# Puppies and Children



## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

Hello, I am new here. I am so excited to have found this forum. I have already done a lot of reading, and am finding it very helpful.

I am wondering if anyone here has raised a puppy along with having young children. I have a daughter, (with allergies) that is 5 and a son that is 2.

When I started researching allergy/kid friendly dogs, I came across this breed. I thought a poodle may have been our only option. When I was a child, we had a miniature chocolate poodle. She was a wonderful pet. (In fact, I was 5 and my brother was 2 when we got her as a pup!)

I have trained dogs before, but never with young children! I have been researching a lot, and I understand all interaction between the dog and children will need to be supervised. I understand that it is also very important for all experiences to be positive between them, especially early on. Also, the need to protect the pup from the kids.

Has anyone here raised puppies with young ones? Do you have any other advice for me? I may start looking for a puppy as early as this spring/summer.

Thank you,
Skye


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## Pixiesmom (Jul 31, 2008)

Welcome to the forum-what fun you're in for!! My immediate concern would be supervision between a puppy and a toddler, but you've already covered that. It seems like you know what needs to be done really. My 2 cents is that you look for an experienced breeder who health tests. I don't know what part of the country you're in, but be very selective where you get the puppy. Please steer clear of pet shops and backyard breeders, and be careful of websites. I can't wait to see and hear about your new puppy!


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

Thank you for your reply! Yes, I am a little nervous about my youngest and a pup. I know my daughter will be just fine. I may wait a few months, I may wait a year. (Although, I don't know if I can really wait that long!)

And I would never buy from a pet shop/puppy mill. I have begun searching for a breeder. That is the difficult part, I think! I live in PA where there are a lot of puppy mill puppies around! So, I am trying to sort through that!

This breed does seem to be just what I am looking for; they sound wonderful!


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## Pixiesmom (Jul 31, 2008)

Yay-you're going about it the right way- ! There are definitely members on here from PA that can maybe suggest someone. I'm in FL in there are some great breeders here. Pixie is my first and only (so far) and she's just the best. I'd love to get another someday. They're great in pairs, or 3's or 4's...


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

It will be like having a new baby in the house and I am not kidding! You will be very busy between your puppy and your toddler! Hope the 5 year old is in a preschool, then it will only be 2 children home.


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## Scooter's Family (May 23, 2008)

Welcome and good for you for doing research on puppies before taking the plunge! Havanese are wonderful dogs!

My kids are older but my nephews are over often and love the dogs. We don't ever leave them together unsupervised but they learned very quickly what to do and what not to do around the doggies, they're now 3 and 2. Only you know what you can handle but I'd plan to use an exercise pen for the puppy from the beginning to make things easier on everyone.

Best of luck to you looking for a puppy, they're so sweet and cute!


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## Moe's Gram (Oct 9, 2009)

On top of what's already been said I would make sure that the puppy has been socialized around small children from the very beginning. The breeder we got Maddux from had 4 children under age 9 so he was use to all the noises, the occasional craziness and being handled less than gently on occasion, etc.... When we got Jax it was a totally different situation and he had only been around teens and older so he was a bit leary of my grandaughter at first. He has adjusted well and we have taught my grandaughter to be "soft and gentle" when near the puppies. Good Luck to you! I really don't think there is a better breed around children!


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

the only issue I've had with Gucci and kids is with my twin stepdaughters. They dropped her when she was a puppy and she does not like them holding her at all..OR picking her up, she hasn't forgotten. lol The twins were 7 at the time and they were the youngest when we got her.

Even though I told them to not pick her up unless I was right there, what did they do the second I turned my back to pull laundry out of the dryer? Kids will still sort of treat dogs like stuffed animals or toys, I have to remind them she's not a toy and needs naps, etc. 

She's been exposed to the toddlers next door with no problems and is patient with the clumsiness of them but she will back off if she senses she could be trampled when they get rowdy .

