# Should we push Cash?



## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

I posted this in Paige's thread on Preston's legs...but I really wanted your opinions on whether we should push (or pull actually) Cash on longer walks or not. Here's the situation: 

Those of you that have met him know he is lumbering giant of a Hav. He is loooong and short-- His front legs are much shorter than his back legs. His front legs are bowed... one more than the other. When he walks he lumbers... But when he is playing and running he is quite graceful...It's sort of that bunny hop thing that happens with the shorter front legs...he also has has a huge chest that makes him quite front heavy. As many of you know he also struggles with weight but is now down to a reasonable weight. Ok- so that is his anatomy. 

Cash hates to go for a walk on a leash...and when we do he will pull to walk on the grass instead of the harder side walk or street. He never seems to be in pain...no whimpering or limping...But he just drags with his tail down. Just today, I went to the park with them. This was their 2nd park walk today as DH takes them every morning for 1-2 miles. I had not even gone a 1/2 mile when he really started dragging and then just stopped. We rested for a while and continued at a slower pace... lumbering along, the words "we're going home" as encouragement. But he will play and jump and RLH in the yard. He just hates walking. 

So finally I get to the question... Should we keep taking him on these long walks even if he seems to be dragging? Should we discourage jumping/playing even though he seems to have no trouble with that? I suspect it is just his anatomy that makes walking as opposed to jumping/running more awkward for him. I do plan on asking my vet next time we go but I just thought I would throw it out see what you all think. 

Thanks for weighing in.


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

If he doesn't get upset if you leave him at home when you walk Jasper, I would let him skip the walks.
Carole


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

You can always take a dog stroller along and when he tires out, let him ride in the stroller. I think that's what Paige was doing for Preston. That way he still gets to smell all the smells and meet the people and you can walk him as far as he's comfortable.


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## Chasza (Dec 10, 2008)

I'm wondering if the harder surfaces might cause more pain to the leg that is bowed more than the other? Does he like you to throw a ball for him in the yard? I don't yet have a havanese, but just going on what you said, I think I would skip the walks. I think I might try again in colder weather (as dogs just like the cooler temps), and I think I might try shorter walks only two or three times a week and see how he reacts.

My thinking is if you only go once or twice a week, for short walks, and he seems happy, then I think that might indicate that he really is having a physical problem with the walks. I think I would wait at least a week, maybe longer, before trying again to rest his legs, in case they are hurting any at all. If he is still avoiding the pavement, and unhappy, and he can keep the weight off without it, then I tend to think skipping the walks would be better. I am wondering if he would play at a park if he was not walked there? If so, I would try getting him there by car or stroller, if you were close. That way he does get out of the house occasionally, if it were to mean alot to him, and if it were part of your regular routine. It doesn't sound like he is happy with the walks. I think the big question here is if he is not happy b/c of pain, or b/c walking is just 'work'.

Lynn


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## Beamer (Jan 29, 2007)

Missy,

If you stop walking him, how would he ge his exercise? How long has he been acting this way for? For some time or is it brand new??

Ryan


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

I say let Cash skip the walks and stick with his playing and RLHs.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Missy- do you have wet photos of his legs you can post? I really think this bowed leg thing and Havanese has been pushed way way too far. MANY dogs have curved legs and live long happy lives and go for walks too. If you really are that concerned, I would take him to the vet and have him xrayed. I would also be concerned not walking him would cause it to be harder for him later on. I know with a lot of dogs and different ailments- joints, patellas, etc. They say the best thing you can do for them is take them for daily walks.

My Dora doesn't really like walking. She never has. She likes going at her own pace and sniffing so we take the stroller but I make her walk some. She NEVER likes walking connected to Dash or Belle as they pull and she is stubborn. But I have taken toys and treats. She is never as excited as they are but I think a lot of it is her personality.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Ryan, you hit my dilemma right on the nose. He does need the exercise. His dislike for walks is not new...but it seems to have intensified. It could be that I am now trying to walk as well, so many days the boys get two walks or more. Most nights I do living room agility and tricks with the boys... I have Cash running up and down stairs chasing balls, jumping on chairs, rolling over, dancing, all of which he loves (because there are tiny treats involved.) And we do it for about 20 minutes so he does get a workout. But now I am wondering if this is also not so good on his little legs. 

Carole, I do think he would hate it if Jasper got a walk but he didn't. They are very competitive.

Amanda, I agree that the bowed legs have been pushed too far. My vet is also of the opinion don't go looking for problems. I just don't want to make it worse. I will take soaped pictures next bath day. His right leg is a bit deformed...He can give me his left paw. But can only lift his right paw about half way. 

