# Shampoo



## Lola

Help! What is a good shampoo and detangling rinse for the Havanese. I would like some product recommendations from other owners for the silky Havanese easily tangled coat. Also Lola is black and white but mostly white. 
The white is REALLY hard to keep clean.
Thanks


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## JodiM

I really like the coat handler products.


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## irnfit

I got samples of Plush Puppy and Coat Handlers. So far I used the Plush Puppy on Kodi and it worked really great. It' been a week and his coat is still very soft. Next time I will try Coat Handler to see the difference. 

Shelby is getting a bath tonight and I am going to use Coat Handler on her. She hasn't been bathed because she ws spayed last 10 days ago. It's time!


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## Julie

I use Coat Handler on the black areas and Bio-groom on the white.I wet the white,apply the bio-groom,then leave it sit on there while I do the rest of the body.Then I rub it really really good on areas prone to staining,like the feet,tip of tail,and the mustache.I can keep it all very very nicely white and pretty except for the mustache.I have no cure for that-but I'm still looking!Before rinsing,I scrub the white areas again.Then I use Pet Silk conditioner on him.Between baths,I have a squirt bottle with Pet Silk in it and water that I use for tangles,matts etc.Hope this helps!


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## DAJsMom

I also use Pet Silk conditioner as Julie described. I also use Pet Silk shampoo. I think it's the Clean variety, but I'm not sure. It seems to keep Dusty's white looking white. Except for those darn tear stains!

It's actually the petsilk whitening shampoo and moisturizing conditioner.


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## Rita

Lola,

I think there are a bunch of threads out there that addressed this. Hope it helps. http://www.havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=387&highlight=shampoo

http://www.havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=168&highlight=shampoo

http://www.havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=123&highlight=shampoo


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## JodiM

I may have to try that white shampoo, as Princess' feet are almost impossible to keep clean these days. I swear she looks for the first mud puddle she can see, and runs for it.


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## Lola

Thank you to everyone for all the information and link to other posts. I will try those products listed and check the websites for supplies.


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## dotndani

My breeder says she uses Petfresh shampoo and conditioner on her Havanese and she got it from PedEdge.Hope this helps some!


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## irnfit

Update....I used the Coat Handler products on Shelby last night, and she looks beautiful. She is so shiny and silky. I can't wait to try them on Kodi next. He is the one with the problem coat. But the Plush Puppy has kept his coat nice for a week.


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## LuvMyHavanese

I first tried Royal Treatment (thru HSN) and they are nice products. Then i tried Les Poochs shampoos & conditioners & they are truly wonderful. They really help my furbabies to stay tangle free or make it alot easier to get them out. And they are soooo soft. Besides they smell really good, too.They also sell perfumes too. I have all their products.
Les Poochs has a Pooch Brite Shampoo which helps Dreamer stay white but here in Va-its hard to keep her feet white with all the red mud we have here.


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## traceyrives

Has anybody ever used the Plush Puppy swishy coat? My dog has a very fluffy coat and I'm trying to get it to lay smooth. I bought this stuff, but not sure the best way to use it. Any advice would be appreciated? Tracey


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## SHOWDOWN

irnfit said:


> Update....I used the Coat Handler products on Shelby last night, and she looks beautiful. She is so shiny and silky. I can't wait to try them on Kodi next. He is the one with the problem coat. But the Plush Puppy has kept his coat nice for a week.


IRNFIT WHERE DID YOU GET YOUR COAT HANDLER FROM . I CANT SEEM TO FIND IT. THANKS


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## juliav

Here you go! 

http://www.showdogstore.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=141


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## CapotesMom

So I went to the vet today cause of capote's cold..and I gave him a bath yesterday so he would be smart looking for his fans! The vet complimented his coat..so the stuff I'm using must be doing good. His coat has a bit of a sheen on it after he's clean too..even if he is a puppy. I don't really think the brand or how special it is matters..as long as it has oatmeal in it. I read and the vet told me that the oatmeal keeps their skin in good condition and helps condition their coat naturally..especially as puppies. 

So far so good!


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## irnfit

Showdown,
I did a search online and found it - chrissystems.com. I ordered their sample kit. They have a few different kinds so you have read the descriptions to see which one you want. You get 4 sample size bottles in a nice little zippered pouch.


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## traceyrives

Swishy coat, anybody? Plush Puppy makes it. I haven't used it yet. Got a show coming up this weekend and was needing some advice. I have a big boy, 11 inches, white, with a big coat. Trying to tame it all down. Any suggestions? So far I use Suave clarifying shampoo, chris christenson After Bath. Blow him dry with a comb combing down. Still need help. Thanks, Tracey


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## MopTop Havanese

Tracy~
I would think the clairifying shampoo would make his coat fluff out more, because it's going to strip everything off his coat.
I have not tried the swishy-coat, but I have tried Plush Puppy products. They smell great, but after a few weeks of use, they really made my girl mat.
I would try a leave in conditioner. Coat Handlers condioner is great. You need something to help calm his coat down a bit~~
Let us know how his show goes~ Best of luck!!


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## SHOWDOWN

irnfit said:


> Showdown,
> I did a search online and found it - chrissystems.com. I ordered their sample kit. They have a few different kinds so you have read the descriptions to see which one you want. You get 4 sample size bottles in a nice little zippered pouch.


THANKS


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## Marti

Just browsing and came upon this thread, I've been a Groomer for more than 30 years, dating myself here! My "other" Breed is Afghans! You can imagine the problems we have with thier coats! Anyway, I have been using Espree products, the silky show shampoo and conditioner is great for show grooming, has REAL silk protien in it, Laser lites is great also. Here is a link with some good advice and vendors that carry good Shampoos and Cond. 
http://www.havanesehappenings.com/BathingBasics.html
Hope this helps some!
Marti
Tommy's Mommy


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## dboudreau

Marti: Great advice in your grooming section. Today is bath day for Sam, will try your suggestion.


