# How About Sad Tawney update has a happy ending



## dbeech (Jun 16, 2009)

I posted a couple of weeks ago about getting a new girl, Tawney, a 10 month old. Tawney arrived Friday night and she is really, sweet little girl who gets along very well with my other Hav.

I took her in for her vet check up on Saturday and the vet found that she had a 2.5 luxating patella that at some point would probably require surgery. The surger runs around $2,000 to $2,500. Later that night, when she was doing RLH I noticed her hopping and favoring her back left leg. 

Obviously, this is a very upsetting development. I contacted her breeder and she gave me a very difficult time and insisted that Tawney must have hurt herself at my house, which is absolutely ridiculous. This is a genetic condition. She also said this was not a serious health condition that would warrant return of the dog. 

Her breeder did finally agree to take her back, but I will have to pay shipping costs. She will not refund her purchase price until she is able to sell her to someone else. 

Sigh, I guess I will keep looking for another dog.


----------



## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

dbeech said:


> I posted a couple of weeks ago about getting a new girl, Tawney, a 10 month old. Tawney arrived Friday night and she is really, sweet little girl who gets along very well with my other Hav.
> 
> I took her in for her vet check up on Saturday and the vet found that she had a 2.5 luxating patella that at some point would probably require surgery. The surger runs around $2,000 to $2,500. Later that night, when she was doing RLH I noticed her hopping and favoring her back left leg.
> 
> ...


 I feel for the puppy having to travel again. Hope she finds a good home I am sorry you had to go threw this. Who is the Breeder?


----------



## whimsy (Apr 3, 2010)

What a horrible situation! I feel bad that you have to go through all this! Its a very upsetting situation for you and that poor pup.


----------



## jacqui (Aug 7, 2007)

So sorry for everyone involved. Let's just hope it was unpredictable. Not an easy situation.


----------



## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

I'm so sorry......


----------



## clare (Feb 6, 2010)

Oh that is so sad.It makes you wonder about some of these breeders,they all maintain that they want the best for their dogs, and how much they value and love them, un yet sometimes it all seems to come down to money.I know that does not apply to the breeders on this forum.


----------



## Ninja (Nov 1, 2010)

That is really sad. I feel bad for the poor pup and it was wrong on the breeder's part. I hope she finds another good home with someone who is aware of her condition. Really sorry to hear about this


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

That is absolutely AWFUL! So sad for Tawney, and you    I hate when breeders get defensive and act like it's nothing THEY did or it's not SERIOUS. Since the dog was 10 months old already wouldn't the fact already be known by the breeder that she had luxating patellas????? I wonder if she knew and sold her to you anyway. I think SHE should pay the shipping back.


----------



## dbeech (Jun 16, 2009)

Mom2Izzo said:


> That is absolutely AWFUL! So sad for Tawney, and you    I hate when breeders get defensive and act like it's nothing THEY did or it's not SERIOUS. Since the dog was 10 months old already wouldn't the fact already be known by the breeder that she had luxating patellas????? I wonder if she knew and sold her to you anyway. I think SHE should pay the shipping back.


Tawney came from a very, reputable breeder and I honestly don't believe that the breeder knew that Tawney had this patella problem. She even had me speak to her vet, who said she was not aware of this issue. My purchase contract had a 48 hour vet check clause and as a breeder you have expect that sometimes health issues are going to come up. I just wish that her response had been more appropriate.

It is just a sad situation all around particularly for the sweet, little dog.


----------



## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

That's BS! I know who the breeder is and as much as I love her dogs, I have heard she was tough to deal with. I remember Tawney was an older pup, so I do believe the breeder knew about the patellas. That's most likely why she wasn't kept for show. How could she not know when the pup was 10 months old? She should pay for the shipping back, as well as return your money immediately. I am sorry you had to deal with that.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

I have to say, when I got Ruby, the vet said she had a luxating patella, though she didn't give it a number. Ruby was only 9 weeks old. When I spoke to the breeder, she told me that vets sometimes say that when it is, in fact, not a problem. In my case, within a very short time, Ruby was showing no signs of the problem and she's now a lunatic who runs and jumps everywhere.

I'm so sorry you've experienced this and I feel terrible for Tawney.


