# Fear of dogs... am I overreacting?



## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

I'm not sure if I'm expecting too much of Kubrick right now so I wanted to ask all of you to help me out. As all of you know, I live in New York City which means lots of cars, trucks, construction, random noises, people, children, strollers and DOGS. In general, Kubrick is pretty good about taking all the noises in. He is a little scared, but as soon as I say come on he will happily walk beside me. He constantly looks to me for reassurance. When we come upon other people, he sometimes stands for them to pet him and sometimes he will try to run away. With dogs, however, he is ALWAYS afraid. He will tug against the leash trying to run away and then, after I say NO he will sit behind my legs hiding, or stick his head between my legs. He actually barked at a dog today who was trying his hardest to play with Kubrick! I try my best to keep him from doing any of this but I'm not sure what is the correct way to handle this behavior.

The reason I'm asking, I guess, is that this is only Kubrick's 4th or 5th walk outside, so maybe he's still taking in the city and meeting other dogs is just too much for him and I'm overreacting. Another reason for me to ask is that he is going to start puppy classes on Wednesday so should I just wait for that and then he'll be better with other dogs? I just feel frustrated sometimes because he's really great when he meets other people at home. It's impossible for me to get him to meet other dogs here at my house because I don't know anyone with dogs, which is one of the reasons I'm doing puppy classes.

And mainly the reason I'm asking is because on a walk today I met this woman with a very sweet Shih Tzu who wanted to play with Kubrick. Kubrick, of course, tried his hardest to run away from the Shih Tzu. As I was walking away, the woman turned to her friend and said "I thought that Havanese were supposed to be very social but that dog was not friendly at all." This actually did hurt me a bit because Kubrick IS friendly when he feels safe (ie at home).

Okay, so I wrote a lot but I'm just hoping that Kubrick won't be one of those dogs that I meet in the street and think to myself "that owner needs to learn how to teach that dogs some social skills."


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Lina, 

Don't beat yourself up over this. He is still very young.

I think puppy classes will help IMMENSELY. But in the meantime, why not introduce really special *treats* when he is around other dogs. Something super special that he doesn't get often, turkey, cheese, etc.

Was the other dog very "hyper"? I know Gucci does not want much to do with super hyper dogs, like Yorkies...but she is better around Havanese.

Just ease into it and it will come with time, keep reinforcing that playing with other dogs is a pleasant experience.

hugs,
Kara


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Thanks for the advice Kara! I will try feeding him a treat. I've tried feeding him cheese outside but sometimes he doesn't even want to eat outside. I'm not sure if that's because he thinks it's dirty (very doubtful LOL) or because he's so overwhelmed with all he sees/smells that he doesn't want to eat. I really do think that he will get better the more I take him out and I will definitely try treating him... maybe I'll use turkey instead of cheese since he seems to go even more crazy for turkey.


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

ok, he is YOUNG...my 5 months old soon to be show dog is still cautious of other dogs...he is getting better and it has taken a lot of work but he will get there. DO not caudil him when he is scared..he has to work through a lot of it himself. And when you are reassuring him you are teaching him that it is ok to behave that way. But don't beat yourself up either...ok so the lady with the shih-tzu was confused...o well...his learning is way more important than what she thinks. When you do meet people with dogs tell them...This is Kubrick and he is _____ months old and we are working through his fear of dogs... most people are more than happy to help.. you will even run into people who will tell their dog to sit so Kubrick can approach them, which most puppies do better with. Don't give up and be patient. He will be ok....
And Kara is right...the classes will help!!!! my older dog is in classes and we bring strut to just sit and be around all the other dogs...I hope this helped or at least gave you a little bit of a pep-talk.

Erin


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Lina, a trainer that came to my house for Lily, who has the same problem, suggested treating BEFORE the introduction, she suggested just shoveling , shoveling, shoveling, then she would be more interested in eating and not the other dog. Eventually she realizes that the other dog, didnt hurt her, and means no harm. We have not been as consistant with this, but it worked well when we did it. Also, puppy class will help a lot!!!!
Laurie


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Erin, thanks yes you helped! I do want to clarify that I do not coddle him. As a matter of fact, I constantly try to distance myself so he can deal with the situation. I also have started to nip his tugging on the leash to run away in the butt. It's slow, but he's beginning to stop with a single sharp NO.

And the shoving treats in his mouth seems like a great idea Laurie! Maybe if his mouth is full then he won't care as much! LOL.

You guys have really helped reassure me! It's funny because I really could care less what people say about me, but when that woman "insulted" Kubrick, it really did make me upset!


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

Wonderful, then you are on the right track...don't give up...and the treats are a good idea...I am not a fan of them all the time but they do have their place!!!

Erin
I am glad I could help


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

I think it will come with time. Gucci would never forget about another dog next to her for treats! lol, but every dog is different!

Also, try to remain calm and upbeat! I really do think that dogs *sense* how we feel, and if YOU are getting uncomfortable or nervous (because you are worrying about Kubrick) than HE will sense that. I have had Gucci sense my feeling on more than one occasion and react accordingly.

