# Tearing and EVO red meat



## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

Hi,

I was just given the advice by another Hav owner that after changing to EVO red meat the tearing cleared up. I am willing to try anything (healthy) to fix this. Has anyone else tried Evo with success?


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

yeah it's a great kibble.


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

This is very interesting to me. Panda tears constantly. I'm washing her eyes at least twice a day. The hair around her eyes is persistently matted due to the tearing. These folks are telling you the EVO red meat kibble cleared up their problem? Is it acceptable for puppies (Panda is 6 1/2 months)?


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## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

I had posted a question on Havanese lovers on facebook about tearing before I found this site. She has 2 white havs that had really bad tearing until she switched to Evo red meat. I am sure it is to good to be true. Scooby currently eats Orijen which he is not to keen on.
I am not sure about pups though. 
But I think it is worth a go.


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

I spoke to my vet about Roscoe's tear staining. She said that it is a natural pigment that is present in ALL DOGS, some dogs just have stronger pigment than others, and some dogs have hair/fur that is more prone to staining than others.

I asked her about all the rumored remedies - parsley, yogurt, changing foods, etc. She said that while it's possible that a change in diet could help, each dog is different (obviously), so each will react differently to the remedies. She said there is no harm in adding yogurt and parsley to his meals, but did say that many of her Maltese owners have been very happy with the results of Angel Eyes. We decided to do a round of it on Roscoe - it is NOT recommended for long term use, but has a mild antibiotic (tylosine) in it which can help to clear up any bacteria that would be increasing the staining. He's only been on it for about 5 days, but so far his face is a bit drier and I have definitely noticed that the gunky crud is his eyes has been hugely reduced. I wash his eyes out with saline solution and a cotton pad every morning, and they have been much cleaner the last couple of days.


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## Kathy (Nov 9, 2006)

EVO might work for some dogs because it doesn't have any grain in it. Grain is the #1 cause for allergies in dogs and tear staining can occur because a dog has an allergy. 

Angel Eye's works very well. For many, using it for a couple of months will rid the problem forever. 

Pigment is the color of the skin, not the tearing which is usually yeast.

Feeding raw also helps.


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

I purchased a bag of EVO red meat yesterday. Mixing that with the Natural Balance small bites as I don't want to upset Panda's stomach. I've got about 1/3 of a bag of NB remaining and will use that and supplement with the EVO until the NB is gone. Will let you know if I see any improvement in the tearing. 

As a side note I was surprised how little of the EVO to feed - and the high protien content (42%). I'll be interested to see how this experiment works....


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## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

I also just got a bag and I am going to do bottle water also (was doing filtered) fingers crossed Waybrook lets experiment together 

Scooby dumped his Orijen on the floor and ate only the Evo. So I hope his tummy will be ok.


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

Jo - Panda really likes the EVO also, but we had some significant poop issues last night (in the house of course - heaven forbid she do that outside!). I'm not sure it was the EVO as I saw her chewing on pinecones yesterday - so she may have ingested some that upset her stomach.... 

We'll keep up on this and see if we see any improvement - interesting about the bottled water - I use filtered with a little OxyFresh in it....


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## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

So far so good for us (touch wood) still not loving kibble. In an ideal world I would feed raw but my dh will not agree as we have a 5 year old and her and Scooby are very close.
I just cleaned Scoobies eyes and just hope this will help him out.
I hope you do better with the toilet issues x


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

waybrook said:


> Jo - Panda really likes the EVO also, but we had some significant poop issues last night (in the house of course - heaven forbid she do that outside!). I'm not sure it was the EVO as I saw her chewing on pinecones yesterday - so she may have ingested some that upset her stomach....
> 
> We'll keep up on this and see if we see any improvement - interesting about the bottled water - I use filtered with a little OxyFresh in it....


Hi Donna , yeah pinecones are toxic to dogs.


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

Dave - I didn't know pinecones were toxic! We live in south GA and have tons (and I'm not kidding) of pinecones fall every year! The Labs don't pay any attention to them - but Panda has been intrigued...puppy curiousity. Thanks so much for the heads up - dh has been out burning the last batch that fell recently - we'll make sure to get all of them out of her reach.


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

Panda is loving the EVO and maybe I'm imagining it, but her eyes do seem to be better (probably just wishful thinking!)....



scoobydoo said:


> I also just got a bag and I am going to do bottle water also (was doing filtered) fingers crossed Waybrook lets experiment together
> 
> Scooby dumped his Orijen on the floor and ate only the Evo. So I hope his tummy will be ok.


