# Allergies



## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

What a pain! In the last few days Bogart and Brando have been itching like crazy! Chewing their paws, scratching their sides, chewing their legs. It's getting out of hand. Bogart ended up chewing his rear paw almost raw. I had to take him to the vet the other day. Not much they can really do except give me some creame for his paw to help it heal. It's not fleas.

I have a cone on his head half the day to stop him from scratching himself. Brando isn't quite as bad as Bogart...yet.

It's really strange how this just started happening in the last week or two. I haven't introduced anything new to the home or to their food. To start ruling things out I washed them today (still scratching like crazy though), changed their food yesterda to a packaged one that has different ingredients and meat (it's a bison and vegi mix) so I'll try that for a week or two to see if there's any change. I really hope it's something in the food and not environmental. Environmental causes are so hard to figure out and rarely have a cure. 

I just feel so sorry for my guys. They look miserable over the last few days. This really comes across as a total shock as I've never had problems with either of them with anything and now both seem to have some type of allergy out of the blue.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

I sympathize with you, Daniel. It is really frustrating to work through allergy issues. It took several months for me to deal with Lincoln's allergies last year.

Anyway, the majority of allergies are environmentally based. I remember you said you rotate their diet so they get a variety of proteins, so I would be surprised if it were food related at this point. 

Good luck and keep us posted.


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## whitBmom (Nov 27, 2006)

Daniel, sorry to hear about your boys - how awful for them. Is it only Isolated to the bellies and legs? I am wondering if it's something environmental outside like ragweed, as it is at its peak right now. Poor hubby is miserable right now - August is the worse for him. I hope you find out what it is bothering your boys, so that they can find relief.


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

Daniel,
Fred and scudder had this about 2 years ago. They both woke up scatching in the middle of the night. It was like clockwork. One started and 5 minutes later the other one stated. I felt so bad for them. I gave them each a benadryl to stop the itching and took them to the vet. They ended up with a staff infection and were given antiobiotics. I really think it was something they came into contact with. They hiked in a nature preserve that day and were in high grass.

Scudder is going through some type of skin infection now. I was told it was a staff infection but the antiobiotics aren't helping. His belly and inner thighs are covered with scabs! I know how frustrating it can be. You may want to try the benadry just to give them relief.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Daniel, I am so sorry to hear about bogart and brando. The fact that it has happened to them both at once makes me think that it is something they got into, or something got into them. A few months ago, Cash got bit by something and his whole eye swelled up and then the other eye. We gave him 1/2 a benedryl (which made him crazy) and the swelling went down but then he has insanely itching himself. And then Jasper started insanely itching. So I thought perhaps they both got bit, but I didn't notice the initial swelling on Jas. The vet gave me this great leave in conditioner (1% hydrocortisone) that really halted the itching. I only used it twice and the itching never came back...

http://www.entirelypets.com/resleavcon8o.html

Perhaps try it and see if they get better before you drive yourself crazy with the food thing.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Hi Daniel, wondering if you would be interested in contacting Sabine at Better Dog Care. She is quite experienced with allergies? Quite reasonable as well.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

Sending Bogart and Brando healing hugs. I hope you can find the culprit and resolve it soon.


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

Aaawww, poor Bogart & Brando. It's so hard to not know what to do when they're miserable like that. One of the things the allergist mentions every time I'm there is to make sure to wipe them down completely with a wet rag every time they've been outside. Allergens enter their system through the skin. Can't say I've been able to be vigilant about it myself, but maybe it will help your guys.


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

With both of them starting to itch at the same time, it is probably not allergies. I would probably take my two to the vet if they starting itching at the same time like that.


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

I was at the vet but there wasn't much she could do. Bogart's paw was made worse the day before when his 100lb lab friend stepped on his sore paw. It swelled up because of that. So he's suffering because of the itching and because of the bruise from the lab.

I told the vet that I stopped with my food and moved to something totally different, but it's only been a day so it's really too soon to tell. Food allergies can stay in the system for weeks. But somehow I don't see it being food related. I also stopped with all treats and chews. My vet said to just monitor it now for a few day and see what happens.

This morning I washed them both thinking to get rid of any environmental allergens they may have come into contact with. All day long though they've been scratching more than ever. It got me thinking that I bought a new shampoo about a month ago and washed Bogart and Brando once with it, then again last week. It could be a coincidence but just in case it's the shampoo, I ran to the pet store and got a hypoallergenic shampoo. I already have an Oatmeal conditioner. So I washed them again very very thoroughly and then put on the conditioner for about 5 min. Over the last few hours, they seem a bit better but it could just be my wishful thinking. I put the cone on Bogart tonight and will take it off in the morning. Brando seems to be a bit better and is sleeping soundly.