Also, since Gucci is so attached to me and follows me around, I have gotten some comments from the kids that she only likes 'me', course that's not true, she'll play with them, go on walks with them, etc..but she won't let me out of her site and maybe they get a wee jealous? lol IDK.

I did tons of research, too. I waited til my kids were older because I did try to have a dog when my kids were younger and it was just a disaster and I had to re-home him, course' I didnt' do my homework on personality and temperments back then, shame on me!


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

Pam and I grew up with dogs from the start and so did our children. We believe it's very beneficial to children. The most important thing for the dog is that it is NOT picked up by a child while the child is standing up. Puppies have NO fear of heights and will sail out of arms, including adults, in a heartbeat.

Rules are that the child ALWAYS has to sit on the floor to hold the puppy. All children and animals love Pam and I've never seen a child come here who does not listen to what she says and takes in how to handle the puppy.

Now of course a 2 year old won't likely remember and the most important thing for the dog is that it can be left alone when it wants to be. The biggest problem I've seen with really young children, and this is the key to deciding to wait to get one or not, is that some just won't leave the dog alone when the dog/puppy wants time to itself-like when it gets under a chair. If a young child won't listen and continues to pursue the dog and reach under furniture for it, it will be better to wait to get one until a little later.

Some breeders won't sell a puppy to a family with children below whatever age, but we have raised children and if the family comes for a visit, Pam's decision is final and we have found very few young children that have to wait. The few times they have had to wait, when they came back a year or two later, they had become GOOD caretakers of a puppy. I think it was a good lesson.


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

This is all excellent information. I thank you all for your responses! I do remember the puppy days...that is why I am going to wait a few months, maybe a bit longer. I am spending this time researching the breed, breeders and training techniques, so that I can be as prepared as possible. Can anyone recommend breeders within a few hours driving distance of Pittsburgh, PA? 

This forum is such a great source of information!


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## dboudreau (Jan 12, 2007)

My kids were 18 months and 4 years old when I got Sam. It was a challenge, every time Sam had to go outside to potty I had to take the baby with me. We had very strict rules about picking up the pup like Tom & Pam, the kids had to be sitting on the floor. We also had a x-pen set up that I put Sam in every time I could not watch them. Even though I was so careful about watching, Sam still got stepped on a couple of times so he doesn't totally trust the kids. When Delilah came into our home they were 3 & 6 and a lot more careful with her. If I was to do it again, I think I would have waited for the kids to be a little older.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Dr Ian Dunbar has a good video about children and dogs


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

Skye, welcome to the forum! To me the Havanese is the very best small breed for children so you have made an excellent choice. Our Abby loves the grandchildren who were 18 mos. and 3 when we got her two years ago. I do have a little trouble with the five year old trying to pick her up, though. Children the ages of yours are a lot of work and so is a puppy so if I were you I would hold out as long as "I" possibly could to get the pup but I know that is not easy to do.......lol I hope some of the PA forum members can help you find a good breeder nearby to work with you.


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

We got Kipling when the kids were 8 and 10. The upside there for me was that I had one baby to worry about. At 8 and 10 kids can be left inside when puppy needs to potty etc. Also, they attended puppy class with my DH and I so we, as a family, work with Kipling. My 8 year old in particular is very good with the practice between puppy classes. So I guess what I'm saying is that the kids were much easier to train at this age than if they'd been younger.

I know it's a long time till your youngest is 8 and I'm not suggesting wait that long..every situation is different - just for us, I'm happy we waited.

One other thing that I liked about this timing is that this became a really big wish come true especially for my 10 year old. He so wanted a dog and now really values each day with him vs. having a dog as a part of the family ever since he can remember had we gotten the dog when he was younger. Hope that makes sense.

You're doing all the right things with your questions and research. Good luck!


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## Brady's Grandmom (Nov 11, 2008)

My daughter Karen got Brady from Woodlands Havanese which is near Philadelphia. I don't know if that is too far for you but Brady is an awesome dog. He is the reason I got Bacca. Bacca came from Florida as he was a retired breeder and I couldn't talk Diane into giving up any of her older dogs and I didn't want a puppy.


