# Help.. He bites



## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

I have a question.. Will neutering help with his biting? My husband is ready to get rid of him. He bites and lunges at my husband every time he sits down. Rio is almost 5 mons olds. I have never had a puppy that bites as much as he does.


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## Jplatthy (Jan 16, 2011)

I don't think that will stop the biting. Is he trying to play with your husband? Is he excited to see him? Does your husband play with him?


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

I feel like he is trying to play with him. Charlie, my husband, does play with him some. Charlie has some health problems that does not allow him to walk Rio or play for long periods of time. Rio does bite me also but not that often.


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## morriscsps (Aug 17, 2010)

It is personal trainer time. Get one that will come to the house and watch the interactions between your hubby and Rio.

Until then, try the squeaky high-pitched "ouch" and put him in his expen when he bites. Biting puppies shouldn't get attention until they calm down.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I agree with Pam. In a puppy this age, it is unlikely to be aggression, but he hasn't learned proper bite inhibition, and you need to get that dealt with SOON. Pam gave you some good ideas to start, and I would definitely get a trainer involved to help you extinguish this behavior as soon as possible.


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

Rio was an only child growing up. When I got him he was in a pen with his mother. He has been around some puppies and dogs since we have had him. He might need some more socializing with dogs.

I will be calling a trainer today.


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## CarolWCamelo (Feb 15, 2012)

Be very careful in picking a trainer, to choose one who uses positive methods. If you post your approximate location (I haven't looked to see if it's visible, and can't see it from here), we might be able to assist you in choosing one who is suitable.

And I do agree with Pam and Karen.

Now that you say what Rio's background is, I can see he didn't learn from littermates how to inhibit his bite! Most pups learn that in the litter, from the other pups.

I'll be here watching and wishing you the very best.

Wed, 11 Apr 2012 06:50:18 (PDT)


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## CarolWCamelo (Feb 15, 2012)

Dave might be able to help you find an appropriate trainer; I see you're in Mississippi, where trainers vary a lot (as they do in many places).

You might drop a PM to Dave, and see if he knows somebody in your area. Could you let us know what city or town you are near, or in? That would help in finding an appropriate trainer. You may send me a private message if you prefer to do it that way, and I'll pass that information on to Dave, who has lots of connections with trainers.

Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:05:29 (PDT)


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

We live in Ridgeland, MS.


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## CarolWCamelo (Feb 15, 2012)

Thanks! Could you give us your zip code? That can help in a search for trainers. Trainers vary SO MUCH, and it's important to avoid any who use inappropriate punishment. There are too many of those, but luckily, more and more trainers are doing a lot better now.

I sent DaveTGabby a private message and asked him to read this thread, so I hope he will have time to do that, and soon.

Wed, 11 Apr 2012 08:46:07 (PDT)


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

39157


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## CarolWCamelo (Feb 15, 2012)

Thanks for the ZIP code! I'll take a look at the APDT list of trainers, but might not find anything I can assess. Dave could likely help a lot more than I can.

Wed, 11 Apr 2012 09:09:04 (PDT)


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## CarolWCamelo (Feb 15, 2012)

Ms Mithchell said:


> 39157


Here's what I found on the APDT trainers list:

Leslie Mayeaux
Brandon, MS 39047

APDT Member since 2005

Phone: 601-212-6968
Fax:

Email: [email protected]

Services Offered

Clicker training and agility, pet sitting.

No certifications, but lots of decent trainers aren't certified.

Doesn't specialize in behavior, or she'd have said so, I believe.

No other trainers listed till you go up to over 50 miles away.

Here's the page I started from:

http://www.apdt.com/petowners/ts/default.aspx

You could phone her and chat with her, and see what you think.

Wed, 11 Apr 2012 09:23:17 (PDT)


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Ms Mithchell said:


> Rio was an only child growing up. When I got him he was in a pen with his mother. He has been around some puppies and dogs since we have had him. He might need some more socializing with dogs.
> 
> I will be calling a trainer today.


Puppies who are singletons don't get to learn bite inhibition from their siblings the way most puppies do. This doesn't mean he can't be taught, he can. But that's probably a good part of why he's more "bitey" than the average puppy.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

CarolWCamelo said:


> Be very careful in picking a trainer, to choose one who uses positive methods. If you post your approximate location (I haven't looked to see if it's visible, and can't see it from here), we might be able to assist you in choosing one who is suitable.
> 
> And I do agree with Pam and Karen.
> 
> ...


Oops! Should have read your post before responding... should have figured you'd be on top of that piece!


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## CarolWCamelo (Feb 15, 2012)

krandall said:


> Oops! Should have read your post before responding... should have figured you'd be on top of that piece!


Karen - I'm glad you added the similar information; that helps to confirm.

How much bite inhibition can be taught at this age remains open to question. But Rio sounds sort of okay, and I could hope that he'll do better with appropriate assistance from a GOOD trainer or behavior counselor.