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## dboudreau

*Shampoo Review!*

With the advice from people on the forum I purchased a new "All in One" pin brush and some "Coat Handler 5 to 1 Maintance Shampoo and 15 to 1 Conditioner".

WOW!!!! I thought Sam's coat was soft before. I can't believe the difference. He feels so much cleaner. I was using "Miracle Coat". No more.

Thank you for the recommendations.


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## Havtahava

Debbie, I'm glad you enjoyed the results of The Coat Handler products. I haven't bothered with the shampoo yet, but I'm hooked on the conditioner. I buy it a gallon at a time (at a 15:1 concentration).


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## JodiM

Hi Marti,
I have a couple of questions for you. 

Your website says that you shouldn't brush out a dirty dog.. but I was under the impression that if you don't brush out your dog, you will have horrible mats after bath time. 
Do you shampoo/condition first, and then brush the dog out? 


It also says to use a slicker brush on the legs, which again, I've heard is a big no-no.
Why do you suggest the slicker on the legs? Doesn't this break the hair causing more matting?

Thanks~ Great site, it will be fun to watch it grow.


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## dboudreau

I have always wondered about that too. "Don't brush a dirty dog and don't bath without brushing first." 

The instructions on the Coat Handler bottle says " No need to pre-brush or pre-demat before bathing. Let the Coat Handler Conditioner do the for for you" And it says to use the conditioner full strengh on the mats, work into mat and leave for five minutes.

So maybe it is not necessary to totally brush out first?


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## vfeldman

Has anyone used Isle of Dogs products?


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## LuvMyHavanese

Sorry, i have never heard of them.


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## JodiM

I haven't, but I've heard great things about the Isle of Dogs detangler. 

I really like the coat handler for everything but the feet on Princess, so I doubt I'll switch.


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## Havtahava

Debbie, I wouldn't recommend it on Havanese (not brushing first). Any water contact seems to set those mats like glue and it is very frustrating to try to remove after a bath.

My interpretation of "don't brush a dirty dog" is that you don't let your dogs get dirty in the first place. I know that sounds bizarre, but if you keep up on brushing and bathing, the coats just stay in much better shape. And if you keep your dog mat-free, you can bathe them as soon as they do run through the sand on the beach, or jump in a river and come back coated in dirt. I have to remove a few leaves and twigs when they are in the bath sometimes, but it sure beats trying to remove mats.


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## JodiM

I wondered about the interpretation of that, although, everyone has a different version of what a clean dog is. 

I try to keep Princess brushed out at least once a day, although occasionally we miss a day (usually because I konked out before I got around to it) ~ and we really pay for it, because she mats easily. (although- the coat handlers products really help that!)

Kimberly- do you spray the mats before you brush them out? 

I currently try to break them apart with my fingers, then I spritz, brush and repeat the whole process all over, until it's gone.


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## Havtahava

I usually try to remove all mats with my fingers. After that, I brush to separate the hairs. I haven't had a mat that I couldn't remove with my fingers in a long time, thankfully. 

I know people say to not dry brush a dog, but I find that damp/misted pulls the hair more than brushing it dry, no matter what product I've tried. Maybe I'm not doing it correctly. I prefer to brush it first and then mist with a light conditioner if needed.


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## irnfit

Remember NO MORE TANGLES for kids. Do they still make it, and would it work on the mats?


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## Havtahava

Jodi, you said that you like The Coat Handler for everything but the feet on Princess. What do you prefer for feet? Does TCH do something to her feet hair that you didn't like? (I'm not looking for a change. Your comment just piqued my curiosity.)


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## JodiM

I don't use anything else for her feet, yet. 

She has staining, and the TCH doesn't seem to work well on it.

I wouldn't mind recommendations for a whitening shampoo, or stain remover (hint, hint  )


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## Havtahava

For staining on white hair, I really like EZ-Groom's Crystal White Shampoo, but you _must_ follow the directions and you can't use it with every shampoo.

That's the most concise directions I can give. It has done wonders for my girls with white coats.


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## LuvMyHavanese

I use Pooch Brite by Les Poochs. It works great & smells good too. I heard about it from a groomers forum. I just love their products!!


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## JodiM

Havtahava said:


> For staining on white hair, I really like EZ-Groom's Crystal White Shampoo, but you _must_ follow the directions and you can't use it with every shampoo.
> 
> That's the most concise directions I can give. It has done wonders for my girls with white coats.


I bet that's what my breeder told me to get - I kept doing a search for Easy Groom. 

I'll order some, I want Princess to look her best for her first show. 

Thanks!


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## marjrc

Kimberly wrote: *"I know people say to not dry brush a dog, but I find that damp/misted pulls the hair more than brushing it dry, no matter what product I've tried. Maybe I'm not doing it correctly. I prefer to brush it first and then mist with a light conditioner if needed."*

That's what I do with Ricky as well. When he's wet, the hair tangles SO quickly and it's heck to comb him out. I dread bathtime now. 

I am waiting for my order to come in. Got some Ice on Ice detangler spray. I use "Groomer's Edge" shampoo and conditioner, but I dont' think it's all that great. Might be time to try something else.

Sammy's hair is straight and silky so he's easy to groom. 

Marty, thanks for the link! I really enjoyed reading about your advice for grooming. I have it bookmarked and will no doubt refer to it again.


