# 10 week old w/some soft poop



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

For the past couple of days, my 10 week old puppy Lincoln has had some softer poop for his 2nd poop of the day (evening). Here's some facts:

*He came home 1 week ago today
*His stool sample at his vet appointment on Monday was negative (fine)
*This has been the case for the past 3-4 days
*He's still energetic, playful, etc, although he's not as hungry it seems (but he has been getting more dried chicken pieces for training purposes the last couple of days)
*His morning poop typically seems firmer/fine; it's the evening poop
*It has a soft-serve-like quality, is a bit yellow/tan in color, and is very stinky
*He has been on the same food his breeder had him on (Blue Buffalo Chicken and Oatmeal for Puppies)
*One of those evenings, I chalked it up to me trying about 10 kibble pieces of Fromm, which I'd like to switch him to
*Another day I figured it was too much of his freeze-dried chicken treats
*We've been spending a lot of time outside the last 3 days or so. He tends to lick the ice outside

*I plan to add some pumpkin to his kibble tomorrow - how much should I add?

Also, is it too early to try and change his food to the Fromm puppy grain-free? 
*
Thoughts on this all? Thanks!


----------



## Chris TO (Jan 1, 2016)

Our breeder had Maggie on Fromm puppy gold. We kept her on that and also started adding pure pumpkin after getting some great advice here on the forum. The recommended amount is about 1 teaspoon on top of the kibble. I've read that too much pumpkin isn't good so I stick to the teaspoon serving.

With the kibble and pumpkin Maggie has been regular with her poos and they are well formed and firm. No issue there.

Maggie licks ice also, eats snow and chews on leaves, non of that seems to bother her so I don't worry about it.


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

Chris TO said:


> Our breeder had Maggie on Fromm puppy gold. We kept her on that and also started adding pure pumpkin after getting some great advice here on the forum. The recommended amount is about 1 teaspoon on top of the kibble. I've read that too much pumpkin isn't good so I stick to the teaspoon serving.
> 
> With the kibble and pumpkin Maggie has been regular with her poos and they are well formed and firm. No issue there.
> 
> Maggie licks ice also, eats snow and chews on leaves, non of that seems to bother her so I don't worry about it.


I gave some pumpkin in his food today, but I gave a tablespoon by accident and he threw it up right after, even without eating all of it. So I wonder if it was too much or if he was allergic to it. It was pure pureed pumpkin.

I really want to switch him to Fromms (I got the puppy formula), but feel like maybe I should wait? His stool this morning seemed to be more formed again.....I am going to stop his chicken treats today too - just not sure why it's softer in the evening, so willing to try various things.


----------



## Karen Collins (Mar 21, 2013)

If you suspect the treats, then stop them for a couple days to see if his poop goes back to normal. A 10 week old has a tiny little tummy, which is why you feed so often at first. Maybe you are over training him? I do very little training at that age. Just some name recognition and eye contact. Because my goal is to get in the show ring, I don't teach sit right away. I like to click a stand or natural stack with good eye contact. Its easy and they offer it naturally anyway. I'm saying that to say you should train only minutes a day. Which will cut down on amount of treats.

Also, I use uncured bacon fried crispy at first for treats. (I start using their kibble later when we get more serious) Break off an inch piece and crumble that for treats. When its gone, no more training for the day. Pups will love the smell and won't mind that they aren't getting much. The message is the same.....reward for desirable behavior.


----------



## Chris TO (Jan 1, 2016)

TamaraCamera said:


> I gave some pumpkin in his food today, but I gave a tablespoon by accident and he threw it up right after, even without eating all of it. So I wonder if it was too much or if he was allergic to it. It was pure pureed pumpkin.
> 
> I really want to switch him to Fromms (I got the puppy formula), but feel like maybe I should wait? His stool this morning seemed to be more formed again.....I am going to stop his chicken treats today too - just not sure why it's softer in the evening, so willing to try various things.


Yes, a tablespoon is too much. I did the exact same thing and Maggie vomited also. Make sure its 100% pure pumpkin, not the pie filling stuff with additional seasoning.