I can think of one technique that might be used now, if Charlie has the capability of doing this (physically); you could use the same technique, Rio's Mum.

Keep a couple of chew-objects where you can reach them quickly. When Rio goes to bite, hand him the chew, and indicate it's okay for him to bite that.

I've used that technique myself in the past, and if you can be very consistent about using it, and if Rio will take the chew, it can really help.

Alternatively, you could use a stuffed toy instead of a chew.

Some more thoughts I have. If Charlie's health problems cause him to move in quick or jerky fashion, Rio might be responding to those. If that's what's happening, it could be good if Charlie slows some of his motions.

Another very common factor is that people anticipating trouble with dogs commonly meet their eyes, usually, with a kind of slightly fearful stare.

That could easily set off the dog. i wouldn't TALK to Rio when he appears to be starting up to jump and bite. I'd suggest Charlie look away from Rio at that time - very difficult to do, when you're anticipating a possible bite!

But, Rio's mom, if you can be there working with Rio and Charlie, YOU might be able to offer a stuffy-toy or a chew.

Without littermates, Rio may not have experienced much in the way of canine calming signals. All the same, dogs are BORN with the capability of learning them. I would, if you possibly can, acquire the work by Turid Rugaas on calming signals - the book and the DVD.

http://www.coherentdog.org/vek/stressdown.php

Amazon or DogWise should have these works.

YOU can imitate the calming signals, and sometimes, they work amazingiy effectively.

I just started a new thread in this forum about interviewing a trainer (or behavior counselor). I don't have much to offer, but am asking others to contribute. You might watch for that thread.

Wishing you lots and lots of good luck - you, Charlie, and Rio!

Wed, 11 Apr 2012 10:14:13 (PDT)


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

Thank you for all the help and tips. We are home with him most all the time. Rio can be the sweetest thing even to Charlie a lot of times. He just needs a little training not to bite.


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## gelbergirl (Jun 9, 2007)

I always *squealed* when Henry would inappropriate bite, it seemed to snap him back to preferred and more sociable behavior.


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

gelbergirl said:


> I always *squealed* when Henry would inappropriate bite, it seemed to snap him back to preferred and more sociable behavior.


We tried that. All Rio does is bark then goes back to trying to bite.


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

When mine got nipie I just gave them a chew toy. I had numerous bites even drew blood but I could tell the difference between play and aggression. Zoey still plays like that but will not bite down she mouths me. I stop when I have had enough. She like wrestle with me just the same as she does with Maddie. I don't understand why a trainer for normal puppy behavior? Is it because Rio's mom is calling it aggression or cant seem to know the difference.? Really what would a professional trainer say to do? Is it bad I allow Zoey to play like that with me?


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

Yes, Rio is trying to play, but he draws blood. Charlie can just sit on the couch and Rio will start biting his hands. If Charlie moves his hands away, Rio will start barking, lunging, and biting him on the leg. I just think it is not normal play. I have never had a puppy that would do this. This is our first Hav. I thought they were a lot nicer toward people.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Ms Mithchell said:


> Yes, Rio is trying to play, but he draws blood. Charlie can just sit on the couch and Rio will start biting his hands. If Charlie moves his hands away, Rio will start barking, lunging, and biting him on the leg. I just think it is not normal play. I have never had a puppy that would do this. This is our first Hav. I thought they were a lot nicer toward people.


yeah a trainer is definitely in order . Email me privately with your personal email address and I will get you some help. I can't find any potential trainers in your area. but can set you up for some online consultation , no charge ... not the best approach but better than nothing.


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## Pixiesmom (Jul 31, 2008)

If it makes you feel any better, I'll tell you that when we brought Mig home he was not a very nice little guy. He was food aggressive, snippety and just plain mean sometimes. He is now the most docile, gentile, happy dog I have ever seen-and an extreme lap dog at that. So, they most certainly can be turned around.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Good stuff Beth, you're proof of what people can do if you take the time, and have the right approach.


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## Pixiesmom (Jul 31, 2008)

Yes, Mig is my sweet simpleton, while Pixie is my cerebral snob.


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## Ms Mithchell (Mar 9, 2012)

davetgabby said:


> yeah a trainer is definitely in order . Email me privately with your personal email address and I will get you some help. I can't find any potential trainers in your area. but can set you up for some online consultation , no charge ... not the best approach but better than nothing.


Sent you a PM


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## Cindi (Sep 5, 2011)

Don’t know if I’ve ever mentioned this on the Forum because it had stopped being a problem before I joined …… but Mojo was a biter (and I do not mean puppy mouth exploring or teething) beginning the day after I brought him home! I can really empathize with you because, like Havanese, Lowchen are noted for their affectionate and clownish behavior. I was stunned when this little puppy would come at me (and only me) and attack my legs. Stunned and covered in bruises. I’ve had many dogs over my lifetime and my shelves are lined with books by all the experts. I’d selected a pup from a reputable breeder, knew his bloodlines back for generations, knew he’d been socialized with people and other dogs, knew he was healthy. I’m a huge advocate of positive training. And none, repeat none, of it made a bit of difference. I had this wonderful, smart dog that was doing amazing accommodating to a human world in every way except the most important one! In addition to my trainer I brought an animal behaviorist into the home. The three of us consulted with breeders and vets – heck, I even picked the brains of the neuropsychologists at work! 

