# Housebreaking Milestones



## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

I know we still have a ways to go, but Gibbs is making great progress at 20 weeks old.

1. This week was a completely accident free week, regardless of location (i.e. visiting other houses).

2. In the past 21 days, Gibbs has only had one accident in our house, and that was two days after we changed from dry kibble to raw frozen (50/50 mix).

3. We visited my parents tonight and he went to their door and rang the bell to go outside and pee.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

that's excellent John, keep up the great work, because it is indeed work.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

He's a cutie!! How can you even get mad at piddles where they aren't supposed to be? lol 

Kara


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## Ruth4Havs (May 13, 2013)

Wow, keep it going Gibbs! Thats great work!


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

Good work Gibbs and Gibbs parents!


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

Dana and I got really lucky with Gibbs. He was able to hold it 8 hours overnight by the time he was about 11.5 weeks. Dana and I didn't believe it at first. The pee pad in his pen was dry, so we wondered if he was that exception who peed in the travel crate where he was suppose to sleep. Each morning we'd remove the bedding to inspect if for pee. We'd even put our nose to it to sniff. We'd inspect all his sleep toys before believing he was holding it.


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

Leo was the same. We brought him home at 10.5 weeks and we got up 2x the first night and 1x a couple of other nights that first week to week and a half but since then he has slept all night staying completely dry til his potty trip out in the morning.


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## Sparkle (May 17, 2012)

Wow, you're doing great with Gibbs. Are you pee pad, litter box, or outside training? I thought I was doing pretty well with Abby (11 wks) but Tues evening she peed 8 times in 45 minutes!! Not just dribbles either. Don't know what that was all about. Hasn't done that extreme amount since. But she did try to hit the pee pads the majority of time. She was running loose in our LR with trainer evaluating the playtime.


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## PiedPiper (Apr 30, 2013)

Yay! That's awesome!!


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

Sparkle said:


> Wow, you're doing great with Gibbs. Are you pee pad, litter box, or outside training? I thought I was doing pretty well with Abby (11 wks) but Tues evening she peed 8 times in 45 minutes!! Not just dribbles either. Don't know what that was all about. Hasn't done that extreme amount since. But she did try to hit the pee pads the majority of time. She was running loose in our LR with trainer evaluating the playtime.


At this point it is all outside training, but here's how we progressed.

We got Gibbs at 9 weeks. We gated off our foyer, about 3 feet by 6 feet on ceramic tile. We put his bed at one end and a pee pad at the other. The bed consisted of a travel crate and bedding. Dana stays at home, so during the day we opened the foyer gate and gave him the run of the kitchen and family room.

For the first 2 weeks when Gibbs couldn't hold it overnight, he used the pee pad in his Pen. During the day, Dana and I would try to take him outside every hour, after naps and after eating. We attached a bell to the door so he would learn to associate the bell with going outside. During the first two weeks, if Dana and I were late taking him out, he would go to the pee pad in the Kitchen. However, that all stopped once he learned to hold it overnight. When he stopped using the pee pad in his Pen, he also stopped using the pee pad in the kitchen. Therefore, if Dana and I were late taking him out, he peed on the carpet if he was in the family room or the tile if he was in the kitchen or foyer outside his Pen.

*The real progress came at the intersection of 2 events:*

1. Turing 4 months
2. Using the potty cue "Go Potty"

Dana and I originally learned using the cue "Go Potty" would be counterproductive because it could make him anxious or nervous and he wouldn't go. I don't know if that was bad advice, or good advice that he eventually outgrew.

We had always treated and praised him for peeing and pooing, but never associated with the verbal cue. Our trainer told us to say "Good Potty" as soon as he peed and pooed. After he got that association, we started to say "Go Potty" as soon as we took him out after naps, eating or an extended period in the house. The results were almost instantaneous, and he seemed to realize that "Potty" was an outside activity that lead to treat, praise and then play.


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## Sparkle (May 17, 2012)

Thanks for your progress strategy. I also say Go Potty as soon as I take her out. 95% of the time she will do one or both. But @ 11 wks, she will sometimes stop in the middle of playing & just immediately pee. And she could've just peed 10 minutes previously! I snatch her up quickly & she stops peeing, I rush her outside & she does nothing! We'll get there. She does use her pee pad in her ex-pen. So I guess she just has too much freedom too soon. She needs more consistent confinement.

Have you taken up the pee pads entirely now?


