# Cuba's First Season Diary



## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

This is probably old territory, and these things have been discussed dozens of times, but I thought I might at least start a diary of Cuba's first season - there have been a few posts about laparascopic spaying on another thread, and questions about what a season is actually like. I know there are people with far more experience than mine, but maybe an actual diary might be worth keeping, in some sort of anecdotal way…it might, of course, be totally uneventful and boring, but I'll start anyway….and hope that others will contribute their experience, too.

So today is Day One of actual bleeding. She was born on March 25th 2013, and my immediate thought is that I am so very glad I didn't listen to my vet's advice and spay her before her first season. Had I done so I should, by default, have had to pre-empt a possible early-as-six-months start, and she would have been deprived of growth hormones and the chance to mature for the extra four months she's actually had before it started. 

For the last couple of days she has been licking more, and there's been a definite vulval enlargement, as one would expect. Otherwise not much change - perhaps a little less of an appetite, but same energy levels, playfulness and joie de vivre. Tycho, my neutered male Coton, has today taken more of an interest in her and is sniffing around her quite a bit. She is bleeding noticeably but is doing an excellent clear-up job herself so far, so not a problem of any kind. Not yet, anyway. I'm watching her when she goes out into our walled garden; we live in the middle of Oxford, and have high walls all around a very secure garden; I'm probably just being neurotic to think that any marauding large dog could jump these walls and break in, and there are very few dogs in the neighbourhood, but I'm not going to take any chances!


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## sandypaws (Aug 8, 2012)

Oh, Lalla, you must be so proud! They have the cutest little panties for such occasions and I'm sure Cuba will need them at some point. I think the "season" lasts about three weeks, but I'm sure someone more knowledgeable than I will weigh in on that. I definitely woulnd't let her out unattended, high walls or not. Better be safe than sorry. Congratulations!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lalla said:


> This is probably old territory, and these things have been discussed dozens of times, but I thought I might at least start a diary of Cuba's first season - there have been a few posts about laparascopic spaying on another thread, and questions about what a season is actually like. I know there are people with far more experience than mine, but maybe an actual diary might be worth keeping, in some sort of anecdotal way&#8230;it might, of course, be totally uneventful and boring, but I'll start anyway&#8230;.and hope that others will contribute their experience, too.
> 
> So today is Day One of actual bleeding. She was born on March 25th 2013, and my immediate thought is that I am so very glad I didn't listen to my vet's advice and spay her before her first season. Had I done so I should, by default, have had to pre-empt a possible early-as-six-months start, and she would have been deprived of growth hormones and the chance to mature for the extra four months she's actually had before it started.
> 
> For the last couple of days she has been licking more, and there's been a definite vulval enlargement, as one would expect. Otherwise not much change - perhaps a little less of an appetite, but same energy levels, playfulness and joie de vivre. Tycho, my neutered male Coton, has today taken more of an interest in her and is sniffing around her quite a bit. She is bleeding noticeably but is doing an excellent clear-up job herself so far, so not a problem of any kind. Not yet, anyway. I'm watching her when she goes out into our walled garden; we live in the middle of Oxford, and have high walls all around a very secure garden; I'm probably just being neurotic to think that any marauding large dog could jump these walls and break in, and there are very few dogs in the neighbourhood, but I'm not going to take any chances!


From what I've been told by breeders, you are COMPLETELY RIGHT to guard carefully against intruders. I've been told if there is ANY way, for ANY intact male, HE WILL FIND HIS WAY IN! 

Beyond that THANK YOU for starting this thread. As far as I know, this is the first of its kind!:thumb:


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

krandall said:


> ... I've been told if there is ANY way, for ANY intact male, HE WILL FIND HIS WAY IN!
> 
> ...


Methods include:

Flowers
Jewelry
Candy
Compliments
Sympathy


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Gibbs Mom and Dad said:


> Methods include:
> 
> Flowers
> Jewelry
> ...


Do you mean from marauding dogs to Cuba??!! I was thinking they'd need, as far as methods went, trampolines, wire-cutters, diggers, ladders or a pogo-stick??


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

DAY TWO

There were two dogs barking outside the front of our house this morning, passing by in the road; no idea if they could tell that there was an in season bitch within - she hasn't been out that way for a while, so I don't think there can be any scent to pick up on; both Cuba and Tycho set up a reciprocal racket inside, but that has happened before and had nothing to do with Cuba's present state, so I think was coincidental. She refused all food last night, but was hungry at breakfast and wolfed down a big raw chicken wing. There's a certain amount of bleeding but not so as to cause any difficulty - she's licking a lot and doing a fine job of keeping herself clean. Tycho seems uninterested, which I guess he would be, given his neutered status. I think she must smell different to him, because he sniffles and snuffles around a bit more than usual, but otherwise they are play-fighting and hurtling about together as usual. She shows no signs when out in the garden of trying to escape. My husband, when I got home, was on sentry duty in the garden, so I've got him well-trained, much to my surprise!!


