# Break it to me gently ...



## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

Do I have a WHITE dog? :ear:

not that there is anything WRONG with a white dog, per say, but I just never intentionally wanted a WHITE dog. SO, is Tillie white....? My eyes see her as more of an apricot/cream color ... but then again, I see my 80 lb 6 yr old as a 'baby' ... :biggrin1: 

what do you think??

some pics from this morning...


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## Lizzie'sMom (Oct 13, 2010)

Um, yeah. It's amazing how much color they lose. Lizzie still has some apricot on her back and black on her ears, but she is white, too.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

LOL LYNNE... thanks a lot. hey, at least we BOTH have white dogs, huh??


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

Abby's coat with the exception of her black ear tips is light. It looks white until she is next to McGee whose white is really white! Her back and the part of the tail that had a black streak is sort of a dirty apricot! I've noticed that in a lot of the sables you can only notice the apricot color at certain angles and it doesn't always show up in a picture. Tillie does look lighter than Abby, though.


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## whimsy (Apr 3, 2010)

I would say Tillie is white. Whimsy has lost a lot of her apricot color too, but she looks cream to me compared to Tillie. Her breeder listed her as cream. I will have to post a recent picture to compare her color with Tillie's. Maybe Tillie looks more white because her ear tips are black and its a contrast thing. But, what do I know.LOL
It also depends on the lighting too I think.


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

She's beautiful no matter what color she is. Shelby is black/white but has silvered somewhat - no as much as sime I've seen. Kodi started out as a gold/sable & white. He is now cream/caramel and white.


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## whimsy (Apr 3, 2010)

Take a picture of Tillie next to something white and see how she compares! She's cute no matter what color!!
In this picture my friend is standing next to me in a white shirt. Whimsy looks kind of off-white I guess. Most people would just look at our dogs and probably say they are white . I call Whimsy cream and thats my story and I'm stickin to it I wonder what the shampoos for white dogs have in them???


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## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

I do see some color in Tillie's sides. And I think Evelyn may be right, in that the black contrast makes her look more white elsewhere. Whatever her color, those are cute photos, Tammy!


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## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

I also think of Augie as 'black', until I see him next to a truly black dog! Then he is not so black at all! :biggrin1:


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

yep, white as snow. LOL Molly has apricot, more in the winter.


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## The Fussy Puppy Gang (May 21, 2007)

In that first photo her front (beard, chest, forelegs) look white but her back looks off-white or cream with a tinge of apricot over her spine.

My guess is that most people would call that 'white'.


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

That picture makes her look whiter than any other pictures I have seen of Tillie. I know sometimes my pictures will make Maddie look like a black and white not the Black and Tan she is. Ive also noticed sometimes Zoey has staining on her mouth that doesn't show up in the photo. I do still see her apricot cream I think she has three colors! 
Do try to take a picture of her out doors on a very white surface and background. PS I love all white Havanese I just think they would be the hardest to keep white looking.


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## misstray (Feb 6, 2011)

She looks pretty white in the photos, but sometimes colours don't come out true to life in photos. She's adorable any way.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

okay, you guys are NO help at all! ound:
I will attempt to find something white to take a pic with Tillie .. ha ha ha ha.. ya right... something white.. heck, even our carpet is beige... LOL

Suzi, she does start looking a tad grungy, grey looking by about 7-9 days after her bath! but it depends on how much "FUN" shes been having since her last bath!!


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## gelbergirl (Jun 9, 2007)

I would go with silver, since she has the color on her ears.
(I agree, this looks like an entirely different Tillie from what I've seen before!)


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

gelbergirl said:


> I would go with silver, since she has the color on her ears.
> (I agree, this looks like an entirely different Tillie from what I've seen before!)


It's not Tillie. Tammy got another dog that she didn't tell us about. ound:


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Take heart, Tammy. Ruby was a rather deep red sable till she got close to her first birthday. For the longest time after that, if I referred to her as "red," people would look at me as if I was delusional. Now, as her second birthday approaches -- tomorrow, actually, she is once again dark red, albeit dirty dark red. I suspect it may change again any day.


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## dodrop82 (May 21, 2010)

Tillie looks white to me.....Dave....Molly's white. Boo is white with a little yellow on her ears. Yogi is dirty white with gray in her ears. I didn't want a white dog either! LOL!


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## klf0110 (Jun 30, 2009)

Tillie must have started out as a sable. Its amazing how much they change. I would say she is all of the above. She has some cream on her body and black ear tips but is mostly white. You could just say she is a sable.


