# ?Hold urine for 8 hours - overnight?



## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

Hi everyone,

I am new to this forum and have had our 19 month "rescue" Havanese for almost 4 weeks...he sleeps in his crate in our laundry room...and has been barking during the night on and off...we go to bed around 10:30 p.m. and get take him out at 6-6:15 a.m. He would much rather sleep in our bed with us, but we agree that is not what we want, so we continue crating at night. Is 8 hours unreasonable for these tiny bladders?

Also, he is very "soft"...hides and runs from visitors (yet allows them to pick him up after a while and hold/cuddle. He is not a big eater (evening meal is his fav). When I begin any training at all, his ears and tail go down and he retreats...he is fairly good at not going potty in the house, but every once in a while he will pee or poop just about anywhere he is at the time! He used a "doggy door" at the last rescue volunteer's home...but we don't have one. Does anyone have any unusual methods for retraining (we think) an adult havanese? Our goldens were trained by 7-8 months, so this is very foreign to us. We are planning on taking him with us to FL this winter and my husband is rather worried about schedule of dog vs. our normal schedule while on the road and sleeping in the hotel room with us (in his crate).

I'm sorry to go on so long, but would LOVE some input....I love him and he has found his forever home, but it would be nice to coexist a bit more smoothly...

Thanks,

Marge


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

He most definately should be able to hold it for that amount of time. Mine went thru the night 8pm - 6am by about 10 months. Of course there are some nights where they drink more than normal & may whine to go out a little earlier but usually they hold it till we are ready to take them out. Sometimes they actually hold it from 7pm to 6am. Our two dogs are also crated at night, but they are in our room with us, which gives them comfort but keeps them out of the bed. All the books on puppy training that I have read, say to put them in a crate, but in your bedroom. Just the sound of your breathing comforts them. YOu might want to try it, I bet he will stop the noise. I bet his not barking to go out, but to be near you.


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## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

*Crate in bedroom...*

Thank you for your thoughts, we will try it!

Your two little ones are absolutely adorable...I must try to learn how to bring pictures to this fun place!!!!


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## Linda P (Aug 3, 2006)

Hi Marge,

Barney acts like he was heavily disiplined in his previous home. Lots of love and being careful not to scold will help him over time. I would even suggest using words other than "come", "sit" and any other words that he reacts negatively to for training. Just make up another word to mean come, etc. for him. When he comes to you, always react very positively and excited. Never scold him after he comes to you no matter what he may have done.

I agree with moving his crate to your bedroom if at all possible. He's crying because he's lonely. Eight hours at night is not unreasonable for his bladder at 19 months unless he has a bladder infection or has never had to wait that long before so he's "trained" to go more often.


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## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

Thanks, again, for your input...we will move the crate into the bedroom and see what happens. I totally agree with the rest of your suggestions...

Marge


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

If you are going to FL by way of I85 or I95 you are welcome to stop by here for a visit. We're 18 miles off of 95 and about 25 off of 85. My wife understands how these dogs think and I get along with them okay too. We have a balanced pack of Havanese and they help train others sometimes.


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## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

Hi Tom,

THANK YOU so much for your kind offer...We are coming down from MN and will be travelling through Dalton, GA on our last night on the road...but will keep your generous offer in mind! Would love to meet you and your wife and pups! We stay near Sarasota...anywhere near there?

Marge


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

We're right below the VA./N.C. border 18 miles west of the first exit on 95 inside N.C.


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## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

You must be living in a wonderful part of the country...we used to dream of moving to NC once retirement entered the picture...but kids and grandkids keep us up here in "the best kept secret" part of the country! We drive down through WI, IL, KY, TN, GA and into FL...so guess we won't even be in your neck of the woods...but I do thank you for your kind offer! 

Marge


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

Hi Marge,
I agree with the other posters as to putting the crate in the bedroom with you. We allow our dogs to sleep in bed with us, but our Hav often gets up in the middle of the night and goes to sleep in his sisters "den" at the foot of our bed (I'd love to know why he doesn't go in his own). At 10 months old, he can make it overnight without going out, but he will often go down and ring his bell. I'm lucky that my husband is often getting up at the same time and gladly lets Cooper out. We were shocked when we first got Cooper, he definately pee's much more often than any other dog breed we've ever had before, and probably 4 times as often as our last golden. 
Beverly


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## elaine_buri (Oct 4, 2006)

*Sleeping Through the Night*

My four month old female Havanese, Shanti, sleeps in her crate next to our bed. She has her last walk of the evening at 9:00 p.m. and sleeps through the night until 5:00 a.m. Early to bed, early to rise!