I really appreciate everyone's input. keep the thoughts coming. 

Perhaps, DH and I can split up the walks...He and Jasper can go on the power walks at the park... and Cash and I can stroll the neighborhood that way they each get one on one time.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

That's a hard one, Missy. I think my inclination would be to let him walk as much as he's comfortable with, and then put him in a stroller the rest of the way (or take him home and let Jasper have a longer walk). If it were me, I'd hate to find out later that he was in some sort of pain or had discomfort and I'd made him continue walking  To make up for less exercise, the RLHs in the yard sound great, or fetch if he'll do that. 

Let us know what your vet advises! :hug: to you and yours!


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## whitBmom (Nov 27, 2006)

Missy, I think seeing if there is a medical reason to reduce or modify the walk would be good, if you feel you need that to put your mind at ease. Although I haven't been here as often as in the past, I do think this straight leg vs bowed leg issue is way overrated. If it does not cause him any pain, and you know for a fact it is not his favourite thing to do, then use your discretion and take him on walks as you see fit. Also keeping in mind that if whatever discomfort you may be feeling is something he will most definitely pick up through the leash. Follow your gut and with the advise of a vet, I am sure you can help Cash have a healthy balance of exercise to keep him strong and happy.

And like Cash, I too hate long walks or exercise  But that is a whole other thread.  Hugs to you Missy, and I hope you get the answers you need, and keep in mind that Cash and Jasper are so lucky to have you as their Mommy.


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Missy, I think he's definitely trying to tell you something. My initial reaction was to skip the walks. He is suffering in some way and I wouldn't push it. However, I love the idea of letting him walk as far as he is comfortable doing and then let him ride the rest of the way.


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

pjewel said:


> Missy, I think he's definitely trying to tell you something. My initial reaction was to skip the walks. He is suffering in some way and I wouldn't push it. However, I love the idea of letting him walk as far as he is comfortable doing and then let him ride the rest of the way.


I agree with Geri, the only thing I would add to this is a think I might take Cash to the vet and have him checked out. If he is trying to tell you something is wrong, the vet can help you figure it out and maybe there is some treatment for it.

On our walks, Casper would never go for the stroller, but Missy would in a minute.


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## Scooter's Family (May 23, 2008)

My inclination would be not to push him into longer walks if he's unhappy. We don't do very long walks but have some crazy RLH time in the backyard where they can run, chase, jump around, and play but stop when they're tired. Any exercise is good in my opinion, maybe he just doesn't like the walks much. I would mention it to the vet though. I love the RLH time anyway, so much fun to watch!


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## Paige (Sep 12, 2006)

Missy, I have wondered the same thing myself. Do I take Preston for walks or am I hurting him by doing so. Preston will follow me around crying/begging as soon as he sees me get out their collars. So, I have no choice but to take him. He has walked up to 3 miles with no problem, but usually is done after 1 mile. I don't take the boys on daily walks, they do however, play outside everyday. I feel like he knows what is best for him, so I listen. He has laid down while walking, like you said Cash does and when that happens, DH will carry him the rest of the way. I would listen to Cash, I don't think that walking on hard surfaces everyday would be good for Preston. He could handle 1/2-1 mile a day, but I wouldn't do much more than that. He will RLH in the backyard with the others, but he knows when he has had enough. I would talk to your vet and get his opinion. I feel like dogs have good instincts so I let Preston tell me what he can handle. I do take them to the soccer park for socialization and they all love that. Maybe you could drive to the park and let Cash have his social time, without the longer walk.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Wow, so nice to hear from you Helen and Paige and Lynn. I miss all of you on the forum as I am not great on tracking people on FB (if you don't come up on my home page I don't have a clue what you are up to) 

I think you all have convinced me to take Cash to the vet. She is really great at helping me work through things. Not sure I will do x-rays, I learned the hard way that tests can be an expensive way to get no answers. The complicated thing in Cash's case is that he is overweight (I was hoping we could help get each other in shape.) and he does need daily exercise. I guess one question would be if DH didn't take them for a long walk each morning would he RLH more? It is so funny how dogs do come to resemble their owners... Cash is truly my dog... Jasper is DH's. LOL...Both my Husband and Jasper have lost 2 sizes since walking (and I didn't think they had to) ...Cash and I struggle along. But I think as Michael has gotten more fit he may be walking faster and longer which Jas just loves but may be too much for Cash. 

Helen, I have actually been enjoying these walks so I don't think Cash is feeling my distress (may be a different story when it gets cold.) 