I wish I could tell you one particular “tip” that worked, but I can’t. The good advice to squeal like another pup and stop the play would set him off worse than anything else. It wound up being a long process involving management, training, keeping him cognitively and physically tired, and providing predictability and structure/structure/structure. 

What I can tell you is that I now have a closer bond with this dog than any other I have ever had. He is well adjusted and happy. No one has bruises! Please, bring in the behaviorist. The time and the money are so worth it. If you want to know more about things we tried that worked and didn’t work, please feel free to PM me – I kept really good notes through the whole “learning experience


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Cindi said:


> Don't know if I've ever mentioned this on the Forum because it had stopped being a problem before I joined &#8230;&#8230; but Mojo was a biter (and I do not mean puppy mouth exploring or teething) beginning the day after I brought him home! I can really empathize with you because, like Havanese, Lowchen are noted for their affectionate and clownish behavior. I was stunned when this little puppy would come at me (and only me) and attack my legs. Stunned and covered in bruises. I've had many dogs over my lifetime and my shelves are lined with books by all the experts. I'd selected a pup from a reputable breeder, knew his bloodlines back for generations, knew he'd been socialized with people and other dogs, knew he was healthy. I'm a huge advocate of positive training. And none, repeat none, of it made a bit of difference. I had this wonderful, smart dog that was doing amazing accommodating to a human world in every way except the most important one! In addition to my trainer I brought an animal behaviorist into the home. The three of us consulted with breeders and vets - heck, I even picked the brains of the neuropsychologists at work!
> 
> I wish I could tell you one particular "tip" that worked, but I can't. The good advice to squeal like another pup and stop the play would set him off worse than anything else. It wound up being a long process involving management, training, keeping him cognitively and physically tired, and providing predictability and structure/structure/structure.
> 
> What I can tell you is that I now have a closer bond with this dog than any other I have ever had. He is well adjusted and happy. No one has bruises! Please, bring in the behaviorist. The time and the money are so worth it. If you want to know more about things we tried that worked and didn't work, please feel free to PM me - I kept really good notes through the whole "learning experience


great advice Cindi, you're absolutely right. These things are never as easy as they appear. The first choice is a knowledgable trainer, to come in. This is not always possible. Not sure what you mean by behaviorist, whether you are talking literally or figuratively. I have her set up to discuss this with a very qualified trainer. If she recommends someone to come in she will if this can't be handled online sort of speak. A certified applied behaviorist is not in the area and would be astronomically priced to get to travel any distance. We'll see how it goes.


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## Cindi (Sep 5, 2011)

Dave,

A whole lot of my training took place on line with a great trainer, so I know it can make a difference. I LOVE this topic because one of the things that I learned while extinguishing this behavior is that people (like me) take it as a personal failure when the dog doesn't live up to their expectations. And bite???? Oh no, that's the worst ... a good dog "shouldn't bite". Not a cute, fluffy, dog with great genes! Certainly not a puppy! But, wonder of wonders, they do. And they can wind up abandoned in shelters for it. This is one of the reasons I asked to join this forum even though I don't have a Havanese living in my home. People here talk about things that matter in the dog-human relationship. And help each other.


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## Beau's mom (Oct 6, 2011)

*Hey, Rio's mom -
We had the same trouble with Beau. Although it is still (sometimes) directed toward my husband (who neither walks, plays, feeds or speaks to Beau), at first it was both of us. My trainer (yes, more for me than for Beau) advised:

1) Turn your back and walk away from him when he gets into the biting frenzy (say nothing)
2) If/when that doesn't work, say "No bites" firmly but not yelling
3) If/when that doesn't work (after a decent time trying), pick him up and put him in his crate for a time out. Don't yell. Let him out after he settles down for 5-10 minutes.

I don't know what the books say -- and I was afraid he would interpret it as punishment (but he didn't). But, it worked for us. It also got better when we weren't dealing with those needle-like puppy teeth!

Don't give up! it WILL pass!!*


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Ms Mithchell said:


> Yes, Rio is trying to play, but he draws blood. Charlie can just sit on the couch and Rio will start biting his hands. If Charlie moves his hands away, Rio will start barking, lunging, and biting him on the leg. I just think it is not normal play. I have never had a puppy that would do this. This is our first Hav. I thought they were a lot nicer toward people.


 I see the difference now. One thing I used to do to divert from ruff play was to throw a ball. Maddie loves that game. It does get their mind on something else and maybe its a game your husband can play.


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