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

Lalla said:


> Do you mean from marauding dogs to Cuba??!! I was thinking they'd need, as far as methods went, trampolines, wire-cutters, diggers, ladders or a pogo-stick??


Just reminiscing about my bachelor days


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Gibbs Mom and Dad said:


> Just reminiscing about my bachelor days


Well, John, you sound as if you did a good job! Glad you didn't need my suggestions of trampoline etc!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

krandall said:


> From what I've been told by breeders, you are COMPLETELY RIGHT to guard carefully against intruders. I've been told if there is ANY way, for ANY intact male, HE WILL FIND HIS WAY IN!
> 
> Beyond that THANK YOU for starting this thread. As far as I know, this is the first of its kind!:thumb:


Thanks for the corroboration, Karen! And if YOU think this is the first thread on the subject it probably is - your knowledge of the forum must be encyclopaedic!
I'm afraid it will get pretty repetitive, I don't think, as the days go on, there's going to be a huge amount of variation on the theme, but we'll see. I just hope I don't have to report on fending off the whole of Oxford canine male society!! So far so quiet&#8230;.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lalla said:


> Do you mean from marauding dogs to Cuba??!! I was thinking they'd need, as far as methods went, trampolines, wire-cutters, diggers, ladders or a pogo-stick??


I wouldn't put it past them!!! Especially after seeing my neighbor's Springer Spaniels go straight up and over a 6' stockade fence!!!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lalla said:


> Thanks for the corroboration, Karen! And if YOU think this is the first thread on the subject it probably is - your knowledge of the forum must be encyclopaedic!
> I'm afraid it will get pretty repetitive, I don't think, as the days go on, there's going to be a huge amount of variation on the theme, but we'll see. I just hope I don't have to report on fending off the whole of Oxford canine male society!! So far so quiet&#8230;.


I've read that as they get closer to the time when they can be bred, males can smell them (and come calling) from miles away.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY THREE*

I've been reading up on a rather old copy of The Book of the Bitch (a friend just asked if he could borrow it&#8230;.I think it was a propos having a rough time with his wife&#8230;.!!!); excellent, though a bit out of date by now, I daresay, and I've just ordered the new version, which you can have a look at at:
Book of the Bitch: A Complete Guide to Understanding and Caring for Bitches (New Edition): J. M. Evans, Kay White: 9781860540233: Amazon.com: Books
if you are interested.

To summarise the immediately relevant bits for me (and forgive me, all you breeders out there with massive experience - and all comments welcomed! - I'm just attempting to pass on a total layman's perspective in case it's of any interest to another total layman), :
* "Day One" should be counted as the first day of actual bleeding, although the build up of levels of oestrogen will have been going on for about two weeks before this.
* All the dire warnings about guarding against marauders (with or without flowers and chocolates) are to be heeded. "Maximum supervision needed".
* Bleeding goes on for 10-14 days; most bitches keep themselves clean. The amount of discharge is variable: "some will have a copious flow, others very little and some may have no bleeding at all, although the vulva is fully enlarged and the bitch will, at the right stage, allow herself to be mated and produce a litter quite normally. The non-bleeding bitch is described as having a 'colourless season'".
*Seasons last, on average, 3-4 weeks. (sorry, this might be a protracted diary! I'll try and find ways to liven up what is bound to be a lot of repetition, and skip a few days if there's nothing interesting to report)
*The dangerous bit is in the middle of this time, which is when she will ovulate, and be "willing, or even eager to mate". There is no particular external indication of this stage (I suppose other than her behaviour, or that of any marauding male? bouquets and stacks of boxes of chocolates on the doorstep?) and it occurs on average 10 to 14 days after Day One of bleeding. Sometimes, though, the colour of the bleed changes to pink and then to colourless, but this can't be relied upon. This stage might start earlier, might only last a few days, but might carry on till the end of her season (21 to 23 days). At this ovulating time the vulva will be at its softest and largest expansion. A lot of 'mights', sentry-duty required whatever, apparently.
*If, when she is ovulating, you run a finger down her spine "she will often turn her tail to one side as she would to facilitate mating.
*The battening down of the hatches against the MM's (marauding males, with or without trampolines) will therefore have to be kept going for the whole season, just in case.
*The clearest sign that the season is over is the shrinking back to normal size of the vulva.
*Around 73 days after the start of the season, "almost all bitches [having gone through hormonal changes whether mated or not] will experience a phantom or false pregnancy to some degree". Some actually produce milk, take to their beds and choose an inanimate object - a toy or something - to guard fiercely as if it were an actual puppy. Another whole topic, and if we get to that stage I see another diary coming on&#8230;.!


