# Orange stain on teeth



## Jeanniek (Mar 20, 2018)

I clean Zumba’s teeth regularly, and have her chew on the bones and bulky sticks the vet recommends. Still, i noticed the other day that, on both sides, on her back top teeth, there is an orange stain in the middle of the tooth. The gums look healthy and the rest of the teeth look good but, there are those stained teeth. Anybody have an idea of what caused it? Do I need to address it now, or can it wait? She just turned 8 months old yesterday.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Is the orange along the gum line?


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## Jeanniek (Mar 20, 2018)

mudpuppymama said:


> Is the orange along the gum line?


Some along the gum line and a bit in the middle of the tooth.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Jeanniek said:


> Some along the gum line and a bit in the middle of the tooth.


It could be tartar, however she is so young. Others may have advice on whether you should have the vet check it out now or wait. I hope you find an answer. Tartar is sometimes hard to fight in small dogs regardless of how much you brush their teeth. I feed a raw diet now so my dogs rarely get tartar. However, it accumulated very fast when I fed kibble.


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## Jeanniek (Mar 20, 2018)

mudpuppymama said:


> It could be tartar, however she is so young. Others may have advice on whether you should have the vet check it out now or wait. I hope you find an answer. Tartar is sometimes hard to fight in small dogs regardless of how much you brush their teeth. I feed a raw diet now so my dogs rarely get tartar. However, it accumulated very fast when I fed kibble.


That's good to know. She does have a diet of 1/2 raw diet and 1/2 freeze dried raw. Her treats are mostly freeze dried. There's one air dried, and I think one that is like a kibble, that has finally finished and I won't be getting again.

I thank you for your input. I hope somebody has seen it before.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

Can you tell if it’s a permanent tooth or a baby tooth? 

I think where you have a good oral hygiene routine, it’s worth following up because it’s less likely to be a simple case of needing to brush more. There are lots of things that can cause discoloration of human teeth other than decay, such as to permanent teeth before they erupt, so I assume it’s the same for dogs. Sometimes discoloration can indicate a cavity, so if it’s on two teeth next to each other there could be something going on between them or at the gumline. I don’t think that means it’s anything serious, but even if it does turn out she just needs special attention to oral hygiene better to know now and be able to plan for it. 

These are all guesses I’m making based on having grown up in a dental office, hopefully you’ll get the answers you need from someone who knows more about dogs!


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

The orange color is the beginnings of tartar. Even though I brush Scout and Truffles teeth daily Scout gets orange spots in the crevices of his back molars. I use an Oral B electric toothbrush on him. Truffles didn't tolerate is at all! 😬 Scout has had his teeth cleaned twice at the pet hospital. Truffles has had her teeth cleaned once last year by a dentist. They both have appointments with the dentist in June for a pre check-up to cleanings. The dentist took before and after cleaning pictures and x-rays. Truffles had a small chip on her molar which was smoothed out. She also had sealant applied. That would not have been done at the pet hospital. It's a bit of a drive, but feel it's worth it.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Heather's said:


> The orange color is the beginnings of tartar. Even though I brush Scout and Truffles teeth daily Scout gets orange spots in the crevices of his back molars. I use an Oral B electric toothbrush on him. Truffles didn't tolerate is at all! &#128556; Scout has had his teeth cleaned twice at the pet hospital. Truffles has had her teeth cleaned once last year by a dentist. They both have appointments with the dentist in June for a pre check-up to cleanings. The dentist took before and after cleaning pictures and x-rays. Truffles had a small chip on her molar which was smoothed out. She also had sealant applied. That would not have been done at the pet hospital. It's a bit of a drive, but feel it's worth it.


Wow that is awesome that Scout tolerates the electric toothbrush! I know mine would not! I do think many small dogs accumulate tartar even with very diligent teeth brushing. Feeding raw has significantly reduced tartar on my dogs yet they still get a little mainly on their canine teeth and they have needed cleanings twice in 11 years. I use fragaria vesca once a week to prevent tartar and if it starts to build up I do a daily treatment for 30 days. This does help my dogs but my friend tried it on hers and said it did not help.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Wow that is awesome that Scout tolerates the electric toothbrush! I know mine would not! I do think many small dogs accumulate tartar even with very diligent teeth brushing. Feeding raw has significantly reduced tartar on my dogs yet they still get a little mainly on their canine teeth and they have needed cleanings twice in 11 years. I use fragaria vesca once a week to prevent tartar and if it starts to build up I do a daily treatment for 30 days. This does help my dogs but my friend tried it on hers and said it did not help.


