# Separation component in Therapy Testing



## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

My Ricky (Rescue PUP from HRI on June '08) tested for TDI on Sunday and did very well until separation for 3 minutes was asked of him. He has always had a issue with this (at CGC he fussed a bit) and really needs someone to show him that he is safe and reassure him I WILL return. The evaluator was not warm and fuzzy and did not even use his name during the separation or attempt to pet hm or distract him. You would have thought he was being injured in some way listening to his barking like noises of stress while laying down the entire time coming from behind closed doors. I explained to the evaluator prior to my leaving him that he had been in 5 homes prior to his furever home and he just needed a little extra reassurance and TLC in her voice. Ricky was in the room with the evaluator all by himself as I walked out. Unfortunately, their was no sound from her at all...I was a little taken back also because when I said Good Morning she didn't respond or even look at me when she approached the training center on her arrival on Sunday. Her only comment was that he would make a great therapy dog, but I needed to work on separation in case I had to go to the bathroom. If that was the case, I would definitely have found someone where ever I might be who could manage to show some interest in him before I left him alone with ANYONE!!
Any thoughts or suggestions?? I have been in touch with another evaluator on the phone who will be testing in the summer and I spoke to her about my experience and she told me she tests this particular component differently..she has several dogs doing separation in the room together so he is not alone..maybe that would help. I am going to practice at our local park with willing animal loving people (loads of dog walkers there all the time) to practice separation. I have practiced leaving him with all the neighbors and he is fine...it is the new people that he doesn't know that he needs practice staying with in short increments to get him use to seeing me leave in strange places. The newest evaluator is familiar with Havanese breed..they need a little extra time to get to know you as opposed to a lab who his your best bud from the minute they meet you. She sounded dog friendly and warm and fuzzy to me on the phone so maybe she will be able to make it happen???


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Try it again but be honest with yourself about your dog's abilities. Evaluators are people after all and have their own biases based on their experiences. Also what works with one dog wouldn't work for another. I wouldn't want the evaluator to talk to Isabelle period. All you have to do is make eye contact and smile and Belle would likely break her down and jump in their lap then she would bark when the evaluator didn't pet her or pick her up. So for me, I would have probably felt annoyed and disappointed with the evaluator who took my dog for supervised seperation and started talking to her on a down (I HATE the ones who do baby talk!) But then again in a therapy situation, I might need Belle to pay attention to me and listen to me when 3 old ladies are talking baby talk 

Some evaluators are more lax about somethings than others but they generally have a reason. For instance the new group I am with does a lot of work with special education students so dogs who growl at a new stranger person pushing them around automatically fail. Their reasoning seemed harsh to me and they freak out about growling when I think a growl is good. For them, it can be a lot more chaotic than the test. So a dog that growls may very well bite come visit day. 

Dora failed a therapy dog test in the grooming section when a heavy lady came up to her left her on the floor and bent over with a brush. Dora backed up and showed apprehension. I disagreed with that and she passed the next text where grooming was done on a table. But then when it came to doing visits, Dora stressed out being on stranger's laps. In most of my visits, you only have a few seconds to introduce to a person and a lot of people will reach down and grab your dog right away. For Dora this wasn't enough time and therapy dog was too much.

While I have honestly never left my dog with someone. I have had plenty of people at facillities grab my dog and take her to patient's rooms. I was there to watch but 10-20 feet away. I think the idea is that your dog can cope without you. Once again each program is different. I also have an unique dog who I think anyone could pick her up and take her to therapy. But I also have one who is a Mommy's boy and wouldn't. Meanwhile on visits with children, they want to take your dog for a walk that is the first thing they always want to do. Belle looks like the kid is gonna try to steal her and she looks to me for leadership. While Dash could care less where I am, he is going for a walk.


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

*Suggestions*

Delta Society testing doesn't require that you leave the dog alone with the evaluator. Maybe you could find a Delta evaluation somewhere in your area.