We do drive to the park and then walk 1-2 miles. Unfortunately it is not a fenced dog park so they can't be off leash. But I don't worry about socialization...I take them everywhere I can...pet stores, garden shops, friends houses, and they meet the neighborhood dogs when we just go around here. 

Thank you all for weighing in...I am trying to tame my urge to take them to the vet for every little thing but this may be one to check in with.


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

Missy, if you're considering a stroller, something to keep in mind.... if you and your husband are walking together, a stroller is a great idea. If it's you by yourself, a stroller and two dogs is rough. The 8 weeks of Cody's recovery was really tough and much of that because I still took Cody with me on our walks, in the stroller. When both dogs are walking you are dragging the stroller along (I found dragging easier then pushing - but it killed my back) and if they want to go investigate something, or you have to pick up poop, you just don't have enough hands. When riding in the stroller Cody preferred the screen not to be zipped up so he could lay with his head and paws hanging off the front but if a dog walked by he'd go nuts and I had to make sure he didn't jump out, while controlling Tess. If I zipped up the screen Cody would spin in circles when a dog would pass, which I couldn't allow because of his knee. My arms and shoulders were sore from trying to control the stroller with Cody in it with one hand and handle Tess walking in the other hand, without running over Tess, not dumping Cody at curbs, bumps in the sidewalk, etc.

Besides that, it worked great.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Paige, It's nice to hear from you! 

Missy, I would think that running up and down (especially down) stairs wou be much harder on Cash's legs than a flat walk. If you're trying to use the extra excercise to take some wieght off, I think I would avoid so many treats at home and try a squeeky toy or something else to motivate him.


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## Paige (Sep 12, 2006)

Missy, I think it would help ease your mind if you took him to the vet. Preston has had x-rays, but vet's aren't as expensvie here, I think it was about $50 for both front legs. I have the opposite problem, Preston is too thin in my opinion. I always had trouble getting him to eat anything. But thankfully that has changed and he eats his meal everyday. I would cut back on treats, I only give them at grooming time. Maybe a short walk everyday will work for both you & Cash.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I think Cash is due for a full physical. I would ask for all his joints to be checked (hip, shoulders, elbows, patellas). The dropped tail could be a sign of his lack of pleasure or it could be a sign of pain, especially if he carries it upward the rest of the time at home. Now if he's a natural tail dropper, ignore the last sentence.

I'd skip taking him on walks or keep them short. It doesn't sound like it's something he enjoys and it doesn't sound necessary if he can exercise in the yard and in the house and enjoys it at home.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

I just have to clarify that Cash's treats are worked into his weight loss plan...LOL. He gets a total of 25 calories a day of treats. I break them up into 1/4" size flat pieces that I dole out through the day for grooming, coming in, and exercise... remember Cash is very food motivated. Once he is jazzed up from doing tricks for treats I can get him to chase a ball... 

Jill I know I could not handle a stroller...(why do you think I didn't have kids...LOL) 

Kimberly, thank you for weighing in I so respect your opinion. He did have a complete set of X-rays-- when he was so sick and lame a when he was about a year and half (he will be 3 in november.) They were done at a specialty vets-- so maybe I can get them transferred to my vet (not just the report) so we can discuss more specifically. Oh and yes, Cash does have a lazy tail. It is up when he plays or wants something...but if he is just hangin...so is his tail... He is such an imperfect specimen of a Neezer and I could not love him more.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Okay, ignore the tail comments then.  My Martha had a lazy tail. She dropped it all the time unless she was in her perky moods, which did happen quite a bit.

Good idea to transfer the films.


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## whitBmom (Nov 27, 2006)

Missy, it is nice to be back. And with the time I have been away I have missed a great deal, so forgive my ignorance as I try to catch up on everything. I would try to rule out if he is feeling pain - poor little guy. And I also did not realize the great point about sidewalks being way harder than grass or softer paths (runners are always advised to avoid sidewalks as concrete is very bad for the joints - very plausible that it might be a bit harder on him). I really hope that the vet can guide you as to what is the best approach to take so as to find a balance to help Cash get healthy and enjoy it as he is doing it. (((Hugs)))


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Just thought I would update you guys... Finally took Cash to see our Vet. She pretty much gave the same advice you all gave. Let him walk on the grass, don't push him too much, perhaps if possible take more frequent shorter walks. She said hills are good for building up other muscles that could help support his joints but that to zig zag on down hills so that it relieves the pounding. She did not feel anything that made her think x-rays were in order and in fact his legs felt better than Jasper's. All that being said he has been better and has not gained any weight since we've laid off the power walks with him.


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