I think tartar develops differently on each dog...just like us. Scout has large teeth and even with the Oral B electric still gets a little tartar on the back molars. Truffles has tiny teeth and had only a little tartar on her molars before cleaning at 4 yrs old. After her cleaning and one year later she has no tartar. I think maybe the dentist did a more thorough job.


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

Pam scrapes tartar off with dental tools for people. You can buy them off Amazon. Tartar comes off pretty easily if caught early. We've had more trouble with teeth that have been "deep cleaned" at the Vets than doing this. I guess because she catches it before it gets down under the gums. They learn to tolerate it fairly quickly. 

Like a lot of the individual differences, some accumulate it more quickly than others.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Wow that is awesome that Scout tolerates the electric toothbrush! I know mine would not! I do think many small dogs accumulate tartar even with very diligent teeth brushing. Feeding raw has significantly reduced tartar on my dogs yet they still get a little mainly on their canine teeth and they have needed cleanings twice in 11 years. I use fragaria vesca once a week to prevent tartar and if it starts to build up I do a daily treatment for 30 days. This does help my dogs but my friend tried it on hers and said it did not help.


Just want to mention Scout loves to have his teeth brushed. He comes running when he knows I'm brushing Truffles teeth. He just sits there watching and waiting. &#128522; I think he likes the toothpaste!


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

Pam brushes teeth with coconut oil, and they line up for it. They still need scaling once in a while though. 

I bought a set of those tools for myself, and scrape tartar off of my own teeth.

If you catch the tartar down close to the gums, it will most of the time all come off in one shot, from one tooth.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Tom King said:


> Pam brushes teeth with coconut oil, and they line up for it.


I also use coconut oil. Mia goes nuts for it!!! I think Fragaria Vesca helps soften up the tartar a bit too so it is easier to get off.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Tom King;1429350 We've had more trouble with teeth that have been "deep cleaned" at the Vets than doing this. I guess because she catches it before it gets down under the gums. They learn to tolerate it fairly quickly.[/QUOTE said:


> Tom, I was wondering what types of problems you encountered from deep cleanings at the vet. I get a bit nervous about vet dental cleanings especially as my dogs are getting older. Thank you.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Tom, I was wondering what types of problems you encountered from deep cleanings at the vet. I get a bit nervous about vet dental cleanings especially as my dogs are getting older. Thank you.


Just curious what problems you have encountered after dental cleanings?


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

I don't know if they went too deep under the gums, or scraped too hard, and damaged the enamel, but those dogs started losing teeth earlier than ones who had never had the "deep" cleaning, as that Vet's office calls it.

It was soon after that when Pam started scaling the teeth herself, and these other dogs have kept their teeth a lot longer.

I don't know if she is simply doing a better job, or catching any tartar earlier, but we won't be seeking any more "professional" help with teeth cleaning.


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

Tom King said:


> I don't know if they went too deep under the gums, or scraped too hard, and damaged the enamel, but those dogs started losing teeth earlier than ones who had never had the "deep" cleaning, as that Vet's office calls it.
> 
> It was soon after that when Pam started scaling the teeth herself, and these other dogs have kept their teeth a lot longer.
> 
> I don't know if she is simply doing a better job, or catching any tartar earlier, but we won't be seeking any more "professional" help with teeth cleaning.


Yikes! I've never heard of anyone having problems like that. That's rather disturbing. I always thought one had to have professional training to do the scaling. That reminds me that a dental hygienist I used to have scaled her dog's teeth. She said she didn't trust the training the vets received in that it wasn't thorough enough.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

My Sparky had serious dental issues at 15 yrs old because I wasn't on top of his dental hygiene. It was wasn't a good because he had heart issues also. I will not let this happen again. Both my two will have their exam and teeth cleaned in a few months. You can find lot's of helpful information on Aggie's Dental Center, Mill Valley, CA website. Here you can find information about cleaning and periodontal disease under services and patient resources. There's lot's of other interesting dental information. They also have a Facebook page. Hope this is helpful.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Thank you Tom and Heather’s for sharing your experiences. I do not think my dogs would tolerate me scaling their teeth. I do feel dependent upon the vet cleaning them properly. She does it herself vs a technician. But going to an actual dog dentist is probably better. Good luck with your appointments Heather’s. I think Mia will probably need hers cleaned this year. I get nervous about the anesthesia as she ages but know it is important to take care of her teeth.