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## mckennasedona (Feb 20, 2007)

You should keep an eye on the forum for upcoming spring play dates in your area. You could attend one with your children to expose them to a bunch of Havs. It would be a fun way to judge whether the kids are ready for a dog, and whether you want to take on another baby.


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## newhavaneselover (Nov 25, 2009)

Hi and Welcome to the forum. I have a 5 year old daughter and just got our pup at Christmas time. I know she is young and a dog is not a toy. The main reason why I got it for her is because, I am a divorced mom, and she is and will be an only child. Wanted to get her a dog as a companion and a best friend as well as to grow up together. My daughter to be honest.. is a pain in the but with this dog. But my god she loves it more than anything. The dog gets more I Love yous than me!!! She is a good girl, listens to me all the time until it comes down to the dog. I say put the dog down.. leave it alone let it sleep... typical kid... in one ear out the other. lol. She is good though with not playing with the dog when I am not in the room or even touching her for that matter. Just remember the puppy stage of the nipping and play bitting!! my god those teeth hurt like crazy


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

What an excellent idea! I'd love to see some Havanese in action, and my kids reaction to them!


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## TheVintageVamp (Oct 14, 2009)

I have two granddaughters, ages 18 months and 7 years. They do fine with Murray, but he was already 2 y/o when we got him, not a small puppy. He tolerates them, but I wouldn't say he loves them.

We previously had a yorkie and it was honestly a constant battle when Raine, my older granddaughter was a toddler and preschooler. She always wanted to be carrying 'baby Kira' around and Kira was not a baby, she was an old lady dog...

I understand the need for a hypo-allergenic dog, and Havanese are a great choice. I'm going to go out on a limb here, though...and it may not be what you want to hear. I don't think small breed dogs are the best option in households with very young children. Yes, with a lot of diligence and proper training of both child and dog it can be made to work, but on a whole, I think a larger, sturdier dog that is less likely to be injured if a child trips and falls on them is a better option. I've known of family pet pekinese, yorkies and poodles that have been badly injured when a child was playing and fell on top of them.

On the flip side, I worked for over 20 years as a pediatric nurse and I cannot tell you the number of children I saw over those years that had been bit by family dogs in similar situations. These dogs ran the gamut of breeds, but in an overwhelming majority of cases, they were small breed dogs that had been inadvertently sat on, tripped and fallen on, etc by the young child.

Not trying to dampen your enthusiasm, just offering up a different opinion.


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

newhavaneselover said:


> Just remember the puppy stage of the nipping and play bitting!! my god those teeth hurt like crazy


this was something we needed to work through with my 8 year old especially - for a while early on it was a bit of a power struggle where Kipling was more assertive and jumpy and bitey than we liked. Of course this is important and vital development (the biting and therefore bit inhibition) but the key for us was that our daughter understood her role in helping him train on this...(waying no...arms crossed and leaving the play). She knew enough at 8 to understand when we said he wasn't trying to be 'mean'. It seems like a small thing but that nippy stage can be tricky...not to mention the biting pant leg stage


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

I did read somewhere something like, "the younger the child, the larger the breed of puppy." I have had dogs large and small, and I do prefer small dogs. I am concerned for my children above all else, and of course, I would never want to injure a puppy. I am leaning towards waiting a bit longer. I have to ignore the "cuteness factor" of these lovely dogs, and think with my head about this decision!

After all, this is going to be a lot more work for me! There are a lot of things that are "up in the air" for us right now, so now is not the time. I am anxious...(who wouldn't want a little ball of fur), but, waiting for a time seems to be the best thing to do.

I welcome all replies; so thank you for going out on a limb! And yes, those puppy teeth are tough, aren't they?


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## TheVintageVamp (Oct 14, 2009)

Good for you, Skye! If everyone would take the time to be so level headed and do their research, our society wouldn't have so many of the problems we face with unwanted pets.

