# Potty Training Same Old Issues



## MyFreddie (Oct 25, 2009)

I am new to the forum and this is my first post. i have a 4 1/2 month old little male. I work three ten hour days and drive 1 hour each way to work. I think that I have confused MyFreddie by not knowing whether to train to a pad or outside. I put a pad in the master shower for days that I am at work and he uses the pad (sometimes he misses) but I take him outside when I am at home
I crate him at night and sometimes I have to get up every two hours with him and not always do we have results. I have tried crating in the day and only let him out to potty and after a successful trip outside but he whines so much I can not leave him in the crate when i am at home except at night,
I have bought books but he is regressing. i have had him for almost three months. HELP!!!:tea:


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

Welcome! 

Is your puppy alone when you are out of the house for 10+ hours on the days you work? Perhaps, you may want to hire a dog walker or sitter or a friend or family member to come in to play with him and take him out so that he learns the potty routine as well as gets some socialization when you are at work. The remaining 4 days, if you are working from home, I recommend that you keep the same routine that you would want the petsitter to follow. The Havanese perform well with organized activity and set routine for meals, play time, potty time and nap time too.

If you have to get up every two hours at night, it is perhaps his way of trying to get to be closer to you. Havanese need companionship. If he is left alone the whole day and at night he is again crated, he is craving for you attention and companionship. You could keep the crate next to your bed and touch him when he whines or cries. 

Good luck!


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## Xtina88 (Oct 5, 2009)

While I do agree that 10-12 hours is quite a long time for a puppy to be left alone, all I can say about your problem is ROUTINE ROUTINE ROUTINE. It doesn't sound like there's much flexibility in your schedule, so I would just make it to where your puppy ONLY uses the pad while you're away and ONLY goes outside when you are home. I would not leave him in the bathroom (I would assume that's where you keep him) when you are at home, and I don't know exactly why you're trying to crate him while you are at home either...? Just make sure you're spending enough much needed quality time with your pup as well, or behavioral issues can easily develop just as a method to get your attention.


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## MyFreddie (Oct 25, 2009)

Thanks for the replies. I would love to have a pet sitter or someone to walk the puppy during my work days but right now since I live a distance from relatives and no one available in my neighborhood this is not an option. i am hoping that a new neighbor might be available in the spring. I do not leave Freddie in the bathroom when I am at home I have a gate that I put up on the bathroom door when I go to work. I never leave during non work days except to shop and only for a couple of hours so I crate him then. He does use the pad when I am away and he is in the bathroom. His crate is by my bed at night I actually have two crates one in my sunroom where he naps during the day when I am at home. I do not crate him in the day time unless I can't watch him. I bought a training book that tells you to crate them all the time during potty training but I just can't do that. I have never had a small dog and am at a loss on the training issue. I am so in love with this little guy and want to do the correct things. I give him a treat and praise him when we go out and he potties and he seems to understand at the moment but he will still go right back into the house and potty after being outside. Should I try bells or just schedule walking? I am taking him every hour rain or shine. Thanks for the help.


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

You are getting a lot of great advice. You might try calling a professional dog walker. Yes, they cost money but that would probably help housebreak him faster. Small dogs can take awhile to housebreak. It's not unusual for a 4 month old puppy to be having accidents. Be patient, it will happen, but it can take a year for some dogs. It just clicks for them one day and it's a celebration!
In the meantime, just clean it up well and it's not a big deal He'll get it soon, hang in there!!


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

In my opinion given your current situaion, I think training your puppy for litter box or pads is a better option for now. If you haven't already, you may want to read Diane Klumb's "The Havanese". It describes the ex-pen set up. So when you are at work, the puppy can stay in the ex-pen which has his crate, food and water bowl and a pad /litterbox and his toys. You may want to keep a radio or TV on (most breeders do recommend it so that the pups are used to various sounds. I often keep my TV on and pups watch it too). 

You may have to create a larger ex-pen area so that the puppy doesn't soil himself if he gets on the pad while playing. One of the experienced breeders had mentioned using a litter box with wood pellets (ones used for wood burning stove) on one the threads on the forum. Perhaps that might work for you. The ex-pen set up will give him enough room for his activities. 