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## Luciledodd (Sep 5, 2009)

I say that Tillie is a beautiful white dog.


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

With sables you never know what you'll end up with!


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

LOL. ... DAVE... Molly is WHITE. :yield: :eyebrows: ha ha ha ha.

and YES, it IS Tillie! LOL ... not that I wouldn't LOVE another 1, but seriously, when we were (okay, I was) looking for a hav my husband commented "for that much $$ we could buy a HORSE!!" LOL ya, I don't see him ever. ever. letting us get another 1!! but hey, with all the color change I can PRETEND she is a different dog... just fully trained already!!! ound:

OH and today we went for a FREEZING cold walk (okay it was 40 degrees, but I'm a california girl!!!) and after I had her on my lap and totally saw several dark apricot long hairs on her back, mingled with the 'cream' and long black hairs... I have hope.. maybe she will turn darker by her 2nd birthday like Ruby! 

either way we love her to death. but seriously. I never wanted or THOUGHT I would get a white dog. ha ha ha ha she is Irish Red Peid. sable. cream. white. grey. apricot. she is sweet, smart, funny, tolerant, loving, healthy, beautiful, understanding, she is my Tillie. :angel:


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Ok you guys! She is pretty WHITE to me! And, she is a pretty girl! So, she is going to need a bath more often to keep that white white. 

Colors change with Havs! We love her all the same! White with some black tipped ears, that is what she is and I am not blind!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

LOLOL.Tammy, I so understand your trepidation. When We got Jasper we said we really didn't care what color, but we didn't want a White dog! As you said,not that there is any thing wrong with a white dog,but we did back then have a prejudice against " little yappy white poodle looking dogs" now of course we understand that even the whitest of havs are not yappy little dogs. But at almost 6 years old, we have come to accept that even though he is technically a "fawn sable" Irish pied... And looks like it against a white blanket... To the world he is a "little WHITE dog."

This conundrum is especially hard, I have found,for the men in the house, who really did convince themselves that Havanese are sturdy little dogs..more like medium or large dogs in personality...and certainly not little fuffy white dogs....lol. But in our house,it is my DH who protests if the boys aren't looking quite as fluffy and clean as normal.

So Tilly...sigh...may be many things to you (and those of us who know the subtleties of sables) But to the world, sigh, is a fluffy white dog. but a darn cute one.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

All this white dog prejudice-ness, sheesh...eace:

Gucci is a proud white dog (with her apricot(?) I've always called them blonde ears ) lol The only thing that has really changed is she has more blonde/apricot down on her rump. It is most obvious when she's wet or in person, for some reason, the blonde doesn't show up very well in photographs, I guess the flash washes it out, IDK..

The bright side is I can always spot every little bug, flea, stick, poop ball, any little thing that *may* slip past me on any other color and the RLH is quite hilarious, its like a little white rocket ball of fluff flying through the room! (We just had a serious post bath RLH session, poor thing is pooped and i"m pooped watching her)

Kara


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## whimsy (Apr 3, 2010)

so how many 'little white dogs' do we have on this forum...anyone ever counted???


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

LOL Kara, SOOOOOO true about being able to find things! it is AWESOME! and I have OFTEN been thankful that she is LIGHT colored (ha ha) so I can see all those things, sticks, SLUGS, fleas (gasp!) and of course every leaf known to man on her light coat!!  so, yes, POWER to the little white fluff balls!!  wahoooo!
Oh and BONUS ... all of her nails, except for ONE are clear ... see through.... I can totally SEE the quick. LOL awesome-ness.


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## Lizzie'sMom (Oct 13, 2010)

Lizzie actually has a lot of apricot on her back, but like Kara said it does not translate in pictures. Nothing wrong with white dogs!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

The only thing is Kara, I actually have true white Hav envy. If I'm gonna have a white dog anyway, I would love for jas to have gucci's or molly's beautiful coat. Jas'is fur where he is sable is kinda funky. But love him anyway. Oh. And wouldn't it figure...he only has two white nails.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

2 white nails? lol Now that is pretty cool, I wonder if dogs have individual nails or pads, sort of like we have our fingerprints..does anyone know if this is unique to dogs, too? hmm..I wonder, it would more likely be pads than nails. And tillie has one different nail? wow, I am going to have to look more closely at Gucci and see, I guess I just assumed they were all the same (I don't cut them, but do trim her pads every month, so you'd think I would've noticed) definitely a benefit seeing all the stray things on the coat, lol..