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

very interesting!! I've never had a dog go into season so this is a great thread for learning!!


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## RitaandRiley (Feb 27, 2012)

I'm interested in hearing if Tycho's behavior changes at all.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY FOUR*

The bleeding is getting marginally heavier, but she's still doing a perfectly good job of keeping herself clean. I think she's hungrier than usual, but otherwise there's no change in her general demeanour - cheerful and playful, hurtling around and enjoying training sessions, playing with Tycho, all the usual.

Tycho seems more interested than in the past in sniffing around where she's peed, and it's just possible that the play-fighting is turning a little bit more into a sniff around, too, and with her more flirtatious than usual, but he certainly shows no signs of trying to mount her or anything - and he does mount, neutered though he is. I was once, memorably, at a friend's house who had a Cavalier King Charles spaniel called "Treacle"; the friend had two little boys, aged 4 and 3. At one point I asked if anyone had seen Tycho, and the 4 year old solemnly said "I have seen Tycho. Tycho is climbing Treacle"!!! Which he was, under the kitchen table!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lalla said:


> *Around 73 days after the start of the season, "almost all bitches [having gone through hormonal changes whether mated or not] will experience a phantom or false pregnancy to some degree". Some actually produce milk, take to their beds and choose an inanimate object - a toy or something - to guard fiercely as if it were an actual puppy. Another whole topic, and if we get to that stage I see another diary coming on&#8230;.!


We have a huge, GORGEOUS female Newfie in our obedience class who is currently working on her Grand Championship, and therefore, of course, her owner doesn't want her bred quite yet. She recently had her heat, and last week she was a riot in class. Suzanne had brought her, hoping it might get her mind off "puppies". She has a pile of stuffed, squeaky "snakes" that she carried around, made nests for, mooned over, nudged up to her belly, (she didn't lactate this time, but I guess she did after her last heat) and groomed continually. She had NO interest in being in class, and would just collapse on her side to "nurse" her row of "snake puppies" in between her turns. While she is normally a BEAUTIFUL heeler, last week you would have sworn she was abused and being FORCED to follow her owner around the ring, head hanging, except when she was longingly looking back at her "puppies".

Fortunately, "snake puppies" seem to mature faster than "real" ones, and she was back to her chipper self this week! ound: It was quite the performance, though!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Lalla said:


> The bleeding is getting marginally heavier, but she's still doing a perfectly good job of keeping herself clean. I think she's hungrier than usual, but otherwise there's no change in her general demeanour - cheerful and playful, hurtling around and enjoying training sessions, playing with Tycho, all the usual.
> 
> Tycho seems more interested than in the past in sniffing around where she's peed, and it's just possible that the play-fighting is turning a little bit more into a sniff around, too, and with her more flirtatious than usual, but he certainly shows no signs of trying to mount her or anything - and he does mount, neutered though he is. I was once, memorably, at a friend's house who had a Cavalier King Charles spaniel called "Treacle"; the friend had two little boys, aged 4 and 3. At one point I asked if anyone had seen Tycho, and the 4 year old solemnly said "I have seen Tycho. Tycho is climbing Treacle"!!! Which he was, under the kitchen table!


Someone here, Maybe it was Suzi? Was horrified when a friends neutered male not only mounted, but actually TIED with her bitch in season. So it seems that not being able to make babies does not entirely equate to not having interest in sexual relations! (I've seen gelding mount mares too, but usually the mare sends him packing!!!)


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## cruzr (Dec 5, 2013)

Following this thread also, thanks for posting Lalla.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

krandall said:


> Someone here, Maybe it was Suzi? Was horrified when a friends neutered male not only mounted, but actually TIED with her bitch in season. So it seems that not being able to make babies does not entirely equate to not having interest in sexual relations! (I've seen gelding mount mares too, but usually the mare sends him packing!!!)