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## Gibbs Mom and Dad (Jun 3, 2013)

Sparkle said:


> Thanks for your progress strategy. I also say Go Potty as soon as I take her out. 95% of the time she will do one or both. But @ 11 wks, she will sometimes stop in the middle of playing & just immediately pee. And she could've just peed 10 minutes previously! I snatch her up quickly & she stops peeing, I rush her outside & she does nothing! We'll get there. She does use her pee pad in her ex-pen. So I guess she just has too much freedom too soon. She needs more consistent confinement.
> 
> Have you taken up the pee pads entirely now?


He haven't taken them up yet, but we should. He hasn't used either of them in about a month. I just know that as soon as I take them up he's going to walk to the exact spot, potty and then wink at Dana and I.

The Humane Society where we are taking puppy classes said dogs can't truly learn to "hold it" by squeezing there "potty muscles" until 4 months. I have no idea if this is true and how dogs can "hold it" overnight if it is. Davet?? Krandall??


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## swaye (Mar 28, 2013)

They are such smart pups!, Cute, too!!


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

I think the staying dry overnight has to do with metabolism slowing, sleeping, less activity and less intake of food and water. When puppies are active and playing, drinking and eating there is more need to pee and poo. Young puppies like young children learning to use appropriate potty places, feel the urge basically as the pee and poo are happening or maybe just immediately before. Then as they gain a bit more maturity the time between the feeling of needing to go and the act of going is a bit longer unless they are engaged in play or something else that is interesting. It takes a while for them to mature to the point that they know they need to go and know how to alert someone that they need to go to get outside or for them to get to a pee pad or litterbox if that is how they have been trained. I think how the puppies have been worked with from around 3 weeks or so can influence how quickly they figure out the potty thing. To help them through the process one needs to limit the size of the space they have access to so the appropriate potty option is the best choice. Consistent praise/treat for pottying in the appropriate place and use of a verbal cue such as Go Potty that the pup will come to associate with the act of peeing or pooing can help things along. At first CONSTANT watching and attentiveness to the puppy when not confined can help prevent accidents. Frequent trips out or to the indoor potty option will help the pup learn where it's ok to go. With consistency most get the hang of it, some sooner and some later. If your house is larger, you may find the puppy reliable in the rooms you spend the most time in but much less so in other parts of the house. It's best to restrict access to less frequently used rooms unless you can spend some time with pup there so that room also becomes part of the "nest" so to speak.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Someone told me, which is I suppose obvious, but I hadn't thought of it, that in many ways although a 'summer puppy' (one acquired in the summer) is easier for the owner to manage - doors into the garden can be left open if one is lucky enough to have a garden (yard, sorry! I'm English!) - there is less difference, from the puppy's point of view, between indoors and outdoors. Many of us have tiled spaces indoors that are more or less similar to outdoors paving; the temperature indoors and outdoors is pretty much the same in summer, whereas in winter the puppy can feel immediately that he/she is going from somewhere cosy and warm to somewhere cold and possibly wet. There's a more obvious delineation between day and night in winter. It's harder work for the owner in that you are constantly having to wipe down a rain-sodden puppy and the days are far shorter so you are probably out there with a torch, too. But it's easier for the puppy to learn the differences.


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## BearsMom (Jul 16, 2012)

I never thought of it that way Lalla...though I can see the idea now. Bear came home to us in June and took all summer and into the fall to truly be house broken. He was my 1st pup to house train and it was definitely a learning process (for us both). 
Even though it took him a while, I don't think I could handle house breaking a pup in winter....I haaaate the cold! :smow:


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## swaye (Mar 28, 2013)

Lalla said:


> Someone told me, which is I suppose obvious, but I hadn't thought of it, that in many ways although a 'summer puppy' (one acquired in the summer) is easier for the owner to manage - doors into the garden can be left open if one is lucky enough to have a garden (yard, sorry! I'm English!) - there is less difference, from the puppy's point of view, between indoors and outdoors. Many of us have tiled spaces indoors that are more or less similar to outdoors paving; the temperature indoors and outdoors is pretty much the same in summer, whereas in winter the puppy can feel immediately that he/she is going from somewhere cosy and warm to somewhere cold and possibly wet. There's a more obvious delineation between day and night in winter. It's harder work for the owner in that you are constantly having to wipe down a rain-sodden puppy and the days are far shorter so you are probably out there with a torch, too. But it's easier for the puppy to learn the differences.