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## irnfit

I only spray the conditioner directly on the mat and work it in. It makes it a little easier to remove that way. I don't brush damp either. After I get out all the mats and thoroughly brush, I will spray something on to take the hair. I have to do that with Kodi, because he has a wavy, bushy coat. Shelby has a staight coat and is much easier to take care of.


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## CapotesMom

I'm ordering the coat handler stuff now..hopefully it works on capote. I got this..comb thing that finds mattes that I didn't even know exhisted! and trying to get them out is TORTURE for him! I feel like the meanest person ever when I have to physically hold him down so I can comb through one..which is what I did tonight. He hasn't even started blowing coat yet! I'm TERRIFIED of that day!! :faint:


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## CapotesMom

well I got the coat handler series. the dilution for it is 15 to 1. I used that dilution and the shampoo was watery and barely broke a lather and the conditioner was like..conditioner water that didn't make a bit of difference on capote's coat. I added more to the next batch but do any of ya'll have a formula ya'll use for diluting it?


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## marjrc

Yeah, I'm not a fan of diluting. I use Groomer's Edge and it needs to be diluted which I just think is a pain. More often than not, I just use the stuff undiluted because I feel like it cleans better.

Still have to find a better shampoo and conditioner though..... still looking!


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## radar_jones

Hey can you get the Coat Handler in Canada?? I'm not sure if anyone else posted that FAQ I'm sure. Is it a good product. Radar is all Cream and when he gets out in the dirt he's gonna get messy...reaal messy.

Derek


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## CapotesMom

you can order it online so I don't see why not...


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## mintchip

*Shampoos*



radar_jones said:


> Radar is all Cream and when he gets out in the dirt he's gonna get messy...reaal messy.
> 
> Derek


I've seen shampoos for black or white dogs--but never anything for cream colored dogs (and I've been looking and asking)I've even had a groomer want to put a whitening shampoo on Oliver, he is champagne and cream. :doh: 
Any ideas welcome!!
Sally


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## Leslie

I use Coat Handler on Shadow. I'm very happy w/their products. Groomer's Choice has an introductory offer for $35 which includes:

•	16oz. Coat Handler Conditioner.
•	16oz. 15:1 Shampoo Concentrate.
•	16oz. 5:1 Premium Shampoo Concentrate.
•	12oz. Sensational Detangler Finishing Spray.
•	1 lb. Odor Handler.
•	1/4 oz. Skin Works.

Here's the link:

http://www.groomerschoice.com/ord_shampoo_ch-intro-offer.html

~Leslie


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## CapotesMom

Does everyone else just use the shampoo and conditioner without diluting them?


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## good buddy

CapotesMom said:


> Does everyone else just use the shampoo and conditioner without diluting them?


I did Rufus' bath yesterday and I used the Pure Paws Shampoo and the Coat Handlers conditioner. Both needed to be diluted so I premixed and labeled them in cheap spray bottles that I got from Walmart for a dollar. That way, I was all ready to go! I found that having the products diluted in advance made them easier to use. The shampoo I sprayed into my hands and rubbed it up a bit before applying to wet dog...the conditioner is a leave in one so it was very easy to spritz him after toweling him off a bit and the comb went through his coat quite easily. :whoo:


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## Thumper

I just have to put a plug in for this new product I got that is phenomenal! I'm using it for daily brushings and Gucci's coat feels like silk and looks better than ever.

http://www.showdogstore.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=415

It also has a sunscreen in it to protect our doggies from the harsh rays. Love it!

Kara


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## SMARTY

I'm using the PetSmart 8to1 no tears and their 8to1 clear conditioners. I never delute. I pour a small amount into my hands, rub all over the wet dog and then lather. I agree it seems when I delute I keep trying to get a good lather, it takes to long to get Smarty clean with the deluted mixture.


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## irnfit

I haven't diluted my products, yet. Next time I am going to try them diluted. I am using Plush Puppy.

Kara, I am going to order the Mink Oil and will let you know how it works for me. I haven't seen it anywhere near me.


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## Thumper

Its really great! And I like the fact that it has a sunscreen in it too, Gucci's skin is pink.

I was worried it would be too greasy or oily, but its really not. Good stuff.

Kara


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## Julie

I have tried almost 10 different whitening shampoos and I just got a new one that I'm currently trying.So far I have used it twice with pretty good results...Kelco Plum White.To date the best one for us has been the Bio-groom whitening.I prefer Coat handlers for the body,and definitely Coat handlers conditioner.I do not dilute any of my dog shampoos or conditioners for bath time.
I did try TOMLYN SHO SNO whitening shampoo----don't waste your money.:nono:


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## good buddy

Julie said:


> I do not dilute any of my dog shampoos or conditioners for bath time.


I may have forgotton to mention that the only reason I dilute mine is because I bought the concentrate and it said to. :bathbaby:


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## Julie

Christy-
Mine says you are supposed to also....I just don't.I use a smaller amount and rinse really well.:biggrin1:


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## good buddy

Julie said:


> Christy-
> Mine says you are supposed to also....I just don't.I use a smaller amount and rinse really well.:biggrin1:


Oh! Haha! I thought maybe I was talkign concentrate and you were having the premixed variety! Well, I don't have much experience yet..so maybe I will try it your way a time or two as well and see which way works out better for Rufus. :biggrin1:


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## radar_jones

I'm gonna look into getting the Coat Handler Shampoo Online and see what kinda deal I can get.

Derek


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## radar_jones

*Link*

http://www.senproco.com/coathandler/index.html


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## marjrc

Derek, I sometimes order from The Pet Supply House, in Canada because they're prices are pretty good and shipping is cheap.