----------



## Sox (Jan 29, 2010)

Debbie,
I'm so sorry that you are going through this. I remember reading your first post about Tawney and hoping that things would turn out just fine for you. Early in our search for a havanese puppy, we interacted with your breeder about an older puppy that she had on her website. We were very excited at the prospect of getting this particular puppy, but having spent numerous hours reading the forum, we had many questions for her. As soon as we began asking more "well-informed" questions about the puppy, the breeder literally snapped. It was truly the most irrational, unprofessional, interaction that my husband and I had ever experienced. We were in disbelief. We knew instantly that this was not the breeder for us. I have admired the dogs bred by her on the forum and I'm glad to see that there are happy endings. However, after our experience, I am very leery of this breeder. You absolutely deserve BOTH the purchase price and the shipping charges to be reimbursed. I hope that this breeder does the right thing. Tawney should go to a home that is prepared for her condition. I know that in time you will find the puppy that is meant to be yours. :hug:


----------



## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

Poor little Tawney. Can you imagine how bewildered that little soul is going to feel? I would have thought that the breeder would have had her to a vet and checked out if she was 10 months old. Sounds like the breeder is not all that anxious to get her back - I hope she just doesn't ship her off to the next unsuspecting person without cluing them in.


----------



## kudo2u (Mar 7, 2009)

How much did you pay for Tawny? When do you plan to ship her back? Where are you located? Would you consider selling her to a forum member rather than shipping her back to the breeder?

I am not actively seeking another dog. And I have to admit, this will be a hard sell to DH. But for some reason, this is just really tugging at my heartstrings. I just have visions of Tawny going back to the breeder. Then being sold again. And returned. And sold again. And returned. And....poor little girl will be very confused and end up with trust issues, then she'll *really* have a hard time finding a permanent home.

I'm not blaming you, and I'm not saying she is the dog for you. So please don't take it that way! I just hate to see things like this happen, especially when it's likely to become a recurring pattern (since the breeder was not forthright about the issue).

Luxating patellas are not that big of a deal. They might require surgery... or they might not. At 10 months old, there really is no way to tell. That's a risk that I would be willing to take, to give this poor girl a forever home. Assuming I can convince DH, of course....


----------



## LilyMyLove (Jul 11, 2009)

This is a really sad situation. Lily has a luxating patella and has been doing okay in her agility class and on the supplements I have been giving her. My vet told me the surgery often doesnt work and can do more harm than good, for that reason they only do it in the most severe cases. 

I feel like everytime we have a thread about breeders who ship puppies, forum members with dogs from this particular breeder chime in to say that they are not all bad and that their experience was great with shipping. I don't mean any disrespect but this is a prime example of why shipping is inhumane. This dog who already went through the trauma of being taken from its home and shipped in less than ideal circumstances will now have to be sent back, and as Kudoz mentioned this could happen again and again. How sad for this little dog. 

It is my opinion that a breeder who ships does not truly care for the well being of the animal or they are woefully ignorant of what a "pet area" on a plane looks like to a 3-10lb puppy.Not to mention from the Midwest in the beginning of February.


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

Oh I feel so bad that little Tawney did not work out I am sure it is a hugh disapointment. Luxating Patella's are always gentic. There are other injurys a pup can get but this is always gentic. The breeder may have thought something is off and maybe did not know for sure. Sometimes it does not cause a big problem that needs surgery, 
more often then not they do require surgery. Everyone who's dog has had this surgery knows it is a big deal. Not only is it expensive it is heartbreaking and then theres the anesthesia that can cause further complications.

Debbie, I am so glad you took her to the vet staight away. I always go within 48 hours, no matter how much I think I love the dog. Most contracts state you should. You will find another dog and Tawney will find a home. I know this was a very hard decision for you. Hugs


----------



## rokipiki (Oct 15, 2010)

Poor little girl! She will probably end up in shelter, not to mention more tragic scenario. Luxating patella is not such a big problem. Maltese from my park had patella surgrey and she is now OK and running around like mad. 
I wouldn't return her. No way! I am sort of caretaker person and I would bond to poor little baby even more! Keep Tawney and take care of her. She will give you back more love than perfect and healthy dog. And don't forget that vets sometimes give dignosis just in order to earn money in future. 
The price for patelle surgery is insane! 
Roki sends her alll kisse on Earth
Marina sends her all love

PS -Oh I saw her photo - she looks exactly like Roki. They would be a great couple!


