# Advice In Buying New Puppy



## MBornadams (Aug 31, 2011)

Hello All!

This is such a wonderful and supportive forum..I'm glad to be a member, as we venture/research out to add a new Hav pup to our family.

Please post any advice on how to go about it. I've research the Internet of various local breeders, etc...

What is the going rate for a new pup? Does it matter what the Mom and Dad's background are? If the pricing is low...does that mean they're from a Puppy Mill?

Is it best to visit the breeder and the way the pups/parents live? How often should breeders breed their dogs for sale?

What are the very basic supplies, (i.e., crate, bedding, etc..) that we need prior to bringing a pup home? Do we need a fence (is an electric one bad or OK?).

Does this site allow people to post suggested breeders? Is it good to get a pup from people who breed their dogs for a hobby?

If there are any websites you suggest, please send them as well.

Sorry for all the questions...We don't want to make a mistake and want to make sure we do our homework before we bring home our new pup.


Take care and have a great day!

~~MM!!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Before You Get Your Puppy by Ian Dunbar http://www.siriuspup.com/pdfs/before_puppy_sirius.pdf

After You Get Your Puppy by Ian Dunbar http://www.dogstardaily.com/files/AFTER You Get Your Puppy.pdf

Finding a Breeder http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/how-select-good-breeder

Finding a breeder http://www.apbc.org.uk/articles/good_breeder


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## Becky Chittenden (Feb 4, 2009)

Price shoul be $1500 up. Make sure the parents are health tested clear (check www.offa for chic and make sure they passed all tests). If you can, visit the breeder. I don't think here you can refer breeders, but the Havanese Club of America can (HCA.org) breeder referral. The HCA website has a wealth of information. Hope you find the dog of your dreams


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

MBornadams said:


> Hello All!
> 
> This is such a wonderful and supportive forum..I'm glad to be a member, as we venture/research out to add a new Hav pup to our family.
> 
> Please post any advice on how to go about it. I've research the Internet of various local breeders, etc...


The best breeders are generally NOT going to be advertising on the internet, or on classified ads. Yea, I know I shouldn't talk - I found my Ceylon on an online classified ad and bought him from a hobby breeder (NOT a backyard breeder, but still, hobby breeders are not as good as really good breeders), but that's another story - I am very, very happy with Cey lol (and, I didn't really know better at the time).

There are some havanese clubs that have registered breeders lists. You might be able to find a quality breeder in your area from there, or, somebody here or elsewhere might have a recommendation for you to check out.



MBornadams said:


> What is the going rate for a new pup? Does it matter what the Mom and Dad's background are? If the pricing is low...does that mean they're from a Puppy Mill?


Not sure what the 'going' rate is for a decent hav puppy, brought up right and whose parents are well taken care of and health tested, but I would guess its somewhere between 1 and 2 grand. And yes, it TOTALLY matters what the parent's backgrounds are. Good breeders have (I believe) at least 3 generation's worth of testing results as well as usually Championship status that they can prove to you.

A good quality breeder will, as stated above, charge more than a hobby breeder, and a hobby breeder will charge more than a backyard breeder (or, puppy mill). Isn't it funny that good breeders, and yes even hobby breeders (if they really care about their dogs) make less, and often take a loss, when selling their puppies, whereas a puppy mill or backyard breeder is breeding to make a profit??? 



MBornadams said:


> Is it best to visit the breeder and the way the pups/parents live? How often should breeders breed their dogs for sale?


IMO, you should ALWAYS visit the breeder, and see the parents and the puppies in their natural environment, before you decide. Although I bought Ceylon from a hobby breeder, I was insistent on that point. Puppies that are neglected and/or not socialized and cared for from the start (which is the main thing that to me separates a hobby breeder from a backyard breeder - not trying to start any sort of argument here about hobby breeders vs. backyard breeders, just stating what 'my' personal distinction between the two are) will usually have issues for often the rest of their lives. And you just can't KNOW what goes on, until you see and meet the parents and the puppies. And that means evaluating the parents and puppies, and not just the environment that the breeder shows you. Are the puppies fearful? The parents? Are the puppies acting scared, instead of curious? Even if the breeder is 'showing' you the puppies inside their own house in an expen, if the puppies are overly scared instead of cautiously curious, that can mean that the breeder just brought them in for the showing. Most puppies old enough to be sold will be cautious but still curious, and, playful among themselves. Just things to look for when you visit 



MBornadams said:


> What are the very basic supplies, (i.e., crate, bedding, etc..) that we need prior to bringing a pup home? Do we need a fence (is an electric one bad or OK?).


