# Photos from Saturday



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

She didn't get any points, but she was a very good girl! And she looks very happy and comfortable in the ring.


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## Molly120213 (Jan 22, 2014)

Such a pretty girl!


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## Zoe093014 (Jan 27, 2015)

She looks SUPER happy!!! But ... does she have eyes??? Seriously she seems like there's nothing she'd rather be doing!
And she looks like a real joy!


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## PaulineMi (Feb 5, 2016)

What a cutie!


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## Ollie"s Mom (May 23, 2014)

She is so darned cute.


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## Layla's Mom (Feb 1, 2016)

Bet she was charming everyone with that awesome tail of hers!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

I can't get over how similar Panda and Nino are in the face. Love to see happy pups in the ring  And outside too! That's one we haven't done smoothly yet. Were you on the other end of the lead this go around?


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## Dee Dee (Jul 24, 2015)

She is so beautiful!! I love her markings she is really growing up. She'll get those points!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> I can't get over how similar Panda and Nino are in the face. Love to see happy pups in the ring  And outside too! That's one we haven't done smoothly yet. Were you on the other end of the lead this go around?


Yes, I showed her last weekend. We are at a 4 day show this weekend, with more competition, and majors this weekend (yay!!!). Kodi is trialing as well as Panda showing. I can't be in two places at once, so Geoff Dawson (the pro handler who has handled her once before) is handling Panda again in the conformation ring. If I can't get over there in time to see her go, a friend will video her for me.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Dee Dee said:


> She is so beautiful!! I love her markings she is really growing up. She'll get those points!


The problem right now is that her coat isn't filling out as quickly as those puppies with more undercoat. So her coat looks a little flat in the ring. This is the type of coat I prefer, because in the long run, it is much easier to maintain. But it does take longer to mature. Her sire didn't start showing until 18 months for the same reason. So we need a judge who understands structure and movement AND understands that Havanese puppy coats develop at different rates. Not all judges understand either.


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

krandall said:


> The problem right now is that her coat isn't filling out as quickly as those puppies with more undercoat. So her coat looks a little flat in the ring. This is the type of coat I prefer, because in the long run, it is much easier to maintain. But it does take longer to mature. Her sire didn't start showing until 18 months for the same reason. So we need a judge who understands structure and movement AND understands that Havanese puppy coats develop at different rates. Not all judges understand either.


Nino is the same way. I share my breeder's sentiments when she says "I'd much rather have a dog/puppy with great structure and an OK coat than a dog with tons of coat but only decent structure". We are going to put a pause on showing after this weekend until January (or so I say...) to let him blow coat and mature a bit. When adults with their coat type show, it's breathtaking, so I don't mind.

BTW, forgot to add in my first reply: LOVE the loose leash gaiting. Trying to get our boy there, but he associated the loose leash with normal walking and choked up with gaiting.


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

Panada is sooo cute!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> Nino is the same way. I share my breeder's sentiments when she says "I'd much rather have a dog/puppy with great structure and an OK coat than a dog with tons of coat but only decent structure". We are going to put a pause on showing after this weekend until January (or so I say...) to let him blow coat and mature a bit. When adults with their coat type show, it's breathtaking, so I don't mind.
> 
> BTW, forgot to add in my first reply: LOVE the loose leash gaiting. Trying to get our boy there, but he associated the loose leash with normal walking and choked up with gaiting.


And I doubt very much that she won't have a lovely coat when she's mature. She just looks very different from the "puff-ball" puppies in the ring.

I'm a stickler for a loose leash, so we work on it a lot! Also, her natural gait is so pretty, all I could possibly do by choking up on her is make it worse. 

Today didn't go well for either of them. There was so much wind blowing through the barn where Kodi's obedience was that the ring gating blew down. There was so much bird poop and bird seed blowing around on the floor that he just left me in the middle of heeling. He has NQ'd for a lot of things, but never for that!!! Then, on his drop on recall, the mats were so slippery that when he went to drop, his legs splayed and he skidded across the floor sideways! My heart was in my throat, I was so afraid he was going to hurt himself.

