# Urinary tract infection or something else??



## Gabby (Jul 20, 2008)

I am hoping someone has some advice so that I can stop worrying that it is something more serious. I thought Caya had a urinary tract infection (trouble urinating, constant licking) and when we noticed that she was spotting blood, we took her to the vet immediately. She is only a 1 1/2 years old and was spayed when she was 6 months old. The vet took a urine sample and put her on antibiotics. The vet called me yesterday (it has been a few days since we took her in) and told me that the culture for bacteria came back negative but there was a large amount of blood in her urine. He said that this "puzzled" him because she seemed too young for bladder stones or cancer. We will be taking her back in for an x-ray this next week. She has no other symptoms and is eating, drinking, playing, and otherwise a normal dog. Has anyone experienced this with their Hav or know what might be wrong with her?


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

She is not too young for bladder stones, one of my dogs had stones at 16 months old-
I would def have an xray or ultrasound done asap- did the vet say if she had crystals in her urine?


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## Gabby (Jul 20, 2008)

He didn't say, and of course, I didn't know to ask. We are bringing her in on Monday for the x-ray.


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## Chasza (Dec 10, 2008)

Gayle,

If they were struvite crystals, and he thinks this is what has caused a stone (if this does turn out to be the case), then he will likely prescribe more antibiotics. Struvite stones are caused by infection and to clear the infection up requires antibiotics.

However, since the culture came back negative, it makes it unlikely this to be the case......*Except * that sometime a free catch culture won't show anything when there really is an infection there. Sometimes a guided C&S has to be done. This happened with my boy. Free catches on him showed no bacteria, but there was an infection there. A guided C&S is where they use ultrasound and with the ultrasound, it helps them guide a needle directly into the bladder and they take a sample this way. I made sure my dog drank fluids well in advance and would carry him in so he wouldn't pee before getting this procedure done. (I was told they could add saline to the bladder if it wasn't full enough, but I didn't like that idea and didn't trust it not to dilute the sample more). So, my boy did have an infection that only showed up by culturing a sample retrieved directly from the bladder (whereas it did not show from a free catch) Can't explain why this is, but it does happen.

So, if the struvites were crystal, then doing a guided C&S (cultrue and sensitivity) and getting the urine directly from the bladder should show the type of infection and then also which antibiotics to use. You have to repeat this procedure a few weeks after stopping the antibiotics to make sure the infection is all gone.. Again, I can't explain why this is sometimes necessary, but it can happen this way.

IF the crystals were oxalate and that has caused an oxalate stone, then we're talking a whole 'nother ballgame. Oxalate stones are formed b/c of the body's inability to properly digest oxalate containing foods. IF this be the case, then I recommend joining K9KidneyDiet yahoo group and strictly follow their guidelines for the FuzzerFood diet. Introduce yourself and they can walk you thru stuff. It is a diet to be followed for life, but is apparently very effective. This is only necessary if the stone was oxalate. From what I have read, using prescription food is ineffective for this purpose.

Lastly, about my boy. He did have blood in his urine, but no stones. His blood was from the infection (again, only found from a urine sample taken directly from the bladder, and not found by free catch). So, it is possible that there are not any stones involved.

Oh, I re-read and it was someone else who mentioned crystals. It's late, and I didn't catch that early on. Still, it could just be an infection, or there could be a stone there. We didn't do x-rays, we did an ultrasound to look for stones. When a stone was not found in the bladder (not one in the shaft, either, since he is a male), then we did the needle draw from the bladder. Some vets don't use a guided needle to draw urine......but my comfort zone wouldn't allow it to be done without using an ultrasound and having it done by someone comfortable with doing the procedure that does it regularly enough. To me, it was a big deal puting a needle into a bladder and not missing. I wasn't comfortable with it at all, but am more comfortable with it now that it has been done twice (by vets that I trusted).

Lynn


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

ps- yes my boys urine draws were all done by needle too- and now the poor guy hates to be put up on tables, so that ended his show career....I think he had needle urine draws 6 times total- poor guy!


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## Gabby (Jul 20, 2008)

Wow thank you for all the information. I now feel like I can go back to the vet armed with great questions. Caya is probably not going to be too happy to go back after the needle poking last time. 

Katie--did yours have to have surgery?


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

Yes, I had two of my dogs have stone removal surgery within three weeks of each other. I am fully confident it was the food that I had switched them too-as I had a third dog get the crystals at the same time, but we caught it in time that she never got the stones. I was feeding Canidae.


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

MopTop Havanese said:


> Yes, I had two of my dogs have stone removal surgery within three weeks of each other. I am fully confident it was the food that I had switched them too-as I had a third dog get the crystals at the same time, but we caught it in time that she never got the stones. I was feeding Canidae.


What would be making a dog have stones with Canidae? Just curious....


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

I had 3 of my dogs get sick within 2 month of switching them to this food. Nothing else had changed. No new treats/chews/bones/bowls etc. The three dogs are unrelated, and different ages. It was all too much of a coinsidense (sp?) PLUS my other two dogs, that were nursing puppies and NOT eating Canidae did NOT get crystals or stones----


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## Gabby (Jul 20, 2008)

I was reading online that too much protein in food can cause a low ph in urine which, in turn, could cause stones. I am feeding Caya Orijen, which I know is a great food. I guess I should wait for the x-ray results before I switch anything. Thanks again for all the information.


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## rdanielle (Sep 2, 2008)

I don't think that Orijen would cause it... My Havs both have oxalate bladder stones & we actually switched them from prescription food to Orijen. They were always having crystal formations on the prescription food. They've been on Orijen since Nov '08 & haven't had any issues with either crystals or stones. Wysong has two holistic pH balancing formulas one for struvite (pH -) & oxalate (ph +).


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