There's lots of advice on this forum about what supplies you need - if you search for it, you will find tons of good advice. Again just my opinion, but at the very, very least, you will need a good wire crate (with a soft blanket to put at the bottom and a towel or something to drape on the top), food bowls (some people recommend using a water bottle instead of a water bowl), either an expen sort of structure or a baby gate to keep your pup contained in an area where you can easily clean up messes (at least at first), a harness and leash, and some good toys (but don't worry - once you get a hav puppy, you are going to be buying him or her toys on a regular basis for the rest of their lives LOL!). There's plenty more supplies that you might need later (shampoo, conditioner, nail clippers, shears, combs, brushes, treats, kongs or something similar for a really good treat for if and when you have to leave them alone, pee pads, bells for the door for housetraining, coats and doggie clothes for if its cold out, doggie car seat for in the car, etc. etc. etc.) but nothing that is worth worrying about now - if and when you need anything else, you will realize it, and will be able to ask for recommendations 

Havanese dogs are very delicate, sensitive dogs. I would never, ever use any sort of shocking device on them, including an electronic fence. EVER. If you have a yard that isn't fenced in, then only let them out on a leash, supervised.



MBornadams said:


> Does this site allow people to post suggested breeders? Is it good to get a pup from people who breed their dogs for a hobby?


As much I think that Ceylon is the best dog in the world, even I cannot recommend that anybody buy their pup from a hobby breeder, now that I know what I know. Do I think it would be the worst decision in the world? -Not necessarily. It would depend on who the hobby breeder was, how well they took care of their dogs, what amount of testing they did, how they raised their puppies, etc. Just my opinion; I still would not recommend it.



MBornadams said:


> If there are any websites you suggest, please send them as well.
> 
> Sorry for all the questions...We don't want to make a mistake and want to make sure we do our homework before we bring home our new pup.
> 
> ...


I'm (relatively) new here myself, but, welcome! You are doing the best thing possible, by asking questions and doing research before you get your puppy.


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## MBornadams (Aug 31, 2011)

OMGoodness! Thank you ALL for taking your time to help me make a good decision for our family and new pup to be . 

I ordered my crate today- -yeah! I am looking for a 24" x 17" crate bed, and seem to be having a hard time finding this size made with microban and cedar chips....any suggestions?!


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

cedar chips??


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

TilliesMom said:


> cedar chips??


Me too... what are the cedar chips for?


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## MBornadams (Aug 31, 2011)

I've read that in some bedding they can put cedar chips into it to help the bedding stay fresher, and possibly keep fleas and ticks away? Who knows...I like the idea to help keeping the bedding fresher though


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

As far as I know, puppies prefer fleece-type blankets, not wood chips, to sleep in  And, you can always just use food-grade diatomaceous earth to keep the nasty bugs away


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

MBornadams said:


> I've read that in some bedding they can put cedar chips into it to help the bedding stay fresher, and possibly keep fleas and ticks away? Who knows...I like the idea to help keeping the bedding fresher though


You will have a little puppy who will need his bedding changed often. Even with an adult dog, I change Kodi's bedding at least weekly. Get fiber stuffed pads, (or with a small puppy, just some old towels folded up!) so that you can throw them in the washer regularly. You'll be washing your Hav regularly, and I would never put a clean Hav to bed on a dirty pad!

I would be VERY worried about either chemicals or cedar chips in bedding that a young puppy could chew on. (and Havs have little to no odor if they are kept clean, so there is no reason for their bedding to smell). Ialso know that the use of cedar is not recommended for most other animals as it can cause respiratory problems. I wouldn't use it with my Hav either.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

heatherk said:


> As far as I know, puppies prefer fleece-type blankets, not wood chips, to sleep in  And, you can always just use food-grade diatomaceous earth to keep the nasty bugs away


Oh yes! You can just buy fleece from any fabric store, fold it up and use that. Buy remnants and it's REALLY cheap. There is no reason not to have enough beds that none of them EVER need to be used smelly or dirty!


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## MBornadams (Aug 31, 2011)

OMGoodness...Thank you ALL for your great advice...I guess I forgot that we have to treat pups like our babies (children)....Now, you've saved me from trying to find this type of mattress/bedding with a cedar lining.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

HI and :welcome: to the forum!! I can see you have a lot of wonderful and advice and tips  Can't wait to see your new baby!

They are like children and the breed is just so special that you can't help spoil them 

Kara


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## marco (Aug 31, 2011)

davetgabby said:


> Before You Get Your Puppy by Ian Dunbar http://www.siriuspup.com/pdfs/before_puppy_sirius.pdf
> 
> After You Get Your Puppy by Ian Dunbar http://www.dogstardaily.com/files/AFTER You Get Your Puppy.pdf


Another newbie here trying to soak up as much knowledge as possible from you helpful folks before we bring our puppy home in a couple of weeks. Tons of great info here for sure.

I just had a look at these (above) two publications posted by davetgabby. In them is a very clear and consise training approach, especially for the early stages including from Day 1 on. It seems very straightforward and logical. My question is would most of you advocate following the system to the letter, or are there some changes or modifications we should condsider?