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## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

Scooby is not a kibble fan but is forcing himself to eat some right now.
I think he has been having way to many xmas treats. So I will let you know how it is in a few days. His tearing is so bad hard to see improvement 
What are you using for treats?


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## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

Oh and I forgot to say thats great news for you guys. I really hope it works


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## Redorr (Feb 2, 2008)

My Lola is crying a river of tears every day. She is 2 1/2. Her body just stains. Fortunately her face is nearly all black, so the gray mix on her face is so stained now it looks nearly black. Her hair around her pee-parts is also stained red/brown. I used Angel eyes for a while when she was about a year old. It did not reduce the tearing. Many find it reduces the staining. 

Lola has been on NV raw 100% for 1.5 years. No change in any aspect of the staining. It did improve and reduce her poops and she has had no gland issues since. 

One of the havs on the board had tearing and found that there were tiny eyelashes irritating the pup's eyes that was causing the tearing. Seeing as only one of Lola's eyes really streams, the vet looked closely and said the same problem could be there. That is the same eye where she has had cherry eye 2x, and may need surgery. So if and when we do that, we'll talk to the opthalmic surgeon about the eye lashes and tearing. On the opposite side only she has constant ear infections. It's always something! Yeast could be the cause there and of the staining, but I don't see a way to reduce it from being on a quality raw diet.

I wash her face with moist wipes after eating, comb out her eye boogers and facial hair with a flea comb after the washing. I wash her face with full shampoo usually once a week. This is OK with her and me! I wish her face was the beautiful black and white she was born with, but it just is not to be. 
Lola's groomer has found a way to cut her face so that the tearing, crusty parts are not so visible. Such a pretty girl!


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

Well I can't feed just EVO red meat as it makes Panda extremely gassy! So we're feeding a little EVO and the remainder Natural Balance. We still have the tearing - so I'm going to ask the vet if the hair around her yes could be causing the issue. If not, we'll just continue to clean her face daily and resign myself to the fact she will have this constant issue.


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## scoobydoo (Oct 5, 2009)

Not been a good experiment for me either. But I have changed the way I clean his face and seems easier to manage. I use a spray bottle of water to damp his hair enough for me to comb it through. 
I was using wipes or a washcloth and I just dont think it was enough as his tearing is so bad. I also use the blueberry face wash when he gets bathed and leave it on while I bath his body. Smellls soooooo good.
I truly believe it eye structure not allergies


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

The spray bottle is something I hadn't thought of - as you're right the washcloth just isn't getting the hair clean enough. Where did you find the blueberry face wash?


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## Kathy (Nov 9, 2006)

I have copied and pasted an article written by a Maltese breeder that might be helpful for anyone having to deal with tear staining. I have to put it in two posts as it is so long. Sorry.

Background and Causes

Perhaps one of the most frequent questions I am asked about Maltese at dog shows is "what do you do to keep your dog's face so white?" My answer is always multiple in nature.; it includes the multiple causes of tear staining, including excessive tearing, genetics, health and diet, fleas, what the prevention is, and what can be done about it when you have it. But remember the bottom line is . . . you must understand tear staining and have it under control or removing it will do no good -- it will only come back and may be worse!!!

Excess Tearing -- Red Yeast

Most veterinary eye specialists believe the actual cause of tear staining is excess tearing. When the face hair is wet from excess tearing it is the breeding ground for bacteria and yeast. One of the most common yeast infections is Ptyrosporin or Red Yeast which causes a deep reddish-brown stain. Low grade bacterial infections in the tear ducts are also common and may cause excess tearing and staining.

Blocked Tear Ducts

If you have a Maltese with excessive tear stains and tearing a visit to your veterinarian may be needed. It is not unusual to find that your Maltese may have completely clogged tear ducts which need to be irrigated by your vet. A veterinary opthamology specialist that I discussed tear staining with also indicated that as many as 20% of small dogs, such as Maltese, may be born with lower tear ducts that are physically closed. These may need to be surgically opened.

Ear Infections

Many times a rampant ear infection can be the cause of excessive tearing and staining. Care needs to be taken that when you Maltese is bathed the ears are dried after the bath. When your Maltese is bathed make sure a good cleansing product that will leave the ears dry is used. Scraggly hairs in the ears should also be removed by plucking or using a forceps to gently pull the hair out. Frequent cleaning with a product such as Nolvasan Otic can go along way to insuring clean ears and a white face. There are several good products to use for ear infections -- see the "Cures" section below for these.