Cali passed the Delta but I thought she wouldn't be able to stay alone w/o me for the CGC test. I took her to Petsmart and the instructor worked on it with us. I'd put Cali in a sit, give the leash to the instructor and leave. Donna, the instructor kept giving Cali treats while I was out of sight. After doing this several times, Cali connected my leaving with her getting treats.
Then we practiced w/o treats.
She passed that part of the CGC.
Perhaps you could try this, with a friend giving the treats etc.
good luck!


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Trish, your Ricky is such a lovely dovey, but sometimes it's just very difficult imagining you not returning after you've left the room. One can only wonder what goes through their minds. I think training this part of the test will help Ricky understand that you always come back. I have no idea how mine would react, but I do know they wouldn't be sitting still! lol


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

This is interesting to read. It sounds so rewarding and affirming of the relationship between you and your dog. I'm envious. Someday I hope to find a place that does this and have the time to drive there. I think the closest one is over an hour away.


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## jillnors2 (Apr 12, 2007)

> Any thoughts or suggestions?? I have been in touch with another evaluator on the phone who will be testing in the summer and I spoke to her about my experience and she told me she tests this particular component differently..she has several dogs doing separation in the room together so he is not alone..maybe that would help


My evaluater did one dog at a time. How long have you had your dog? I wouldn't push this issue at this time, training in general should be fun and not stressful to your dog.


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## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

Thanks so much for everyones thoughts...and as their are different dogs there are different needs for each. My Ricky has been with me for a year and our training began several weeks after we adopted him with Good Manners Class. The separation portion of the CGC and TDI consisted of treats from a stranger watching him (class of 8 dogs and tested alone and sometimes with his classmates in the room) until I return and immediately stopped the treats when he sees me with my attention looking elsewhere with no fussing from me on my return!! Food definitely WORKS!! Unfortunately, no treats are allowed during the testing. His response to my leaving is very uncomfortable for me to hear and it only escalates with him as time goes on. My two previous trainers knew how to handle him and kept him occupied with different commands such as give me your paw and sit/down. With the CGC, his trainer was in the room the entire time which probably helped...a familiar face who he loved. I definitely agree with you Jill..if it is not FUN I do not do IT!! I am only considering this second retest befcause the evaluateor seemed to understand "The Rickster"!! This will be my last try and he will be the therapy dog for my friends and family!!:amen:


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## jillnors2 (Apr 12, 2007)

Trish-I completely understand what Ricky is doing. My girl has terrible seperation anxiety, she is fine when my other dog and I are with her but if both of us leave her, she is beside herself. I've had her for almost 3 years and she squeals like a pig when we are at an agility trial and I'm running my other dog-we can hear her clear across the agility venue.

I wonder if Ricky would be better if one of his brothes/sisters was outside the ring within eye shot? Just a thought.

My other dog has his CGC and TDI but Emily will not get the TDI due to the 3 minute seperation. I just accept this and go on-she was 7 when I adopted her and gosh only knows how many homes she had.

Good for you for training, that is wonderful for your rescue and I bet he loves it!!!!


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## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

It would be great if anyone he knew was around..even Happy and Lucky, but unfortunately that is not allowed!! I was thinking about giving him a piece of my clothing or a toy or both when I leave....I am thinking too much as usual, but just cannot get inside his head. He loves training and being with people and other dogs..just do not move too fast...therapy training for children might have been good (no separation needed), but he is not happy if things move towrds him too fast like kids, puppies or a big dog!! I am sure having his new brothers has helped alot when both my husband and I go out!! They are a great pack of pups together..we are so grateful that it worked out and they get along. I have learned over the years and even on a daily basis..THINGS HAPPEN FOR A REASON!!:wink:


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

Trish~ You've gotten some good suggestions already. Tori didn't have a problem w/the separation part of the CGC or TDI. Both of them were administered outside, at dog shows, so there were many things for her to be distracted by and help her not think so much about me leaving, I think that helped her do well. Maybe you can find someone who administers the test outside? 