The black nails look weird to me, maybe that is because I am so used to seeing the clear ones

I wonder why the apricot/blonde doesn't photograph well, everyone that has met Gucci in person is always surprised at her blonde ears and rump that are never seen in the pictures.

Kara


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## jessegirl (May 13, 2011)

I hear ya. We thought Rollie was going to be brown. Then we thought he was going to be grey. Then we thought he was going to be brown. Now I think he's going to be champagne. 

But Tillie is so beautiful with those silver ears. I think her coloring is gorgeous!!!!!


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

awwww, thanks Jessica! ... maybe Rollie will one day join the "white dog club"! LOL

and YES the apricot-ish color totally doesn't show in pictures for some reason... and YES I am a tad envious that she isn't white-white. she mostly just looks grungy! LOL but I'm like, that is her COLOR!!!


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

Hi Tammy,

Does Tillie seem apricot to you throughout, or just on the ends of her hair? Ceylon started out as a gold brindle (I think) and has lightened significantly since then, but, he still seems pretty golden to me and even now still has quite a bit of black tipping throughout, not to mention hairs scattered throughout that are black from root to tip. Still, I think he may up almost all 'white' eventually! It will be interesting to see (especially since I, too, didn't originally want a white dog! )

Also, how his color looks in a picture depends a LOT on which type of lighting I take his picture in. Here are two different pics I took just tonight, one that shows him looking very whitish-blonde, and one that is (IMO!) truer to his current golden color .


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

Tillie used to have black tipping also... but she was shaved down in March and of course lost it all at that point. 
Her back is predominatly apricot to the root mostly, although as it gets longer I am seeing some 'banding' where it grows cream for a bit, then goes to apricot and back to cream again! LOL I really see her coloring best when she is getting a bath!  maybe I'll try to take a picture next time... although with my lucky I will either a) drop the camera IN the bath or (b) she will still just look white to the camera! LOL


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## Stacierew (Oct 29, 2011)

She does look white, but she is sooo pretty. She changed her outfit : )


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

TilliesMom said:


> Tillie used to have black tipping also... but she was shaved down in March and of course lost it all at that point.
> Her back is predominatly apricot to the root mostly, although as it gets longer I am seeing some 'banding' where it grows cream for a bit, then goes to apricot and back to cream again! LOL I really see her coloring best when she is getting a bath!  maybe I'll try to take a picture next time... although with my lucky I will either a) drop the camera IN the bath or (b) she will still just look white to the camera! LOL


Doesn't that sort of banding have a name? I forget it at the moment...


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## TnTWalter (May 9, 2007)

side note... Winston had black tipping that was lost also boo hoo his ears still have black tipping....but he had apricot that only I could see once his adult coat came in ... and everyone talked about my 'white' dog....LOL. He has similar coloring to Tillie.

BUT....just in the last year....and he's 4.5 ? now wow time flies... the apricot has popped.... :whoo: but some people still call him a white dog...but some comment on his coloring.

just made him go outside and pose for you... added... no flash really helps with the coloring.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

awesome! thanks Trish for that encouragement! LOL ... Winston definifly looks more apricot than Tillie .. but maybe in another 3 yrs her apricot will pop too!


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## Cherin36 (Sep 2, 2010)

I totally understand how you feel. Chewy and Tillie could be twins. My husband didn't want a small dog but agreed to a Havanese as long as we didn't get a white one. When we got Chew he was very dark, but I kind of knew that he would probably go white but didn't tell my husband that, of course. The funny thing is that now that Chewy is pretty much all white with dark ears, my husband has never mentioned anything about it. They are such besties that I don't even think he has really noticed.


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## DonnaC (Jul 31, 2011)

Baxter started with all apricot ears and apricot tipping (I hesitate to call it sable, but the apricot really was only at the tips of his hair -- I think it may be that the top coat was apricot and the undercoat cream). ANYWAY. . . His ears are growing out -- the apricot is mixing with cream and is more and more at the tips. I'm seeing what looks like an actual, large "spot" of apricot coming up on his side -- don't expect much from that. And, when I bathed him this weekend, I noticed that his new coat has actual threads of a darker color -- probably apricot -- rather than just the tipping. The undercoat, and his topknot and tail -- are bright white with apricot on the ends. Given that he started out mostly cream, I'm not expecting a dramatic change, but it is fun to watch.

Also, I'm a little weirded out by how much this interests me.


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## dodrop82 (May 21, 2010)

LOL Cherin! How precious is that?! Are you ever tempted to make mention???