Meanwhile, Panda was down at the conformation rings, "looking nervous" according to Geoff. Two friends who were watching said she didn't look happy. So I don't know whether it was the wind (which WAS strong!) or that Geoff was showing her instead of me. She got reserve, but that was it.


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

How did they do today?


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> How did they do today?


Kodi had a terrible day. Whether it was all that went on yesterday, or the fact that the moment we walked into the ring, the ring behind us erupted with applause and cheering I'm not sure. But he was rooted to the spot, and I couldn't get him to move to the beginning of the first exercise. (At our level, you don't have a leash on the dog from the minute you walk in the ring gate) I finally had to pick him up and excuse ourselves, since he had turned to stone.

Panda was very unhappy with the handler again. He and I talked, and we decided that I should show her tomorrow and Sunday and see if she does better for me. If I want him to show her, I may just have to send her to him for a while so that she gets used to him. He's a REALLY nice guy, and very gentle and sweet with her. So it's definitely not his fault. But we both think that the most important hing, at this stage, is for her to have good experiences in the ring. (The only problem being that I didn't' bring any show clothes with me... So I just have to wear my obedience clothes, which are a little more casual. (pants and a blouse or jacket) I did stay after Kodi's class today and walked her ALL over the show grounds and through the tents, around the rings and near other dogs. Her tail was up and happy the whole time. So I'm hoping she'll be happy in the ring tomorrow too. Unfortunately, we have an 8:30 ring time. What were they THINKING putting a breed that requires a lot of grooming that early?!?!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

krandall said:


> Kodi had a terrible day. Whether it was all that went on yesterday, or the fact that the moment we walked into the ring, the ring behind us erupted with applause and cheering I'm not sure. But he was rooted to the spot, and I couldn't get him to move to the beginning of the first exercise. (At our level, you don't have a leash on the dog from the minute you walk in the ring gate) I finally had to pick him up and excuse ourselves, since he had turned to stone.


Poor guy  Just not his weekend, huh? Was the applause from an obedience ring? At every show I've been to, they have been super strict about what's allowed in the obedience areas. Signs posted everywhere that no dogs are allowed past a certain point and volume must be at a low level. Nonetheless, I'm sorry he had such a rough go of it this weekend. Do you plan on competing the next couple days?



krandall said:


> Unfortunately, we have an 8:30 ring time. What were they THINKING putting a breed that requires a lot of grooming that early?!?!


I shared those sentiments at first, but after some looking around and asking questions, I've learned that Havs are one of the easiest breeds in terms of day-of grooming and are more of a maintenance breed. Most others need trimming, shaving, shaping, etc. My family has shown Beagles in the past, and even they require a lot more grooming on show day than Nino ever has (bath and blow dry on day 1, then a quick fluff up ringside). Most in the breed roll up to the show 30 minutes ahead, and very few take reserved grooming (might just be a Midwest thing though LOL) All of our ring times have been at the start of the show as well, so we had lots of 4:30 wake ups to get baths and driving in, but we were granted a reprieve this weekend: 10:20 and 12:20 after 20 dogs 

Best of luck tomorrow, and I hope you get Panda's handler situation sorted. Can't be fun for either of you!


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Karen, sounds like a grueling couple of days for you. I hope you all (you, Panda, and Kodi,) all have a better time of it for whatever is still to come. That is pretty odd for Kodi, isn't it? Hope he's not coming down with something, and that he was just off his mark. We all have those kind of times-but so strange for him, isn't it?

Good luck with Panda! You are so good with all of your dogs, making sure their days are good and they are doing what they like.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Sophie, you and Nino are showing as well this week? Hope it is going well for you!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Sheri said:


> Sophie, you and Nino are showing as well this week? Hope it is going well for you!


