# How many Havs?



## Cbelknap (Sep 17, 2014)

Answer: 2


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Three here...


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## Genie1000 (Apr 13, 2017)

Just one.... so far she's a handful when paired with my Maine **** and now my daughter's Chinese crested powderpuff.


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## Bowie's Mom (Oct 1, 2016)

LOVE the camouflage...just one pillowpet here!


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

One sweet angel. Here's my newest favorite photo of her. Love your photos, all!


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## articshark (Apr 4, 2016)

Just one. lol


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## Marni (Apr 1, 2017)

*1 + 1*

Zoomies pause.


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

Just one. I'd consider a 2nd, but until Perry stops hating my husband, my husband will never consider another one


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Perry still hates your husband? Perry, Perry, Perry, what are you thinking? You are a loving HAVANESE!


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

*hating my husband*



ShamaMama said:


> Perry still hates your husband? Perry, Perry, Perry, what are you thinking? You are a loving HAVANESE!


Well, first I have to say that my husband isn't doing a ton to help change this (he grew up in a culture where "pampering" dogs was not and is not a thing and the way Perry acts makes him feel like he's some sort of monster and he sees no reason to do the things the behaviorist suggested because Perry just needs to behave right).

However, I've also started to see a bit of a pattern and it's really weird. I feel like it's when stress builds up (either that or Perry has multiple personality disorder  ). For example, since he's on crate rest right now, when I get home, I take him out of the crate and then sit on the couch with him. Perry starts out on my left, my husband is on the right side of the sectional. Perry will, every day, jump over to the other side of me, and lie between us, stretched out toward my husband. Depending on the day he'll then sniff at or nudge his hand or throw one of his toys at him (his way of wanting to play). My husband can then pet him (sometimes) as long as he continues to otherwise ignore him. However, if my husband moves, Perry freaks out and jumps back to the other side. Then, on the same day, a few hours later when I take Perry out again, when we come back in or walk across the living room he might (not every day) stop and either bark or growl at my husband - even if my husband doesn't move a muscle sitting on the couch watching tv or doesn't look at him. So, I am wondering if it's a build up of anxiety/ nervousness. Because, when this happens, if I put him back in his crate for 15 minutes or so, he chills out and is fine when he comes back out. I think Perry is generally an anxious pup and needs some alone time to decompress at times.


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## Dee Dee (Jul 24, 2015)

One little delinquent here 0


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## Dee Dee (Jul 24, 2015)

Sorry to hear Perry doesn't like your husband! I wonder what the heck? You have some good theories though.


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

*men*



Dee Dee said:


> Sorry to hear Perry doesn't like your husband! I wonder what the heck? You have some good theories though.


He's not generally fond of men overall - he just reacts at different levels of distrust to them. With one of our guards he would growl through the window at him for months... but then we went to the US for Christmas and when we got back Perry decided he was ok, with the other male guard there was never a problem at all. All male visitors are immediately distrusted (though after time he's started to drop his toys at the feet of the house caretaker occasionally). With one of our vets (male) he was terrified, with the other male vet that we went to last week he wasn't happy, but wasn't totally freaked out (about the same reaction he has to strangers in general, not men specifically) - might have been his size - he was not a big man (though my husband isn't either, he's only about 5'8" but the vet was shorter and slight build). Our main vet is female.


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## smemft (Feb 22, 2017)

*Two...*

Chloe and Chandler napping together:


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## Tux's Mom (May 24, 2016)

Melissa Brill said:


> Well, first I have to say that my husband isn't doing a ton to help change this (he grew up in a culture where "pampering" dogs was not and is not a thing and the way Perry acts makes him feel like he's some sort of monster and he sees no reason to do the things the behaviorist suggested because Perry just needs to behave right).
> 
> However, I've also started to see a bit of a pattern and it's really weird. I feel like it's when stress builds up (either that or Perry has multiple personality disorder  ). For example, since he's on crate rest right now, when I get home, I take him out of the crate and then sit on the couch with him. Perry starts out on my left, my husband is on the right side of the sectional. Perry will, every day, jump over to the other side of me, and lie between us, stretched out toward my husband. Depending on the day he'll then sniff at or nudge his hand or throw one of his toys at him (his way of wanting to play). My husband can then pet him (sometimes) as long as he continues to otherwise ignore him. However, if my husband moves, Perry freaks out and jumps back to the other side. Then, on the same day, a few hours later when I take Perry out again, when we come back in or walk across the living room he might (not every day) stop and either bark or growl at my husband - even if my husband doesn't move a muscle sitting on the couch watching tv or doesn't look at him. So, I am wondering if it's a build up of anxiety/ nervousness. Because, when this happens, if I put him back in his crate for 15 minutes or so, he chills out and is fine when he comes back out. I think Perry is generally an anxious pup and needs some alone time to decompress at times.


