone way but kind of powdery - when you get to the bottom of the bag). At home boiled chicken etc but that's so messy in a class situation. 

I recently read that pomegranate seeds are okay for dogs. I dont know that it would be practical as training treat however.


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