I know how hard it is to make yourself wait, but you looking at the greater good for your family AND the potential pet. Something to be commended.


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

Completely agree and look forward to hearing about the day you bring your new furball home


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## Wyndward Havanese (May 9, 2008)

Skye - Good job doing your research and taking the time to make the right decision.

I've had dogs, both large and small breeds all my life, so when we had my daughter, she just fit in seamlessly. The dogs did great with her when she was a baby, and now we are working with her to be as good to them as they are to her. 8) We have australian shepherds and our havanese. My daughter just turned 2 in December. She is not allowed to pick them up, but really doesn't try (yet).

We just had a litter 3 weeks ago, and she loves the 'beebee's" and can pet them and points out all their body parts (nooooose, eeeeeyes, etc). She's very gentle with them. Of course everything is very closely supervised.

Kadence knows all the dogs by name, will call them to her, walks them, tells them to sit for treats, worries about their wellbeing, and even knows when they go potty (which may prove useful when potty training her!).

I wouldn't have it any other way. My toddler is great with the dogs, but we've made sure that she was taught what is appropriate. We've had children who come to visit puppies that never even get to hold one before I tell them its not going to work out.

Havanese are very resilient and hardy, and if raised with children, make wonderful playmates and companions. 8)

Farah
www.wyndwardhavanese.com


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## Leah (Jan 12, 2010)

Your kids are going to want a dog they can play with. I would recommend a standard Poodle. When I was 7 my mother bought me a Shetland Sheepdog and that was a perfect fit, but they're not hyro-alergenic. The only larger dog I can think of off the top of my head is a standard Poodle. Havaese are small for young children, they're more of a lap dog for adults.


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## Mojo's Mom (Jun 6, 2009)

Leah said:


> Havaese are small for young children, they're more of a lap dog for adults.


LAP DOG????!!! Mojo CAN be a lap dog, but he is mainly a rough and tumble whirling dervish, hardy, strong, tough and ready for as serious play as any child could want.

Back to the original subject...the best news I can give you is that by the time the puppy is old enough that you can begin to relax about things, you won't remember how incredibly hard it all was!

My grandaughter lives with us, and she was 4 months shy of her 2nd birthday when Mojo the nine week old wild man came home. Constant vigilance isn't too hard to maintain considering you will be running around every waking moment trying to keep things halfway under control. Actually, forget about control, you won't have much...

Maybe (I hope) you'll get a calmer pup than we got, but Mojo seldom had a waking moment that didn't include his sharp puppy teeth snapping at anything within range. I will say that for some reason, Mojo never put a scratch on my granddaughter, while we were bloodied everywhere. He did, however, jump and bite at her clothes, hair and anything else remotely attached to her. Here are some of the highlights you will have to look forward to:

1. The puppy will adore diapers, either clean or dirty. There couldn't be anything more messy when shredded.
2. The puppy will be unable to distinguish between his toys and the toddler's. You will hear constant anguished cries of, "No, MINE!!!!" Expect a few of your toddler's favorite toys to be destroyed, or at least muddied beyond hope.
3. If you are toilet training and using a potty, DO NOT LET THE PUPPY IN THE BATHROOM IF YOUR TODDLER IS POOPING. Trust me, this can go badly.
4. The toddler will likely not be gentle with the puppy, and may be jealous of the attention this new "sibling" is getting. Do not underestimate the danger to the puppy. Do not even think about letting the baby pick up the puppy. My granddaughter had been wonderful with our 15 year old mutt, but the puppy was a whole different deal.
5. The toddler will want to eat, and will succeed in eating, the puppy's food, and vice versa. Feed a human grade food. The toddler will want to play in the puppy's water dish, or even pick it up and dump it out.
6. The toddler's needs and the puppy's needs will be in constant conflict. The puppy will bark and wake your toddler from her nap, or when you have just spent ten minutes very carefully extracting the child from the car seat without waking her up, have successfully gotten her through the door to the house and are just about to gently lay her down in her bed. 
7. Any toddler eating or play activity will need to be above the puppy's reach, unless you are using an x-pen. We didn't do this, maybe we should have.
8. I didn't notice if your 2-year-old was a girl or boy, but expect that any hair scrunchies or other adornments will be among the puppy's favorite hit-and-run targets.
9. Everyone will tell you to never chase the puppy. You will chase the puppy. Often. 
10. You will have to keep the baby's shoes out of reach. This won't work. You will spend time searching the back yard for the left shoe of the pair that is the only one your toddler will agree to wear to pre-school.
11. You will be late to pre-school, because as you were ready to head out the door, the puppy grabbed A, B or C and you HAD to get it back.
12. You will read many suggestions on how to keep control of the challenges of having a puppy and a toddler simultaneously, and you will think you can just have a well organized set-up and firm rules and strict discipline and training for the puppy and the child, and it will all be fine. It won't. It will be chaos much of the time, and you will be harried and frazzled and exhausted, and you will wonder, a couple of weeks into the deal, how you could have so badly underestimated the challenge you were taking on.
13. After the first 4 months, it will all begin to get easier, and by the time the puppy is 8 months old you will have mostly forgotten the crazy early weeks and months.

But...you will have lovely moments shared between toddler and puppy, hilarious anecdotes for dinner guests, and they will adore each other. And the insanity is only a short interlude in a longer and very rewarding relationship between the puppy and his family. I would do it all again...I think...

We chose a Havanese specifically because we wanted a toy breed that was physically tough. You will have to be careful for the puppy's safety while he's small, but he will be an excellent match for your children once he's grown.

I will have to remind Mojo, who can play hard for hours, run 2 miles with me every day (probably could do more, but I can't), and is strong as an ox, that he is a lap dog; I am still laughing over this. He will cuddle when he's tired, for a few minutes, anyway...but I think he merely puts up with it, rather than seeking it out.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Welcome Skye I would highly recommend this site for children and dog relationships. http://www.doggonesafe.com/


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

I am laughing out loud! I want to print this out...Mojo's Mom, thank you for taking the time to write this out; I love it!

One of the things that got my attention about this breed was that they are "wonderful with children of all ages." At least, that is what I read from one source! So, I started looking at all of the information I could find!

I am really enjoying everyone's responses, but, I found this one especially entertaining!
Thank you all for your input!


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

Thank you for the website on safety!


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Mojo's Mom... I'm sitting here, laughing, and thinking how THANKFUL I am that I have no toddler living in the house! Whew, I'm amazed that you survived joint puppy-and-baby-hood, apparently at an older, more golden age!

Ha! Loved the list!! Especially 3, 9, and 10!

Well, beyond that, Havanese are wonderful with children! Tucker isn't much of a lap dog, either, but he loves to snuggle up right next to me. I live alone with him. But, if there are others around, his favorite person is the youngest one present! If he even _hears_ a child his attention is all on them, whether he knows them or not!

I'd never leave a puppy or dog alone with a young child, no matter what breed. But, Havs are great with kids.


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## Maxmom (Jul 22, 2008)

I have the solution! Buy an older hav to begin with. Maybe 2 years old. Then your NEXT hav can be a puppy. Because you WILL want another one, we all come down with IWAP (I Want A Puppy). You kids will be older and your puppy will have another hav to chase and nip at.

My havs are 2 years old. Max adores children and has an uncanny ability to know each child's play style. He is so wonderful with kids. I have 5 grandchildren, ages 2 to 8. They love Max. Cooper is a rescue dog, so he's shy around kids and can run fast.


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

Maxmom, 
I have been thinking about this. There was a Havanese on the "Save a Dog" application on Facebook. Her name was Nora, she was 3-4 year female surrendered by a breeder who was closing their kennel. It said she was calm, and good with children and other pets. Of course, she was scooped up very quickly!