Paige, thanks for the link to PetEdge, but shipping here costs a bundle and the deals aren't so good after you factor that in. Bummer!! They have great prices, even if it's U.S. funds.

Here's the link to PSH...... http://www.petsupplyhouse.com/index.htm

Click on the 'webstore' and you can type in Coat Handler in the search box. You can also call to place your order if you aren't comfortable putting your credit card online. I've had fast and good service every time so far.


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## dboudreau

mintchip said:


> I've seen shampoos for black or white dogs--but never anything for cream colored dogs (and I've been looking and asking)I've even had a groomer want to put a whitening shampoo on Oliver, he is champagne and cream. :doh:
> Any ideas welcome!!
> Sally


"Bio-Groom" has a "Bronze Lustre" color enhancing shampoo for Brown, Tan & Red Coats. I haven't tried it so I don't have any first hand experience with it.


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## Thumper

Or, you could try the Gold on Gold by Chris Christensen;

https://www.showdogstore.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=443


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## LuvMyHavanese

Actually i had groomers tell me that whitening shampoos will even brighten black coats. Dreamer is black & white & i have to use a whitening shampoo on her to counteract the yellowing she gets from the sun,dirt etc...I also use it on Tripp to brighten his coloring & it works great. He is a creamy, red brindle color. Dont worry, it wont turn your dog white!!


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## mintchip

*shampoo*

I wasn't thinking he would turn white....I was thinking it might be to harsh for him due to the "whitening factor":biggrin1:
PS- I don't recall who told me that it would dry his coat and skin out to much :suspicious: :ear:


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## LuvMyHavanese

mintchip said:


> I wasn't thinking he would turn white..


I know, i was just kidding!!:laugh: I thought it would dry them out too but i havent had any problems with what i use & i use it on her almost every time & Tripp about every 3-4 times i bathe them. I have heard some horror stories(Kimberly!) and others about dryness & dogs turning purple!


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## dboudreau

dboudreau said:


> With the advice from people on the forum I purchased a new "All in One" pin brush and some "Coat Handler 5 to 1 Maintance Shampoo and 15 to 1 Conditioner".
> 
> WOW!!!! I thought Sam's coat was soft before. I can't believe the difference. He feels so much cleaner. I was using "Miracle Coat". No more.
> 
> Thank you for the recommendations.


It has been two months since I started using the "Coat Handler" Products and they don't seem to working any more. His coat is getting very dry and matting easily. I don't know if he is going through another coat change. (He is 18 months old.)

Is it a good idea to switch products periodically like with human hair?

Anyone else have this problem?


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## Julie

I don't know what the answer would be Debbie.I continue to have really good luck with the Coat Handlers,and PetSilk,though I do shake it up a bit by trying other whitening shampoos.The conditioners I rarely try anything different,as I find one I like,I just stay with it.Perhaps Sam is going through another coat change?Some say that can be up until they are 3 yrs.of age.eace:


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## irnfit

I just tried Isle of Dog shampoo and conditioner on Shelby last night. While her coat is pretty easy to handle, she doesn't mat too badly, this shampoo made her hair brighter and so silky soft. However, the real test will be today when I bathe Kodi. He is the one with the problem coat. I read a couple of articles about the Isle of Dog products and I picked up a trail size kit. The article said that at shows, people are lined up at their booth to get their products.


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## Havtahava

Debbie, I switch periodically. My main choices are Pure Paws Shampoo and The Coat Handler Conditioner, but maybe once a month or less, I use another product for a fresh wash.

Shannon, yeah, purple hair is cute, but not exactly what I was hoping to get back when my little girl came home. 

On dilution...
I don't follow the exact dilution rates, but I do dilute them a little bit, especially the Pure Paws Reconditioning Shampoo because it has a very thick, gummy consistency. For The Coat Handler's conditioner, I dilute and pour over the dog and then barely rinse the dog at all. It's a leave-in product.

Michele, I just saw the Dog of Isle products at a show last weekend. After you have used it for a few months, I'd love to hear what you still think of it. I'm always intrigued by the new lines, but quit buying them all after I found the two I like most.


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## irnfit

Kimberly, I'll definitely let you know about the shampoo. Like I said, I used it on Shelby, and she's the easy coat. My true test comes tonight when Kodi gets his bath. I was going to take him to the groomer, but I want to try this product myself.


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## Leeann

Debbie, I too am having a problem with Riley, he is 16 months and just seems to be dryer and matting so much more. I have also tried Coat handlers with no luck, it seems to leave a build up on his coat.

I took him to a groomers back in Feb. for a conditioning & hot oil treatment that was great I had no mats for 3 weeks yes 3 whole weeks of no matting it was great but cost me $80.00 I wish I knew what they used. Anyone have any suggestions??

Jan had mentioned in another thread about Neutrogena Triple Moiture silk leave in conditioner. I have been using this for about a month now and is has made a life a lot easier. It is nice and light and with Riley's massive amount of hair I need something that does not build up.

Another question does anyone add Salmon oil to there kids diet's? In the new KV Vet supply book they have Grizzley salmon oil that is suppose to be good for their heart, skin & coats has anyone tried this? I was thinking of ordering some.


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## mintchip

JodiM said:


> I may have to try that white shampoo, as Princess' feet are almost impossible to keep clean these days. I swear she looks for the first mud puddle she can see, and runs for it.












Oliver is the same!! Those paws are really hard. (esp. when the rest of him is clean) Any hints you can share with me :ear: 
Sally


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## irnfit

Leeann, I know exactly what you are going through. Kodi has been matting like crazy for weeks. He is 19 mos. This is a pic of him right after his bath today.