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

Rokipiki, I very much doubt Tawney will end up in a shelter. The breeder just needs to disclose that there could be a problem down the road and there are always people willing and able to deal with whatever the out come. You know they say forwarned is forarmed. Many dogs that we never hear about get returned. What is sad is when people keep the dog for 6 month or more and never properly house train and sometimes use abusive training so the dog becomes a shy/frightened dog, no matter how beautiful a dog with those issues are hard to place. This was not a down the road issue, this came up right away.


----------



## Paige (Sep 12, 2006)

I am so sorry, what a terrible situation you have been put in.


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Tawney*

I am the breeder and to make posts on this Forum without telling the WHOLE story is not giving everyone the truth of the matter. Tawney was a puppy back from two patella cleared champion parents and she was health checked by Madeleine's vet in FL before coming to me. I kept her and at 9 months decided she was not show quality and sold her as a pet. She was then vet checked again before flying to her pet home in CA.

Then suddenly I get an email from you Debra saying she has something wrong with her patella. I stated this dog was vet checked twice and I never noticed anything. How can this be. BUT, if she wanted to send her back, she would get her money back once I had my vet check her AGAIN for the 3rd time. My contract states that if you do not want a dog you need to ship the dog back at your expense. Standard in any contract.

I also gave Debbie my vet's phone number and she spoke with my vet Dr. Erin yesterday. My vet wanted to know if this was a Grade 1 or Grade 2 patella and Debbie stated she didn't know. My vet said does not sound like a surgery problem and my vet stated that Debbie said I am worried about arthritis in the future. Dr. Erin said arthritis is a problem that any dog faces in their older years.

Bottom line here is that she was told she could return the dog. So why post on this forum is my question. Why exagerate that the problem is that the breeder isn't standing behind a dog with a problem. Any dog or puppy that I have that isn't adoptable or has any issues that might be a problem in the future, is never sold and is given to a home for free.



dbeech said:


> I posted a couple of weeks ago about getting a new girl, Tawney, a 10 month old. Tawney arrived Friday night and she is really, sweet little girl who gets along very well with my other Hav.
> 
> I took her in for her vet check up on Saturday and the vet found that she had a 2.5 luxating patella that at some point would probably require surgery. The surger runs around $2,000 to $2,500. Later that night, when she was doing RLH I noticed her hopping and favoring her back left leg.
> 
> ...


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

I hesitate to post this, lest anyone think I'm prejudiced, since my babies all came from Linda, but I do know that she is telling the truth about placing dogs with good homes for nothing when there's an issue of any kind.

I don't remember the name of the dog, but not all that long ago (a year or two possibly) there was a very shy dog that she clearly stated she was going to place at no cost to the right home.

I can't speak to the specifics of this particular dog, but once again, when I first got Ruby, the vet said she felt a luxating patella. I was frightened and contacted Linda about it. She assured me the dog had been checked by her vet before she came to me and there was no problem. She told me to give it a little time and have it checked again. By the second visit there was no indication of anything and as any of you who know her . . . or me, know she's a lunatic who corrals the whole gang and has taken over, ruling the house.


----------



## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

I don't know anything about this situation but what I do know about luxating patellas is that almost every puppy seems to have them because their bones are not fully developed and therefore slip more easily. As the dog's bones mature and they build stronger tendons and muscle, the patella is less likely to slip. My vet has told me that luxating patellas cannot actually be diagnosed until around 2 years of age, and that only a grade 3 or higher may ever require surgery.


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

PS
About this shark feeding frenzy. I have many, many happy customers who email pictures and ask advice and brag about my dogs that they have had for over 10 years. As well as my new puppy buyers. For those that say I am difficult to deal with. Perhaps it is the customer that is difficult to deal with because there are always two sides to every story. Not every single puppy buyers is ethical or honest about their dealings. It isn't ALWAYS the breeder that is the bad guy.

I will deal with this lady individually and this is defamation of my character and it needs to stop. At no time did I ever say that Tawney could not be returned. If I was doing something unscrupulous I would never have given Debbie my vets phone number.

There are puppy buyers out there that no matter how much you do or how good you care for the dogs will find some fault. Human nature always wants to believe bad gossip.



pjewel said:


> I have to say, when I got Ruby, the vet said she had a luxating patella, though she didn't give it a number. Ruby was only 9 weeks old. When I spoke to the breeder, she told me that vets sometimes say that when it is, in fact, not a problem. In my case, within a very short time, Ruby was showing no signs of the problem and she's now a lunatic who runs and jumps everywhere.
> 
> I'm so sorry you've experienced this and I feel terrible for Tawney.