My husband has IWAP. But, I am considering this. A very good idea, indeed!


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Man, are u in for some fun, and challenges!!!
My 3 kids love to play with the dogs slobbered toys, not to mention Harry LOVES to slobber on the kids stuffed animals....:doh:

Anyway, We got Harry a year ago, he was just a puppy.

I have a 2 yr old, 4 yr old and 7yr old.

I found it a huge challenge to find a reputable breeder who would sell to me because of my 3 kids, especially the youngest.
I would look into your local Hav group, lots of times there are pet expos or dog shows which u can find breeders/owners, etc.

This weekend is the canine experience in allentow, I know the Hav breed will be represented there ( delaware valley Havanese club)...maybe there is a similar show going to come around your area?

I have found that a crate with a lock along with a dog door has kept me sane. Otherwise my 2 yr old is in the crate with the dog:rant: or the dog is under my feet while I am trying to cook in the kitchen (because someone left him out) and all the kids are crying... I know all those mothers can relate to that scenario.

He was having accidents in the house when he shouldn't have, the dog door ( mounted in a wall) has stopped all of his accidents except when it rains of course!

Also, he is a fearful dog, although he has dominate tendencies....
during play dates and a new child is over, he is right there on the kid, or will bark/growl at the friend from in his crate....if the kid is running he will chase and nip. He is also a resource guarder with certain types of bones and the kids. He will growl and snarl at my kids if they come close to him while he is near or chewing on his special type of bone. so, we have still have these issues eventhough we got him as a puppy and tried to make the kids dominate, but there are still issues.
Definately educate yourself as much as possible, like personality testing of pups is a good place to start, and consider where your gonna have his set up be in the home because your 2 year old will be all over it!

Oh, and I am allergic to dogs, but not Harry!


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## Mojo's Mom (Jun 6, 2009)

Sam375, that's scary...if it were me, those "special bones" would be gone. 

That's an important issue, the food behavior. We were careful with Mojo to regularly take his food away from him, or flossies, or whatever, right from the start. I don't allow food guarding, but I learned first hand from my last two mutt sisters what can come of it. A bite, is what can come of it (in my case, it was a full-out dog fight).

Rescuing an older dog is something to consider, but I've never met a rescue dog (including the two I had) that didn't have "issues". I felt that especially with the baby in the home, I wanted control over my dog's behavior from the very beginning, and didn't want to deal with someone else's mistakes (of course, I made mistakes, too, but I know what they are). You never know what you are dealing with in a rescue until you get the animal, no matter what you've been told.

Mojo's breeder had children at home, although not toddlers, so I knew Mojo would be prepared for young humans to some extent. He has been marvelous with my granddaughter, somehow never hurting her while he was busy biting us to pieces in the early weeks. No matter what she did, the only time he did anything more than shrug her off was one time when she just plain fell on him, and that only elicited a short warning bark.

I will warn you that doing the kind of training with your puppy that you would ideally do is VERY difficult with young children in the house. There is just too much going on and too many variables. Mojo does not come when called, and I know it's because of the crazy stuff that was happening all the time and the amount of time we spent chasing him because he had something we had to get away from him.

I've tried and tried to teach my granddaughter to keep her face away from dogs, but everyone else in the extended family doesn't cooperate when she's with their dogs...no one ever believes that THEIR darling dog would bite...


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Mojo hits the nail on the head, which is why IF you do do it, the crate is a must until you can get everyone through that bad things.

If I had to do it all over again I still would have gotten Harry when we did, why? It is because of his personality. He is very atypical in that he doesn't bark excessively, doesn't chew on everything (even as a young pup) and he listens when he gets something and we tell him sit, lay down....
But, don't get me wrong it was really hard with the potty training and the puppy phase of trying to eat everything that fell on the floor, especially crayons, playdough, etc....I mean, when Harry finally worked out his digestive issues and had a hard poop....it was rainboW:jaw:  that's the other thing, when they are pups not only do you have to worry about the accidents on the floor, but sometimes they have issues with food, and have diarreha and stuff.