When they are younger 13-14 weeks, they need to go pee-pee more frequently but not every hour in my experience. But gradually it comes to about 3-4 hours. You should take him out as soon as he gets up in the morning, after meals, playtime (any excitment) after walks, before & after car rides and after naps. Please take away his water after 7pm- latest by 8pm (no vigorous play after that or he would want to drink). The last potty call is usually around 10. He should be able to hold his bladder the entire night. If you are consistent and stick to the routine, he should be quite reliable by 6-7 months. Some Havanese are house broken by 6 months and are 100% reliable by 9months while others take longer and some do regress. Mine were comepletely house broken and reliable by 7-8 months. But anytime there is disruption or unexpected disturbance in their routine, accidents do happen. 

Hope this helps. Good luck!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

MyFreddie's Mom or Dad. Welcome to the forum. I feel for you. You obviously love your your Freddie but your schedule must be confusing to the little guy. But I think you just have to re-think your strategy and go back to square one. 

I would totally train only to pads whether you are home or not. Outside will come naturally when he is older. But if you need to leave him for 10-12 hours with out a break in the middle he needs to feel secure about where he does his biz. 

To this end, I would take the next 3 days you have with him and re-train him to the pads.. if he goes in the right place...party, party, treat, treat, treat. Even if he is half on and half off the pad. If he is off the pad more times than not...consider doubling up the pads...or even placing them in a tray... we found a more defined area really helps. 

If his potty is in the bathroom, and you want him to have free reign of the house when you are home... you need to periodically guide him through the house to his potty place... train him to go there from where ever he is in the house. 

Also 4 and a half months is not that old, especially for a Hav. Many Havs are not fully dependable til they are a year. You just have to be vigilant when you are home and never take the training for granted. 

We trained our both our boys to go in their "potty room" when they had relapses we would make a list of every time they peed and pooped for a few days...sure enough we saw a pattern and we could anticipate their needs and lead them to their room. When we weren't home they were in the sunroom which had access to their potty. We totally didn't focus on outdoor potty til there was no doubt that they got where they were supposed to go to the bathroom. In fact Jasper once scratched on the door while playing outside to go IN and potty. But as they got older and could hold it more, they chose to hold it and wait til we could take them out. But in an emergency they have their room. 

good luck, keep us posted.


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## Xtina88 (Oct 5, 2009)

Great advice - I didn't think about the fact that your pup is still quite young when I suggested doing both pads/outdoor potty breaks. It probably is indeed a bit illogical to expect him to learn both at such a young age. 

QUESTION to everyone: If using potty pads, is it ok to place more than one in the house (one in each bathroom, etc.)?


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

I have two 4 month old puppies (phew!) and it's alot of work and consistancy-
Mine have been using potty pads, I used to have 4 of them in different areas in my livingroom/dining room where we spend all of our time. I was gradually able to pick up the extra pads and now they only have one in the livingroom that they use. Just in the last 3-4 days they have been consistantly going out the doggy door to go potty (yay!), but I still leave the pee-pad down too. They use that maybe 1-2 times a day. They do not 'let me know' that they have to go potty, they either bolt out the doggy door or go over to the pad.
4 month old puppies potty ALOT!! And I would guess that with you being gone 12 hours a day for 3 days a week is very confusing for your little pup.
You just need to be consistant and have LOTS of patience- he will get it eventually! Most Hav's arent fully reliable until closer to 6-7 months. Yours may take a bit longer with you working such long hours. Kind of like a toddler, they aren't going to learn by themselves to use the toilet, it takes alot of training and consistancy on the part of their parents- puppies are the same way, they won't teach themselves to be housetrained!! :bounce:


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## MyFreddie (Oct 25, 2009)

I am My Freddie's mom. Freddie does better on the potting on the days that I am at work and he is confined to the bathroom then he does on the days that I am at home. He does go to the pad every time. Sometimes he misses the pad. So you think I should only use the pad and not take him out and confuse him. I am not quite sure how to get him to use the pad when I am with him. Do I keep the lease on him? Sorry that I am asking such elementary questions to all of you but this is my first attempt with a small dog, I have always owned labs. I am a widow that lives in a remote area and having a pet sitter is not an option for me in my area. I love my little guy and want to do what is best for him. Do you think that I should not have a puppy with my schedule. I am so attached to him already, since I am alone he is soooo much company to me !!!!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

I am sorry you're having a tough time with the potty training. I can see that you love Freddie very much. In the ideal world, he is being left alone too long, but you will have to just do the best you can. I personally think that it would be a good idea to get another dog to keep him company, maybe once he's a little older and potty trained. You could even consider a rescue or adult dog, and that way he will be much happier on the days you have to work. Everyone has given you great advice. Just stick to the routine, be consistent, and it will happen, so hang in there. My Hav still had occasional accidents up until 7 months or so, and I do think little dogs can take longer to train. Good luck!


