# Another issue



## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

I know, I have a lot of issues... sigh.

So like all puppies, Roshi likes to sleep. He just passes out wherever he decides to land. However, I see his nap times = opportunities to do my own thing! However, I can't just leave him pass out in the middle of the floor - especially in an open room that I led him into with a leash. 

I know... never bug a puppy when he sleeps. But I can't leave him there. If he wakes up, it will give me more of a headache finding chewed up stuff or pee/poo on the floor. So... in coming hands to pick him up to place him in the pen/crate. I think because of this disturbance, he's been growling and nipping at my hands. 

Did I just screw myself over again?


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

why can't you leave him where he passes out??
I would start by putting cushions or dog beds in a few different places, maybe he'll gravitate towards one??
Could be a reason he is snapping at you, I know my hav does NOT like to be bugged when she is sleeping, and she is nearly a yr old!! LOL
Hopefully some of the "experts" can chime in soon!!


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

The issue with OPEN CONCEPT nowadays. My kitchen and dining room opening is 6-7 ft wide. I can't bar it off. The kitchen to upstairs is about 5 ft wide. Also cannot bar it off.
So if he wakes up and I'm upstairs/basement. He has FREE range. Not good. 

The other day, he fell asleep on my lap. So sweet. However, that means I will need to sit on the hard kitchen floor for who knows how long! I wanted to stay there, but my bony butt was getting a little sore... sigh. I need a bigger butt.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

awwww, that is hard... our house is 1 story and SMALL... LOL
I wonder if you can kind of tell when he is getting tired and put him in his crate with a Kong to keep him distracted and maybe he'll fall alseep on his own that way? Just an idea....?
oh and feel free to borrow some of MY butt, Lord knows I have plenty to share!


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## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

Casie, you can borrow my butt too; however, no need to return it!! :biggrin1:

Do you have an ex-pen? We don't have the connectors on ours and we zig-zag it (to give it stability) across wide openings. I think there are about 8 panels, each 2 feet wide. So, without the connectors attached to hook the first and last sections together to make an enclosed area, it is more like a long bendable portion of fencing. It has come in very handy to block things off or keep the dogs in a certain area.


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Boy.....Do I remember the puppy-hood! I held Dexter a lot too and I would not disturb him while he was sleeping....so, I sat there watching TV. I know if I moved, he would wake up!

My life was resolved around Dexter for the 1st year of puppy-hood. I was happy just the way things were....it made me relax and showed me that other things in life like housework could wait.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Yep, I have a pen, but it only has 6 panels... So I can block off one opening and not the other. Sigh. Does this mean MORE money need to be spent. Thank goodness for the upcoming salary review! Or ask for puppy support from the dad. 

But even if he's chewing on a toy, if I want to pick him up to play in the pen so that I could go to the washroom or something, he will start making that chesty growl. Should I still pick him up telling him, I'm the boss and you are now going to play by yourself in the pen, or just leave him be?


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

One of my clients had a very large opening to the living room/dining room area. They used the zig zagged pen very effectively on it. Their little dog was effectively barred from the area.


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## Lizzie'sMom (Oct 13, 2010)

I hava a doggy pen too that I opened up and used for the wide opening from kitchen to family room. I had an extra piece I used from the kitchen to dining room and had a gate from the kitchen to hallway. I had to use painter's tape to tape it to the walls. At first I just leaned it and it did fall on Lizzie and terrified her. Having a puppy is sure a learning experience!!! Not sure how you would handle the kitchen to upstairs but again a pen put together in a straight line might work if you could tape it on each side somewhere.


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## Lizzie'sMom (Oct 13, 2010)

CrazieJones said:


> Yep, I have a pen, but it only has 6 panels... So I can block off one opening and not the other. Sigh. Does this mean MORE money need to be spent. Thank goodness for the upcoming salary review! Or ask for puppy support from the dad.
> 
> But even if he's chewing on a toy, if I want to pick him up to play in the pen so that I could go to the washroom or something, he will start making that chesty growl. Should I still pick him up telling him, I'm the boss and you are now going to play by yourself in the pen, or just leave him be?