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## Leslie

Leeann- My breeder recommends salmon oil. She gives it to all her adult dogs. I've been looking for it in the stores here, but not had any luck. Is there a website for the KV Vet supply you mentioned?


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## Leeann

Wow Michele look at all that gold coloring in Kodi, he always looks so white when dry. I can see all those little mats on him also, looks like you had your work cut out for you today. That is the exact same way Riley is, I can brush & brush before a bath and as soon as he get's wet it's mat city..

Leslie - www.kvvet.com I just got a catalog in the mail, so I have not ordered yet but I see they also have the Red barn bully stick's for $4.79, I paid almost $8.00 at the pet store for those. I know everything is cheaper when ordering but I get so impatient and love to spoil my boys..


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## irnfit

Kodi was a gold/sable when I got him, but most of it faded. Some of it has come back now, and when he is wet, you're right, he looks gold. When he dries he is white and them will look cream. His hair is very wavy, so I tink that makes the matting worse.


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## mintchip

Kodi is adorable!
I give Oliver salmon oil and he loves it! He likes to lick the bowl clean
(I have to add it to his food a little early so it will soak into the food otherwise it gets his moustache sticky and oily)


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## LuvMyHavanese

I love Kvvet. I just ordered a bunch of stuff from them. I give my pups salmon oil in their food. I have used Grizzly & Kronch brands. I dont see a whole lot of difference between the two. But my dogs have very nice coats. My breeder could not believe how nice their coats(and them!) looked.
I just got my Ice on Ice spray & pin brush from Chris Christensen Monday & so far i love them both.


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## Havtahava

> Another question does anyone add Salmon oil to there kids diet's? In the new KV Vet supply book they have Grizzley salmon oil that is suppose to be good for their heart, skin & coats has anyone tried this? I was thinking of ordering some.


Yes, I use Kronch salmon oil. I tried Grizzly one time, and just as I was warned, it leaves a stronger scent on the dogs than the Kronch does. I always have a bottle of Kronch in the fridge and just ordered a few more. (By the way, Kronch comes from Denmark, so check the prices before you buy. They vary greatly by web sites.)


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## LuvMyHavanese

I'm sorry, i just meant a difference in how well they work . I have read people love one or the other, but Grizzly is stronger scented!!
Kimberly, dont you just love those salmon oil kisses!!









Amazon has a good price on the 17 oz but on larger bottles(35.2 oz), i found puplife.com or sitstay.com prices much better.


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## Julie

I have never of this before....A few questions:
How much do you add to the food?Daily?Weekly?
How do you keep it off the mustache?
Does dog shampoo cut through the grease?
Thanks in advance......


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## Havtahava

Shannon, funny you should ask. My dogs have Salmon kibble (Fromm), so I don't notice the smell at all; however, my dad has been over a lot lately and everytime one of the dogs comes up to give him a kiss, he says "Mmmmm, salmon!" LOL



> I have never of this before....A few questions:
> How much do you add to the food?Daily?Weekly?
> How do you keep it off the mustache?
> Does dog shampoo cut through the grease?
> Thanks in advance......


Julie, I just add a pump of the oil per dog per meal. My dogs lick it off themselves. It doesn't stay on their face. One of my dogs gets a little higher dose (2-3 pumps per meal) because she has dry skin and it was recommended by her vet for another reason as well.


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## Leeann

Thanks Kimberly one more question please. Right now my boys are eating chicken Fomm’s and I was thinking of trying the Salmon next, should I still give the oil when feeding the salmon kibble?

Thank you everyone for all the info, this has been a great help. I am very lucky to have a holistic pet store near me that caries everything under the sun at good prices they even have the giggle veggies for only $5.00 ea. They are closed for the holiday but I am going to call Monday to see they have the Kronch brand.


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## Havtahava

It depends on _why_ you are giving the salmon oil. If you just want the added benefit of the Omegas, you can check the dietary listings at Fromm's web site to see if it naturally comes with the salmon blend. If your dogs have dry skin or if your vet has recommended it, then I don't think the salmon kibble has enough to make a difference. I add the oil in addition to the kibble to get the extra amount I need for my dog.

Leeanne, the full name is Lakse Kronch Salmon Oil, but I think a lot of businesses shorten it to Kronch Salmon Oil. (Just in case they say they don't have it, but they have another brand.)

Oh, and if buying it in a store, look at the expiration date before you purchase it. If it has been sitting on the shelf a while, it may lose some integrity.


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## Doggie Nut

Kimberly...this is off the subject.....love all your pups on your avatar but esp. Hillary.....she is gorgeous....love her face.....rather regal!


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## LuvMyHavanese

Doggie Nut said:


> Kimberly...this is off the subject.....love all your pups on your avatar but esp. Hillary.....she is gorgeous....love her face.....rather regal!


They are all gorgeous but I just LOVE Tinky!! Something about that sweet face just makes me melt! Dont tell my pups!!:focus:


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## Havtahava

Vicki, Hillary really does have a regalness about her. I can't ever get any goofy playful photos of her because she loves to sit and watch things or be perched up high or laying against someone's chest. She has an elegance about her (and I don't just mean body structure) that is unique. Nevermind the fact that black dogs are so difficult to photograph!

Shannon, Tinky's much easier and fun to photograph. She will even make faces. She's a nut. (And Martha will jump up and try to take the camera, so it's just hopeless.)


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## LuvMyHavanese

Elegant, Thats how i always describe Dreamer. She also likes to just sit back & watch. She rarely lets loose-when she does i never have my camera around or she stops when i move to get it!!


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## Leeann

Thanks again Kimberly, I am just looking for the added benefits of the Omega. I will check the Fromm's website and the exp. date if I purchase from a store (great advise).