We show tomorrow and Sunday, which I have decided will be our last time out until January. I have barely had him at the end of his show lead in the past 3 weeks, so I don't have high expectations, but he's been known to do a lot with a little. Will post updates!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> Poor guy  Just not his weekend, huh? Was the applause from an obedience ring? At every show I've been to, they have been super strict about what's allowed in the obedience areas. Signs posted everywhere that no dogs are allowed past a certain point and volume must be at a low level. Nonetheless, I'm sorry he had such a rough go of it this weekend. Do you plan on competing the next couple days?
> 
> I shared those sentiments at first, but after some looking around and asking questions, I've learned that Havs are one of the easiest breeds in terms of day-of grooming and are more of a maintenance breed. Most others need trimming, shaving, shaping, etc. My family has shown Beagles in the past, and even they require a lot more grooming on show day than Nino ever has (bath and blow dry on day 1, then a quick fluff up ringside). Most in the breed roll up to the show 30 minutes ahead, and very few take reserved grooming (might just be a Midwest thing though LOL) All of our ring times have been at the start of the show as well, so we had lots of 4:30 wake ups to get baths and driving in, but we were granted a reprieve this weekend: 10:20 and 12:20 after 20 dogs
> 
> Best of luck tomorrow, and I hope you get Panda's handler situation sorted. Can't be fun for either of you!


The ring with all the clapping and cheering was the rally ring, which adjoins the obedience ring here. Just one more distraction to add to the wind, smells and slippery, hard footing. He was only entered yesterday and today. I don't like doing more than 2 days in a cluster with him... I think it's too much for him. Even if he WERE entered, I'd have thought long and hard about bringing him back tomorrow.

I agree that few Havanese people around here do a ton of grooming IN the show grooming area, but that doesn't mean that a lot of grooming doesn't get done... Either at home or in the RV (or hotel room) before going to the ring.

We'll see... It would be helpful to have someone else who could show her when I'm busy with Kodi. But if she needs me to show her, I'll just have to alternate between them and not show them on the same days.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Sheri said:


> Karen, sounds like a grueling couple of days for you. I hope you all (you, Panda, and Kodi,) all have a better time of it for whatever is still to come. That is pretty odd for Kodi, isn't it? Hope he's not coming down with something, and that he was just off his mark. We all have those kind of times-but so strange for him, isn't it?
> 
> Good luck with Panda! You are so good with all of your dogs, making sure their days are good and they are doing what they like.


Although it's not common, he has shut down at times before... Always in very challenging situations. In fairness, he was not the only dog who left the ring without finishing his run in the last couple of days, some with a lot more experience than he has (dogs working on their UDX or OTCH) and the Q rate for the whole trial has been very low. I really don't think he's sick... He seems to feel just fine other than when he was in the ring. He even warmed up well outside the ring. He's done for the weekend, and he will go for a long walk with Dave and Pixel in the morning while Panda and I are at the show.  In the afternoon, we'll find something fun for everyone to do.


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

krandall said:


> The ring with all the clapping and cheering was the rally ring, which adjoins the obedience ring here. Just one more distraction to add to the wind, smells and slippery, hard footing. He was only entered yesterday and today. I don't like doing more than 2 days in a cluster with him... I think it's too much for him. Even if he WERE entered, I'd have thought long and hard about bringing him back tomorrow.
> 
> I agree that few Havanese people around here do a ton of grooming IN the show grooming area, but that doesn't mean that a lot of grooming doesn't get done... Either at home or in the RV (or hotel room) before going to the ring.
> 
> We'll see... It would be helpful to have someone else who could show her when I'm busy with Kodi. But if she needs me to show her, I'll just have to alternate between them and not show them on the same days.


Is cheering a common occurrence though, in either sport? You would think that, in one that requires such concentration from both dog and handler, there would be a bit more courtesy, even if rally is a bit more laid back than obedience.