I think you will not regret picking this breed as long as you can afford the grooming expense. They are hardy, smart,comical, sensitive, loving, sometimes lap dogs. We also considered the soft coated wheaten, which are also suspose to be allergy friendly, great with kids, but larger sized.

It would probably be wise for you to wait though. at least look now, and take your time finding a breeder, and by the time you do that you'll have the money saved for a deposit on a pup, and then you'll have to wait for the breeder to have puppies anyway.

What about volunteering at a Havanese rescue, or even at a breeder to play with the puppies?


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Mojo's Mom said:


> Sam375, that's scary...if it were me, those "special bones" would be gone.
> 
> QUOTE]
> 
> ...


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## Sam375 (Feb 2, 2009)

Is this near you? I would start here, and if they say can't help you, ask them if they know who can help you.
Steel Valley Havanese Association 
6719 VERONA RD
VERONA, PA 15147

Gibbons Havanese
Apollo, PA phone (724) 388-2708 email: [email protected]

http://www.wpka-inc.org/

http://home.comcast.net/~ddherrick/site/

I know the breeder that will be at the booth this weeknd in allentown has a good reputation, maybe contact him and see if he can recommend some breeders near you or point you in the right direction.


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## Leah (Jan 12, 2010)

Mojo's mom.......When I was 7, I wanted a dog I could wrestle with. I was just one scrawny little girl, but when you add in another child and a boy on top of that, I think a bigger dog would be better. Just my opinion.

I have two 12 week old puppies who can knock an adult off their feet, but I don't feel they would tolerate anyone returning their roughness.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

A good rule of thumb. "Any child who
cannot get a puppy to come, sit and lie down, should never be allowed to play with that pup
unsupervised."


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

ound: @ Mojo's momm Toddler tops!!! ound:

Oh dear, I do know I will be a grandmother one day and I may have to print this up, lol....hilarious.

I guess the point to consider is that you won't just be training the dog, you'll be training the kids to deal with the dog.


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## TheVintageVamp (Oct 14, 2009)

And an excellent rule of thumb, indeed, Dave. 

Since I worked outside the home and had to rely on babysitters much of the time with my children, our choice was not to have dogs until they were older. 

I know many people can and do make it work. My youngest is doing quite well with it in her household, but the dogs in question are a larger breed (Siberian Huskies) and quite docile. My son in law works from home as well. My oldest granddaughter was 3 1/2 when they brought Dazien into their household as a pup. The two of them wrestled around with close supervision as the puppy got larger. By the time the younger child came along, Dazien was well settled into her role as household companion and set herself as Ezzie's guardian. The only problem there ever was happened when Ezzie was learning to walk. Dazien would become quite upset when she fell, so she didn't want her trying to walk and would nudge her back down onto her little rump, lol.


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

Just catching up with this thread -Mojo's mom - so funny! I loved your list. This is a gret discussion - Thanks for asking the question Skye. 

I agree with the point many raised about the more rough and tumble nature of the Hav. For us, Kipling has turned out to be exactly that. He wrestles and runs and plays at just the right level for our two - my 10 year old is a boy and he definitely rolls around with him though very mindful that Kipling is 12 lbs to his 90. This is not a precious lap dog breed...I often characterize him as a small breed with a larger breed's personality.


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## Mojo's Mom (Jun 6, 2009)

KSC said:


> This is not a precious lap dog breed...I often characterize him as a small breed with a larger breed's personality.


Exactly, that's what I tell people, too. I sometimes tell people he's a toy breed with a labrador's personality (fortunately, not a labrador's appetite). I wanted a small dog particularly for the toddler for some more reasons not yet mentioned:

1) Mojo will, barring some unforseen horrible accident or disease, live long enough to see my granddaughter most of the way through her childhood;
2) Even a puppy as small as a Havanese is more than capable of knocking over a toddler, and a bigger puppy would be much more so;
3) Puppy teeth are sharp as needles, and the bigger the pup, the bigger the needle teeth.