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## leena365 (Sep 17, 2009)

I am having problems with Miya as well when it comes to pottying. You give her too much freedom in the pen and she will do her business on the floor or rubber mat as opposed to the pee pad. Kashi however is almost there when confined even with a little more space he goes on the pee pad every time. It is when I let them roam free in the home that I find accidents on my tile floor or carpet. They even go for me outside when I take them out to play in my backyard.


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

MyFreddie said:


> I am My Freddie's mom. Freddie does better on the potting on the days that I am at work and he is confined to the bathroom then he does on the days that I am at home. He does go to the pad every time. Sometimes he misses the pad. So you think I should only use the pad and not take him out and confuse him. I am not quite sure how to get him to use the pad when I am with him. Do I keep the lease on him? Sorry that I am asking such elementary questions to all of you but this is my first attempt with a small dog, I have always owned labs. I am a widow that lives in a remote area and having a pet sitter is not an option for me in my area. I love my little guy and want to do what is best for him. *Do you think that I should not have a puppy with my schedule. I am so attached to him already, since I am alone he is soooo much company to me !!!![/*QUOTE]
> 
> Bold mine. It is so obvious that you love your Freddie dearly. The Havanese are bred for companionship and you picked the perfect little guy to love. They will shower you will attention and love. You are going to have little tough time in training him due to your schedule. You have got good advice already. Just hang in there. I think for situation training him for a litterbox or pads is the best option. Be consistent, patient. It will take some time, but he will get it.
> 
> As someone suggested, perhaps you can get a rescue from HRI when Freddi is a little older and well settled with you. They will keep each other company when you are at work and you can shower your love on 2 of them. Wish you all the best with Freddie. Keep us posted.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Freddie's mom, I have raised and potty trained 2 puppies working out of the house 3 days a week. sometimes they are long days. We do have a dog walker come in 2 of those days so they are only alone one full day. As small puppies we had some one come more. On the days I am not home they get a very long walk in the morning. and leave them with safe toys to play with. I think you can make this work if you really want to. You are with his 4 full days a week and all night. I would make mornings and nights extra special.

I think it is important to build a very stong beginning. With our first pup Jasper I took to work with me for the first 3 weeks of his life with us...would that be possible for a short time?

you know I think the biggest thing is to be patient with yourself and with freddie. Labs are notorious for learning to do their biz outside very quickly. Havanese are notorious for taking a very long time to learn this. But they can learn! One technique is to leash him, or tether his leash to you while you train him (get an extra long leash and tie it around your waist). Or you can simply always keep treats with you and lure him to his potty. I think this works best because you train him to always go there when he gets the urge. Create questions, commands and praise language to use... Ours is " do you have to do your Biz?" "do your biz." "good biz." and always treat when the task is done. The most helpful book I found "house training for dummies."

http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=10366#post296701

When you are home you should both always be in the same the room...if you catch freddie in the act use it to your advantage and correct him. NO! and pick him up and carry him to his potty. if he even gives you a drop after the correction party and reward him.

I hope the book helps. Please keep us posted.


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## kauai mommy (Jul 22, 2009)

When my Hava turned four months old, I got rid of all the pee pads and tried to train her to go potty only outside. All the expert opinions suggested that going both inside and outside is confusing for dogs. I also work full time so I used the combination of crate training and dog walking service to transition her to the outside-only routine. But Eeven though she never ever soiled her crate, she always had accidents when she was not crated. Sometimes, she would have potty accidents within 30 minutes of coming back from a walk. The only way to prevent accidents was to walk her every hour or so when she's not crated, which became impractical. 

So after five months of continued frustration and minimal progress, I decided to make her an inside-outside doggie. I set up a pee pad in the kitchen for her and she goes there whenever she wants. She still gets her four walks a day - first thing when she wakes up, mid-day by my dog walker, as soon as I get home from work at 7 pm, and then a run to the dog park at 9 pm. And it's been great. If I'm running late from work, I don't have to be stressed out that she's crated. If it's raining outside, I can just let her go inside because she really hates the rain. 

Despit what the experts recommended, letting her go inside and outside has been the best solution for my little one. Just my two humble cents...

Hope this helps...