I didn't elaborate enough; those who I've found myself spending time with usually dedicate about 2 hours to brush out and bath pre-arrival, and that's it until ringside. It can feel like a lot (especially at 4:30 am), but in comparison to a larger breed that requires the bath and brush along with scissoring/shaping the day of, it is not much (unless their is ironing, teasing, etc being done...that's a different issue). That all being said, we have one of the most grooming intensive breeds when it comes to maintenance grooming, so the little relief we get (or at least I do) is well deserved. I'm also the crazy person who wants a TT and a Beardie, so maybe I've just been desensitized to that kind of grooming 

Totally understand that. Ring conflicts are difficult as is (my handling services were offered up by our breeder for Neezers AND Goldens this weekend due to conflicts within a breed), but adding in the fact that the obedience handling has to be done by you makes it all the more tricky. Do you have a friend who shows in another breed that Panda knows and feels comfortable with? Nino is ridiculously attached to me, but I know of 3 people I could confidently hand him off to if ever necessary. Just an idea that may make a happy medium. I don't know about you, but sending mine off to live with a handler, especially as a non-special, would break my heart (but I'm a big softy when it comes to my boys :laugh


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

No love for us today. Judge was a coat guy and put pouffy dogs up, so Nino just wasn't his type. Every dog with a handler was put up over those without (not one didn't win its class, no matter the quality), so this judge might go on the DNS list. I left Nino's Resco kindness lead at home (if it were a smooth day, it wouldn't be a show day), so he was thrown on a slip lead, which he did NOT like. It was a fun day though; a lot more of the general public came in, and Nino was fawned over, much to his delight. We are for sure done with AKC shows until January, but I plan on entering him at least one day of an IABCA show in November to get some nice feedback. We have tomorrow, and then it's 4 months of relaxation and maturing (with a CGC title thrown in, hopefully).


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Is cheering a common occurrence though, in either sport? You would think that, in one that requires such concentration from both dog and handler, there would be a bit more courtesy, even if rally is a bit more laid back than obedience.

Yes, it's not uncommon for people to clap and cheer when awards are given. In fact, it's kind of poor sportsmanship NOT to applaud. Even getting a Q at levels beyond novice is hard, and takes an ENORMOUS amount of time, training and commitment. It was jus bad timing, in an already difficult environment. Today, there were only 2 obedience Q's in the whole trial. I was SO glad that taking Kodi back wasn't even an option. (Since he wasn't entered  

Totally understand that. Ring conflicts are difficult as is (my handling services were offered up by our breeder for Neezers AND Goldens this weekend due to conflicts within a breed), but adding in the fact that the obedience handling has to be done by you makes it all the more tricky. Do you have a friend who shows in another breed that Panda knows and feels comfortable with? Nino is ridiculously attached to me, but I know of 3 people I could confidently hand him off to if ever necessary. Just an idea that may make a happy medium. I don't know about you, but sending mine off to live with a handler, especially as a non-special, would break my heart (but I'm a big softy when it comes to my boys :laugh

I don't think that's really a happy medium, even if I had someone I could do that with. All my dog show friends are Havanese people, and they already have their own dogs to worry about. I am quite sure she would have been as unhappy with any of them as she was with Geoff. Once she gets more used to him, he will be a MUCH more reliable source of help than a friend who might or might not be planning to go, that Panda might or might not be happy going in the ring with. It was interesting, today, when I was waiting outside the ring (under the tent) to shoe, Geoff walked in, and before he saw her, she saw him, and started wagging and smiling. I think she's really close to feeling comfortable with him. I have no intention of ever sending her off to "live" with him... But that's different than her traveling to a multi-day show in another state here and there... Especially when we need to pick up those majors.

Btw, she showed beautifully today for me... Geoff said she looked great! She went Best of Opposite today! I'll upload video to YouTube later.

I also got to help a friend show her English Toy Spaniels, which was pretty funny. THAT girl wanted no part of ME either! :laugh: My friend didn't care that much, though. All the ETS's were hers, and she knew ahead of time which one was likely to win, and she was on him.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> No love for us today. Judge was a coat guy and put pouffy dogs up, so Nino just wasn't his type. Every dog with a handler was put up over those without (not one didn't win its class, no matter the quality), so this judge might go on the DNS list. I left Nino's Resco kindness lead at home (if it were a smooth day, it wouldn't be a show day), so he was thrown on a slip lead, which he did NOT like. It was a fun day though; a lot more of the general public came in, and Nino was fawned over, much to his delight. We are for sure done with AKC shows until January, but I plan on entering him at least one day of an IABCA show in November to get some nice feedback. We have tomorrow, and then it's 4 months of relaxation and maturing (with a CGC title thrown in, hopefully).