Genetics

I believe that genetics plays a significant role in excessive tearing and staining. Like most everyone with more than one dog I have had Maltese that tear stain. However, my first champion Maltese bitch has had minimal tear staining. When I breed her both of her puppies had no tear staining as baby puppies. The female puppy continued through her championship and a limited specials career with no tear staining. She recently had a litter of 3 puppies and as of 4 months of age they have absolutely no tear staining or facial stain from nursing. One month after this litter of puppies was whelped I had another unrelated bitch whelp. Both were breed to the same sire. The second litter of puppies had tearing and staining from the beginning. The head structure on the two litters is different. Many veterinary eye specialists believe that the actual structure around the eye area plays a significant role in excessive tearing. I feel there is a genetic predisposition toward tear staining. Being selective in Maltese breeding stock can play a significant role in tear staining.

Cutting Teeth

Maltese will cut their adult teeth any time form 5 months to 8 months of age. During this time the head structure and mouth are under going many changes causing pressure on the tear ducts. Many Maltese puppies who have had no previous tear stain problems will during this time. It is most important to keep the facial hair as dry as possible and frequently wash it to help keep yeast and bacteria under control. The good news is that when the adult teeth are in this will go away if you have kept it under control. Make sure your Maltese has plenty of chew type of toys to help relieve the pressure on the mouth during this time.

Irritation & Allergies

Eliminating excess tearing is one of the best ways to stop staining. Maltese owners should pay attention to the hair around the face and prevent hair from falling into the eyes causing irritation and infection.

Maltese can be susceptible to allergies so watch the environment your Maltese is in. I have heard from other Maltese owners whose dogs previously had sparkling white faces and overnight tear stained when in a hotel room with a friend who smoked. It also is important to be extra careful when bathing you Maltese. Shampoo and other chemicals in the eyes can cause irritation and excess tearing. I use a little DuoLube -- basically sterile mineral oil -- to protect my Maltese dogs' eyes when I bathe them. You can find this human product in the eye care section of most drug stores.

My vet believes that many times a "sub-clinical" allergy so something as simple as a type of food can cause an allergy which is an inflammatory reaction. The inflammatory reaction can change the pH fluid in your dogs systems causing excessive tearing and potentially allergies.

Water

The water in many areas has a high mineral level. If your Maltese drinks from a water dish and your local water has a high mineral content you may find the entire face and beard stained. I have solved this by training all my dogs to drink from a water bottle. This also keeps the face dry. I start training puppies to drink from a water bottle when they are weaned. Alternatively, a Maltese can be placed on purified or commercial bottled water.

Food & Treats

Diet can play a significant key role in tear staining. I find that feeding a dry kibble that is natural with no additives, preservatives or food color in it seems to aid in maintaining white stain free faces. Many commercial dog foods contain beep pulp which can cause staining of the face and beard. I also keep my show dogs' face hair in wraps so that their food does not come into contact with their hair. If facial hair is not wrapped it needs to be washed on a regular basis to removed any left over partially digested food.

Fleas

Another potential source of tear staining is fleas. If you read the directions on most flea shampoos they suggest starting the shampoo with the head. Why -- because fleas need moisture to survive and get this from the dogs' tears/eyes. Naturally, this can cause an irritation in addition to red stain from the fleas' left behind feces (which contains digested blood). Another problem that comes with fleas is ear mites. These are carried by the fleas. Ear mites can cause severe ear infections and as a result tear staining. Fleas require a pro-active approach to keep under control.


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## Kathy (Nov 9, 2006)

Cures For Tear Staining

Before a Maltese owner attempts to remove the tear staining from a dog's face it is most important to have eliminated the source of the staining. Otherwise it will just come back and many times it will be worse than before. Once the source of excessive tearing and staining is found a pro-active program to remove the staining can begin. After insuring that health, irritation, environment, water and diet issues have been eliminated as a source of excessive tearing you can begin to think about removing the tear staining.

Tetracycline 
I have found success in eliminating tear staining by putting my Maltese on a ten day course of low dose chlortetracycline or tetracycline. Occasionally this may need to be repeated. However, I do not use this in puppies that have not yet cut their adult teeth. Tetracycline has been shown to cause teeth which have not erupted to permanently stain yellow.