The problem is really with Bogart. Because he's itchy and his toes are bruised, he keeps on wanting to lick his toes, which doesn't help. I tried putting a baby sock on but he just tried to chew right through it. I also tried a winter doggie paws but it doesn't breathe so it's not very good. I feel so bad putting the cone on him. He's sooo good, he just let's me and doesn't even try to take it off. Throughout the day when I'm home I leave it off and just watch him like a hawk and tell him "no" when I see he's thinking about licking or biting himself. If I have to leave for a few minutes, the cone goes on. 

Let's hope Saturday is a new day...


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## Drew"s Mom (Jul 29, 2009)

Poor babies. I hope you can find out what is causing them to itch.


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## Pixiesmom (Jul 31, 2008)

Poor guys. I hope that this will be very temporary and whatever caused it doesn't return again. Hang in there puppies and Daniel.


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## HavaBaloo (Mar 24, 2009)

With it affecting both so fast, it too makes me think that the shampoo is the problem. And if so, they that will be a quick and easy fix. Let us know how they feel this morning. Poor little guys.


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## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

Daniel, I am so sorry for Bogart and Brando, for something to affect both dogs at the same time is very strange. I washed with a new detergent once, my daughter and I itched like crazy, but not my DH and son. Sometime it is something very simple, most times not.

Both of my girls were scratching a few weeks ago. I line (!) bathed them because I could see nothing when I brushed other than a few tiny red spots. Both girls had a couple of fleas, I saw no flea dirt no indication until I wet them and went a few hairs at a time. I assume they picked them up at the park. Nothing since.

I really hope it is not your food as I am following your and Amanda’s lead with the raw and Nupro. Smarty is much better with the leg and foot itching. Her stools are not as consistent though, more loose on this than any other fed type.


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

I highly doubt it's the food. Last night I recalled that I had recently tried a new shampoo, so last night just before the pet store closed I ran and got a hypoallergenic shampoo and oatmeal conditioner. Washed them both. Then this morning I cleaned my place, washed the bed sheets and even bought a flea spray for the home. Today they seem a bit better but not 100% sure. I washed them again today but no shampoo just the oatmeal conditioner.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Good luck! I hope you're on the right track with the shampoo and flea spray. It only needs to be one flea bite to set them off if they're allergic and lots of small dogs are. Another idea is maybe they walked theough something at the dog park? Maybe they treated the lawn there?


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

If one flea did bite them and set off their allergies, how long do the symptoms stay? I mean they are on Sentinal tablets so the larvae won't grow. Since I don't see any fleas I'm assuming if it did bite them, it must have fallen off. Would I be able to even see the bites? Is there something I can put on their skin to stop the itching if it was a flea bite?

I washed them again today since I thought they did a bit better last night when I washed them. Unfortunately it didn't help at all today. It's been a rough day for Bogart. It really kills me to see him suffering. Brando seems to be doing pretty good. A little scratching here and there but not too bad.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

I don't know how long it would bother, but I would assume until it heals. Yes you should be able to see a bite. It would be red if they are reacting to it. Have you tried benedryl? It doesn't work for every dog, but I've had luck with it for Rufus for his seasonal allergies. I'll notice the itching has stopped in 20 minutes. He gets 1/2 an adult tab. They are 25 mg (I think) so that would be about 12.5 mg and he is between 15-16 pounds. If that doesn't work I know your vet should have something to stop the itching.


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## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

When I found the fleas on my girls, the bites were tiny red bumps. The bites were in the area of their vulva and on their sides. Once I killed the few on them I have not had any more scratching. I hope you find it is the shampoo that would be the easiest remedy. If it is the shampoo please let us know which one caused the problem.

When Smarty had her food allergies I would put a very small amount of Hydrocortisone “cream” on the worst areas and that really help with the itching. If you use this make sure you message it in good and I wiped excess out of the hair with a baby wipe. I have used this cream for years on my hands as I have all kinds of allergies that will break them out and the itching will drive you crazy.

Good luck and keep us posted.