Yes, I rather anticipate something similar unless Cuba can see him off; but presumably she won't WANT to see him off while she's ovulating&#8230;happy days!! I love the Newfie story - it must have been fascinating. Cuba's got one enormous stuffed toy that she really loves, a sort of stripy, spotty, red/blue/orange cartoonesque 'dog'; it's about the same size as she is; I wonder if she'll take that to her bed like a sort of giant cuckoo&#8230;or perhaps I should get some snake babies?! Clever of the Newfie to find herself a whole litter!!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY FIVE*

No particular change today - more of the same, but i've been out a lot and left my husband to do the garden police job! All went well. I'll catch up properly tomorrow, too tired now to write!


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## Deacon Blues (Nov 22, 2013)

Subscribing.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY SIX*

She seems sort of distracted today, a bit less playful than usual and deeply uninterested in any training, partly because she seems also to be a bit off her food. It's tempting to put every little sign down to this event, but some of it could, of course, be totally coincidental. She wouldn't eat her normal food for breakfast, but was tempted when I gave her a chicken wing and gobbled that up energetically. Usually, when I come down in the morning, she's excited and apparently thrilled to see me, rolls around in her bed with her paws in the air and generally shows a lot of playful 'happiness'; today she just got up and waited to be let out of her pen for a garden trip; I guess, since I'm not an entire male dog I'm suddenly a huge lot less interesting than I was!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

In anticipation of Tycho's failure to recognise his neutered status, and taking heed of Karen's friend's experience, I've been looking up about how to manage if we get to a tie situation. I'll post the advice for those of you who don't know what you are supposed to do, forgive me those of you with proper experience, and put me right if the information gleaned from the updated "Book of the Bitch" is wrong in any way.

They say that the tie can last anything from five minutes to an hour, with an average time of 20 minutes. "Stud owners will turn the dog so that he no longer rests on the bitch's back, and will steady the dog and bitch so that neither is pulled around during this close contact which many bitches find very irksome. The tie finally breaks spontaneously". I have no idea how long, in a neutered male, he can go on deluding himself - or physiologically it will be possible to keep the tie going…any experience, anyone? I don't somehow imagine it happening, but maybe my imagination is just not up to much! Watch this space!!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Let's just hope Tycho doesn't get any ideas, so you don't HAVE to figure it out! I've seen Tom post photos of Starborn dogs who simply curl up together and wait it out with a snuggle, but they are experienced breeders. (the dogs AND the people! )


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY SEVEN*



krandall said:


> Let's just hope Tycho doesn't get any ideas, so you don't HAVE to figure it out! I've seen Tom post photos of Starborn dogs who simply curl up together and wait it out with a snuggle, but they are experienced breeders. (the dogs AND the people! )


Yes, let's definitely hope he has no such ambitions!! Waiting it out with a snuggle sounds a sensible way to go, but I'm no Tom and my dogs probably know it!!

Cuba ate very little yesterday - a chicken wing in the morning, having refused her Wolf Tucker; I gave in to another chicken wing because she hadn't eaten the night before, either, and it seemed sensible to get her to eat something. It poured with rain more or less uninterruptedly yesterday, though we did manage a few sodden outings around a quagmire of a garden. Yesterday evening I had to go to a dinner in London and got someone in to keep the dogs company. She reported that Cuba refused her supper but was playful. She didn't want breakfast this morning, either, until I gave her some Ziwipeak and fed it to her as training treats. That seems to be a good way to get her to eat - she loves it when I get the clicker out and she knows there will be things for her to work at. I think all is pretty normal - she's certainly up and down, general mood-wise, but not significantly. She's keeping herself perfectly clean - I don't have to clear up anything at all. So far this is totally manageable, though I don't want to tempt fate by saying so! I am watching her like a hawk whenever she is in the garden, but that's not terribly difficult, and I like being out there with them, anyway, though could wish for slightly less rain!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY EIGHT*

She refused all food again yesterday evening, but has eaten a chicken wing this morning - I'm keen to get a bit more variety back into her diet, but would rather she at least ate something&#8230;not sure if that's right. She's bouncy and energetic though. There's a lot more licking going on, but Tycho is still not particularly interested - he'll occasionally sniff around her but mostly just carries on as normal. At Day Eight I realise we are now beginning to head into the ovulating part of the cycle, and life may change a little? I'll certainly watch her carefully whenever she's in the garden, but I've been doing that anyway, so it won't make much difference. My husband, and his PA who works in our house, are on high alert, and have had diligent clicker training!! I've been watching the dogs' play carefully, but it doesn't seem to have changed in nature - not rougher, or making any attempts to mount her. We'll see how the day goes, it's still only 8:30 in the morning in the UK (you can see how I get my day off to a good start, posting here and reading other threads instead of getting on with my work! PERFECT displacement activity!!)