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## Doggie Nut

Kimberly, does Hillary still have pups??:biggrin1:


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## Havtahava

Vicki, do you know something I don't know? :ear: Hillary is too young to have puppies.


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## Doggie Nut

Ooooh! Well, how long before she can have babies??:baby: :eyebrows:


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## Havtahava

Not until the end of this year.


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## Doggie Nut

Cool! Do you know who the Daddy will be yet?reggers:


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## Havtahava

We have a few options, but I won't decide that for a while.


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## LuvMyHavanese

irnfit said:


> I just tried Isle of Dog shampoo and conditioner on Shelby last night. While her coat is pretty easy to handle, she doesn't mat too badly, this shampoo made her hair brighter and so silky soft. However, the real test will be today when I bathe Kodi. He is the one with the problem coat. I read a couple of articles about the Isle of Dog products and I picked up a trail size kit. The article said that at shows, people are lined up at their booth to get their products.


:bump:

Michele, i was just wondering if you still are using Isle of Dog products. I just got the sample pack w/grooming spary & i used it on Tripp who is going thru the blowing coat stage. I really do love it so far. Possibly even better than Les Poochs that i have been using. His coat does seem brighter & he is soooo soft & is just like silk. I have only used it 1 time, so we will see. Their products are VERY expensive so i thought i would get your opinion before i order the liter sizes. Thanks!!


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## Lola

What does "blowing coat" mean. I have seen it referred to a few times in this thread.


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## irnfit

Shannon, I am still using the Isle Of dog products and I still love them. In fact, I just ran out. I especially like the Detangler. Yes, they are expensive. I had the sample kit, used it for 3 baths on both dogs. I think they are worth the money. 

I also had a sample kit of Plush Puppy - Conditioning Shampoo, Silk Protein Cond, Swishy Coat and Protein Coat Balm. I haven't used the Swishy Coat, but it is recommeded for flowing coat breeds. The samples kit is 500ml (?) of shampoo and cond in a nice pump bottle. The fragrance is great, too.


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## LuvMyHavanese

Oh, just wait!!! It means they are losing their puppy coat & getting their adult coat. That transition varies but can take several months. During that time(for most) it means SEVERE mats if you dont keep up with it daily. Tripp never had a mat until one day he was covered. I could brush him 3 times a day & he would still get mats. It started when he was approx 10 months old. It is getting better(i think!).


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## irnfit

I don't know why they call it blowing coat...it doesn't blow anywhere. :biggrin1: It just makes a matted mess in the puppies. :frusty: I had it very easy with Shelby up until now. She is 10 mos and blowing coat. No where near as bad as Kodi did, but still a nuisance.


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## LuvMyHavanese

irnfit said:


> I also had a sample kit of Plush Puppy - Conditioning Shampoo, Silk Protein Cond, Swishy Coat and Protein Coat Balm.


Where did you get the Plush puppy kit? Is it from a place i could try it? Have you tried the Evening Primrose oil spray or just the grooming spray?


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## irnfit

Sorry, I don't remember which website I got it from. I'll try to find out. I haven't tried the sprays, either.


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## maryam187

Just wondering: when they are blowing coats if it's a good idea to keep them in a short cut until they're through with it. Does that help at all against that crazy matting madness?
Maryam.


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## LuvMyHavanese

Thats ok, i can google it!! Thanks!


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## LuvMyHavanese

maryam187 said:


> Just wondering: when they are blowing coats if it's a good idea to keep them in a short cut until they're through with it. Does that help at all against that crazy matting madness?
> Maryam.


It will if you want your dog to have a short coat. I wanted the coat to stay long, so i suffered thru it. Tripps coat is gorgeous & i just didnt have the heart to cut it off. I had considered it though!:frusty:


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## maryam187

Shannon,
yeah, I guess that makes sense. I just don't know if I'll have the nerves to brush my puppet more than 3 times a day, yikes! I was thinking the short cut for a short time would help the dog and myself...after all, hair does luckily grow again. But I totally understand the aesthetic problem...sigh.
Maryam.


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## irnfit

Shannon, it's plushpuppy.net. Click on starter kits. It wasn't cheap, but the quantity is probably double any other bottle of shampoo/cond you would get.


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## KarenG

*Karen Granholm*

I use Plum Silky by Natures Specialties. It smells soooooooooo wonderful and leaves the coat so silky smooth and soft. In a pinch I will rinse with The Coat Handler, coat conditioner, but only if they require a bit of extra conditioning. Otherwise, the Plum Silky is all that is needed.


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## LuvMyHavanese

Well, i didnt brush him 3 times a day, but i should have!! He would run when i took the brush out!


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## LuvMyHavanese

Welcome Karen!! You should start a new thread to properly introduce yourself so we can all say hi!! Oh we need LOTS of puppy pictures if y ou have them!!:welcome:


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## juliav

Hi Karen and :welcome: to the forum!!!

Did anyone mention yet that we love puppy pictures!!!


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## DAJsMom

I'll share our blowing coat experience. Dusty started it rather late-more like 13-14 months (her breeder had told me that Dusty's mom was slow to get her adult coat also). I didn't have to brush her three times a day, but definitely every day. Much more hair was coming out in the brush than usual, and I could see new hair coming in (slightly coarser texture-more shiny). She would mat in one place for a week and then that would suddenly stop and she'd be getting mats in some other place that she'd never had any before. This went on until a couple of weeks ago (she's 17 months now) and she has suddenly stopped matting so much. I can skip a couple of days of brushing and have no problem when I get to it again. She is not done getting new coat, so I don't really know what changed, but it's nice! I noticed about a week ago that she had a bunch of new hair coming in around her eyes! I can tell because she was originally dark around her eyes and has turned completely white. The new hairs are dark, but given what we've seen so far with her, they will be dark on the tips and then be white further down. It's interesting to say the least! We've kept her in a full coat through all this, but it does take persistence with brushing! I was getting tempted to get her a trim a month ago, but now it's much better.