I always told Lizzie "NO growl" if I picked her up and she got sassy. If she is sleeping we don't bother her, though.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Because I have no stairs from the porch to the potty spot, I have to pick him up to go get off and on the porch. "Grrrrr" and start snapping at my hand. This behavior has to change before his adult teeth comes in. Am I picking him up wrong?


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## kimnaz (Feb 15, 2011)

I took my panels apart also to block Kaleb in my kitchen/family room area. He sleeps so light if he hears me move his head pops up. He does that terrible howling also if I am out of site. That makes me crazy if others are home but if I am coming right back and I am home alone, I let him howl his little head off!! Good for his lungs(like we use to say about babies crying!!!)


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

CrazieJones said:


> Yep, I have a pen, but it only has 6 panels... So I can block off one opening and not the other. Sigh. Does this mean MORE money need to be spent. Thank goodness for the upcoming salary review! Or ask for puppy support from the dad.
> 
> But even if he's chewing on a toy, if I want to pick him up to play in the pen so that I could go to the washroom or something, he will start making that chesty growl. Should I still pick him up telling him, I'm the boss and you are now going to play by yourself in the pen, or just leave him be?


Yep. We have 3 ex-pens that we have used in a number of configurations.<g> We still use them from time to time. Ex-pens are not that expensive, and are an investment you'll be glad of in the long run.

As far as "guarding the bones, we actually went in the opposite direction. We would talk to Kodi saying, "That's Kodi's bone!" As he started to realize we weren't going to take his prize possession away, he relaxed about it and stopped growling. Now, if we have to move the bone or move him, he's very relaxed about the whole situation, knowing that we'll give it right back.

So I guess I don't think this is a mater of "telling him who's boss", but I also don't think you want to pussy foot around the problem. You want him to have confidence that he can trust you with his "treasures".


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

karen, he doesn't guard his bone or food. He is very good with the 'give' command. It's more like "grrr, don't bug me while I'm chewing" or "grrr, I'm chewing here on the carpet and not back into my pen"

What am I going to do with him?


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## FancyNancy (Oct 7, 2009)

I always made the ex pen into a little (actually, quite big) circle around Henry when he slept on the floor. It didnt disturb him, and it assured that no one stepped on him!


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

He needs to learn to be handled at any time. You need to pick him up ignoring his growling and nipping. It's okay to deflect any nipping, but he needs to not feel any anxiety from you, and certainly no fear. I don't know how to explain to you in words how I would do it, but he would neither get anywhere with it, or get any input of feelings one way or the other from me. This is what expens are for at this age. He needs a place he can feel secure and unbothered to rest. That is, unless you want him to be the one that runs the house.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

CrazieJones said:


> karen, he doesn't guard his bone or food. He is very good with the 'give' command. It's more like "grrr, don't bug me while I'm chewing" or "grrr, I'm chewing here on the carpet and not back into my pen"
> 
> What am I going to do with him?


Are you sure its really growling, and not just "grumbling" or talking? Kodi often worries people who don't know him by making grumbly noises. But the context of these noises make it very clear to me that he's NOT growling. And when I HAVE on rare occasion, heard him growl for real, it's a very different sound. It has a high pitched frantic quality to it.


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

Casie, I don't know if this will help much but we've had McGee for six weeks now and he is finally getting better!!! I was so tired and frustrated the first 4 weeks especially so if you can just let go of the notion of having a clean house for a few more weeks and concentrate on the bare necessities it should help.

When McGee would nip or gnaw at us I finally tried pinching the back of his neck on the loose skin like a mother dog would do and would say "no bite". That helped a lot but time has helped the most because that is way better now, too.