My son and grandson came for a visit. They decided that Tux was growling at them because he has been too coddled and acts "like a cat instead of a dog". Nevermind that Tux loves everyone but them. Their first entrance into the house was to stare at Tux with unblinking eyes, then wave their arms in the air and run after him. Unbelievable. I tried to explain they were doing the opposite of what was required to gain trust and alleviate obvious fear in any animal. After they left, I found this video which is invaluable. Maybe your husband could benefit from it. It may take a long time and tons of patience, but worth it in the end. Good luck.


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## Pucks104 (Aug 16, 2012)

Two lovely boys - Leo and Rex.


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## Tux's Mom (May 24, 2016)

Cbelknap said:


> Answer: 2


Half a Hav!


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

Two loved doggies...






Before and







After


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## Marni (Apr 1, 2017)

*Fear in Dogs*



Tux's Mom said:


> My son and grandson came for a visit. They decided that Tux was growling at them because he has been too coddled and acts "like a cat instead of a dog". Nevermind that Tux loves everyone but them. Their first entrance into the house was to stare at Tux with unblinking eyes, then wave their arms in the air and run after him. Unbelievable. I tried to explain they were doing the opposite of what was required to gain trust and alleviate obvious fear in any animal. After they left, I found this video which is invaluable. Maybe your husband could benefit from it. It may take a long time and tons of patience, but worth it in the end. Good luck.
> How To Stop Dog Fear People - YouTube


Honestly, some of my friends and family act so ridiculous around my puppies I feel like staying away for months until they are older. Strangers approach warily and ask permission to touch, friends and family want to jerk them up like they are dolls. Sometimes they look back over their shoulder like, "WHAT?" If I can't be more assertive, we will have to all hide out together.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

You need to learn to "just say no". You are responsible for your dog's well-being.


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## Tux's Mom (May 24, 2016)

Yes I agree on defending your dog, which I do vociferously. The kids live in another state, and the visits are short and infrequent. I have to balance between anger and patience. I hope to get these two "better trained". In the meantime, they have left, Tux still loves a stranger (thank goodness), and we are going to start agility training soon. Tux could use some socialization with other dogs, and more activity. He is quite an athlete and agility seems to be calling.


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Heather's said:


> Two loved doggies...
> View attachment 145210
> Before and
> 
> ...


I admit that I'm a little OCD about the photos. I turned two of your photos and cropped all three. I'm also adding one you posted when Scout turned five!

(Heather, I am making an appointment for Shama to see an orthopedic specialist just in case. My vet agreed with you that it would be worth it to consult an expert given that, as my vet put it, "Shama is not your average couch potato!" I'll start a new thread in the forum after the appointment. Thanks for your PM on that topic.)


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## Tillerys2 (Jan 16, 2017)

Two bundles of fun!


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## Heather's (Jun 18, 2012)

Thank-you ShamaMama for rotating the pics! They look much better right side up! My husband I tried to fix them and finally gave up. 😊


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

*empathetic?*



Tux's Mom said:


> My son and grandson came for a visit. They decided that Tux was growling at them because he has been too coddled and acts "like a cat instead of a dog". Nevermind that Tux loves everyone but them. Their first entrance into the house was to stare at Tux with unblinking eyes, then wave their arms in the air and run after him. Unbelievable. I tried to explain they were doing the opposite of what was required to gain trust and alleviate obvious fear in any animal. After they left, I found this video which is invaluable. Maybe your husband could benefit from it. It may take a long time and tons of patience, but worth it in the end. Good luck.
> How To Stop Dog Fear People - YouTube


As I analyze the situation more and more I am wondering if Perry just has a very finely tuned sense of empathy. I think he is really closely tuned to people's moods but doesn't understand that the mood isn't directed at him (who knows if this is just him or if it's based on his past - as a rescue I have no idea what he experienced in his first year). The reason I'm starting to think this is because my husband is a very internal person. When he's upset he seriously internalizes it - he doesn't rant or rave or yell or stomp around or anything like that, but I know when he's tense or upset or whatever. I think Perry knows too and it scares him when Dawit is not chilled out. This is the only way that I can explain the fact that one day (or even within the same day) he'll sit between us on the couch and will nudge at Dawit's hand or throw his toy (to play) or will let Dawit pet him (all usually provided that Dawit doesn't look at him when he's doing it - that still scares him a little bit) and then another (or another part of the day), he'll shrink away from him or growl or bark when, outwardly, Dawit's not doing anything different (still not looking at him, etc).