You would have liked our judge today, then! In the best of breed class, every one of the dogs she picked was owner handled.


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Glad you had a better day today! Can't wait to see the video  How many points is she at now?

Nino was so off today, the poor guy. On the way there, we stopped for a potty break on a very pristine patch of grass, and he managed to find a bur to step on, pokers right into the pad, so he was a bit gimpy. The lead we borrowed was a super touchy slip, so every move one way or another (for either of us) tightened it. I loosened his lead to stop this, something we have only worked on at home, and he saw it as an opportunity to dance around like a wild man :der:

What was the name? Love me a judge that doesn't care who's handling (and one who understands that puppy coats develop differently, good lord). A friend in the breed recently got a t-shirt that says "Just judge THE DOG"...yep.

Forgot to mention: I did end up showing WB in BOB because the handler had a special. Fun getting to work with a different dog, and I'm sure glad my services weren't needed with a Golden. Whole different ballgame, going from a table breed to a sporting breed HAH


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> Glad you had a better day today! Can't wait to see the video  How many points is she at now?
> 
> Nino was so off today, the poor guy. On the way there, we stopped for a potty break on a very pristine patch of grass, and he managed to find a bur to step on, pokers right into the pad, so he was a bit gimpy. The lead we borrowed was a super touchy slip, so every move one way or another (for either of us) tightened it. I loosened his lead to stop this, something we have only worked on at home, and he saw it as an opportunity to dance around like a wild man :der:
> 
> What was the name? Love me a judge that doesn't care who's handling (and one who understands that puppy coats develop differently, good lord). A friend in the breed recently got a t-shirt that says "Just judge THE DOG"...yep.


Bonnie Linnell Clarke.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

The gal who videoed for me took lots of little clips rather than one whole video, but here she is in the Best of Breed competition:






Sorry for the butt shots in the beginning! It was pretty warm, and we were told to stay under the tent until we were asked to gait.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Here's Miss Panda waiting for her class. (Photos loaded one at a time because I'm on my iPad.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Waiting for Big Brother in the Obedience barn after her class.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Yuck! I REALLY have to get my legs washed and dried AGAIN?!?!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Being a show dog is absolutely exhausting!!!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Haha yup, Nino's been there Miss Panda!

He gets a romp at the park after he shows, no matter what, so a second bath is always in order (the face only has to be done once though, thank goodness).

Going to watch the video now 

EDIT: Loved watching her move. She just floats and jaunts so nicely. I also LOVE seeing her standing so nicely without all of the fussing/holding in place; we had a show where we were instructed to free stack our dogs when entering the ring rather than hand stacking...half of those in the puppy classes went white as a sheet. What a sweet girl you've got. Just realizing now it's been quite some time since I've gotten video of Nino...Sunday is usually my "on your own" day, but if any of my entourage shows up, I'll put them to work.


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## Dee Dee (Jul 24, 2015)

> Yuck! I REALLY have to get my legs washed and dried AGAIN?!?!


LOL LOL oh that body language made me laugh. Why couldn't I have been born a min pin? No grooming involved!  She really is a beautifully marked girl, reverse belted galloway indeed! (or hampshire pig I had one once lol)


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Dee Dee said:


> LOL LOL oh that body language made me laugh. Why couldn't I have been born a min pin? No grooming involved!  She really is a beautifully marked girl, reverse belted galloway indeed! (or hampshire pig I had one once lol)


I can just picture what's going through her mind. "Hmm...the jump isn't _that _far...if I just wait until she looks away..."


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## Ditto's Mom (Apr 29, 2007)

Oh Miss Panda you are one special little girl!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Best of luck today!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

She did a very nice job again today, in spite of gale force winds. Happy, tail up, and waggy for the judge on the table. But, as things so often go at dog shows, against the exact same bitches she won over yesterday, she got nuthin'  Oh well, it was good practice for both of us!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Ditto on the nothing for us. Judge said he had wonderful structure, but so did all of the other dogs, and Nino's coat is holding us back. With that, we hang up our (AKC) hats until early January.

