# Brushing spray



## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

I just started using spectrum 10 about a month ago and I LOVE it! I tried using the diluted conditioner as a brushing spray and didn’t like it as a grooming spray. Next I switched to Just Divine and the texture is about right but it has a lavender scent (which my husband likes) and the lavender is driving me crazy. I’m not a lavender person. The other sprays I used before he started blowing coat don’t seem to penetrate now that his coat is coming in so much thicker. 

Any suggestions on what to try next as a brushing spray? 

I think the reason I like the texture of the Just Divine even though it’s a little heavier is because it is slightly silky/oily compared to other sprays I’ve used and it seems to help break up any grime I might miss when I wash his face. It also seems to saturate better and doesn’t evaporate as quickly.


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## hlang (Jan 21, 2018)

I also use the spectrum 10 shampoo and conditioner and recently got some Pure Paws H2O mist for daily grooming. I really like the look and feel of Jerry's fur with this product for his frizzy curly coat.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

I don’t think I’ve come across this one yet, where did you find it?


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## cishepard (Apr 8, 2018)

I’ve been using Plush Puppy OMG spray, diluted by half. I haven’t tried many others, so not much to compare it to, but I’m not super impressed. It does help loosen tangles but smells too strong for me, even diluted. It does not add any shine to the coat, but maybe that’s asking too much from a brushing spray? I find myself not using it much and just combing Bingo’s coat gently ... maybe I don’t even need a spray.
I would love to hear more conversation and recommendations as well...


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## hlang (Jan 21, 2018)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I don't think I've come across this one yet, where did you find it?


 I found it on Amazon after it was recommended to me by a groomer and haven't been using it long but so far I really like it. I dilute all product I use on Jerry by 50% and I only bathe him once a week or a little longer when I notice either a doggy smell or start to find matts during daily grooming and add face or butt bath as needed.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I use CC Ice on Ice almost always. Sometimes with a squirt of Spectrum 10 in it as well. Everything else is too heavy for my dogs' coats.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

I was thinking of trying the white on white kit, which includes a trial size of ice on ice. My only hesitation is my puppy is gold/red with a white belly and feet (and much more white on his face than his puppy pic). It says to use on any coat color, but if it’s tinted purple and intended to remove yellow, i’m a little suspicious it’s going to neutralize the gold of his coat, too.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I was thinking of trying the white on white kit, which includes a trial size of ice on ice. My only hesitation is my puppy is gold/red with a white belly and feet (and much more white on his face than his puppy pic). It says to use on any coat color, but if it's tinted purple and intended to remove yellow, i'm a little suspicious it's going to neutralize the gold of his coat, too.


White on white is very mild, and has no "lighteners" in it. It won't hurt a gold coat.


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

I really like Warren London Hydrating Butter. It's not really a brushing/detangler spray but more of a moisturizer. However, for me, it seems to work well on the longer hair on the tail and ears as a detangler. Makes it lots easier to comob. And I love the scent (pomegranate & acai). Someone recommended this product on a really old post. Don't remember who. https://smile.amazon.com/Warren-Lon...ydrating+dog+butter&psc=1&smid=A3SBDOAENTRT1F


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> I really like Warren London Hydrating Butter.


I use this after a bath and LOVE it. I don't use a lot, but I apply it in a thin layer to my hands and then sort of dab it on the areas that are the most tangle prone, and then work it into those areas. It just seems to work best when he's wet because it spreads more easily, otherwise too much in one spot is too heavy on his coat. I wish there was a way to dilute and spray it!

I ordered the CC system set because my whitening shampoo is almost gone and it also contains Ice.

I'm making progress - I found a great shampoo and conditioner, and I found I like Magic Foam better than the other waterless bath products I tried. I'm down to finding a whitening shampoo to rotate in and a better spray. At least I can use the Precious Drops until it's gone while I'm experimenting. It's weird to me that it's lavender scented because everything else I have tried by CC smells much lighter and fresher.

Thanks! Now to start working my way down the list!


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I use this after a bath and LOVE it. I don't use a lot, but I apply it in a thin layer to my hands and then sort of dab it on the areas that are the most tangle prone, and then work it into those areas.


I like the way the hydrating butter makes my hands feel. I keep thinking I should use it on myself! I haven't tried it on a wet coat. I will next time she gets a bath.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

My kit arrived! Ice on Ice saturates SO much better than the Divine brushing spray. It doesn’t just lay on the top layer of hair. So I like it as a brushing spray for a dry coat.