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Still Day Eight; interestingly (or perhaps not?!) it's not Tycho who is showing much of an interest in Cuba, but the other way round; she's trying to get him interested in HER! I feel awfully sad that I can't tell her that she's barking up the wrong dog!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Hmmm…STILL day eight, and it's all change here. Tycho is now totally fascinated by her, but not quite as fascinated as she is by him. I noticed their play changing from being a cheerful innocent romp to suddenly being more focused, more energetic, Tycho up on his back legs and batting at the air in quite a frenzy, and Cuba far more animated than I've ever seen her. Then he started mounting her. He is doing so over and over again, for very short bursts each time over ten or fifteen minutes or so, usually, then they stop for a bit and snuggle up together panting. At the end of a marathon this evening she simply wouldn't let him alone, poor boy, and he eventually escaped by jumping INTO her ex-pen!!! The door was open, and he can leap it easily enough but she can't. So he sat in there panting with exhaustion while she sat outside it panting to get in!! It's all go!

He's somewhat confused by the whole process, it would appear, and sometimes mounts her head by mistake, which is pretty hilarious and, I daresay, quite usual?


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY TEN*

Missed yesterday, in London and up to my eyes with work all day, didn't get home till late having left my husband in charge of the x-rated goings on here!! It was pouring with rain again (will it ever stop?), so the poor dogs were stir-crazy in the conservatory, but Richard said that Tycho didn't seem particularly interested in her. She's still bleeding but the colour has definitely changed to almost clear, the vulva is greatly enlarged, as predicted, and I think she must have read "The Book of the Bitch" because she is doing everything as they describe it. Richard took her into the garden on a leash yesterday, he was so frightened of losing track of her, and it's not THAT big a garden!!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY ELEVEN*

Well, we had a hiatus in the x-certification, but are back on track this evening. They've been playing happily all day, hurtling about in the garden (the sun was shining, oh happy event!!), RLH-ing, and generally being energetic. Now Tycho is back to mounting her over and over again, so she's greatly cheered up - she's been pursuing her reluctant Coton boyfriend and he seemed to have gone off the boil, but he's definitely back on it again now!! I'm keeping a close eye on them in case they tie, but so far no sign of that. She's incredibly flirtatious - she skids around on our wooden floor, and won't let him have a rest for a moment, poor boy!! Sometimes she just lays her head on his shoulders and they stand there quite still for about thirty seconds, then she's off again, backing up against him and leading him on. He'll probably jump back into her ex-pen for a break soon!! I don't find it at all difficult to cope with, though am mildly relieved we don't have visitors - not entirely sure how the faint-hearted would take it!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY TWELVE*

It's still all go; Tycho is not quite as fervent in his pursuit as he was a few days ago, but still pretty keen. She's less flirtatious, but still quite happy to be pursued. And so we go on. I've read that the first season can be fairly 'mild', and I guess it might be shorter than later, more mature events, I'm not sure - wishful thinking, probably! I'm thinking we might have a week or so to go&#8230;.I'm still out there with her whenever she's in the garden, she's not been out of my sight outside since Day One, but there have certainly been no attempts to leap walls by neighbourhood suitors. So far. Phew! I'm not at all sure how I'd deal with them if they suddenly DID appear&#8230;.go for the hosepipe, I daresay?


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

I PROMISED myself that I was going to leave this alone, but I just can't.



Lalla said:


> ... so that neither is pulled around during this close contact which many {females} find very irksome.


at least all the ones I've known, or maybe it's just me



Lalla said:


> ... and sometimes mounts her head ...


Tell him shaving helps, but baby powder and cologne are counter productive



Lalla said:


> Now Tycho is back to mounting her over and over again, so she's greatly cheered up


Not going to touch this one with a 10 foot or 6 inch pole



Lalla said:


> &#8230; and won't let him have a rest for a moment, poor boy!!


Tell him to enjoy it while he's young because he'll need a nap once he gets past 40.



Lalla said:


> She's less flirtatious, but still quite happy to be pursued ...


Typical female

The previous replies in no way shape for form express the opinions of the "Mom" half of Gibbs Mom and Dad, and the are soley the ramblings of the "Dad" half. They are meant as diversionary humor only and not meant to offend.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Well, John, I am amazed you were so reticent for so long!! I'm very happy you have lent such gravitas and wisdom, such sound advice to both partners in this touching (quite a lot of touching) and delicate romance, such moral (??) support during this time of sensitive handling of a transition from puppyhood to maturity of a young and impressionable mind (not mine), and such obvious tender concern for all parties. Note to Gibbs: if ever you need some light-hearted advice, should you ever find yourself in a similar position to Tycho, he can tell you a lot about positions, and will give you no doubt much needed dog-to-dog counsel and distraction from the weighty words of your over-serious Dad...