So, make sure YOU are feeling positive and comfortable about it.

And Erin makes a great point! Just tell people he is just a puppy and still learning social skills. They don't fall out of the womb knowing everything in the world. lol...He's just a baby. That lady must've forgotten the puppy stage.

Kara


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

You are so right Kara...and I have found that people sho have do forget what a puppy is like and not to mention..."my puppy is perfect and NEVER did that when he was that age" I find many people actually believe that. I guess it is a syndrome.


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

It is amazing how protective we can be with our pups- just like our kids!! You re right Lina, say anything about me you want, but dont say a thing about my pups!!!!!
Laurie


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

LOL!

It must be a syndrome.

Did you get panicked or upset when Kubrick started doing this? He *MAY* have sensed that and reacted. Everytime I have been nervous or upset around strangers, Gucci has reacted with anxiety and fear! They really can pick up on your feelings. Stay calm and focused, positive energy!

Kara


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

Right On!!!!
My pups are all I have!!!
I just have not had any 2 legged versions yet

Erin


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

You know Kara has a point...Brutus ( my pit ) growles every time a man approaches us...and it has gotten to the point where I anticipate the growl and I think he is now just reacting to my fear. This is why are are re-enrolled in obedience classes. But the fear I have is deffinetley affecting Brutus actions. Good Call Kara!!

Erin


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Erin,

There have been 2 specific occasions where I was "scared" of a man. On one instance, it was a salesman that walked up to the door when I was going out to get the mail. He immediately made me uncomfortable, violating my space and trying to get too close to me! I was on the verge of running back to the door and then Gucci started GROWLING! And showing her teeth, so I started backing off w/ her and he kept stepping forward, until I just said "not interested" and ran in the door. She was STILL growling and then stayed at the door and barked!

Another time, I had her someplace where she wasnt' supposed to be (not dog friendly) and a guy approached me and I got nervous/scared and she did the same thing.

And another time.....this neighbor followed my husband in the house after work and I was like "Oh brother, go home..." I was really annoyed that he was there, and she wasn't friendly either. He kept trying to pet her and she would bark/grumble and walk off (not as rude as the last two, but still picking up on my emotion)

So, I firmly believe they are in tune with us.

Does the man make you nervous or scared?

Kara


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

I may have gotten nervous and just not realized it. I do try to stay positive, but I will try harder next time to stay calm and positive so that he will be the same way.

And yes, I guess it IS the same as having kids... I totally got offended and I'm sure that if it was my (yet to be born) human kid, I would have felt the same way. Don't mess with my children (four-legged or otherwise). :boxing:

LOL!


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Not to worry, Lina. The puppy classes are a good place to teach socializing. Of course, it depends on how good the classes are! Some like to do the "sink or swim" technique and dont' take into account the size of some of the pups. They'll tell you to let all pups off leash and let them fend for themselves. A 4-5 lb. Hav versus a 25 lb. Lab aren't the best paired and it can make your pup even more fearful of dogs! There's no problem being in a class with bigger dogs, but there has to be some consideration when they all play together.

Ricky will NOT take treats when we're in busy places, or even in the car. He's too distracted and doesn't want them. Some dogs are just like that, but maybe Kubrick will be fine as he gets older. Treating him when in a tense situation will teach him to tolerate them and is a good tool! 

Good luck, Lina and don't worry. In time, he'll do just fine.


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

The men don't actually make me nervous...it is the fact that Brutus is going to growl at them. The problem is that he is an American Pitt Bull - I have socialized him to the extreem but one day we were all at the softball field and a guy walked up to us and asked if he could pet him and if he was nice...I said yes but you could tell the guy was nervous ( don't know if it was because he is a pitt, or a dog, or if because he is 80 pounds ) never the less, Brut picked up on it and growled, barked and lunged at him. Now I am a little different with him then the girls ( the havs ) for obvious reasons and it was really hard to correct him proprely infront of 30 people. I would have been turned infor abuse probably. ( you can do anything other than fus at your dog here ) So it is not the men ( if anyone tried to do anything they would be stupid with Brutus standing there ) But after that I get really nervous when a man approaches him. Then last halloween this idiot jumped out from behind a bush to scare us when Brut was standing right next to him. Bad expirence #2 when a man for him. So I have worked in depth with this for about 2 years...I refues to loose my dog if I can control the situation!!! Here is a picture of him...


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Hang in there Lina!With a pup as cute as yours--that lady was just jealous
Kubrick will get more used to his surroundings and get more socialized....by the way,I don't think it has nothing to do with breed? however--my friend has a shih-tzu too that is very playful,and Quincy just hates that dog.....he growls and stuff....totally out of character for Quince.Embarrasing too!


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

Dogs are like people and they don't get along with every dog. Just like we don't get alone with every person.