Also, from the time Tori was little, when Amanda and I would take the pups out, I'd leave her w/Amanda whenever "nature called". IDK~ maybe that helped her learn that Mommy always comes back.

Good luck the next time around!


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## ECudmore (Jun 5, 2007)

Love on the Leash testing program does not ask you to leave the dog alone for 3 minutes.

I think each group has different requirements to pass the test.

Elayne and Racquet


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## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

RICKY PASSED HIS THERAPY TEST YESTERDAY!!!!!!!!!! I continued to practice leaving him alone in strange places while he couldn't see me gradually getting to almost three minutes. He eventually realized I always came back and he just layed on the ground staring in the direction he saw me last!! I made an appointment with a different evaluator in another town who had a time slot available for us. It was hot and humid and the testing area was very friendly and non-threatening even though we knew NO ONE!! I had presented my frustration with separation with the evaluator when I made the testing appointment so she had some heads up on his history. He was perfect through it all..even when I left him with 6 strange people with the evaluator holding him as I left. She allowed him to moan a bit, but he layed down and was quiet and did not appear anxious or under any stress during the 3 minutes. What a difference from his last testing date..he cried and carried on so terribly the evaluator asked me to come IN!! Yesterday's performance was exactly what I knew he could do and the evaluator agreed he would be a perfect therapy dog. She wrote on his testing record that he was a very sweet dog who loved people and very attached to his MOMMY!! She was very honest and up front with me and felt he would always have this separation "concern", but it would diminish over time and improvement has been shown in the one year (last weekend) that we have adopted him into our family. I am so proud of him and ME (I was definitely nervous taking it a 2nd time!!)...now should we try pediatric therapy class training????..at least there is no separation component in that test!!!


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!! Hard work pays off.

Trish, like I said before, I have hardly ever been without my dog in a therapy setting so you might just want to try a few visits first and see what you like. Just remember if he gets stressed, you need to be the one to walk out. Make it always fun. I always have our chicken jerky in the car when we are done or with Dash, we play outside before and after we go in. Also helps with the energy.


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## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

It was harder than a stress test mentally than anything I have ever done...HATE TAKING TESTS!!! Ricky was really pooped when we had time to relax when we got home..it was an hour ride up and down and a HOT hour of testing time with paperwork and waiting. Thanks so much for your help and guidance..this forum is the greatest..never shared so much in my LIFE!!


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Yes, I know what you mean. But keep it in perspective too. A good friend of mine when I got really nervous in obedience said if you mess up- your dog will go home loving you just like he always has, you should do the same for your dog. So even if you fail the test, you still leave there with your best friend 

But now that you passed-party time! Do you have a place in mind you want to do visits at?


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## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

I am going to a local nursing home with a friend who was in my therapy training class with her pup Nadia (collie). Her aunt is there and she had been going for quite a while with her pup Sabrina who unfortunately died suddenly 2 months ago. She wanted to continue with therapy visits with her new pup who just turned one year old. So I will be with a seasoned handler which will give some guidance on what to expect and where to go!!! I love new adventures so I am excited about this...it will take a month or so to get all the paperwork completed and returned to me. Ricky had a complete physical 2 months ago so that is the easy part..and I have loads of pictures of him too!! I am defintely excited in a CALM way..I finished the hard part!!


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Oh Trish! I am Soooooo happy for you!!!!! Wish I could give you a hug. I know how much this worried you, but you handled it perfectly, training Ricky slowly but surely. You guys did it! :cheer2:


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## Trish (Jan 15, 2008)

Thanks Marj I was so excited yesterday that I drank an entire bottle of Asti Spumonti and I do not DRINK!!! No hangover this moring..that is a good thing!! :laugh:


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

Trish,
Congratulations! Great accomplishment.
The people in the nursing home will love visits from you and Ricky.


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