I tried the white on white and I’m not sure about it. I don’t know if it’s because I tried to use the Ice on Ice afterwards, and so I was trying two new products at the same time, but he felt so dry and tangled afterwards. I used the “after bath” that came with the kit but he still felt dry so I used the spectrum 10 conditioner (even though I think After Bath might replace conditioner?) but then I couldn’t get the conditioner to dissolve in my squirt bottle and it kept squirting little blobs of conditioner, which I don’t remember ever happening before.

I ended up using almost half the little bottle of Ice to comb him out and then finally switching to the Warren London Hydrating Butter, but I had to use a ton to comb through so his coat is a little weird in a couple of places. 

I’m hoping it’s just that the White on White is a more drying shampoo and next time the Ice on Ice will work better after his bath with just the Spectrum 10. Maybe I’ll look for a heavier conditioner for after White on White, which I only plan to use occasionally anyway.


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## Jackie from Concrete WA (Mar 23, 2015)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I ended up using almost half the little bottle of Ice to comb him out and then finally switching to the Warren London Hydrating Butter, but I had to use a ton to comb through so his coat is a little weird in a couple of places.
> 
> I'm hoping it's just that the White on White is a more drying shampoo and next time the Ice on Ice will work better after his bath with just the Spectrum 10. Maybe I'll look for a heavier conditioner for after White on White, which I only plan to use occasionally anyway.


I use the White on White too but haven't really noticed that it's drying. After rinsing off the shampoo, I put on the Spectrum 10 and rub it in good and then rinse again. She always seems pretty soft after she is dry.

I am not crazy about the Ice on Ice. I know a lot of the forum members like it, but for me it really doesn't do much to detangle. Justs seems to make her wet. I like the Hydrating Butter better for Willow's tail and ears. She has a puppy cut so most of the rest of her is fairly short.

My favorite product for mats is plain ole cornstarch. Just rub it into the mat and gentle work out the mat with a fine tooth comb. Sometimes you have to let the cornstarch sit for a minute before working out the mat.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Jackie from Concrete said:


> I use the White on White too but haven't really noticed that it's drying. After rinsing off the shampoo, I put on the Spectrum 10 and rub it in good and then rinse again. She always seems pretty soft after she is dry.


I do pretty much the same, though I do dilute the Spectrum 10 (and the shampoo, for that matter) before applying. But they feel really soft and silky after washing with this combination.

The ONLY shampoo I use without following up with Spectrum 10 is CC Fair Advantage, which is an all-in-one conditioning shampoo. This works GREAT on Pixel, who is in a puppy cut, but isn't conditioning enough for Kodi's long and fully mature coat. I use it sometimes on Panda, but she's got so much white, that I often need the whitening shampoo on her, in which case, I also use Spectrum 10.

I do use Ice on Ice, both just as a wetting agent while grooming, and also on small mats. but my dogs really don't get many mats now that they are mature. I also liked corn starch better than anything for dealing with blowing coat type mats when they were younger.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

My husband just told me the water softener was pretty much empty when he went to fill it last night. I’m thinking that might explain why the Spectrum 10 conditioner didn’t seem to work as well as I remembered! Our water is really hard. 

I’ll give the White on White another try a few baths from now. Once I was able to comb him and get him dry he was pretty soft, but his coat was just not as manageable as it usually is after a bath.


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

I use CC Advantage on Perry too (he's in a puppy cut) - but his tail seems a little dry so this weekend I tried a little added conditioner to his tail only. I also use Johnson and Johnson no tears baby wash on his face because that's always a mess and I need to really wash it good and I don't think the fair advantage is no tears. 

The hydrating butter sounds interesting though, so might hve to get some of htat to use on his tail.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Melissa Brill said:


> I use CC Advantage on Perry too (he's in a puppy cut) - but his tail seems a little dry so this weekend I tried a little added conditioner to his tail only. I also use Johnson and Johnson no tears baby wash on his face because that's always a mess and I need to really wash it good and I don't think the fair advantage is no tears.
> 
> The hydrating butter sounds interesting though, so might hve to get some of htat to use on his tail.


I use Fair Advantage on my dogs faces all the time, and have since they were small puppies. It has never bothered their eyes. Even Pixel, who gets "crusties", so I need to really scrub.


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## 31818 (Oct 29, 2014)

krandall said:


> I do use Ice on Ice, both just as a wetting agent while grooming, and also on small mats. but my dogs really don't get many mats now that they are mature. I also liked corn starch better than anything for dealing with blowing coat type mats when they were younger.