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

Ok, good tips. I will try the pumpkin in a VERY small amount again....should I wait until tomorrow or try again tonight? It is pure pumpkin and not the pie filling. :laugh2:

Great tips on the training. My trainer had suggested I treat for desirable behavior like you said. And to also treat when he is exposed to new things in order to help him be less timid. My guess is I am over-feeding treats, which is why he is not as interested in his meals. *While I only use the dried out chicken pieces and his kibble as treats, I am guessing, since his stool is soft the 2nd poop of the day (after food, etc), it's TOO MUCH food. His kibble is Chicken and Oatmeal and he seems to tolerate that, so I am guessing it's not an intolerance to the chicken treat (I get it at a whole food dog/cat food store and it's just plain dried out chicken). Can eating too much/having too much in your system make the tummy upset and poop very soft? 
*
I will try the bacon, too. We ourselves eat uncured/nitrate-free turkey bacon - would that be okay? He can tolerate turkey hot dogs, too.

Today I am doing no chicken treats and very little training, just to "reset" things. I do think I am treating too much - I guess because I feel like I should truly be helping him associate new things as positives, as well as catching the positive behaviors. (He's only been here a week yesterday, but I think I am too nervous about his new timidness and need to remember it can be due to adjustment period!).


----------



## Chris TO (Jan 1, 2016)

TamaraCamera said:


> Ok, good tips. I will try the pumpkin in a VERY small amount again....should I wait until tomorrow or try again tonight? It is pure pumpkin and not the pie filling. :laugh2:


I'd wait till tomorrow to give his tummy a chance to recover. The pumpkin has really worked for us and Maggie loves it. It adds a little taste to the boring kibble.


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

*Also....can you recommend something that is a peanut butter alternative to use in Kongs for puppies around 10-11 weeks old? *Was going to use pumpkin, but need to determine first if I feed too much or if it doesn't agree with him. We have a severe peanut allergy in the house, so can't use anything with peanut butter.


----------



## Eveningpiper (Sep 23, 2015)

yogurt or cottage cheese works in a kong if you freeze it.


----------



## Karen Collins (Mar 21, 2013)

TamaraCamera said:


> Can eating too much/having too much in your system make the tummy upset and poop very soft?
> 
> I will try the bacon, too. We ourselves eat uncured/nitrate-free turkey bacon - would that be okay? He can tolerate turkey hot dogs, too.


Yes to both questions.



TamaraCamera said:


> I think I am too nervous about his new timidness and need to remember it can be due to adjustment period!).


Yes, puppies go through a lot in a short amount of time. When gauging timid or soft behavior, a good thing to look for is how fast does the puppy recover. Do they startle and in 1-2 seconds go sniff the thing that startled them? Or do they run for cover and don't come out for 1-2 minutes? The shorter the recovery, the better. But even if they are slower to recover, you just meet them where they are and build confidence slowly with positive reinforced exposure to the stimuli.

Puppies respond to high praise too, you don't always have to treat. An enthusiastic atta boy goes a long way! Try to relax and enjoy him. Don't fret about failing. A calm gentle energy from you will do wonders for the puppy. :wink2:


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

Karen Collins said:


> Yes to both questions.
> 
> Yes, puppies go through a lot in a short amount of time. When gauging timid or soft behavior, a good thing to look for is how fast does the puppy recover. Do they startle and in 1-2 seconds go sniff the thing that startled them? Or do they run for cover and don't come out for 1-2 minutes? The shorter the recovery, the better. But even if they are slower to recover, you just meet them where they are and build confidence slowly with positive reinforced exposure to the stimuli.
> 
> Puppies respond to high praise too, you don't always have to treat. An enthusiastic atta boy goes a long way! Try to relax and enjoy him. Don't fret about failing. A calm gentle energy from you will do wonders for the puppy. :wink2:


Thanks for the reassurance. :laugh2: He pooped midday today as well and just like the mornings, it was formed. So looks like it was most likely *too* much of the chicken treats, as when we initially used the chicken treats more sparingly, it wasn't an issue. But I will monitor how much we use when we reintroduce it in a day or so.

May try almond butter for the Kong as well as try the pumpkin again (for ideas to freeze in the Kong).