----------



## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

dbeech said:


> Tawney came from a very, reputable breeder and I honestly don't believe that the breeder knew that Tawney had this patella problem. She even had me speak to her vet, who said she was not aware of this issue. My purchase contract had a 48 hour vet check clause and as a breeder you have expect that sometimes health issues are going to come up. I just wish that her response had been more appropriate.
> 
> It is just a sad situation all around particularly for the sweet, little dog.


 Maybe she would pay for a second opinion or in this case a third.


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

pjewel said:


> I have to say, when I got Ruby, the vet said she had a luxating patella, though she didn't give it a number. Ruby was only 9 weeks old. When I spoke to the breeder, she told me that vets sometimes say that when it is, in fact, not a problem. In my case, within a very short time, Ruby was showing no signs of the problem and she's now a lunatic who runs and jumps everywhere.
> 
> I'm so sorry you've experienced this and I feel terrible for Tawney.


Hi Geri, why would a vet say a puppy had luxating patellas if s/he didn't? That just doesn't make sense. Also in Tawney's case, she was already limping, so it was clearly bad enough that it was bothering her. That doesnt sound like it bodes well for long-term soundness.

I know you are very happy with this breeder, but this doesn't sound like it was handled well.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

krandall said:


> Hi Geri, why would a vet say a puppy had luxating patellas if s/he didn't? That just doesn't make sense. Also in Tawney's case, she was already limping, so it was clearly bad enough that it was bothering her. That doesnt sound like it bodes well for long-term soundness.
> 
> I know you are very happy with this breeder, but this doesn't sound like it was handled well.


Karen,

I was telling my experience with what the vet said when I first got Ruby. I wasn't addressing her experience. What I said was, the initial observation by my vet turned out to be wrong. When a different vet in the same office examined her weeks later there was no indication of any problem.

I must say, I don't believe the breeder would have sent a puppy with a known problem . . . and based upon her addressing it, she obviously didn't. And yes, I'm very happy with my whole fur family and would get another from Linda in a heartbeat.


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

OK now I understand the situation with your vet better. 

Also, Linda is absolutely right that if the return shipping is stated as the buyer's expense in the original contract, it shouldn't be any surprise.

The whole thing is a shame, and I hope that Linda is able to find Tawney another forever home soon. She's absolutely adorable!

I know how happy you have been with your dogs and there are other holy Prairiwinds owners on the forum as well. And Linda is absolutely right that no one can please everyone all the time.

If there is one thing that people should take away from the two threads in the last few days with people unhappy with a puppy transaction, it is READ and understand your contract. If there is something you are uncomfortable with or don't understand fully TALK to your breeder about it ahead of time, and ask for clarified wording, or if necessary and agreed to by the breeder, a change in the contract ahead of time. If both of you are truly on the same page, there's much less room for misunderstanding after the fact.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

There's another take away in this for me. In any business, if you deal with the public (and I do), you can please a great many people, but if there are a few unhappy with your service or product, word will spread like wildfire. There is no way to make everyone happy all the time, much as we might want to.


----------



## dbeech (Jun 16, 2009)

pjewel said:


> There's another take away in this for me. In any business, if you deal with the public (and I do), you can please a great many people, but if there are a few unhappy with your service or product, word will spread like wildfire. There is no way to make everyone happy all the time, much as we might want to.


So true, as a business person I learned a long time that your business reputation is not just based on your happy customers, but also how you treat your customers with problems.


----------



## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

This is becoming a he said she said thing. This is a sad situation and I can now see both sides. 

Honestly, I would have a hard time sending the dog back myself. When you decide to bring a dog into your life, people need to realize the cost that can occur. Bella needed dental surgery and liver surgery when she was a pup. Cost me 800.00 for the first dental surgery, 4000.00 for the liver surgery, and another 300.00 for her second dental surgery. The breeder offered to take her back or refund my purchase price to put towards the surgeries. At no point, did I consider returning her. I know it's a lot of money, but getting a new puppy does not guarantee it won't have health issues at some point.