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## KarenG

*Karen Granholm*

Hi Shannon,

Thanks for your note. I would love to start a "new thread" but I could use some help as I am not sure what that is. I am just starting to navigate around this forum. It was referred to me by a customer of mine who owns a Havanese. I am a pet sitter of small dogs here in South Surrey BC and have several Havanese that stay with me on a regular basis. I absolutely loooooooove the breed. I have two shih-tzu's and a toy poodle and get my Havanese fix vicariously through others. I will post some picutres of my guests but first I will ask the owners if that is OK to do. I can post pictures of my three though but since this is a Havanese forum I will wait till I get owners permission and then share with everyone. In the meantime, I hope I can share some of my experiences with this breed and be of help in some small way.

Thanks for your response.

Karen


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## LuvMyHavanese

Karen, if you click on the 'forums' link up top then pick you group heading, probably 'general discussions' would work for this. Click on that then you will see where it gives you the option on top to start a 'new thread'. Its really quick & easy to do. Pick your title & then fill in the rest! You can set up your avatar pics etc.. later if you would like.
Hope this made sense!


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## LuvMyHavanese

Now, to do show us pictures you will need to click on the 'go advanced' button below & you should see the link to clik on to add pictures. To add a pic to your avatar or signature(like most of us did) you do that under the 'user cp' link at the top of the page & you will see the options at the upper side under 'settings'. whew!


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## marjrc

irnfit said:


> I don't know why they call it blowing coat...it doesn't blow anywhere. :biggrin1: It just makes a matted mess in the puppies. :frusty:


I agree, Michele!!! If we could just stick the pup outdoors on a windy day and be done with it, life would be so much easier.

But "if life were like that, you wouldn't need a Visa card." ... to buy all the grooming products we need! LOL


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## marjrc

maryam187 said:


> Shannon,
> yeah, I guess that makes sense. I just don't know if I'll have the nerves to brush my puppet more than 3 times a day, yikes! I was thinking the short cut for a short time would help the dog and myself...after all, hair does luckily grow again. But I totally understand the aesthetic problem...sigh.
> Maryam.


Oh, absolutely, Maryam! Ricky started getting mats like crazy in his cottony, thick, wavy hair and I had to get him cut down to an inch after one especially difficult time after a bath. It had taken me over 2 hrs. to only get him half dried and half combed. :frusty: I said "enough"! I started trimming him myself, but a month later, I brought him in for a puppy cut and have NO regrets at all. :whoo:

We have at least one whole thread on 'puppy cuts' http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=625&highlight=puppy with pictures posted to give people ideas. I brought a photo with me and made sure the groomer understood what I wanted. I was 95% satisfied which is great! The only thing, is that Ricky's lovely long ear hairs were cut a bit too much for my liking. Within one short week, though, he looked perfect!  In fact, he's due for another cut so I think I'll try doing it myself.


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## Posh's Mom

Okay everyone my "package" arrived today. It is a Chris Christensen experience. I have gold on gold, thick n thicker, after bath, and ice on ice.

I'll let you know after tomorrow's bath.


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## Lynn

I learned a new one on shampoo here this week....I thought I would share next time the subject of shampoo comes up.

I have been using Vellus show dog products for along time, reorder a few times, very happy with them. Well, Casper must be blowing coat again....his coat has been so difficult this winter. I thought I would try the Coat Handlers, everyone talks about using...so I ordered some.

I have been using Vellus on Casper and Missy, but this week I used coat handlers first on Missy and I was not impressed. She has a silky coat and I thought it made it drier and not as shiny. Then I used the coat handlers on my cotton ball (that is what I call him) Casper and I loved it. He was really soft and his hair was easier to manage this week.

So...my lesson different products for different dogs with different coat type and I also know their coats are always changing, so I need to be fexible.


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## irnfit

Lynn, I agree about the coat types. Pretty much anything I use on Shelby's silky coat makes her look good. I found that Eqyss didn't keep her as white as some of the other shampoos. But she gets great results with just about every shampoo I have used. Her last bath I used California Baby on her and I loved it.

Kodi is a different story. He did fine with Eqyss and the Pantene, but I like Isle of Dog the best for him. It seems to keep him cleaner for a longer time.


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## Havtahava

Amy, I hope the CC products work for you. Several of us had the coats start drying out with regular use of that brand. If you know that ahead of time, you can keep an eye out for it.


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## Jane

Havtahava said:


> Amy, I hope the CC products work for you. Several of us had the coats start drying out with regular use of that brand. If you know that ahead of time, you can keep an eye out for it.


Ditto. The ice on ice was especially drying - I would use it sparingly!

Lynn, Scout is also on the silkier side. For after shampooing, I use Nature's Specialties Remoisturizer with Aloe conditioner with good results. For Lincoln's more puffy, cottony coat, the Coat Handlers is wonderful. Glad you found something that works for your dogs!


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## Lina

I've already posted this on the Kubrick's first cut page but I am SO impressed with the Eqyss products right now. Kubrick feels and looks wonderful! It's 100x better than the Coat Handler for him.


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## LuvMyHavanese

irnfit said:


> Pretty much anything I use on Shelby's silky coat makes her look good. But she gets great results with just about every shampoo I have used.
> Kodi is a different story. He did fine with Eqyss and the Pantene, but I like Isle of Dog the best for him. It seems to keep him cleaner for a longer time.