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

good buddy said:


> I don't know how long it would bother, but I would assume until it heals. Yes you should be able to see a bite. It would be red if they are reacting to it. Have you tried benedryl? It doesn't work for every dog, but I've had luck with it for Rufus for his seasonal allergies. I'll notice the itching has stopped in 20 minutes. He gets 1/2 an adult tab. They are 25 mg (I think) so that would be about 12.5 mg and he is between 15-16 pounds. If that doesn't work I know your vet should have something to stop the itching.


Did you find that the Benedryl made Rofus sleepy? I don't mind if it makes Bogart sleep for a few hours but I don't want him sedated all day long. That wouldn't be much of a life. I gave Bogart a childs 12.5 mg tab this morning. He's sleeping now which is fine since both dogs usually fall asleep after breakfast.

I went to the Vet Clinic this morning. The vet was pretty sure that Bogart has developed seasonal allergies from where and how he's itching. Apparently dogs will lick, scratch or bite the tops of their paws and sides/groin and ears, when it's an airborne type allergen. Food allergies are usually on the face and neck and sometimes dogs will lick the bottom of the paws. The vet gave Bogart's skin the once over as well and said definitley no flea bites can be seen.

What's funny is about 10yrs ago I developed season allergies. That summer it started was the absolute worst summer of my life. This year is supposed to be really bad for allergy sufferers and yet this is the first summer I'm not feeling anything and didn't have to take my Reactine.

I think in the fall I am going to get Bogart and Brando test for allergens and then do the immunotherapy for them. I would rather do that then medicate them throughout the summer. Does anyone have any experience with immunotherapy? How often are the shots done, weekly or monthly?

I have read


> that the most suitable cases for immunotherapy are young dogs with little secondary pyoderma or associated flea allergy. The key to success with immunotherapy is an early diagnosis and early therapy once.
> 
> Dogs have a chronic recurrent secondary pyoderma or have had chronic glucocorticoid therapy (even if only intermittently) they do not appear to be as good candidates for immunotherapy.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

DanielBMe said:


> Did you find that the Benedryl made Rofus sleepy? I don't mind if it makes Bogart sleep for a few hours but I don't want him sedated all day long. That wouldn't be much of a life. I gave Bogart a childs 12.5 mg tab this morning. He's sleeping now which is fine since both dogs usually fall asleep after breakfast.


Rufus didn't seem to be excessively sleepy, but a little sleep is a good thing on those days when he wakes me up scratching. I know when he's itchy like that he can't be getting a good night rest anyways. You should make a note on when he started with the itchies and how bad were they. I did this last year and also kept a food diary to try and find the culprit. I never did find anything with the foods, but when Spring rolled around again this year, Rufus was right on time with the itchies so I knew it was a seasonal thing and also about how long it would last. He doesn't need the benedryl every day, so I save it for the days he's really itchy. Also more frequent baths and bed washes help to keep the pollens away from him. The nice part with allergies is they generally change over time!


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Jill in Mich has been going through extensive allergie testing with Tess and there's a thread around here somewhere where she's been really telling all about it. I believe Tess is receiving shots too.


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

good buddy said:


> Jill in Mich has been going through extensive allergie testing with Tess and there's a thread around here somewhere where she's been really telling all about it. I believe Tess is receiving shots too.


Thanks! I'll see if I can find it. I found the following thought you may be interested as an alternative to Benadryl.



> Chlorphenamine (INN) or chlorpheniramine (USAN, former BAN), commonly marketed as its salt chlorphenamine maleate (CPM; Chlor-Trimeton, Piriton, Chlor-Tripolon), is a first-generation alkylamine antihistamine used in the prevention of the symptoms of allergic conditions such as rhinitis and urticaria. Its sedative effects are relatively weak compared to other first-generation antihistamines. Chlorpheniramine is one of the most commonly-used antihistamines in small-animal veterinary practice as well.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Daniel, from that same incident Cash had the opposite reaction to benedryl like some children do...My extremely mellow dog became agitated and restless. He was running up and downstairs like a mad dog---jumping on our bed and tossing full size pillows around. and he was acting crazy like he was hearing things. The vet said to take him for a long walk that he was trying to blow off steam and that helped. I have never heard of chloratrimeton being suggested for dogs though... I would call your vet.

She gave a homeopathic remedy to try if he got another bite. I just looked for it and couldn't find the name... but it was labeled for bug bites...I will keep looking and post if I find it.

But you should see if you can get the resicort from Virbac. It really worked right away and using it once after a bath on damp fur was enough to let him get over what ever it was in his system. If your vet is open today I bet you can get it from them or maybe even a good pet store. I wouldn't want to use it regularly, but once or twice to halt a reaction. And it made them feel sumptuous and soft and silky to boot.

http://www.entirelypets.com/resleavcon8o.html

Good luck. Poor boys. belly rubs from Me and the boys.