I make my own brushing spray!
- 24 oz. distilled water in spray bottle
- 1.5 oz. CC Ice on Ice Concentrate
- one capful good quality human hair conditioner
- mix thoroughly 
* Don't get overspray on hardwood floors, your backside will learn to regret it!

Ricky's Popi


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## Melissa Brill (Feb 22, 2017)

*CC Fair*



krandall said:


> I use Fair Advantage on my dogs faces all the time, and have since they were small puppies. It has never bothered their eyes. Even Pixel, who gets "crusties", so I need to really scrub.


Good to know - I'd prefer to use just the one, and in a puppy cut the CC Fair advantage works well and keeps him soft overall (except his tail so I do add a little extra conditioner to that), but I have to scrub his face and he hates getting his face washed most of all, so I didn't want to exacerbate the whole thing with soap that bothered his eyes - glad to know it won't.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

Melissa Brill said:


> Good to know - I'd prefer to use just the one, and in a puppy cut the CC Fair advantage works well and keeps him soft overall (except his tail so I do add a little extra conditioner to that), but I have to scrub his face and he hates getting his face washed most of all, so I didn't want to exacerbate the whole thing with soap that bothered his eyes - glad to know it won't.


No matter how hard I try, I can't seem to keep water from running near his eyes when I'm rinsing! I even watched a few YouTube videos and they make it look so easy but I'd need three hands to hold him, rinse, and guide the shampoo and water. I still use puppy shampoo from his eyes up to the top of his head, but it would be a lot easier to use one product.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

I’ve been using Ice for a couple of weeks now and I do like it but it seems like I’m going through it really fast. If I’m having to use so much, I’m wondering if it’s right for his coat? Sometimes his coat feels dry, especially when it’s wet from his bath. Once he’s dry after his bath he feels soft and fluffy, which is why I like Spectrum 10, but i feel it’s dry enough that it encourages the hair to tighten up at the roots if I don’t comb through after his bath, and it’s hard to get the comb through without a ton of Ice. 

I have two different less expensive products I ordered but neither of them were available through Prime so it’ll still be a week or so. I’ll probably mix up the last bit of Ice as Ricky’s Popi suggested in the meantime! 

Should I back up to adjusting the shampoo and conditioner or continue to try for a better detangler? Or is this as good as it gets? I thought I had settled on Spectrum 10 being the best so far, and with Ice, the hydrating Butter it is coming along, but our climate is super dry and it’s not even winter yet. I’m thinking of trying some of the silk type products that I’ve read can sometimes be too heavy for Hav’s.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I've been using Ice for a couple of weeks now and I do like it but it seems like I'm going through it really fast. If I'm having to use so much, I'm wondering if it's right for his coat? Sometimes his coat feels dry, especially when it's wet from his bath. Once he's dry after his bath he feels soft and fluffy, which is why I like Spectrum 10, but i feel it's dry enough that it encourages the hair to tighten up at the roots if I don't comb through after his bath, and it's hard to get the comb through without a ton of Ice.
> 
> I have two different less expensive products I ordered but neither of them were available through Prime so it'll still be a week or so. I'll probably mix up the last bit of Ice as Ricky's Popi suggested in the meantime!
> 
> Should I back up to adjusting the shampoo and conditioner or continue to try for a better detangler? Or is this as good as it gets? I thought I had settled on Spectrum 10 being the best so far, and with Ice, the hydrating Butter it is coming along, but our climate is super dry and it's not even winter yet. I'm thinking of trying some of the silk type products that I've read can sometimes be too heavy for Hav's.


I'm not sure what you mean by "his coat feels dry, especially when it's wet from his bath" How can a coat feel dry when it's wet? I use Ice on Ice for 3 dogs almost daily. I buy the concentrate, but a bottle of concentrate lasts me over 2 years. So I'm not sure how you are using it or why you are going through it so quickly. You just mist the dog with it, you don't thoroughly soak them. (you can soak a bad mat if you need to work on it though)



EvaE1izabeth said:


> I feel it's dry enough that it encourages the hair to tighten up at the roots if I don't comb through after his bath, and it's hard to get the comb through without a ton of Ice.