I have her trained to the pee pad about 90%. Four days ago I was able to start taking her outside. I had to wait until her puppy shots were completed because there are many dogs in the area. The breeder did not start the shots until she was 11 weeks old (shame on her, but she bred a beautiful puppy). I am now training her outside, using the pee pad as an incentive. I am afraid to brag, but after four days she has made such great progress. I am keeping a pee pad in our condo just in case, but it is not getting too much use. I am thrilled.

Now, if I can just get to stop terrorizing our two cats!

Elaine Buri
New Smyrna Beach, Fl.


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## susaneckert (Sep 7, 2006)

Great to hear that your little one is going out side Elaine remember couple steps forward and once back.But you are on your way so that is good,My 8 month old male love to play with our friends cat but our cat no way he was so affraid of it it was funny he would take the longest way around to avoid the cat or sit there if he could not get pass him and cry till I came to get him .Have Fun Susan


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## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

*Thank you!*

You folks are the best!!!! I so appreciate hearing from other Havanese owners...it makes me feel comfortable that if any problem comes up, I can log on and find someone who understands this delightful breed.

Barney does know when he disappoints me...he will watch my face and seems to be more aware of my posture - and when I smile towards him, he lights up and all is right with his world again!

Now that he is going to be on leash (because of going through the ice in our lake yesterday)...he won't be getting a chance to run-like-the-wind as often...what do you all do with your dogs in the house for play?

Marge


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Inside my girls seem to find their own fun and exercise. They chase each other round & round the house, wrestle with each other, and actually will growl or moan while scratching at a wall or furniture to get the others attention to play. My oldest loves to play catch. she will bring the same toy to me over & over again.


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

It seems that out of all the different breeds of dogs I've had, the Hav is the most thankful to have a little partner in crime. Cooper delights in torturing his big Bichon sister, Lily. They run and chase and wrestle and fight over toys. They have a large selection of toys, but I try to limit the number that are available at one time. They also love hooves and bully sticks for some quiet time activity.
I certainly agree that Hav's are very sensitive and can be greatly influenced with voice tone alone, but I have heard Cesar Milan say many times that dogs live in the moment. His point being that many times with rescue dogs people feel so badly about what the dog may have gone through in it's past, that they don't disipline it in it's current situation. Of course that's not good either. Just a thought.
Have fun, try the fetching game, mine at least likes to chase the ball even though he's not so fond of bringing it back!
Beverly


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## Barney's Mom (Nov 24, 2006)

*Very confused at this point!*

I am Barney's Mom...he is the now 19 month old rescue Havanese we brought home with us 4 weeks ago....he can be good as gold about going potty in the house for 4-5 days and then, out of the blue, he will pee just anywhere and when scolded with my "bad Barney, you need to go OUT to potty low voice) he doesn't act like he gives a darn.

My hubby and I are concerned that we have been engaged in a "pity party" for this adorable little fella and now that we have viewed a couple of Cesar Milan's tv shows...wonder if we have given Barney total control here in our home in such a short time? We put him in his crate at 10:30 or so, he barks a couple of times around 6 a.m., I get him right away, take him out, he goes does his business and then we have been bringing him into our bed for a bit of cuddle time...now I am thinking he is being given love and affection after going potty and is calling the shots about what time he barks to get me up to take him out and I am rewarding that behavior with the cuddle time!!!! I am so disappointed that at 19 months he is not more reliable in the house as far as going to the bathroom...I am jumping at his command at 6 in the morning to take him out .... and I am not sure what to do! I want to help him become a wonderful companion pet and don't want to spoil him, but also don't want to make the mistake of NOT being his alpha! HELP!


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

If he acts like he doesn't give a darn you didn't get the point across. He has to be caught in the act, or preferably before he starts to pee, or is just posturing, or even better- thinking about it. If he's not caught at that instant it means nothing to him now. When he is caught he needs to understand that he has made a BIG mistake and the voice needs to be forceful enough that he stops everything he's doing including breathing. Immediately pick him up and take him where he's supposed to potty. Set him down and say "go potty" or whatever else you want to use. No interaction between you and him, not even eye contact, until after he had gone potty. The INSTANT he finishes pick him up with much praize and his world starts turning again. Timing is most important in training. His understanding will come later. Obviously he doesn't understand now.

As far as sleeping in the crate, you decide when he gets up. If he wimpers or barks, say, "QUIET" not "Oh sweetie boy, you don't really have to get up do you? We'll get up in a little while........." After the quiet command or whatever else you want to use you have to ignore him until you decide when to get up. It shouldn't last more than a minute or few but if it continues for too long you have to get your point across that it's not acceptable. They love a routine but you can't be nice and sweet while explaining their new routine. Sometimes if one is too persistant about complaining in the crate Pam or I will get up and slap on the crate door as if we are really aggravated by their noise. He will not think less of you for being the leader. It's a lot like Cesar walking the dog on a leash or doing his mouth touch with his hand except the dog is not in your reach so you have to use your voice.