Makes sense! We have had mostly large breed pups and during the summer. We brought Sofie home the first week in March. Since toy breeds take longer to house train, I couldn't objectively say. I do know our larger breeds were quicker. It took Sofie 3 months before she was reliable.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Today was a good day; no disasters during the night - when I got up at 4:45 (as usual) all was fine, clean litter box, pee and poo as soon as we went outside, back to sleep till 7:00; I've gone back to basics with on the hour every hour getting Cuba out, and that seems to be working predictably well. Still don't dare give her a bed to sleep on for fear that it will cause instant regression to peeing on her bed, but with no bed to pee on she seems fine. She's spent some of the day in the conservatory room, gated off from the rest of the house, with my Coton; no disasters there, either. I made the area slightly smaller after she peed on the floor a few days ago, and maybe that's has been a good thing. We went to class yesterday evening, mostly out of doors but some indoors in a huge, carpeted barn; no disasters there, and a fantastically helpful and useful class, with her Leonberger friend, and other adult dogs. I SO prefer taking her there to puppy class - she is learning SO much from the calm, kind adult dogs and their experienced owners, it's such a lovely thing to see her watching, learning, copying, calming down in the presence of calm older dogs. And all fear of big dogs seems now to be so much better. There were two new ones yesterday, so it's not just that she's getting used to the others, and anyway, this was only her second visit. I'm sure we haven't got anywhere near through the housetraining difficulties, but I feel less out of control of it all, and that she will eventually learn that beds are for snuggling and sleeping in, not for peeing on!


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## Ruthiec (Jun 18, 2013)

Great progress Lalla and yes, I think many of us have to go back to basics on the housetraining. I know i did and it has helped (although not last night as I shall post in Charlie's Diary).

You live in a beautiful place. We lived near Thame and used to love going for a mooch around Oxford.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Thanks, Ruth! I must say it really does help to have feedback - I'm not used to going on these sorts of forums (fora?) and I've found the support and information, and comparing of notes incredibly helpful - it's so good not to feel that one is alone, but that other people go through stuff, too. And not just the bad stuff - it's fun to report the successes and hear of other people's triumphs, too. And you live in a beautiful place, too!
Today was equally good - no pee or poo when I came downstairs at 4:45 again. I might risk pushing it to 4:46 tomorrow, you never know!!!


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## Ruthiec (Jun 18, 2013)

On the confidence bit - I'm sure you'll see a transformation. It was the same with Charlie. Initially he hid behind me every time he saw another dog. But with the help of Puppy Class and some well-managed introductions he's really come out of his shell. He even tried to play with a fully grown Great Dane this morning - the look of disdain was wonderful.

As for a snugly bed - we've given Charlie's to the cat. He refuses to lie on anything soft - preferring the cool tiles or the rug or our laps. We tried to teach him "in your bed" but within 2 mins he would be completely out except for one paw as if to say "see I'm being good, honestly".

Enjoy your lie-in tomorrow  (and sorry Gibbs Mom and Dad for hijacking your thread)


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Oops, just sent a reply off into cyberspace, so if it shows up repeated, apologies. Confidence is no longer a problem thanks to my brilliant trainer, Kay Laurence, allowing me to bring Cuba to grown-up dog class; there are only six or seven dogs there, all experienced owners, and a genius trainer. Cuba's best friend now is a Leonberger. Others there are labs, retrievers, a border collie, a Flatcoat and a Lagotto (interesting dog), but it's the Leonberger that Cuba really adores. She's SO tiny next to him! These classes are just SO good, although the more I work with Kay the more I realise how much I've got to learn - Cuba's really bright, it's I who have to work hard not to give her the wrong signals. And she will go 'in your bed' (by 'go' I do NOT mean 'pee'!!!) faultlessly and from a really good distance. Sometimes I use an actual bed, sometimes just a mat; whatever the 'bed' she'll rush to it, lie down and stay till I release her from the 'stay'; we even managed it at class on Thursday, with the Leonberger for distraction!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Gibbs Mom and Dad said:


> He haven't taken them up yet, but we should. He hasn't used either of them in about a month. I just know that as soon as I take them up he's going to walk to the exact spot, potty and then wink at Dana and I.
> 
> The Humane Society where we are taking puppy classes said dogs can't truly learn to "hold it" by squeezing there "potty muscles" until 4 months. I have no idea if this is true and how dogs can "hold it" overnight if it is. Davet?? Krandall??


They obviously have LESS control when they are very young, but even 4 week old puppie can " hold it" long enough to climb out of the whelping box into thier potty area. By the tine the Starborn pups are 8 weeks, Tom has video of them successfully and consistently getting to their litter boxes from across th "play porch".

I do think it's a developing skill... For the first couple of months, I never asked Kodi to hold it long enough to go from one room to another.


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## Lalla (Jul 30, 2013)

Ruthiec said:


> (and sorry Gibbs Mom and Dad for hijacking your thread)


Yes, sorry, too, Gibbs Mom and Dad for hijacking your thread - didn't mean to go off on a tangent.


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