The growling and barking have lessened, but the reason I'm really seriously thinking this is because Saturday when I was giving Perry a haircut it came back to the 1000 degree. He wouldn't stand in a way that meant he couldn't look at Dawit, he growled multiple times (even with a calming time out in his crate part way through) --- and at that time Dawit was watching a soccer match - his team was playing and he was a little tense 

Dawit does have to take him out during the day - who knows how that goes  - but it doesn't seem to have changed things much for better or worse.


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## Tux's Mom (May 24, 2016)

Melissa Brill said:


> As I analyze the situation more and more I am wondering if Perry just has a very finely tuned sense of empathy. I think he is really closely tuned to people's moods but doesn't understand that the mood isn't directed at him (who knows if this is just him or if it's based on his past - as a rescue I have no idea what he experienced in his first year). The reason I'm starting to think this is because my husband is a very internal person. When he's upset he seriously internalizes it - he doesn't rant or rave or yell or stomp around or anything like that, but I know when he's tense or upset or whatever. I think Perry knows too and it scares him when Dawit is not chilled out. This is the only way that I can explain the fact that one day (or even within the same day) he'll sit between us on the couch and will nudge at Dawit's hand or throw his toy (to play) or will let Dawit pet him (all usually provided that Dawit doesn't look at him when he's doing it - that still scares him a little bit) and then another (or another part of the day), he'll shrink away from him or growl or bark when, outwardly, Dawit's not doing anything different (still not looking at him, etc).
> 
> The growling and barking have lessened, but the reason I'm really seriously thinking this is because Saturday when I was giving Perry a haircut it came back to the 1000 degree. He wouldn't stand in a way that meant he couldn't look at Dawit, he growled multiple times (even with a calming time out in his crate part way through) --- and at that time Dawit was watching a soccer match - his team was playing and he was a little tense
> 
> Dawit does have to take him out during the day - who knows how that goes  - but it doesn't seem to have changed things much for better or worse.


I would tend to wonder how things go between Perry and Dawit when you are not around. Some people don't have a clue how much like a human these dogs are. They are sensitive because they are really smart. In addition, as you said, they have the ability to "sense". As a rescue, you have no clue what Perry was subjected to. I think it could be a rewarding experience if you found a really good behaviorist (with lots of references) to help all three of you.

If there is anything Perry loves, (eating, games, walks) see if Dawit can take over most of the parts Perry likes that Perry normally shares with you. Tux was wary of my husband when he was really young. I did all the caregiving, so I decided to have my husband start to be the one who fed him. I encouraged him to use the same type of soft "baby voice" that I used (just until Tux relaxed more with him). It worked. The two began to bond, and now Mark is his best BUD! It took paying close attention for awhile, but soooo worth it in the end.


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

Tux's Mom said:


> I would tend to wonder how things go between Perry and Dawit when you are not around. Some people don't have a clue how much like a human these dogs are. They are sensitive because they are really smart. In addition, as you said, they have the ability to "sense". As a rescue, you have no clue what Perry was subjected to. I think it could be a rewarding experience if you found a really good behaviorist (with lots of references) to help all three of you.
> 
> If there is anything Perry loves, (eating, games, walks) see if Dawit can take over most of the parts Perry likes that Perry normally shares with you. Tux was wary of my husband when he was really young. I did all the caregiving, so I decided to have my husband start to be the one who fed him. I encouraged him to use the same type of soft "baby voice" that I used (just until Tux relaxed more with him). It worked. The two began to bond, and now Mark is his best BUD! It took paying close attention for awhile, but soooo worth it in the end.