You need to ALWAYS comb through THOROUGHLY after a bath. I do it while I'm blow drying because a good dyer will help you blow out mats, and also show you where they are so you can work on them. That's just a Havanese coat. it has nothing directly to do with the products used. If it's REALLY bad, one thing you can do is "float" their coat. Which means to stand them in a tub or the sink, full enough with water and a LOT of conditioner, so that the coat actually is mostly floating. If they aren't comfortable with the water deep enough to cover their back, you can make it as deep as they will tolerate (most will be OK with it deep enough to at least touch their belly if it's warm) and scoop water repeatedly over their back with a cup. While they are standing in the water, you can usually use both the conditioner and the "floatiness" to help you get through mats pretty easily. then when you've got all the mats out, drain and rinse one more time. it should now be quite easy to give a once-over "check" with the comb before drying completely.

I suspect that the biggest problem for you right now is that you are dealing with him blowing his puppy coat. In which case, there are things that can make it easier, but nothing, short of shaving him down and letting it grow out again when he's older, will totally avoid the problem.  Sorry, welcome to the world of Havanese adolescence! LOL!


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

krandall said:


> I'm not sure what you mean by "his coat feels dry, especially when it's wet from his bath" How can a coat feel dry when it's wet? I use Ice on Ice for 3 dogs almost daily. I buy the concentrate, but a bottle of concentrate lasts me over 2 years. So I'm not sure how you are using it or why you are going through it so quickly. You just mist the dog with it, you don't thoroughly soak them. (you can soak a bad mat if you need to work on it though)


Am I comparing it too much to human hair? There isn't any slip at all when I try to comb it after a bath, it's squeaky clean Yet it does dry very soft! I worry about combing it when it doesn't have any slip - it feels like I'm pulling and I'm afraid it's more likely to break. He's thoroughly combed before the bath, and I'm careful to wash and rinse in the same direction so I'm not scrubbing the hair, but he's still tangly right out of the bath. Mostly at the roots.

I use the Ice for regular grooming, I usually use something else after his bath. I spray a light mist, but his coat is so dense I'll turn the section over and it's completely dry. It actually seems to penetrate better than the other detanglers I tried, though. It works, but I feel like I'm double spraying. I don't think what I'm using is concentrated, though. It's a small sample bottle, and I've used almost 2 ounces grooming him twice a day for two weeks or so. I'm going to try pouring it into a better spray bottle and see if that makes a difference.



krandall said:


> You need to ALWAYS comb through THOROUGHLY after a bath. I do it while I'm blow drying because a good dyer will help you blow out mats, and also show you where they are so you can work on them.


I comb him really well, but I don't usually blow him dry him because he's in short coat and it's so dry here he's completely dry within an hour. In the summer, by the time the zoomies are out, it takes me about half an hour to comb him, then I go over it with a brush to fluff it up, and he's already almost dry. By the time I get to his tail, which I always do last, it's completely dry and I have to dampen it. In the winter I did blow dry him, but it was hard because it took a while to detangle enough to brush without pulling, so really I was just warming the room with the hair dryer. I'm not sure how I would detangle while I'm drying because I'm not great at detangling with a brush, I use a comb to detangle. Do you usually use a comb to blow dry, or switch back and forth? I haven't tried drying with a comb. Maybe I need a better brush and drying technique? I read that a few of the really good detanglers work best with heat, and it's starting to cool down outside, so I should probably prepare to start drying him again.



krandall said:


> If it's REALLY bad, one thing you can do is "float" their coat.


I can see why this would work better because it's hard to soak the conditioner into the roots, and that's where I'm finding it feels tight after a bath - not quite matted, but the comb doesn't pull through it easily, like it's seconds away from matting. I've been doing his "bath" in the shower with the handheld, but I have a rubber tub I can bring in there.



krandall said:


> I suspect that the biggest problem for you right now is that you are dealing with him blowing his puppy coat.


Most definitely! He had to be cut short about two months ago and I felt so guilty, but he had matted so quickly on our trip. I thought it was from traveling, but I figured it out the week after his haircut when i was still sliding little knots of hair out of his short coat twice a day. It doesn't seem as bad now. How long does it usually last?

In the short term if a conditioner would normally be a little too heavy for his coat but would allow for easier, more frequent combing, what would be the downside of diluting and using something like that just while he's blowing coat?


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> Am I comparing it too much to human hair? There isn't any slip at all when I try to comb it after a bath, it's squeaky clean Yet it does dry very soft! I worry about combing it when it doesn't have any slip - it feels like I'm pulling and I'm afraid it's more likely to break. He's thoroughly combed before the bath, and I'm careful to wash and rinse in the same direction so I'm not scrubbing the hair, but he's still tangly right out of the bath. Mostly at the roots.