He definitely recovers quickly after startling or being timid....usually within seconds. So that is a good thing to read. He wasn't a timid puppy at the breeder's, so it definitely seems like it's just transition and/or fear phase. He is definitely wanting to explore a ton more outside and isn't phased by cars/various noises as much anymore. I will continue to try and use the verbal praise and a pet, too. He does like that as well. :wink2:


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

TamaraCamera said:


> He definitely recovers quickly after startling or being timid....usually within seconds. So that is a good thing to read. He wasn't a timid puppy at the breeder's, so it definitely seems like it's just transition and/or fear phase. He is definitely wanting to explore a ton more outside and isn't phased by cars/various noises as much anymore. I will continue to try and use the verbal praise and a pet, too. He does like that as well. :wink2:


As "the other" Karen (Karen Collins) said, it is absolutely appropriate for puppies (or even full grown dogs) to startle or shy away from something that is unknown. (and for puppies, most of the world outside their breeder's home is unknown at first! ) It's ALL about their recovery time.

That's actually part of puppy temperament testing... To gauge their reaction to noises, keys are dropped into a metal bowl and to gauge their reaction to startling sights, an umbrella is (gently) popped open near them. in both cases, it is perfectly OK for the puppy to startle... in fact, it is expected. It is how fast they recover and come over to sniff and investigate the item that tells you something about the puppy's temperament. Most companion breed puppies would be expected to startle, then eventually come to investigate. On the puppy temperament test I like best (in The Focused Puppy), A puppy is given FULL marks if it approaches and investigates within 20 seconds! That's a long time when you're sitting patiently waiting for the puppy. (which you should do)

And temperament testing is done between 7-8 weeks of age. By the time a puppy is home with you, they may be in a bit of a fear period, where they may be even slower to warm up to things, people and other dogs. That's why it is SO important, through this period, to keep exposing them to things but at their own speed, without forcing them.

Panda was the most confident puppy I've seen during temperament testing. She just BARELY flinched on the sound and sight sensitivity tests, then IMMEDIATELY ran over, stuck her nose in the bowl and pulled out the keys. She ran to the umbrella, stepped on the edge, dragged it with her teeth and then climbed into it. Even so, when I brought her home at 12 weeks, she needed some time to get used to our training facility, and she has growled when she has seen large dogs. We are just continuing to gently expose her to everything we can, knowing that this is to be expected. She is becoming more confident again, day by day.

Pixel is a "softer" puppy, and has required even more gentle introductions to things. She hit a real fear imprint period around 9 1/2 months (not an unusual time for this to happen) and we've been slowly and carefully working her through that. She is very confident in her familiar "zone", but needs time to acclimate to new situations.

Kodi was somewhere between the two girls, though closer to Panda. He did go through a period where he was quite shy of strangers as an adolescent. I remember him ducking behind me if someone he didn't know tried to touch him. I remember thinking, at the time, that although he was already shaping up to be a great performance dog, that he would never make a therapy dog. The funny thing is, once he fully matured, he has ALL the instincts of a great therapy dog. He loves elderly people and children, but is very calm and gentle around both. I've seen a number of elderly people who told me they "don't like dogs" totally charmed by him when he just quietly goes over and lies down with his chin on their foot. When my Dad was in rehab, there were several instances where something required my urgent attention, and I was able to set him in a corner on a sit-stay, and have him stay there, with wheel chairs and walkers going past him, until I could get back to him.

So, as Karen said, don't "worry" about your pup... just make sure you gently expose him to as many new situations AS HE IS COMFORTABLE WITH, and give him all the time he needs to acclimate. That means just following him on his leash, letting him get closer or farther away, talking to him in an up-beat voice for any signs of "being brave", but (and this is REALLY important!) not trying to "jolly" him into something he's not ready for.


----------



## HavGracie (Feb 27, 2012)

TamaraCamera said:


> *Also....can you recommend something that is a peanut butter alternative to use in Kongs for puppies around 10-11 weeks old? *Was going to use pumpkin, but need to determine first if I feed too much or if it doesn't agree with him. We have a severe peanut allergy in the house, so can't use anything with peanut butter.