There is definitely nothing like a behaviorist here in Kampala. We did find one in the US that we went to (but can't do regularly) but that's where the problem with my husband comes in . As I mentioned before, he's from a culture where you don't deal with dogs that way - and the need to do it totally rubs him wrong. But, that being said, he is, slowly, in his own way, doing some of the things that the behaviorist suggested so we are making progress.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Melissa Brill said:


> As I analyze the situation more and more I am wondering if Perry just has a very finely tuned sense of empathy. I think he is really closely tuned to people's moods but doesn't understand that the mood isn't directed at him (who knows if this is just him or if it's based on his past - as a rescue I have no idea what he experienced in his first year). The reason I'm starting to think this is because my husband is a very internal person. When he's upset he seriously internalizes it - he doesn't rant or rave or yell or stomp around or anything like that, but I know when he's tense or upset or whatever. I think Perry knows too and it scares him when Dawit is not chilled out. This is the only way that I can explain the fact that one day (or even within the same day) he'll sit between us on the couch and will nudge at Dawit's hand or throw his toy (to play) or will let Dawit pet him (all usually provided that Dawit doesn't look at him when he's doing it - that still scares him a little bit) and then another (or another part of the day), he'll shrink away from him or growl or bark when, outwardly, Dawit's not doing anything different (still not looking at him, etc).
> 
> The growling and barking have lessened, but the reason I'm really seriously thinking this is because Saturday when I was giving Perry a haircut it came back to the 1000 degree. He wouldn't stand in a way that meant he couldn't look at Dawit, he growled multiple times (even with a calming time out in his crate part way through) --- and at that time Dawit was watching a soccer match - his team was playing and he was a little tense
> 
> Dawit does have to take him out during the day - who knows how that goes  - but it doesn't seem to have changed things much for better or worse.


All dogs are very able to assess people's emotions, and I DO think that is highly honed in Havanese, having been specifically bred as companion animals. So I think that is VERY likely to contribute to the problems between Perry and Dawit. Our dogs, and ESPECIALLY Kodi tune in to tension or unhappiness VERY easily. Now, his response is to want to comfort the person, but he also didn't have the rough beginning of life that Perry had, and was well bonded to his humans at a very early age.

It's hard to know what, if anything, you can DO about it, but it might help Dawit to understand what's going on a bit more.


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## Tux's Mom (May 24, 2016)

Melissa Brill said:


> There is definitely nothing like a behaviorist here in Kampala. We did find one in the US that we went to (but can't do regularly) but that's where the problem with my husband comes in . As I mentioned before, he's from a culture where you don't deal with dogs that way - and the need to do it totally rubs him wrong. But, that being said, he is, slowly, in his own way, doing some of the things that the behaviorist suggested so we are making progress.


I think if Dawit ever had the chance to feel what it's like to have the absolute devotion of a dog, and to understand how much these Havanese really grasp us humans, it could be life changing. My husband has said numerous times, "I never ever thought I would feel this way about a dog. Now I look back on my childhood and feel sorry for the dog we didn't afford the respect he deserved". I feel the same way. As a kid, we had a dog that stayed outside. I never experienced how much a dog can give back if you only give them a chance, and a bit of understanding.

On the Dawit's side, it's hard to warm up to a dog that growls at you. That's where humans have to be the "emotional" guide to the dog with a mistreated past. .......same as you would with a child.


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## smmrwlknsn (Jan 12, 2017)

Just 1 for now but considering getting a sibling for Leela! They are so much fun!!


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## Maistjarna (Oct 15, 2016)

Just one little monster (for now...?)


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## Dee Dee (Jul 24, 2015)

LOVE all these adorable photos!

I have always been a one dog only person but we took in Aunt Edna to help Sophie and her tummy (thinking an older sweet dog would be a calming influence which she was!). I was surprised at how much they bonded and I loved Edna with all my heart but I still really dont like having 2 at once. Now that we lost that sweet girl I dont' plan to get a second again. I like the one on one and so much easier to take her places etc. I am with her all the time so she does have me for company and she has actually been pretty giddy the last 2 days after Edna's passing. She searched like crazy at first but I'm wondering if Sophie getting into Edna's poop  (no matter how hard I tried to monitor it, it happened) is helping her tummy. So there was that worry also.

Interesting discussion on the pups not liking certain people also. Sophie absolutely loves EVERYone but one friend and her husband came over, she is a big gal and very gruff in her tone and mannerisms. I couldn't believe that Sophie was afraid to go up to her. She never did really win her over. Usually I have to peel her off of people and make her mind her manners. They are so intuitive.


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