OK, I understand. You may be rinsing out TOO much conditioner. When I use Spectrum 10, I rinse until there's no more "white" coming out of the coat, but NOT until it's "squeaky" I leave a little in.



EvaE1izabeth said:


> I use the Ice for regular grooming, I usually use something else after his bath. I spray a light mist, but his coat is so dense I'll turn the section over and it's completely dry. It actually seems to penetrate better than the other detanglers I tried, though. It works, but I feel like I'm double spraying. I don't think what I'm using is concentrated, though. It's a small sample bottle, and I've used almost 2 ounces grooming him twice a day for two weeks or so. I'm going to try pouring it into a better spray bottle and see if that makes a difference.


Oh, OK! So the bottle you're using up is a trial size. That makes more sense. If you like it, buy the concentrate, and use your own (better) sprayer. It's MUCH cheaper that way!!!



EvaE1izabeth said:


> I comb him really well, but I don't usually blow him dry him because he's in short coat and it's so dry here he's completely dry within an hour. In the summer, by the time the zoomies are out, it takes me about half an hour to comb him, then I go over it with a brush to fluff it up, and he's already almost dry. By the time I get to his tail, which I always do last, it's completely dry and I have to dampen it. In the winter I did blow dry him, but it was hard because it took a while to detangle enough to brush without pulling, so really I was just warming the room with the hair dryer. I'm not sure how I would detangle while I'm drying because I'm not great at detangling with a brush, I use a comb to detangle. Do you usually use a comb to blow dry, or switch back and forth? I haven't tried drying with a comb. Maybe I need a better brush and drying technique? I read that a few of the really good detanglers work best with heat, and it's starting to cool down outside, so I should probably prepare to start drying him again.


OK, if you're letting him air dry, what you are doing is fine.

If you are using a dryer, it helps to have an arm to hold it, so you have two hands free to work on his coat. (I have the dog in a grooming loop while I'm drying) I do switch between a CC Buttercomb and a wood pin brush when I'm drying. I use the wood pin brush for general "fluffing" to help dry, as you would human hair. I use the comb if I come across any mats while I'm drying.

The technique is something you learn with time. Remember, I've been doing it for over 9 years now, and on 3 dogs, two with full coats. I get LOTS of practice! LOL!



EvaE1izabeth said:


> I can see why this would work better because it's hard to soak the conditioner into the roots, and that's where I'm finding it feels tight after a bath - not quite matted, but the comb doesn't pull through it easily, like it's seconds away from matting. I've been doing his "bath" in the shower with the handheld, but I have a rubber tub I can bring in there.


It sounds like it might really help you at this point. I don't do it for every bath, but if I feel the coats on the long-haired ones are feeling at all dry, I'll float them. I probably do Kodi a couple of times a year, and I've done Panda once in her almost 3 years.  Pixel never needs it, but her coat is very fine and she is also in a puppy cut.



EvaE1izabeth said:


> Most definitely! He had to be cut short about two months ago and I felt so guilty, but he had matted so quickly on our trip. I thought it was from traveling, but I figured it out the week after his haircut when I was still sliding little knots of hair out of his short coat twice a day. It doesn't seem as bad now. How long does it usually last?


Don't feel guilty! Hair grows!  Blowing coat can be kind of an off and on thing between 10 months and two years. The first one is usually the longgest and worst... It can go on for 2-3 months. After that, they may blow more a couple more times, but it won't be as bad and it won't go for as long. Since he is a boy, you won't have the hormonal changes that girls have, but I should warn you that they can also blow coat if they get ill. Kodi blew coat terribly at about 4 years old when he had several bouts of Clostridium overgrowth. (fortunately now under control!) I've heard this with several other dogs. Panda blew a TON of undercoat after her last heat.



EvaE1izabeth said:


> In the short term if a conditioner would normally be a little too heavy for his coat but would allow for easier, more frequent combing, what would be the downside of diluting and using something like that just while he's blowing coat?


Every coat is a little different. You've just got to keep experimenting to find what works best for him. For Kodi, when he was blowing coat, I found that when it was at its worst, bathing him and really conditioning his coat every 4 days, and completely combing him out twice a day, ESPECIALLY right before bed, was what got us through it. But he was in full coat. I think it would have been easier if I'd been willing to put him in a puppy cut. Fortunately, Panda was MUCH easier. She got some little mats, but nothing that I couldn't keep ahead of grooming her once a day, or even missing a day here or there. If I missed a day when Kodi was blowing coat, he was a solid mass of mats from head to toe!


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