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

I'm the dog holder for a number of different things like this, but they quickly learn to tolerate the tooth scaling, so Pam does some by herself.

You just get behind the tartar at the gum line, and pull up towards the outer tips of the teeth. It usually comes mostly off with the first pull, and might leave a little along the edges that rubs off easily.

The longer it's left on, the harder it is to break it loose.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Tom King said:


> I'm the dog holder for a number of different things like this, but they quickly learn to tolerate the tooth scaling, so Pam does some by herself.
> 
> You just get behind the tartar at the gum line, and pull up towards the outer tips of the teeth. It usually comes mostly off with the first pull, and might leave a little along the edges that rubs off easily.
> 
> The longer it's left on, the harder it is to break it loose.


The role of dog holder is pretty important in our house for a few things. I may have to give this scaling a shot. I might start with my fingernail and see how that goes. Thank you.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Thank you Tom and Heather's for sharing your experiences. I do not think my dogs would tolerate me scaling their teeth. I do feel dependent upon the vet cleaning them properly. She does it herself vs a technician. But going to an actual dog dentist is probably better. Good luck with your appointments Heather's. I think Mia will probably need hers cleaned this year. I get nervous about the anesthesia as she ages but know it is important to take care of her teeth.


I understand you concern about anesthesia. The pet hospital and the dentist required exams and blood work before the procedure. Unfortunately Sparky had heart issues and was not a candidate for any anesthesia. The first time Scout's teeth were cleaned I was able to watch. The vet intubated, gave meds and was there for the whole procedure, but a hygienist cleaned his teeth. The second cleaning I was only able to stay until he was asleep and intubated. I thought it would be a good idea to take Truffles to the dentist because she has little teeth. Truffles cleaning with the dentist was much more thorough. Plus there is a board certified anesthesiologist that stays with your pet until it wakes up which is comforting.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Heather's said:


> I understand you concern about anesthesia. The pet hospital and the dentist required exams and blood work before the procedure. Unfortunately Sparky had heart issues and was not a candidate for any anesthesia. The first time Scout's teeth were cleaned I was able to watch. The vet intubated, gave meds and was there for the whole procedure, but a hygienist cleaned his teeth. The second cleaning I was only able to stay until he was asleep and intubated. I thought it would be a good idea to take Truffles to the dentist because she has little teeth. Truffles cleaning with the dentist was much more thorough. Plus there is a board certified anesthesiologist that stays until your pet wakes up which is comforting.


Thanks Heather's. My vet does do thorough blood work first but it would be comforting to have an anesthesiologist around. Mia also has very tiny teeth compared to my yorkie. I would think those are a little more difficult to clean without getting carried away and going too deep. This could be why some dogs lose some teeth more than others after a deep cleaning.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Thanks Heather's. My vet does do thorough blood work first but it would be comforting to have an anesthesiologist around. Mia also has very tiny teeth compared to my yorkie. I would think those are a little more difficult to clean without getting carried away and going too deep. This could be why some dogs lose some teeth more than others after a deep cleaning.


When we go for the exam I will ask the dentist why deep cleaning might cause a dog to lose teeth. I guess it could happen due to infection.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Heather's said:


> When we go for the exam I will ask the dentist why deep cleaning might cause a dog to lose teeth. I guess it could happen due to infection.


Thanks Heather's. My understanding of tartar is that if enough of it forms under the gums, it can loosen up the tooth and that is why it is good to stay on top of it. It would be great to know if this is true and if deep cleaning itself can cause it.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Thanks Heather's. My understanding of tartar is that if enough of it forms under the gums, it can loosen up the tooth and that is why it is good to stay on top of it. It would be great to know if this is true and if deep cleaning itself can cause it.


I asked a friend that's a human dentist if deep cleaning can cause to loss. His response was,"Not if done properly." :grin2:


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## Jeanniek (Mar 20, 2018)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> Can you tell if it's a permanent tooth or a baby tooth? !


I don't know. It's the teeth at the very back on top. Are those permanent teeth, like they are in humans?

I read all the comments, which was very interesting and which I appreciate. I think i would be nervous to do the scaling myself. If a vet can cause tooth issues by doing it incorrectly, how can I do a better job of it? What is it they are doing wrong, that I would do better?

