# AKC Rules on Showing Dog With Cherry Eye Repair



## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

Hi all,

This Forum is such a wonderful source of information. Does anyone have a definitive answer on whether AKC rules allow showing a Havanese (or any dog) who has had a repair of cherry eye by the doctor making a small slit and repositioning the gland and securing it? I think the rules on the AKC website are a little hard to interpret and I've heard conflicting views.

Thanks SO much.

Shirley


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Shirley, the problem is that there is only conflict _when people interpret_. Go straight to the source and you'll see it is very clear and does not need any interpretation. This is taken straight from the AKC web site under the section of Frequently Asked Conformation Questions (emphasis mine):



> *Surgery, Allowable Procedures, Health Reasons*
> 
> For a dog that is competing in Conformation or Obedience, what health-related surgical procedures *are allowed*?
> 
> ...


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

The above quote was taken copied on 2/22/10 from http://www.akc.org/events/conformation/faqs.cfm


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*Thanks*

Kimberly,

Thanks for the information. I had received this from another source. We took Keeper to the vet this morning and we don't know if he will need the surgery.
Medication is being tried first.

I will tell you that the very good veterinarian we have feels that the AKC is wrong here. Either you disqualify totally from showing any dog that has cherry eye procedures, or you allow the medically accepted surgery now used which is by making a slit, inserting the gland and suturing. The gland is necessary--removing it results in dry eye which must be treated for the life of the dog and may result in blindness in later years.

I must agree with him. Whether we show Keeper or not (it would need to be prior to surgery), depends on what is best for this puppy. We would, of course, abide by AKC rules which are, in this case, silly.

Thanks again.

Shirley


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I don't understand. What is silly about it?


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Maybe there is some confusion as to what the nictitating membrane is?

Here is some more info from WebMD that may be helpful in explaining why you shouldn't need to do anything with the nictitating membrane. My interpretation is that if you need to alter the membrane, maybe there is a bigger cause, which would be reason the dog shouldn't be shown.

Source:http://pets.webmd.com/dogs/nictitating-membrane-third-eyelid-dogs



> The Nictitating Membrane (Third Eyelid) in Dogs
> An opaque third eyelid, normally not seen, may become visible across the front of the eye, in which case the nictitating membrane is protruding. The appearance of the third eyelid indicates that the eyeball has sunken into its socket, or that the eyeball has been pulled back into its socket by spasm of the retractor muscles in response to severe eye pain.
> 
> A dog may be born with visible third eyelids, called haws. In the show ring this is often considered undesirable, because it gives the animal a somewhat haggard look. Most breed standards (if they mention it at all) require that the haws be scarcely apparent. The haws are a concern only because they give the dog an unsightly appearance. There is no medical reason to remove the third eyelid just because the haws are visible.
> ...


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*AKC Rule*

Hi Kimberly,

I think the AKC should clarify this. It is indeed, silly, if they allow these procedures (cherry eye is on the list) saying that it is strictly for the health of the dog, and then proceed to rule out the current medically accepted procedure. Our vet, who is really a great doctor, will positively not remove the gland since it is necessary to tear production. If you research the 'fix' for cherry eye, I think you'd find this to be true. So, if there is something about this procedure that changes the picture, it should be explained or cherry eye should be a disqualifier.

Shirley


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Maybe you really should call AKC for clarification, because I certainly don't read that portion of the rules as saying they are advocating _removal _of the gland. In fact, they don't specify anything about what is being done to the gland at all, so why are you assuming they mean removal?


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*Not an Assumption*

Kimberly,

Our dog's breeder, who I consider a very good one, got this information from her circle of breeder friends who said that only the removal of the gland is being accepted.

I'd love to call AKC--how do you do that?

Shirley


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Go to AKC.org to get the phone number. It is on their contact page.


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*Phone*

I'll try this, Kimberly, and see how far I can get with a real answer. Your cute little guy looks a lot like Keeper by the way.

Thanks, Shirley


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

They are great at answering questions. Look for the contact number for show information. I can't remember if is specifically listed under Conformation or Show Rules or what, but you'll recognize it when you find the page full of contact information. They list each department with a separate phone number.

Gotta love those cute black & whites!


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*Things*

For sure the black and whites are adorable. Is your little guy an Irish Pied or Parti Color (i'm no expert on either), but Keeper is described as Irish Pied.

Keeper's breeder has decided to question the AKC so I'll let you know what we find out. Also, can't remember if I mentioned that there is no conclusive evidence that this is genetic. It is prevalent in some breeds such as the beagle and Mastiff. It is seen in other breeds but not a lot.


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## Jennifer Clevenger (Jun 26, 2008)

I have heard most are genetic. The others are by injury or irritation. I would not breed a dog with cherry eye without KNOWING if it is genetic or not. It is not worth guessing.


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*Cherry Eye*

Thanks, Jennifer, you and I have met and even talked about a black puppy you had. This is one of Vicki's puppies and we're not breeding, just want to show and haven't heard back from the AKC yet. We're hoping.

Shirley


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## ShirleyH (Sep 13, 2009)

*Answer*

Kimberly, I promised to get back to you with the AKC ruling on the correct 'fix' for cherry eye. After both the breeder and I had contacted the AKC, we got differing answers, 'no' and 'yes' from different people. The outcome is a 'yes' and the admission that this is wording that needs to be clarified.

Thanks again.

Shirley


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