Erin


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Erin, that is too bad about those bad experiences for Brutus. It is almost a vicious circle, I think, when it comes to those breeds that have a 'bad name'. 

I was at the dog park last week, with my two little guys and a large, female mixed pitbull came in. I think she was a boxer/pit bull. I dunno, but she was big and had a large, very strong head and body. I was a little nervous, I have to admit, but she seemed to just skip along and come over for an innocent look. She was more interested in me than the boys and I petted her, but looking into her eyes and face, I started to worry and think "what if that strong jaw of hers decides to bite? I'd never stand a chance, nor would Sammy or Ricky!" ........ not fair, I know. I started feeling nervous so moved away. I didnt' want her to feel my fear. I am not proud of it because I'm not usually afraid of large dogs so it's really a shame.

I think you are courageous to take on the extra work in making sure your Brutus doesn't react to bad experiences, but in a way it's not really his fault at all.


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

Thanks Marj, 
It has been an up hill battle...unfortunatley for him he was bred in the middle of Atl...my boyfriend bought him before we started dating and he was about 10 months old. So I have been working with him since then. I don't think he was suposed to be a pet...We walk every day for about 2 hrs all together, I think it is so important for any dog with any problem to be excersized... yeah it is a vicious cycle but if your going to own one you do what you have to do not matter how much time or energy (or what time you have to get up in the morning to walk) it takes...
Lina, is doing right by Kubrick but I am irritated with the shih tzu's owner..who does she think she is? Puppies have fears and at least she could have been nice about it!!!
Erin


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## Sunnygirl (Jun 1, 2007)

Lina, I think you'll find that puppy classes help a lot. Especially since you'll remove some of the outdoor noises and distractions and Kubrick can concentrate on the other dogs. When I lived in NYC I was overwhelmed by the noise and bustle, and I was a heck of a lot bigger and had a lot more experiences than a young puppy. Nico really enjoyed interacting with the puppies in puppy class. He had the good fortune of spending his first 9 weeks in a house with 23 other puppies (my breeder had 3 litters - 19 pups - within a 12 hour period and another 10 days later!), so he absolutely loved being with puppies again. But I noticed that the pups who were shy at the first class really warmed up and were happily playing with all the other pups after a couple weeks.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Lina,

Can you arrange a playdate at your house with maybe one of your friend's small dog? A friendly one? Maybe that would be a good way to introduce and limit the _other_ "activity and noises" going on at the park!

Erin, sounds like you are doing all the right things. I'm generally afraid of big dogs, but I have a friend with two pit bulls, that I am actually really comfortable around. They can be the sweetest dogs, it just takes extra work with them because they are wired to protect!

No wonder he's leary of men! Jumping out of a bush would put any dog on the defensive. Yikes!

Maybe you can run an experiment, and have a man that you know/like approach you on your walk, and see if he picks up on your comfortable feeling? Its worth a shot.

He's a cutie! I love the spots. Keep working with him, and let us know what the trainer says.

I just find it ironic, that all 3 times I've had a "growling" reaction from Gucci, I was scared and upset. I think she just looks to me to see how I react, and goes from there.

Kara


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## EMarie (Apr 11, 2007)

Yeah...it is amazing how much our dogs do react directly in response as to how we are feeling...That is my biggest problem, not getting nervous and antipicating the growl. Like Ceaser says, dogs live in the moment and not what happened yesterday or 3 weeks ago...but that is a hard thing for us humans to move foward from... o well...We will all just keep trying!!!

Erin


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

EMarie said:


> Dogs are like people and they don't get along with every dog. Just like we don't get alone with every person.
> 
> Erin


How true! Lincoln has always LOVED any dog he's ever met. But trust me, NOT every dog loves him. Many get annoyed and try to get away.....I guess he is just too, well, exuberant...."unstable energy" as Cesar would say...


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## Rita (Jan 1, 2007)

EMarie said:


> I have found that people sho have do forget what a puppy is like and not to mention..."my puppy is perfect and NEVER did that when he was that age" I find many people actually believe that. I guess it is a syndrome.


LMAO. So very true. My neighbor that had a hound dog that ran around the neighborhood at 3AM chasing rabbits and howling loudly told me a few months ago that I have to train Houston better because he wouldn't come right away on command (He was only 5 months old and pulling the usual I don't feel like listening thing). It seems he has the syndrome (plus he no longer has the dog because he couldn't control it). LOL

:focus: Lina, he is just a puppy and will get better. Follow everyone's great advice and he will be fine. Actually for living in New York City and only being afraid of other dogs, that is a great accomplishment!!!!!!!:biggrin1:


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Lina,
I think everyone gave you some good advice. I would just not make a big deal about it. I always did this and a few weeks ago when my husband was with my maltese at a park, it was interesting to see the girls act totally different when a dog approached. They thought he wasn't in control of the situation so they had to be. One of the things Cesar tells people to do is pretend to be someone strong and powerful and act when they are with their dog. This will help your pup think you are in control of the situation and not have to worry!

Good luck,
Amanda


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