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

Lalla said:


> ... and distraction from the weighty words of your over-serious Dad...


I do believe that is the first time I've ever been called "over-serious".

...
...
...

OK, that's a big fat lie.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY THIRTEEN*

Difficult to follow Gibbs'Dad's apposite comments!! Thank you, John, I seriously enjoyed your &#8230; well, I was going to say 'poking fun', but perhaps that's an unfortunate expression in the circumstances&#8230;.

Day Thirteen has been a killer day for me, chairing two committees in London, so I've been away from the canine amorous coalface and left the chaperoning to my poor husband. Tycho, reinforced in his sense of masculine prowess, tried, apparently, to take on a Bernese Mountain Dog in the park on his walk today and was given short shrift&#8230;and returned to Cuba with perhaps a chastened sense of his little self&#8230;.or not. She is still flirting remorselessly with him and he is showing a disdainful lack of interest. For now. But that seems to be the pattern - a day of energetic pursuit followed by a day of playing hard to get&#8230;.or perhaps, since it is his 7th birthday on Thursday, he's showing his age and taking a day to recover?


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

DAY FOURTEEN

Just a little update….it's hotting up here!! We are into a major bonkathon situation (is 'bonk' a recognised word in the US? if not, I leave it to your imagination!); Cuba is flirting for Havana, and Tycho's coton socks are wearing out, never mind other bits of him….sorry for the sensibilities of anyone for whom this is All Too Much!! I recommend a quick retreat to a safer thread!

It's Tychy's birthday tomorrow - I've got him the usual over-the-top number of presents, but I don't think he's going to be remotely interested in ANY of them - he's got his very own living, breathing cuddly toy these days…..I'm baking him a liver cake, though - I imagine he'll have an appetite, at least!


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

What's really going to trouble Tycho is when her season is over and she no longer gives him the time of day. He'll be wondering "why can't we do all that fun stuff like before". He'll start bring flowers and jewelry, but to no avail. He'll soon realize ...

...
...
...
...

He's married to her.

Just kidding Ladies.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Thank you, John - that, at the end of a long and tricky day, has made me laugh out loud and cheered me up more than I can say!! It won't cheer Tycho up, but it has been a much-needed very good laugh for me!!!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY FIFTEEN*

Today is Tycho's 7th birthday, and oh boy is he happy with his very own live cuddly toy (Cuba)! He's had a nice time opening presents (especially with the wrapping paper) and Cuba has been helping him (especially with the rawhide birthday card); every so often they break off playing with the new toys to "play" together - MUCH more fun - and then go back to the other toys. Now they are both cuddled up together in a mass of wrapping paper.

No particular change, season-wise, therefore. I haven't noticed any of the possible mood-swings, or indeed any personality change whatsoever. The play pattern has changed dramatically, but in between the flirty leg-over games, they are back to normal play-fighting and tearing around in the garden in between the endless downpours. No invasion of neighbourhood dogs and no attempts on Cuba's part to escape. So far!


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## sandypaws (Aug 8, 2012)

Lalla said:


> Today is Tycho's 7th birthday, and oh boy is he happy with his very own live cuddly toy (Cuba)! He's had a nice time opening presents (especially with the wrapping paper) and Cuba has been helping him (especially with the rawhide birthday card); every so often they break off playing with the new toys to "play" together - MUCH more fun - and then go back to the other toys. Now they are both cuddled up together in a mass of wrapping paper.
> 
> No particular change, season-wise, therefore. I haven't noticed any of the possible mood-swings, or indeed any personality change whatsoever. The play pattern has changed dramatically, but in between the flirty leg-over games, they are back to normal play-fighting and tearing around in the garden in between the endless downpours. No invasion of neighbourhood dogs and no attempts on Cuba's part to escape. So far!