----------



## Flynn Gentry-Taylor (Jan 17, 2008)

Heartbreaking story for Tawney...I hope the person on the forum who thought she might take her can buy her with DH's blessings...


----------



## The Fussy Puppy Gang (May 21, 2007)

So....what you're saying is that Tawney is here, in CA, and possibly in need of a permanent home.

Oh heck I wish I was ready for another one right now. It's a good thing DH isn't here to hear me cry. :Cry:


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

lfung5 said:


> This is becoming a he said she said thing. This is a sad situation and I can now see both sides.
> 
> Honestly, I would have a hard time sending the dog back myself. When you decide to bring a dog into your life, people need to realize the cost that can occur. Bella needed dental surgery and liver surgery when she was a pup. Cost me 800.00 for the first dental surgery, 4000.00 for the liver surgery, and another 300.00 for her second dental surgery. The breeder offered to take her back or refund my purchase price to put towards the surgeries. At no point, did I consider returning her. I know it's a lot of money, but getting a new puppy does not guarantee it won't have health issues at some point.


I agree with that after the initial vet check. But if a puppy has problems at the first vet check (whether the breeder knew about them or not) I wouldn't blame the buyer for wanting to return the puppy in the least. It's one thing to knowingly agree to take on a puppy with potential problems, the way Natalie did. It's also different if you've had the puppy for a while and bonded with it (and it with you) before problems become apparent. It's another thing to agree to purchase a healthy puppy and then be expected to keep one that has health problems from day one. (I want to make it clear that I am NOT suggesting that the breeder knew this puppy had a problem... I take her at her word that she did not)

There are no certainties when you are dealing with animals, but why bother going to the trouble of purchasing a puppy from a reputable, health-testing breeder, if you don't care if you receive a puppy who at least starts out healthy? Then we might as well ALL just take any cute puppy that comes along. That's fine if you are truly "adopting". But, for all that people use that term, most of use do NOT "adopt" purebred dogs... we purchase them. Often for a LOT of money.

Again, I want to make it clear that I am not in anyway blaming the breeder here... it's an unfortunate situation for all involved. But I don't think it's fair to make Deb feel bad about sending her back.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

The Fussy Puppy Gang said:


> So....what you're saying is that Tawney is here, in CA, and possibly in need of a permanent home.
> 
> Oh heck I wish I was ready for another one right now. It's a good thing DH isn't here to hear me cry. :Cry:


Yes Wanda, right there in California . . . that beautiful baby girl with the flaming red hair. Hmmmmmm.


----------



## LilyMyLove (Jul 11, 2009)

I would take her in a second if I were you she's gorgeous!


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

I suppose before I commented I should have waited to hear both sides of the story. I can understand where both sides are coming from. I just hope that Tawney finds her forever home and is happy! She is beautiful.


----------



## kudo2u (Mar 7, 2009)

I'm the one who inquired about buying her, if there was an issue with the breeder.

The offer still stands....assuming I can convince DH. And that's a big IF... haha

Here's the thing. I know nothing about the breeder. I know nothing about the buyer. Well, except what I've read in this thread (and I have read the whole thing).

Here is what I do know.

-Every story has three sides - yours, mine, and the truth.
-Luxating patellas are usually not a big deal, no matter what stage it has progressed to.
-There is about a 95% chance she is limping because it's annoying, not because she's in pain.
-This poor little girl has just been taken from her home, shipped halfway across the country, is about to be shipped back....only to have the whole thing happen again. Talk about traumatic.

I don't care what transpired between the breeder and the buyer. 

I don't care who's "right." 

I don't care what the contract said.

I don't care what the vet said.

I do care about the dog. I think that after something as traumatic as being shipped, settling into a new home, being shipped back, resold, being shipped again, all before she is a year old...I think that will cause significant trauma, will cause trust issues, and will stunt her emotional development.

I've worked with enough rescues (Havanese and many, many other breeds) to know how difficult that type of situation can be to rehabilitate. I am offering to step in and eliminate at least two steps, and to give Tawney a permanent home. Assuming I can convince DH we really need another dog. 

I have not talked to him (and will not) until there is some sort of resolution here.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

I think there has been resolution here in terms of Debbie wanting to send Tawney back and the breeder agreeing to take her back. It seems to me that Tawney would do well to be with someone who will love her and nurture her for the sweet soul she is.