We crate train our puppies before they leave and it usually only takes a night or two before they go home. Their leaving dates are staggered to allow individual nights alone in our bedroom in their crate before they leave. Sometimes if one is not reliable in their potty training that one will be the last to go and we might keep him for an extra 4 or 5 days. As soon as I get one alone he/she is quick to learn. There is a difference between potty training and house training and potty training has to come first. Occasionally a puppy buyer will have some trouble with the training and maybe undo what they went home with. Pam can usually get it corrected over the phone but if not we can take the pup back and it only takes a couple of days to get back on track but when the owners come to pick the pup back up we have to spend time training them.

It's not hard to do but the dog won't do something just because you want it to-at least not for the first year or two.

Please also see my thread on "Belly Bands". I'm sorry I didn't mention them earlier.


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## CapotesMom (Apr 3, 2007)

Capote is making it through the night for the most part now..is this abnormal? I don't know if he's just not waking me up..if I'm just being a heavy sleeper, or if he's ok.. Usually the slightest noise will prompt me awake, and I've been listening for him to whimper but he doesn't make a sound and he sleeps in his bag on my bed with me. We usually go to bed at about 12-1 and we get up at about 7 to go out to potty...so that's between 6 and 7 hours for a 9 week old. His bed is nice and dry in the morning and even when I do wake up to take him out he's not antsy to go..he's patient while I get my shoes and sweatshirt and such on..

I also stop giving him water about 2 hours before we go to bed..that may help as well..


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I don't think that is abnormal. I have all of my puppies start crate training at 6 weeks old and they are all able to sleep through the night regularly without accident by eight weeks of age.


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Barney's Mom,
There is alot of good advice here on the forum.I can't really offer anything more,but I did want to tell you Congrats on your Adoption of your new Buddy Barney!


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Logan came to us at 9 weeks old and also slept thru the night. The key I think is that he is in his bed (crate, bag - or whatever they sleep in) and if he cant really get out, they will hold it as to not soil their sleeping area. It did amaze me though that he could hold it at night, yet pee on the floor every 15 minutes or so during the day!!!


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

I got both of mine when they were 11 weeks, and both of them slept thru the night. They also sleep in our bed. Kodi has only gotten me up once during the night, and he had a bad belly ache. Shelby got me up once to go poop. Otherwise, when I say bedtime, they run to the back door to go pee or whatever, and then to bed for the night. They settle down about 10pm and we get up at 6:30 or 7am.


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## Cosmosmom (Jan 12, 2007)

I agree that it is important that you have Barney sleep in the bedroom with you .. He needs to bond to you ..It sounds like he may have had a rocky start and maybe a little patience & reassurance is is in order as well . Trust me these dogs want to please you but they have to know the rules of your house .
My dogs have all slept in the bedroom with me .. Cosmo and Ahnold sleep in their crate side by side .. 
You need to be consistent and you need to be clear as to where it is OK to go potty .. ? Do you do it on a walk or in the yard in a chosen spot .. You have to have a good attitude and also you have to realize they are not perfect and mistakes happen .. 
Maybe you should say do your business instead of go potty - 
Tom gave you a lot of great advice . I also think it is hard for them getting adjusted after they have been trained to use a potty door . They are used to come and go as they please .. Now they are unable to do this .
Crate trained dogs learn not to soil their crate .
Also you need to pay attention as to when they need to go potty . Time of day .. Cosmo has a pretty regular schedule before bkfst and then he has to go again right after breakfast - then around noon , then later in the afternoon .. and after dinner before bed 
Some dogs go right after they eat - some go a little later . Just pay attention and be diligent .. Also the kind of food kibble versus wet determines how often they need to go . 
My dogs hold it all night but by 6 am they are ready to get up and go and I know that and I get up and take them out to potty .. 
Cosmo is 9 months and doing well but we still rely on the pee pee pads by the door and the dogs do not have run of the house . They are in the kitchen which is gated but I am with them a lot .. 
I made that mistake with Asta and he had too much freedom to roam and make deposits ..
I know it is still a work in progress but it is improving .
I will add one more thing - maybe it is time to teach him the basic commands and have him go to school and work to do so he sees you as the alpha .
Also restrict their water after 7 or 8 pm .. 
Hang in there - he will get it ..


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Barney's Mom,
There are alot of ways to do this and alot of great advice,however I wanted to add a couple things.Quincy is crate trained and goes in his crate when I tell him it's bedtime.His crate has ALWAYS been in our kitchen.We have never allowed him in our bed or on our furniture as that is just not something we want to start with our other dog as well.He is loved just as much as one in bed or on furniture and is held and cuddled all he wants.Everyone has certain "rules"I guess I would call them with their own families,and pets etc.You know what you are comfortable with and I would just encourage you to do what is best for you and remain consistant and firm-
let us know how you are doing ok?


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