I agree Michele. Tripp is so cottony/fluffy. Pantene did not do well for him. Even though he felt silky his coat was very dry & flyaway. Isle of Dog and Les Poochs has worked best for him. I do have to agree that Ice on Ice has been very drying for Tripp. I stopped using it.
I can use just about anything on Jax & he will feel fabulous. He is so silky soft & smooth. Dreamer is silky too but she yellows easily. So far Isle of Dog has been my favorite but its $$$. I will use cheaper Pantene on Jax since it seems to work well on him. But he is starting to blow coat  so we will see.

I love trying new shampoos as long as they smell good!


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## maryam187

Lina, which products of the Eqyss line do you use? I have the Avocado Mist spray that Pablo MAY be allergic to, hasn't been obvious yet. I remember you said you were allergic to Avocado...


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## Lina

Maryam, I am allergic to avocado, nice memory! 

I actually use the Premier Shampoo and Cream Conditioner as well as the Survivor Detangler Shine (for use on either wet or dry coats). None of these have the avocado in them, so I do fine with it.

Why do you think Pablo is allergic to the Mist? Does he scratch a lot after you use it?


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## maryam187

Lina, he turned *very pink* w/o being hot or itchy for a few days sometime after I used the spray. But I'm not sure if it had to do with the spray, so I'll have to try it again and se what happens.


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## Lina

How odd! I would also try it once again and see if the same thing happens. If it does, then at least you know not to use it!


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## irnfit

I didn't have good results with Coat Handlers, either.


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## Lynn

irnfit said:


> Kodi is a different story. He did fine with Eqyss and the Pantene, but I like *Isle of Dog the best for him. It seems to keep him cleaner for a longer time.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> Michele,
> this caught my eye....keeps him cleaner longer:biggrin1: think I am going to have to try it! I am going to try Eqyss and Isle of Dog next....I am into dog shampoos and conditioners lately.


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## Moko

*I should take out Stocks in Shampoo Companies!*

I swear that in another month, I'll be able to start my own doggie shampoo store! ound:

Although I haven't yet had any TERRIBLE results on Molly with any shampoo I've tried, like all of you, I'm looking for the best I can find to keep her clean and healthy and GORGEOUS!

We used Coat Handler today after she came inside DRIPPING with MUD, but for some reason she didn't smell as fresh as she usually does after a bath.

So...I hosed down the poor sweetie one more time! I KNOW she's squeaky clean now, but I'm wondering if switching off now and again would give good results (I do that with my own hair on the advice of the girl who cuts my hair).

I think we're ready to try the Pantene...AND/OR WHATEVER I read about on this Forum!

Maureen and (squeaky) Molly


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## irnfit

Lynn, I don't know exactly how to explain it, but he did look like he was cleaner for a longer time. He had that just cleaned look, soft and fluffy, and his color stayed brighter. Does that make sense?


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## Jane

It does make sense, Michele. Sometimes if the coat is too oily, it can attract dirt.


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## Posh's Mom

Okay, good advice about the CC stuff... I will use the gold on gold stuff sparingly, like maybe once every few months (I ordered just a trial size anyway) and the ice on ice I have diluted, against the directions so it's more like one part ice on ice to 6 parts water...I hope this doesn't dry Posh's hair out. The weather is so dry here now that I'm not giving her as many baths because I just think her skin couldn't take it. At least that's how I feel too...
I still feel pretty uncomfortable about using a shampoo on Posh, my kids, or myself that is full of chemicals. So, I will more than likely keep using the California Baby Organic Calming line on Posh for a while. 
When I misted and brushed her, I had been using Zoochy Kitty Spray. It smells wonderful, is made locally out of safe organic ingredients, and really seemed to soften her hair nicely. I ran out of this and was using some cheap crap for dogs I had watered down. It was terrible!!! I got it a Petco, or somewhere. Smells bad, full of alcohol, and very drying.
I just ordered some more Zoochy spray, also some shampoo and conditioner. I just feel more comfortable using something that it doesn't matter if she gets it in her eyes, or in her mouth. She has this habit of licking the spray from her face when I'm combing her out.
I'll let you all know. I did think the gold on gold would be a fun thing to try to see if her golden undertones came out...


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## Lynn

irnfit said:


> Lynn, I don't know exactly how to explain it, but he did look like he was cleaner for a longer time. He had that just cleaned look, soft and fluffy, and his color stayed brighter. Does that make sense?


YES!!! I know just what you are talking about!! If I had nothing else to do....I would probably wash Casper every 3-4 day, because his hair goes bad about then and starts the matting dirty look thing. So I am going to try that shampoo. But I did like the Coat Handlers, but it still didn't keep him clean looking for a week.


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## ama0722

Leslie and I went to a grooming seminar today where we were able to purchase but even better, we have a giant bag of free samples (Leslie- I didn't realize it was an entire bag until Jim opened and he asked how much money I spent on all the junk!) So hopefully I kick my butt in gear and do a lot of experimenting. I already used the baby powder and Leslie and I brushed our teeth with Oxyfresh!


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## amy-ciara

I tried the European Pantene Pro-V blonde expressions. It works. Thank you very much for the tip. 
So we would use the strong parfumated Petsilk only for show.


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## mintchip

ama0722 said:


> Leslie and I went to a grooming seminar today where we were able to purchase but even better, we have a giant bag of free samples (Leslie- I didn't realize it was an entire bag until Jim opened and he asked how much money I spent on all the junk!) So hopefully I kick my butt in gear and do a lot of experimenting. I already used the baby powder and Leslie and I brushed our teeth with Oxyfresh!


You two are soooo lucky. I wish I could attend one sometime.


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