I'm a sucker for a happy ending, so I'm hoping we find one here for her with someone who will share her with us.


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

Wow, Tawney is not a rescue and is not a discount dog! She belongs back with her breeder who will decide what is best. What is the point of buying a dog from a good breeder who offers a guarantee and advises you to have the dog vet checked. I must be a bit confused, I thought the purpose to buy a dog from a good breeder was to hedge you chances on having a dog with medical problems. So I guess if you spend x amount of dollars to buy a dog from a good breeder if you take it to have it health checked within 48 hours and the Vet warns you of problems down the road you should just suck it up. We are not talking about a dog that has bonded with us and then gets a problem, that is different.
As for flying, show dogs fly all the time esp. dogs that are shown internationally! These dogs are sometimes met by a new handler that will show them in the country they arrived. We are talking about a dog that was kept as a show prospect and then sold as a pet. Tawney is probably a well adjusted dog, not a rescue. No one is saying that the Breeder is a bad breeder. I am sure it is disappointing to both partys.


----------



## kudo2u (Mar 7, 2009)

The Laughing Magpie said:


> Wow, Tawney is not a rescue and is not a discount dog! She belongs back with her breeder who will decide what is best. What is the point of buying a dog from a good breeder who offers a guarantee and advises you to have the dog vet checked. I must be a bit confused, I thought the purpose to buy a dog from a good breeder was to hedge you chances on having a dog with medical problems. So I guess if you spend x amount of dollars to buy a dog from a good breeder if you take it to have it health checked within 48 hours and the Vet warns you of problems down the road you should just suck it up. We are not talking about a dog that has bonded with us and then gets a problem, that is different.
> As for flying, show dogs fly all the time esp. dogs that are shown internationally! These dogs are sometimes met by a new handler that will show them in the country they arrived. We are talking about a dog that was kept as a show prospect and then sold as a pet. Tawney is probably a well adjusted dog, not a rescue. No one is saying that the Breeder is a bad breeder. I am sure it is disappointing to both partys.


I'm sure that was a reply to me...

I wasn't trying to imply that Tawney was a rescue. I was just saying that in my experience with many, many rescues, one of the major problems occurs when they are shuttled from one home to another and lose trust in people.

Also, it sounded like there was a disagreement between the buyer and the breeder. So rather than have what sounds like a really sweet girl have a very uncertain future, I was offering to buy her (from the buyer).

If the buyer and the breeder have worked something out...then I don't have to try and convince DH that we need another dog right now. If they can't reach some sort of resolution, then I'm still offering to see what I can do.

Does that make more sense?

I think I talked too much in my last post and ended up going around in circles...:suspicious:


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

The reply was not just for you Kudo 2 it was my feeling of how everyone is missing the point. First off Good Breeders generally have contracts that state they have first right of refusal if you should get rid of your dog for any reason. The dog cannot be sold or given to a third party without permission of the Breeder. I am sure the Breeder cares about Tawney. I feel both parties are being treated unfairly by the assumption that both parties are being irresposible in regards to the dog, this just is not true.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

I don't think there's any question here that everyone wants the best future for Tawney. The first thing Debbie said was how sweet she was. I'm sure Debbie, Linda and all of us would like Tawney to be in a home where she will be loved and cared for forever. If she can wind up in a home of one of the members, that's a bonus for all of us who would like to share in her future adventures and love her by proxy.

Robbie, you're right. There is no dereliction of duty being suggested here, and of course the breeder would have to agree with the choice. It just might be easier all around if someone contacts Linda to discuss it.


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Tawney for sale*

The buyer and the breeder have not worked anything out because the buyer is only posting on this list and not responding to any emails I have sent to her. I sent Debbie the phone number of my vet and the only way I knew what transpired between Debbie and my vet is because my vet told me about the conversation. And the other point is Tawney is not for sale from the Buyer, Tawney is my dog and anyone who wishes to buy her needs to contact me and discuss Tawney. I have a contract and questionnare that any potential buyer needs to fill out. Tawney is NOT a rescue dog and this has become a ridiculous scenario played out like she was abandoned by the breeder. Debbie has been told to return Tawney to me, but at this point has not contacted me again, just complained on this list. Tawney is not sick, she is healthy and has a wonderful and sweet temperament. Debbie is worried about some future problem that doesn't even exist at this time. That is her choice, but Debbie you need to contact me and decide what you are going to do. Also Debbie paid a very low pet price which included having Tawney spayed before she left my home.



kudo2u said:


> I'm sure that was a reply to me...
> 
> I wasn't trying to imply that Tawney was a rescue. I was just saying that in my experience with many, many rescues, one of the major problems occurs when they are shuttled from one home to another and lose trust in people.
> 
> ...