I have been doing a lot of reading lately and jotting down many notes, but now find some of the info I have compiled at least partially conflicting. It would be great to have a clear, well laid out plan that covers all the important bases that we could just follow with a clear conscience and not have to do any second guessing.

Oh yeah, here is shot of our little guy to be (taken by his very loving breeder).


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

marco said:


> Another newbie here trying to soak up as much knowledge as possible from you helpful folks before we bring our puppy home in a couple of weeks. Tons of great info here for sure.
> 
> I just had a look at these (above) two publications posted by davetgabby. In them is a very clear and consise training approach, especially for the early stages including from Day 1 on. It seems very straightforward and logical. My question is would most of you advocate following the system to the letter, or are there some changes or modifications we should condsider?
> 
> ...


Now THAT is one of the cutest puppy pix I've seen! Congratulations!

I read all sorts of books, including Ian Dunbar's and tried to take what made sense ro me, and for our situation, from all of them. For instance, Dr. Dunbar's advice on potty traini may be perfect for someone who lives in a warm climate and want to ONLY train their puppy to go outside. But I live in an area with cold, snowy winters, and I was also purchasing a puppy from a breeder who puts a tremendous amount of work potty training their puppies to a litter box. It made no sense to me to take a puppy who was already well started in his training, and try to change things in the middle. So, with occasional advice from his breeder, Kodi has always had a litter box available, and we continued with that system. Kodi, as is true for most dogs, "learned" to go outside on his own, and by the time he was a few months old went outdoors preferentially, only using the litter box if outdoors wasn't an option.

Another of Dr. dunbar's ideas is to feed the puppy entirely from a Kong or as training treats. This didn't work for us, because Kodi had absolutely no interest in a Kong... Wouldn't touch it until he was MUCH older. (then he started chewing them up,so they STILL weren't a good option!ound:

I think the important thing is to understand the BASICS of what these methods ALL are saying. That is, that in terms of potty training, it is YOUR responsibility to make the puppy successful. That means close confinement when the puppy can't be watched like a hawk every second. (like don't take your EYES off them!!!) the idea behind the Kong is that a busy puppy is a puppy who will stay out of trouble, and a Kong helps the puppy learn what are appropriate to chew on, and what things aren't. But if Kongs don't work for your puppy, you can be creative, and teach them in other ways.

All the above is to say that as nice as it would be if there was one "definitive" handbook that would work perfectly for everyone and every puppy, it's not that easy. Every puppy is different, and every family is different. There are lots of ways to a well trained puppy.

Probably the BEST thing you can do is enroll your pup in a puppy kindergarten class with a good positive based trainer. And if you have questions, poke around the archives here... It's unlikely someone hasn't asked it before. If you're still having trouble, just ask! There are lots of friendly people available to help!


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## MBornadams (Aug 31, 2011)

marco said:


> Another newbie here trying to soak up as much knowledge as possible from you helpful folks before we bring our puppy home in a couple of weeks. Tons of great info here for sure.
> 
> I just had a look at these (above) two publications posted by davetgabby. In them is a very clear and consise training approach, especially for the early stages including from Day 1 on. It seems very straightforward and logical. My question is would most of you advocate following the system to the letter, or are there some changes or modifications we should condsider?
> 
> ...


Congratulations! What a cute puppy!

I'm still looking for a reputable breeder in Northern VA or MD suburbs...any advice?! You're a little bit ahead of the game then we are...when do you get to bring him home? So adorable!!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

These two books are general guidelines. The closer you follow the basics the better. I like the housetraining method. It worked for me. Molly was reliable at four months. When you deviate from your plan , that's when things go astray. Everyone has different situations. But know AHEAD what you're going to do. Once you have the dog, it's too late to learn on the fly. Use a lot of the food for training at least. Nothing is free. If you do put some in a bowl ,get a sit first type thing. Glad you're reading , now's the time to learn , not when you get your puppy. Enjoy, what a great picture.


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## marco (Aug 31, 2011)

Thanks for the feedback Karen and Dave. Your comments make perfect sense ... use the books as guidelines but make modifications to fit our situation as necessary. I'll probably have a few questions as certain situations arise, but you're probably right Karen, that most things have already been asked so I'll try to find existing aswers first.

MBornadams, we bring Marco home in about 2 weeks. Actually, he has a very adorable sister still looking for a home but that likely won't help you as we are pretty much on the other side of the continent in BC, Canada.


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

Welcome to you and Marco! You must be getting pretty excited with only two weeks to go! Karen is right about choosing the training method for your personal situation. We live in SE GA so have trained to go outside right from the beginning. Our little guy, McGee is *almost* reliable now at seven months - not as smart as Dave's Molly!!!

Good luck with your new little guy and enjoy him. The first couple of months are pretty exhausting but when you get through it you will admit that it was worth it!


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