Happy, happy birthday Tycho, from your Hav friend, Tyler, and me. Sounds like Cuba has given you a great gift this year for one of the best birthdays ever. Enjoy it while you can! :bounce:


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

sandypaws said:


> Happy, happy birthday Tycho, from your Hav friend, Tyler, and me. Sounds like Cuba has given you a great gift this year for one of the best birthdays ever. Enjoy it while you can! :bounce:


Thank you Mary and Tyler! Tycho is SO honoured to have birthday wishes from the forum's Grandee, and sends cottony greetings and gratitude for having been accepted as an honorary Havanese!! He says to tell Tyler that the last few weeks have made him feel at lease sixteen and a half, never mind seven!! But that it's been worth it&#8230;.!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY SIXTEEN*

Hmmm&#8230;well, it's like a sort of frantic version of RLH in pursuit of poor Tycho, who is manfully obliging as much as he can manage, and then every so often hurtles towards the penned-off bit of the conservatory and leaps the barricade to escape Cuba's amorous advances. She then leaps and capers and cavorts and whimpers until he gets his strength back enough to leap back over the barricade and into the fray again&#8230;.

They were fairly peaceful all day, but now that it's evening we are into the red light district again with a vengeance!! Oh, what fun&#8230;

Still no tie-ing though, so that's something I suppose - and still no visitors to be taken aback, thank goodness! I have a friend from Tennessee coming to stay for a couple of days next week - fortunately she has horses and dogs and I don't think will be surprised by anything, and with a bit of luck the pace may have slackened somewhat by then.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I have to say, I'm catching up after several days away from this thread, and have had a smile on my face the whole time. Between your descriptions, Lalla, and John's comments… this is a VERY entertaining (if racy ) thread.

Should we re-name it "50 Shades of Fluff"?

Happy Birthday, poor, exhausted Tycho!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

krandall said:


> I have to say, I'm catching up after several days away from this thread, and have had a smile on my face the whole time. Between your descriptions, Lalla, and John's comments&#8230; this is a VERY entertaining (if racy ) thread.
> 
> Should we re-name it "50 Shades of Fluff"?
> 
> Happy Birthday, poor, exhausted Tycho!


Very glad you've found it amusing, Karen!! John's comments have definitely added the serious touch needed&#8230;.

"50 Shades of white and black and white"? (actually, Tychy is looking a bit grey these days&#8230;..!!)


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY SEVENTEEN*

I'm soldiering on with the diary, though notice a certain slacking in interest out there!! Hardly surprising, there's a lot of repetition now, and perhaps I've driven the faint-hearted away with to much information?!

Anyway; the x-certification continues, but possibly slightly less energetically than of late. Cuba still has a vastly enlarged vulva, with colourless bleeding; she's still pursuing a diminishing-ly enthusiastic Tycho; otherwise not much change here at Chateau Fifty Shades&#8230;perhaps down to about 40 shades&#8230;.I'm still not letting her out of my sight in the garden but I think we are getting through an uneventful first season.

I've now posted the following link, that someone has kindly just send me, on a couple of other threads, because I think it's really interesting, and might influence the next decision to make re spaying:

http://www.thedogdaily.com/health/safety/dog_spaying/index.html#axzz2s9jc6KD


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY EIGHTEEN*

Well, we must be getting near the end now&#8230;Tycho doesn't think so, and neither does Cuba, but I'm ever hopeful that things will begin to quieten down in the next day or so?? She still seems as flirtatious as ever, nothing much changed physiologically (I'm trying not to be too graphic here&#8230 and hasn't yet gone off the amorous attentions of Tycho&#8230;.but mercifully there have still not been any marauding canine suitors trying to scale the walls, or any attempts on Cuba's part to escape.


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## Deacon Blues (Nov 22, 2013)

This thread has been very interesting to me as the owner of a young intact female that has not come into season yet. Not to be indelicate here, but could you reference the odor involved?


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Deacon Blues said:


> This thread has been very interesting to me as the owner of a young intact female that has not come into season yet. Not to be indelicate here, but could you reference the odor involved?


I think we've long passed a state of delicacy, Deacon Blue!! Absolutely zero odour that I, as a mere human, can detect; obviously plenty for Tycho to twitch his small nostrils around!! did you read that article about not spaying till post 6 years old? I wonder if that is catching on&#8230;.??? Anyone else seen anything similar?


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Both of my girls a still not spayed. I had only one bad experience. I went to visit my sister who has a fixed male and he raped my Maddie. I had no idea some males will still mate even though he was fixed. My poor baby was being dragged around by him.She didn't want to visit again for a very long time. Zoey hates my sisters dog but acts like he is her best friend when she is in heat. She like has a dance.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAY NINETEEN*

Neutered males certainly can and do carry on exactly as if they were entire. Tycho is a fine example! I was wrong that things were beginning to calm down, it's been all go this evening, Cuba as flirtatious as ever and Tychy happily obliging. Not much sign of any activity all day long, but this evening has been back to x-certificated activities. I wonder whether it will all stop suddenly, or taper off?