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Tawney*

Thank you. That is the total point here. Seems like you have a very level head. Anyone interested in buying Tawney, please contact me at [email protected] I have attached some pictures of Tawney as a baby and one of her happy face.



The Laughing Magpie said:


> The reply was not just for you Kudo 2 it was my feeling of how everyone is missing the point. First off Good Breeders generally have contracts that state they have first right of refusal if you should get rid of your dog for any reason. The dog cannot be sold or given to a third party without permission of the Breeder. I am sure the Breeder cares about Tawney. I feel both parties are being treated unfairly by the assumption that both parties are being irresposible in regards to the dog, this just is not true.


----------



## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

dbeech said:


> Tawney came from a very, reputable breeder and I honestly don't believe that the breeder knew that Tawney had this patella problem. She even had me speak to her vet, who said she was not aware of this issue. My purchase contract had a 48 hour vet check clause and as a breeder you have expect that sometimes health issues are going to come up. I just wish that her response had been more appropriate.
> 
> It is just a sad situation all around particularly for the sweet, little dog.


 Have you guys noticed that Debbie would probably like nothing more then this trend to end. We have had several different trends lately that have turned in to a breeder buyer nightmare.It is Unfortunate only because I have seen this happen to at least two others including myself where you feel like you do not want to be a member of this forum.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Linda, maybe I'm missing it. Where are the photos of Tawney?


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

How do I post the pictures?


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Tawney Pictures*

Okay, I think I figured it ou.


----------



## morriscsps (Aug 17, 2010)

Use the 'Go Advanced' button. A more detailed reply box shows up. If you scroll down, there is a section for managing and adding photos.

Oops, you beat me to it.


----------



## kudo2u (Mar 7, 2009)

pjewel said:


> I don't think there's any question here that everyone wants the best future for Tawney. The first thing Debbie said was how sweet she was. I'm sure Debbie, Linda and all of us would like Tawney to be in a home where she will be loved and cared for forever. If she can wind up in a home of one of the members, that's a bonus for all of us who would like to share in her future adventures and love her by proxy.
> 
> Robbie, you're right. There is no dereliction of duty being suggested here, and of course the breeder would have to agree with the choice. It just might be easier all around if someone contacts Linda to discuss it.


Geri, I think you hit this on the head. I think the majority of this discussion is a big miscommunication.

It does sound like everyone here, including the breeder and the buyer, want what's best for Tawney. Everyone has said how sweet she is, and I'm sure the breeder will have no trouble in finding her a good forever home.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Linda, she is beautiful. Love her. In the more recent photo, her sweetness shows through.


----------



## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

What a beautiful girl!


----------



## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Linda,

Tawney is absolutely gorgeous!!! Oh, I love those redheads!!


----------



## trueblue (Jan 22, 2008)

OMG. I wish Tawney was a boy!


----------



## The Fussy Puppy Gang (May 21, 2007)

In all seriousness, if we were in any position to add another I'd be sending a filled out questionnaire to Linda in a heartbeat! 

Tawney looks like a sweetheart. I love that smile! 

I hope that all ends well for everyone.


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

trueblue said:


> OMG. I wish Tawney was a boy!


LOL Kim!


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

She's such a beautiful girl!!!!!


----------



## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

Tawney is gorgeous! What a sweet face!


----------



## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

Omg she's gorgeous. How has this story ended?


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

I don't think it has ended . . . yet.


----------



## holt24 (Jan 21, 2011)

please keep us posted she is a beauty, hope it is a happy ending for all


----------



## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

Seriously, any issues between buyers and breeders need to be kept between them. There are so many mis-understandings that go on that we, forum members just don't need to get involved. Hurt feelings and hurt reputations all around. I know everyone is just trying to be helpful but we just never know all the facts.........just sayin'.......


----------



## KSC (Aug 6, 2009)

mellowbo said:


> Seriously, any issues between buyers and breeders need to be kept between them. There are so many mis-understandings that go on that we, forum members just don't need to get involved. Hurt feelings and hurt reputations all around. I know everyone is just trying to be helpful but we just never know all the facts.........just sayin'.......