I do use coconut oil, but have not been consistent about it. And I do it after I brush. I am wondering if giving the coconut oil first, then brushing might be more effective?

I also have started putting a drop of apple cider vinegar in her water bowl. I read that helps against the tartar. What do you all think of that? I would not want to erode her enamel.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

Jeanniek said:


> I don't know. It's the teeth at the very back on top. Are those permanent teeth, like they are in humans?
> 
> I read all the comments, which was very interesting and which I appreciate. I think i would be nervous to do the scaling myself. If a vet can cause tooth issues by doing it incorrectly, how can I do a better job of it? What is it they are doing wrong, that I would do better?
> 
> ...


I just assumed it wasn't tartar because i don't think of tartar as being isolated in the middle of the teeth, but I realized "middle" can mean a lot of things and tartar IS the most logical explanation. I'm not sure how to tell about permanent teeth, i just know in humans discoloration can sometimes occur before permanent teeth erupt, and if it's a discolored baby tooth it'll probably be gone soon.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Heather's said:


> I asked a friend that's a human dentist if deep cleaning can cause to loss. His response was,"Not if done properly." :grin2:


I guess with any profession there are some who are more skilled than others. I would think the majority know what they are doing but I am not sure how to tell who those are!


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

The orange stuff is plaque building up. Even through I brush Scout and Truffles teeth daily, Scout has orange staining on his last upper molar. When the dentist spoke to us after Truffles cleaning she said not to brush that night, but start the next day because bacteria starts to adhere to the teeth within 48 hrs. If the tooth is etched and not polished bacteria becomes a problem. I like Aggie's website because it covers why x-rays and routine cleaning are important to prevent future periodontal disease. Scout and Truffles never showed any signs of discomfort with the tooth abscesses they had. When Truffles went for her pre procedure exam the dentist said her teeth looked good. She expected just a routine cleaning to be done. The two molar abscesses and the cracked front lower tooth under the gumline with an abscess would have been totally missed if x-rays were not done. The dentist said animals mask their discomfort very well. It's important to have x-rays because the major problems are under the gumline. Hoping our next appointments goes well this time!


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## Jeanniek (Mar 20, 2018)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I just assumed it wasn't tartar because i don't think of tartar as being isolated in the middle of the teeth, but I realized "middle" can mean a lot of things and tartar IS the most logical explanation. I'm not sure how to tell about permanent teeth, i just know in humans discoloration can sometimes occur before permanent teeth erupt, and if it's a discolored baby tooth it'll probably be gone soon.


You were right. It is the middle of the tooth. Gum line, white teeth, orange spot, white teeth. 
It seems to be getting lighter, so I'll keep an eye on it.


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## mudpuppymama (Mar 24, 2012)

Heather's said:


> The orange stuff is plaque building up. Even through I brush Scout and Truffles teeth daily, Scout has orange staining on his last upper molar. When the dentist spoke to us after Truffles cleaning she said not to brush that night, but start the next day because bacteria starts to adhere to the teeth within 48 hrs. If the tooth is etched and not polished bacteria becomes a problem. I like Aggie's website because it covers why x-rays and routine cleaning are important to prevent future periodontal disease. Scout and Truffles never showed any signs of discomfort with the tooth abscesses they had. When Truffles went for her pre procedure exam the dentist said her teeth looked good. She expected just a routine cleaning to be done. The two molar abscesses and the cracked front lower tooth under the gumline with an abscess would have been totally missed if x-rays were not done. The dentist said animals mask their discomfort very well. It's important to have x-rays because the major problems are under the gumline. Hoping our next appointments goes well this time!


Thanks again for all the information you have shared. It sounds like your dog's are in great hands between you and the dentist. I checked out dog dentists and appears there are not too many. Only 3 in my entire state. You would think there would be more considering how important dental health is to dogs. Hope all goes well at your upcoming appointments. I would love to know how they go.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

mudpuppymama said:


> Thanks again for all the information you have shared. It sounds like your dog's are in great hands between you and the dentist. I checked out dog dentists and appears there are not too many. Only 3 in my entire state. You would think there would be more considering how important dental health is to dogs. Hope all goes well at your upcoming appointments. I would love to know how they go.


Only 15 dentists in our state. Our town does have a dentist, but feel comfortable with Aggie although it is a 45 minute drive. Having to wait three months for a pre exam. I don't think they will get an appointment until June or July. Fingers crossed this time everything will be ok! &#128556;


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