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## MyFreddie (Oct 25, 2009)

Thank you everyone! I think I just needed some reassurance that i am doing the right thing for my little one. I am going to take a deep breath and start over on Thursday morning. I will be on vacation the next week and we are really going to work on this issue. I will have to decide the best approach for us before Thursday. Love my little guy !!!!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Oh I am so glad you get to have a whole week to work with him. You can make amazing strides in a solid week with a Puppy. IMO that is like a year of learning in human terms.


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

Good luck! I'm sure he will get it soon enough. 

Since a pet sitter is not an option, maybe you could leave the TV on for him. Also try leaving an article of clothing that has your smell on it with him. I think all pups are different. My Bella is so independent, that I could leave her for hours on end. Fred and Scudder are mama's boys, so that's the reason I don't leave them for more than 5 hours. Maybe Freddie is ok without you. Sounds like he gets a lot of quality time with you when your not working


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## MyFreddie (Oct 25, 2009)

This is day two of my eleven day vacation and holidays off. My Freddie has done great.
We have had no accidents!!! Yea. I think I have relaxed about the potty training and that little Freddie can sense it. I have kept him in the crate when I couldn't watch him. I am still training him outside so hope when I go back to work on the 30th that he will not be confused again. When we go out and he potties we have a big party lots of praise,loving and a treat. He is really happy about all of that. Just love my little guy!


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## MyFreddie (Oct 25, 2009)

Update on My Freddie's potty training. I am now back to work after my vacation for the Thanksgiving holiday. Little Freddie has made good progress in his potty training issues. I am training him to the pad the majority of the time but do take him out some. He loves the reward of his treat and is now getting the idea of why he gets the reward. I ordered a ugodog litter tray and it came yesterday. I lined it with his pad and he got the picture in less than an hour. Love My Little Freddie and am so proud of him!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

That's great news! So glad Freddie's coming along well with his training.
Gina


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

That's great news! Congratulations! :clap2:


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## waybrook (Sep 13, 2009)

Congratulations on your great progress! Everyone says its harder to train little dogs and I agree. Our Panda is 6 mo. and is just now becoming somewhat trustworthy - but we don't let her out of our sight in the house - ever! Labs are much easier!

Hope you have continued success with Freddie - we need pictures!


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## Redorr (Feb 2, 2008)

Ah, you are experiencing the joy of the puppy and the potty. It may take a long time, or go swimmingly. Every one of these little kids seems unique in this area. Lola is 2.5 years, and when we are staying at friends homes, she is perfect. Holds it until we take her out, different schedule, no problem. As soon as she got home, two "accidents" in two days. Back to square one for a few days.

Lola also has severe Separation Anxiety, where she will pee or poop in the house whenever she is left alone. For the longest time I thought it was a housetraining problem, but was finally diagnosed by a trainer. It is something to keep an eye out for. These havs are serious about their people.


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## Sandi (May 29, 2008)

Mine are almost 2 and have reverted to using our house as their potty spot. I'm sure it's because we didn't crate train them when they were babies. We have a doggie door and they went outside when they needed to go. They did great for about a year and then we took them upstairs to sleep in our room and everything changed. They started peeing at night on the carpet and then it was downhill from there. I have moved them back downstairs to the family room (where they used to be and were fine). At first they were doing great but now they are going at night in there. We even take them out right before we go to bed and they both go before we bring them in. Frustrating!!!!! Is there hope for us? I am thinking I need to get some large crates (their baby crates are too small) and start putting them in there to sleep.

I hadn't thought about the anxiety thing. I know our female has an attachment to my husband and I think she is the one with the problem. But even when they slept in our room, they went. Love these guys but am getting really annoyed with cleaning up the poop and pee every morning.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Definitely time for crates.

They really don't even mind when they are used to it! Kodi's crate opens directly into his ex-pen, so he doesn't HAVE to stay in his crate at night, but that's where his bed and his sleep-time stuffed animals are, and that's where HE wants to be too.


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## LuckyOne (Sep 3, 2009)

So glad things are going well for you. You have gotten some great advice. My two have been totally potty trained since about 4 1/2 months. They have never had accidents in their crate either. We are lucky that our schedules overlap enough that I'll bet they have only been alone for a total of 4 hours. I have always outdoor potty trained and they get a treat each and every time. I used to give it to them just as soon as they did their business but now they run into the house and wait at the treat cupboard. LOL I just can't stand to leave them! Good luck with your little cutie pie!


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## leena365 (Sep 17, 2009)

Does anyone have any advice for me with regards to Miya? Kashi my boy is pretty good at going on the potty pad but Miya definitely does not use it when out of her pen.


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