I'm very sorry poor Maddie had a bad experience, Suzi. Cuba has certainly not found the experience anything other than entirely to her liking&#8230;it'll be interesting to see what happens when she's got through ovulation - John (Gibbs' Dad) might well be right and Tycho might find it a dreadful shock to his system to have his advances rebuffed when the good time girl goes off him&#8230;we shall see!


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

*DAYS TWENTY AND TWENTY ONE*

Well I seem to have slacked in my diary duty, but things have been calming down somewhat, and there wasn't much to report yesterday.

Tycho is, as I write, boxing with Cuba, like kangaroos - both up on their back legs and tussling together; he's doing his best to get around behind her, presumably thinking he'll get the welcome he's had for the last couple of weeks, but to no avail - she's enjoying the play but he's not going to get anywhere&#8230;which suggests to me that she is no longer ovulating. It'll be nice not to have to supervise her every outdoor moment, but actually the whole thing has been so easy to manage, really no trouble at all. It's exactly three weeks today since she started her season; I'll keep an eye on her till for a bit, but I think we are pretty much there now.


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## Deacon Blues (Nov 22, 2013)

I've followed this thread with great interest. Would this be an accurate recap?


Apart from interaction with males (intended or otherwise) there is no particular drama?
Havanese, or at least yours, kept herself tidy and did not varnish your furnishings with blood and fluids?

Based on your experience, what advice would you give someone preparing for an upcoming heat, minus the amorous Tycho?


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Deacon Blues said:


> I've followed this thread with great interest. Would this be an accurate recap?
> 
> 
> Apart from interaction with males (intended or otherwise) there is no particular drama?
> ...


Hi, Deacon Blues - I think that's a fair summary; there was certainly no particular drama, and no, absolutely no mess whatsoever - she kept herself entirely clean.

My advice would be to keep an eye on when the season starts - the easiest way is to check the vulva every day - look and see what pre-season looks like (small and unswollen) and then you'll recognise changes. You'll probably notice more licking, too. If you are checking every day it's not difficult to notice the first show of blood. It's useful to know when Day One is because then you'll have some idea of when the danger time starts. I tried that thing of running a finger down her spine to see if it made her turn her tail to one side, but nothing happened (it's supposed to indicate when they are receptive to mating, that's what she would do if a male touched her back).
I wouldn't let her wander around even in an enclosed garden without supervision; I've gone out with her every single time, just to be sure that I know for sure that no marauding suitors have leapt the garden walls. None did, but I'm glad I know that for sure. Check from time to time after the first seven to ten days to see when the bleeding lightens in colour - this is when she is beginning to ovulate, and is the time when she needs most careful supervision.
If there is another dog in the house that is neutered and can do her no harm I wouldn't worry about his amourous pursuits or mounting antics. Just let them get on with it. Tycho mounted her frequently, but never tied; if he had done so I'd have tried to make sure that she was in no distress, turned them around as advised if I'd had to (I'm very relieved I didn't have to!) and let them wait it out. It's pointless getting all upset about dogs doing what dogs do, or trying to stop them. It's harmless if the male is neutered. I'm watching them carefully now that she is no longer receptive to his advances, just to be sure he doesn't try and push her too far or take the play into any kind of aggression, but so far there is no sign of that.
Towards the end of the three weeks it's worth checking for signs that the vulva is shrinking again - that is apprently the clearest sign that the season is over.
Once the season is over a good bath is probably a sensible notion before taking her out again on normal walks; Cuba hasn't been outside the house except to play in the garden, for the whole season. I've tried to make an extra effort to give her lots of games and fun and training so that she has had plenty of exercise, not counting the tearing around with Tycho. I don't think she has particularly missed going out, and anyway the weather has been so horrible that I haven't missed it, either!
I think all dogs are different, and I've been lucky that Cuba has seemed to manage the whole event remarkably easily; no mood swings, that can happen; no pain, that can happen - or at least no sign of any discomfort. First seasons can be lighter than subsequent ones, I understand, so I wouldn't be complacent about the next, if we decide to hold off the spaying. I'm tempted to do that following that last bit of research that suggested leaving it till they are 6 years old....I'll do a bit more research on that before deciding. I'm really, really glad, though, that I didn't spay her before her first season.
Do ask if there's anything else particular I've forgotten? I'd recommend getting The Book of the Bitch, too, it's really helpful to know what one is looking for at various stages. Hope the diary has been useful!


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