Delta AlbaPlex 
An antibiotic of the tetracycline class, Delta AlbaPlex also contains a low level of steroid (not enough to cause Cushing's Syndrome). A veterinary specialist in Opthmology recommended this product to me for tear staining as the steroid will help eliminate inflamation that goes along with excessive tearing, thus allowing the antibiotic a chance to work.

Gentian Violet Flush
One of the best products I have found to deal with "gunky ears" (and in my personal opinion one of the biggest causes of tear staining) is Gentian Violet Flush. Yes, this is purple but it does not stain the coat. The place to buy this is from Belcher Animal Clinic, Clearwater, FL, phone: 727-536-6548; email [email protected]. Using this over about 2 weeks will clear up most ear problems and many times solve a tear staining problem.

TYLAN™ 
TYLAN is the brand name for Tylosin, a veterinary antibiotic that is FDA approved for fowl (chickens/turkeys) and swine (pigs). This is used primarily to treat respiratory disease caused by Mycoplasma gallisepticum. Many Maltese people have found that this product can also have some beneficial effect in controlling tear staining in Maltese. You can purchase this from Omaha Vaccine. See Dog Shopping and Services page for their phone number.

Flagyl
Flagyl (Metronidazole) is an anti-diarrhea medicine commonly used in dogs to treat yeast or Giradia infections causing irratible or inflammatory bowel syndrome. This can also be very effective in the treatment of tear stains, particularly when the staining is the result of red yeast. This is given for 2 weeks. You will need to see your vet to have this prescribed.

Lincocin
Maltese not responding to tetracycline may respond well to Lincocin. The typical dose of this for a Maltese is 50 mg twice a day.

Otomax or Gentamicin sulfate 
Yeast infections in the ears may also be a frequent culprit of tear stain; this generally responds well to OTOMAX (gentamicin sulfate) or liquid drops.

Xonodine Solution 
Manufactured by Veterinary Products Laboratories this product available from your veterinarian is a polyhydroxydine solution with Iodine as the main active ingredient. It does work well with fungus infections such as yeast in the ears. Also good as a topical for cuts and abrasions to prevent bacterial infections.

AK-TROL 
Another useful product is AK-TROL which is a human prescription eye drop containing neomycin, polymyxin B and dexamethasone. AK-TROL is also available in an ointment form. Your vet can prescribe this for your Maltese and can be used before the adult teeth are cut if needed.

TUMS 
Tums is primarily a source of Calcium, known as an antacid formulated as 500 mg Calcium Carbonate. Giving your Maltese 1/2 of the Fruit flavored variety twice a day will help change the pH of the tears. This will change the tears' environment and can help make it hostile for the continued growth of yeast and bacteria. Some Maltese exhibitors also use TUMS with success to control excessive tearing before shows. There are other brands of 500 mg calcium carbonate that may work as well.

Missing Link 
This is an all natural powder that you mix into the animal's food. It comes in a dog formula, dog and cat formula, and a formula for horses as well. It works especially well with Maltese that may have an allergy problem causing the excessive tearing/staining. It is a fatty acid supplement (Omega 3) and in addition to helping the tearing staining its good for your dog's health. Some have reported seeing results in 1 week to 1 month period of time. See Dog Shopping & Services page for vendors of that sell this product.

Colloidal Silver 
This is a product that is again placed in the eyes and works much like an antibiotic. I have not personally used it but know of others who swear by this. See Dog Shopping & Services page for vendors of this product.

White Vinegar
A teaspoon of white cider vinegar can be added to your dogs drinking water to control new tear stains. It may take a while for your dog to "decide" to drink this water so start with a little less and gradually increase the amount of vinegar. Vinegar works much like TUMS in that it can changes the pH of the drinking water.


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## MacGyver (Nov 9, 2009)

We have been struggling with tear stains with MacGyver as well. We switched him over to distilled water and started adding parsley to his food. It's only been a few days, so we will see what happens.

Everyone's input is so helpful!


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## heatherkurt (Sep 1, 2009)

Hudson seems to have more tearing and staining from his right eye, which now that I think of it, maybe points to a clogged tear duct. Both my dogs have staining around their mouths. I just started using Angel Eyes, and I have noticed some improvement these past few days. I've tried filtered and bottled water in the past, but didn't notice a change. I currently feed EVO chicken to my guys, and am curious whether the red meat formula would improve the staining. My friend says that her dog's tear staining immediately cleared up as soon as she switched him to a RAW diet.


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