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## Chasza (Dec 10, 2008)

Daniel,

If you keep giving the Benadryl, then it should be that the sleepy affect will wear off after awhile. I think their bodies get used to that sedative affect so that they aren't asleep all the time. Also, it might be better to give the liquid dosage -- just make sure there is no xylitol in it-- I try and find the bubblegum flavored b/c there are not food coloring in it (my girl says it taste awful, tho). The reason I think the liquid would be better is b/c with the capsule, you are giving the upper limits of the dosage amount, and you can give less with the liquid (but you can't split the capsules -- and don't try that, either, b/c the liquid in those capsules is super nasty tasting!!).

If the Benadryl is working, but making them too sleepy, then I would try giving it awhile longer while lessing the dosage with the liquid. If it's not working, then you can try either prescription Hydroxine or over the counter Chlor-Trimeton or Tavist. You must make sure these are PLAIN, and not decongestants. Do NOT get Tavist-D b/c that is the decongestant -- always get the plain varieties. Also, with the Tavist, make sure and get the original dosage amount of 1.34 mg (equivalent to 1 mg clemastine). Pay attention to dosages on medications as many times they will come out with a double strength version.

However, the dosage amounts on these drugs are different than what you would use with Benadryl. So, if you change either of these, please ask your vet how much to give based on weight. I have a chart my vet gave me, but I'm not entirely comfortable posting it since other dogs may have issues where one of these drugs should not be used with them, as an individual.

Lastly.....if you have a natural or green store around that sells homeopathics, then I suggest trying a couple of things. Both of the following are 'blends' and not individual therapies. One that helps my girl stop from biting bleeding sores into her skin is by Hylands and it is called "Hives". Another one to try is also by Hylands and is called "Seasonal Allergy Relief". You can use one, or both together. Do not touch them with your hands. Get an index card, or the non-glue corner part of an envelope and put one into the folded card or envelope. Then crush with a mallot. Then open their mouth and pour the crushed content into their mouth, trying to get them not to swallow right away. Give several times a day, away from food. The Hives one, in particular, seems to helps with the biting for my girl....but the allergy one might help with the cause. 

Lynn


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Another thing....if the Benadryl doesn't work, ask your vet for another antihistimine. My vet told me there are several they can try, and that they are all different. If you dog doesn't respond to one, he may respond to another. There isn't really a way to tell unless you try it.


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## Beamer (Jan 29, 2007)

Daniel,

I'm just seeing this now for the first time. How are they doing today? Maybe they just miss Beamer is all? hmmmmmmmmm

Ryan


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

Hey Ryan,

I moved this discussion to the Allgergies, Allergies, Allergies thread. Take a look.


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## abuelashavanese (Mar 26, 2007)

I have 5 havanese all in full coat. Yes, MHS hit me big time! We had the same problem here. Everyone started scratching and it wouldn't stop. This went on for about two weeks and I couldn't figure out what was causing it. There were no fleas. I home cook for them and nothing was changed in their diet prior to this episode. The scratching was non-stop, and with five of them, I had to do something. 

I consulted with our vet and he suggested using an oatmeal shampoo and conditioner made by VET Solution. I also started them on 3V fish oil (liquid form). After about 7 days on the fish oil, their scratching stopped. Their coats seems stronger and less dry which also helps with less mats. I don't know if this was the solution or if it was due to a season change. We have had no scratching for about 6 weeks now.... 

I hope this will help other havs with the scratching. I know me and my crew are alot happier now


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## Perugina (May 28, 2008)

abuelashavanese said:


> I have 5 havanese all in full coat. Yes, MHS hit me big time! We had the same problem here. Everyone started scratching and it wouldn't stop. This went on for about two weeks and I couldn't figure out what was causing it. There were no fleas. I home cook for them and nothing was changed in their diet prior to this episode. The scratching was non-stop, and with five of them, I had to do something.
> 
> I consulted with our vet and he suggested using an oatmeal shampoo and conditioner made by VET Solution. I also started them on 3V fish oil (liquid form). After about 7 days on the fish oil, their scratching stopped. Their coats seems stronger and less dry which also helps with less mats. I don't know if this was the solution or if it was due to a season change. We have had no scratching for about 6 weeks now....
> 
> I hope this will help other havs with the scratching. I know me and my crew are alot happier now


What fish oil product do you use?


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