As for wrestling with a dog, Mojo can wrestle just fine. I really don't think it's wise to get a dog with a vision in mind of several children wrestling with it; they just shouldn't be allowed to do that. Children do have to understand that there are acceptable and unacceptable ways to play with dogs. My sister-in-law is grandmother to three pre-teen boys who play rough with each other, but they understand that play with dogs is different. They don't play rough with her German Shepherd, and they don't play rough with Mojo.

Another point is that Havs come in different sizes. If you want a larger, tougher one, look for a breeder with large parents. At nine months, Mojo is 15 lean pounds, a bit bigger and slightly taller than most Havs, but some will run 20 pounds and taller. Mojo's brother is a tiny 8 pounder, the runt of the litter, who might be a bit fragile for children.

"A good rule of thumb. "Any child who cannot get a puppy to come, sit and lie down, should never be allowed to play with that pup unsupervised." Good rule...I get such a kick out of my granddaughter, in her tiny, high voice, sounding as stern as she can, saying, "Mojo, DOWN!" And he doesn't, of course. But once she's big enough to modulate her voice better, he will.

Uh-oh. I can't play with Mojo unsupervised! His recall is improving, but no, I can't really yet depend on getting him to come...


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## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

Really great points re the rules of play. We were and are very careful about what's ok and what's not when teaching both the kids and the dog. We began very early with exercises to play and then calm. Kipling does really well. He has learned about play and acceptable and unacceptable behaviour. I would want to be clear that wrestling in my house means one child and more like being on the floor with him and playing in that way. It's never a situation where both kids are playing that way with him at the same time.


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## murphymoesmamma (Apr 1, 2009)

Oh my goodness Tom! I just visited your website and saw Roxie's darling little pupsters! They are too cute for words!


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## Skye (Jan 23, 2010)

Boy, am I glad I am not trying to housebreak a puppy right now! Living in Pittsburgh, we have soooooo much snow, and more coming!!! Is anyone out there trying to housebreak in this mess???


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

This made me laugh! It is cold here in Eastern NC! Dexter is learning "Hurry Up!" and "Go Potty" real good when it is cold! 

I remember last year with potty training Dexter every 45 minutes outside! I cannot imagine going outside in snow! I would be training with those potty pads for sure. 

I did have to give up the potty pads with Dexter when he was young because he found out he could tear the paper up! Even.....with that potty pad holder! 

I was so glad when Dexter was potty trained!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

Hi Skye, and welcome. Everyone has given you great advice. Havanese are perfect for those with allergies. We are all highly allergic in our house, and our Hav doesn't cause the least bit of allergies. I know many small dogs that are great with children. And I think that if you stick to a great breeder and do alot of training you should be fine. Mine came from a woman posing as a breeder who was actually running a mill, and my little guy can't be trusted at all with children. So stick around and learn about the great breeders on this forum, and you will end up with a wonderful puppy. Good luck


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## Melissa Woods (Feb 21, 2019)

We have 6 kids and got Oliver when our youngest was 4. It’s been a good experience for us all, but there was a learning curve. My biggest suggestion is to make sure you have an exercise pen where you can put the pup if either the kids or the dog is getting too rough. Roxie is our second dog and because of this, I learned to immediately pop her in the pen if she was play biting the kids. Kids dangle fingers in faces at times, they let the dog play tug of war with clothing—basically even if they’re behaving well, they can encourage bad behavior from the dog or prevent them from napping. This can be discouraged if you start with that pen immediately and use it. With Oliver we let him out with every whine. He bit for way longer which is super upsetting for kids. I think a lot of times with these little dogs we are making sure the kids don’t hurt the dog while forgetting that little puppies can and DO make kids bleed with their razor sharp teeth! You do not want a young child putting their face near an exuberant puppy of any breed...


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