We have an open floor plan that makes it nearly impossible to keep him confined. If I really needed to do something then I would put him in his crate and let him howl. I didn't have to do that often, though. I know exactly what you mean about them falling asleep "anywhere" because then I don't feel I can go into the bedroom or laundry room without him waking up without me knowing it and getting into trouble. Now that he is getting much more reliable with going potty outside that is also getting easier.

I guess what I'm really saying is it does get better! McGee is four months old and we have survived!!!


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## Divaskychick (May 18, 2011)

Okay, I've been reading Dunbar and it seems to me that he needs to associate your hand coming at him as a good thing. What about practicing taking his collar with a yummy treat in your hand? I'm not sure if you give the treat before you take the collar or after, but supposedly doing it will make him associate hands in his face as a good thing. Same with feeding him his kibble in the bowl but out of your hand, and sneaking some special yummies into your hand occasionally. You're not teaching him to eat out of your hand, just that hands near his face are cause for celebration. 

Anyway, I don't even have my dog yet but this is what I'm getting from the book. I'm watching your progress! Good luck!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Divaskychick said:


> Okay, I've been reading Dunbar and it seems to me that he needs to associate your hand coming at him as a good thing. What about practicing taking his collar with a yummy treat in your hand? I'm not sure if you give the treat before you take the collar or after, but supposedly doing it will make him associate hands in his face as a good thing. Same with feeding him his kibble in the bowl but out of your hand, and sneaking some special yummies into your hand occasionally. You're not teaching him to eat out of your hand, just that hands near his face are cause for celebration.
> 
> Anyway, I don't even have my dog yet but this is what I'm getting from the book. I'm watching your progress! Good luck!


BINGO . Your dog is hand shy. I still think you need a trainer to come in.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Hmm, he doesn't seem to mind my hand in his face. He eats from my hand. He lets me clean his eye gunk. He licks my hand. Just not a big fan with my hands picking him up. Sigh.
My sitter told me he did it once to her, but she gave a firm no right away, and he stopped and never did it since. Maybe I should try it...


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

CrazieJones said:


> Hmm, he doesn't seem to mind my hand in his face. He eats from my hand. He lets me clean his eye gunk. He licks my hand. Just not a big fan with my hands picking him up. Sigh.
> My sitter told me he did it once to her, but she gave a firm no right away, and he stopped and never did it since. Maybe I should try it...


Casie ,he's obviously not comfortable with being grabbed, or picked up. I strongly do not recommend correcting him in any way. It will only make things worse. You need someone to see firsthand what's all going on here.


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## CrazieJones (May 28, 2011)

Hmm, then how is he going to go pee?! My porch is 2-3 ft off the ground!!! I doubt any of you would say let him jump off!

Well, so far I've been trying to let him sniff my hand, pet his body a bit, and then pick him up. It works about 50-60% of the time. Maybe just keep at it.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

CrazieJones said:


> Hmm, then how is he going to go pee?! My porch is 2-3 ft off the ground!!! I doubt any of you would say let him jump off!
> 
> Well, so far I've been trying to let him sniff my hand, pet his body a bit, and then pick him up. It works about 50-60% of the time. Maybe just keep at it.


Casie, email me at [email protected] , I have an article that's too long for here.


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

It seems to me that he is acting like the boss. I don't allow my dogs to get aggressive like that. Fortunately our growls are not scary to me and I have never encountered either one bighting at me or another dog. I just let them know I am in charge. Your sister in my opinion had the right idea.


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

Does he wag his tail when he does the growl when he's chewing something? There's all sorts of what I call "growl talk". Any time we feed the dogs, when one finishes he/she goes around checking to see if anyone dropped anything that can be scooped up. When the other one is still eating from their bowl when they are approached, they will give a little growl, but it's usually accompanied by a tail wag. It's more like, "na, na, na,na, naaa, I have food, and you don't". 

Get him wagging his tail before you approach. "Is that a good bone/toy?" "what are you doing with that bone?" type of thing. In other words change it from a challenge to more like play talk. This type of thing can be taught during play doing tug and such with toys.


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