Also, cream cheese stuffed into a Kong and frozen works well.


----------



## MarinaGirl (Mar 25, 2012)

TamaraCamera said:


> May try almond butter for the Kong as well as try the pumpkin again (for ideas to freeze in the Kong).


Almonds are not recommended for dogs so it's best not to use almond butter as a Kong filler.


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

krandall said:


> As "the other" Karen (Karen Collins) said, it is absolutely appropriate for puppies (or even full grown dogs) to startle or shy away from something that is unknown. (and for puppies, most of the world outside their breeder's home is unknown at first! ) It's ALL about their recovery time.
> 
> That's actually part of puppy temperament testing... To gauge their reaction to noises, keys are dropped into a metal bowl and to gauge their reaction to startling sights, an umbrella is (gently) popped open near them. in both cases, it is perfectly OK for the puppy to startle... in fact, it is expected. It is how fast they recover and come over to sniff and investigate the item that tells you something about the puppy's temperament. Most companion breed puppies would be expected to startle, then eventually come to investigate. On the puppy temperament test I like best (in The Focused Puppy), A puppy is given FULL marks if it approaches and investigates within 20 seconds! That's a long time when you're sitting patiently waiting for the puppy. (which you should do)
> 
> ...


Such great insight!!! Thank you so much for sharing your experiences, as well as tips. I have been letting him explore things around the house outside (since I am not taking him on the sidewalks yet until he gets his 2nd round of shots next week). He often explores, sometimes retreats, and then definitely within 20 seconds, goes to re-investigate. I constantly give him good praise and tell him he's okay. I now see him not flinching when cars drive by, or when dogs walk by on the sidewalk. And even see him trying to bark at some dogs (not growl), so I think his confidence is slowly rising. He even visited with a friend's 20 pound Australian Labradoodle, and the Labradoodle was scared of him, and he was cool and calm! :grin2:


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

MarinaGirl said:


> Almonds are not recommended for dogs so it's best not to use almond butter as a Kong filler.


So good to know - thank you!


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

HavGracie said:


> Also, cream cheese stuffed into a Kong and frozen works well.


Lots of dairy like that is okay with puppies' tummies?


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

TamaraCamera said:


> And even see him trying to bark at some dogs (not growl), so I think his confidence is slowly rising.


Incidentally, growling is not a "bad thing". It is an early warning system for the dog's emotional state. You don't want to stop a dog from growling. Dogs who are discouraged from growling become the ones that can "bite without warning", because their only way of warning people of discomfort (or at least the one humans are most likely to pay attention to) has been trained out of them.


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

krandall said:


> Incidentally, growling is not a "bad thing". It is an early warning system for the dog's emotional state. You don't want to stop a dog from growling. Dogs who are discouraged from growling become the ones that can "bite without warning", because their only way of warning people of discomfort (or at least the one humans are most likely to pay attention to) has been trained out of them.


Good to know!


----------



## Eveningpiper (Sep 23, 2015)

TamaraCamera said:


> Lots of dairy like that is okay with puppies' tummies?


I fill the kong with kibble and only use a little pumpkin or diary as a topper to seal the top.


----------



## sesa70 (Jan 25, 2016)

For stuffing a Kong I really like to use plain yogurt. Mix some kibble with the yogurt and pop the whole Kong in the freezer. You can do the same with the pumpkin or mashed up banana. When you mix it with the kibble they are getting less of the yogurt/banana/pumpkin.


----------



## TamaraCamera (Dec 27, 2015)

sesa70 said:


> For stuffing a Kong I really like to use plain yogurt. Mix some kibble with the yogurt and pop the whole Kong in the freezer. You can do the same with the pumpkin or mashed up banana. When you mix it with the kibble they are getting less of the yogurt/banana/pumpkin.


Thanks so much! I've been using pumpkin this week in them, with some kibble, bacon, hot dog, or chicken bits in them. He loves them! Then I just refill again for next time and freeze. Waiting to try yogurt as I am currently doing a slow switch from Blue Buffalo puppy food to Fromm puppy food (grain-free) and don't want to mess with his tummy too much.


----------