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## Cherin36 (Sep 2, 2010)

Hi Stacey-
I like to skip over the color issue and a prefer to bring up the fact that had we followed his wishes we wouldn't have Chewy. I always get a "you were totally right" and of course I love that. He calls me "SMother" but he is actually more ridiculous than I am. I have caught him singing and having Chewy play the air guitar. I thought he had lost it.

As for the coloring...I am pretty sure Chewy and Tillie are about the same age. It will be interesting to see if their coats change in the same way. I will post a pic soon so you guys can see how similar they look.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

TnTWalter said:


> side note... Winston had black tipping that was lost also boo hoo his ears still have black tipping....but he had apricot that only I could see once his adult coat came in ... and everyone talked about my 'white' dog....LOL. He has similar coloring to Tillie.
> 
> BUT....just in the last year....and he's 4.5 ? now wow time flies... the apricot has popped.... :whoo: but some people still call him a white dog...but some comment on his coloring.
> 
> just made him go outside and pose for you... added... no flash really helps with the coloring.


HI Trish!!
Wow! Winston has changed color quite a bit, I can't believe he's 4.5, Gucci will be 5 in December....time has flown! seriously!

Love the apricot version of Winston! 

Kara


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## TnTWalter (May 9, 2007)

Kara..crazy I know...good thing we haven't aged! :brushteeth:...I don't post as often as I used to but love to read about all Winston's cyber-friends! LOL.

And it really depends on lighting and camera...sometimes he looks white sometimes not.


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## java (Sep 3, 2011)

dont worry i didnt really intend on having a BLACK dog, but i think java will lighten. Everyone says he's black but he's really a dark chocolate. But you can really only ever tell in the sun. He's got that tanish color on his face, though. 

And everyone sort of said the same thing to me about the $, they were like you could buy a massive tv. And i just say but i didnt want a massive tv i wanted java.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

wait... is THAT Java?? how old is he!? I thought he was a puppy, right??
He looks so 'mature' in those pics!!!


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## heatherk (Feb 24, 2011)

java said:


> dont worry i didnt really intend on having a BLACK dog, but i think java will lighten. Everyone says he's black but he's really a dark chocolate. But you can really only ever tell in the sun. He's got that tanish color on his face, though.
> 
> And everyone sort of said the same thing to me about the $, they were like you could buy a massive tv. And i just say but i didnt want a massive tv i wanted java.


I for one think that my dog is much more entertaining than anything on TV


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

I keep telling myself my baby's are the vacations I haven't gone on in 5 years.


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## java (Sep 3, 2011)

Yeah, that's java. I know the picture where hes looking makes him look a lot older for some reason, his hair doesnt normally stay out of his face like that. But yeah he is just a pup, just made 4 months. Hes just got a lot of hair.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

wow, how much does he weigh!? How big were his parents!?


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## java (Sep 3, 2011)

I'm not sure, but he is 5 lbs.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

oh, that's a nice size for a 4 month old! sounds about right! my girl has always been tiny so I guess my perception of size is a little off!


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## Momo means Peach (Jun 7, 2011)

I was going to say that Java has really grown up and looks so handsome!

Momo is a sable parti. Her ears, when I got her, was black and red and she had a red saddle on her back. Now her ears are black, silver and kind of red but going towards apricot and her saddle is apricot. Also, she has developed some additional apricot coloring surrounding her right ear. I don't have a picture right now to show that. Anyway, I think that people would say that she's white, despite the sableness of her.


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## tootle (Jun 19, 2007)

My Hank was born a gold sable and his saddle was mostly black as a little puppy. At about one year of age, he had turned mostly white. Then a year later, he started turning a beautiful apricot. I've attached some pics to show the change. I love the way Hav's change their colors. You never know


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

wow, that is amazing!!!


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## jillnors2 (Apr 12, 2007)

OMG-that apricot color is gorgeous!!


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## whimsy (Apr 3, 2010)

Hank is so handsome!


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## Pattie (Jun 25, 2008)

I love Hank, E.Ann.


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## Becky Chittenden (Feb 4, 2009)

I wouldn't call Tillie white, though she looks predominately white. Who cares anyway. Was glad to see E. Ann's pictures of Hank. We bred our Inky to Hank, not because of his color, but because he is a really nice dog. It would have been nice to have a different color than black and white in the litter, but didn't matter. What we got were 3 black irish pied and one black parti color. We kept 2, Spot, that you haven't heard much of and Oliver, the parti, that I've mentioned alot. We don't love Spot any less, he'll have his day.


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