All of that said, though, some great news came of the day! Our breeder's class bitch, the one who has been chasing a major for ages, finally got her Championship with a 4 point major over some good looking girls. Really did like this judge. He looked at structure over everything else, took into account the fact that Hav coats can be weird (new CH is notorious for blowing a little coat after each heat), and gave feedback.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Panda's coat is actually looking pretty good these days. This judge just seemed to like small and "cutsie" and didn't mind tight tails.  All three girls behaved well, especially considering the wind!


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

Nino is blowing coat, so that combined with his sickness a few weeks back has left him with even less undercoat than he started with. Our hope with waiting a few months is that he will have time to grow that back (plus more, hopefully), finish blowing coat, fill out as far as weight/muscle go, and mature a bit.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

It sometimes makes good sense to take a dog out of the ring to let him grow up some. I have a friend who has Whippets, and her younger boy just wasn't doing well in the ring. She took him out until he was two, put him back in the ring and finished him in two weekends. 

Panda is blowing coat some, but less than I would expect, considering she is 11 months now, and recently went through her first heat. (Well, except for all the matting on her butt under her panties... Not something boys have to worry about! :laugh. SO FAR... (Knock on wood!!!) she is having less matting than either Kodi or Pixel had. Pixel STILL mats more than Panda, and she's 18 months now. (Which is why she's in a puppy cut  )


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## KarMar (Jan 14, 2016)

2 and a half months of limited showing with 2 points to show for it...can't complain there. A dog that knows when fun times are okay in the ring (ie NOT in the down and back) is one that just looks so much nicer, and that comes with age for any dog.

So far (also knocking on wood), the matting hasn't been terrible, but I've been obsessive over brushing. Just passing a hand over him now, I can feel areas where dead coat needs to be removed. My breeder had to poke fun at me: Nino was done for the day and we were watching her in OH group, but I was combing him out like I was prepping for ring. I can't help it; I feel pre-tangles, I must comb.

I'm thinking Mario and Pixel must have a similar coat (though his is probably quite a bit stiffer). Ultra-fine, though. He never went through a decisive blowing coat phase, but he's also been fast to mat since a year old. The good thing is, his mats break apart very easily with a little attention from a slicker (combing is futile, and he hates it).


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

KarMar said:


> 2 and a half months of limited showing with 2 points to show for it...can't complain there. A dog that knows when fun times are okay in the ring (ie NOT in the down and back) is one that just looks so much nicer, and that comes with age for any dog.
> 
> So far (also knocking on wood), the matting hasn't been terrible, but I've been obsessive over brushing. Just passing a hand over him now, I can feel areas where dead coat needs to be removed. My breeder had to poke fun at me: Nino was done for the day and we were watching her in OH group, but I was combing him out like I was prepping for ring. I can't help it; I feel pre-tangles, I must comb.
> 
> I'm thinking Mario and Pixel must have a similar coat (though his is probably quite a bit stiffer). Ultra-fine, though. He never went through a decisive blowing coat phase, but he's also been fast to mat since a year old. The good thing is, his mats break apart very easily with a little attention from a slicker (combing is futile, and he hates it).


Yeah, I don't let mats go on mine either. I learned early on that little knots are easier to remove... Let them lie on them, and they grow into a HUGE mess!!

Pixel's coat his profuse, but very, VERY fine and soft. When it was long, she looked like a black powder puff. It feels FANTASTIC, but between it being SO fine, and her having more undercoat than either of the others, she mats SO easily. In a puppy cut, I can get out all the problematic dead undercoat before it causes a trouble. In a long coat, it was HOURS of careful combing and line brushing... Which neither of us appreciated. Since she's not going to be a ring dog (she has lovely conformation, but worries about dogs coming up behind her) and is Dave's little love more than anything else, a puppy cut was definitely the right answer for her. I can wash and dry her in under a half hour, and a slicker through her coat every 2-3 days keeps her mat-free.


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