Absolutely...very good point. I don't care about those dynamics nor is it any of anyone's business...I was just curious about where this beautiful girl ended up. Thanks for your reminder...you're right.


----------



## dbeech (Jun 16, 2009)

I have a happy update. Linda had out of town guests so could not take Tawney back this week. Of course, after spending the week with Tawney we have all fallen in love with her, especially Riley, my other Hav. He is just crazy about her. So she is going to be staying with us. She is such a sweetie and I am glad we will have her in our lives. Sometimes these things just have a way of working out...

Now, can anyone tell me how to walk two dogs at once...LOL??!!


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

I love happy endings!!!!! Congrats on your new girl. I am so happy you worked this out between you. I have a feeling this girl is remarkable. I know since she was kept for show even though she was not used, she must have a great temperment!!!!! Riley's new girl friend how cute. Now we need pictures!!!!!


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Debbie, I'm so excited for her and for you. I really believe she'll bring you a lot of joy. Now they're right. Pictures, we need pictures.


----------



## rdanielle (Sep 2, 2008)

Congrats, what great news!! Can't wait to see pics!

Try a leash coupler:

http://www.keepdoggiesafe.com/couplers.html?gclid=CMDqo5y6k6cCFRRg2godEWROdg


----------



## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

I am so so glad to hear that Tawney will be staying with you!!


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

dbeech said:


> I have a happy update. Linda had out of town guests so could not take Tawney back this week. Of course, after spending the week with Tawney we have all fallen in love with her, especially Riley, my other Hav. He is just crazy about her. So she is going to be staying with us. She is such a sweetie and I am glad we will have her in our lives. Sometimes these things just have a way of working out...
> 
> Now, can anyone tell me how to walk two dogs at once...LOL??!!


That is WONDERFUL news!!! She is beautiful and as I know, Linda's dogs are so sweet and lovable!  Can't wait for more Tawney updates!


----------



## clare (Feb 6, 2010)

So good to hear Tawney is going to have a great life !! It's great walking two, it balances you out!


----------



## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

:whoo: :cheer2: I just love happy endings!!! 
I am so glad that little Tawney has stolen your hearts and that she and Riley are already good friends. I can't wait to see pictures!!!


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Tawney*

I am very happy also for a happy ending. Yes I have a house guest. Her name is Bente Bejorneset and she is from Norway. She is taking home a Havanese and she brought me a new boy. His name is Iwo. Here is a picture of him outside at the airport in The Netherlands. And the other one is of Bente boarding the plane for the US


----------



## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

dbeech said:


> I have a happy update. Linda had out of town guests so could not take Tawney back this week. Of course, after spending the week with Tawney we have all fallen in love with her, especially Riley, my other Hav. He is just crazy about her. So she is going to be staying with us. She is such a sweetie and I am glad we will have her in our lives. Sometimes these things just have a way of working out...
> 
> Now, can anyone tell me how to walk two dogs at once...LOL??!!


 Oh Debbie, I am so happy everything worked out:whoo:


----------



## trueblue (Jan 22, 2008)

Linda, they look like twins!

oh...never mind. i obviously didn't get enough sleep last night. same dog. doh.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Linda, beautiful boy and I'm sure, a great addition to your hav family. 

I'm a sucker for a happy ending. As William Shakespeare wrote, oh so many years ago, "All's well that ends well." The sound you hear is me applauding.


----------



## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Linda,

Your new little boy is a heartbreaker!!! Awww, I want a puppy!!!!!


----------



## frankiemuniz01 (Feb 19, 2011)

I have heard she was tough to deal with. I remember Tawney was an older pup, so I do believe the breeder knew about the patellas.


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

I guess someone coming from Norway would not find it a heartship visiting SD this time of year. Me on the other hand I am sure stepping out of the airport I would try to run back in, I find this part of NC cold and it was 70 yesterday. Congrats on your new little stud puppy Iwo. I am so happy everything worked out.


----------



## kudo2u (Mar 7, 2009)

Yay! Debbie, I'm glad you decided to keep Tawney. I have quite a bit of experience dealing with luxating patellas, as do others on the forum. I really wouldn't worry about it for quite some time, if ever. And definitely get a third and fourth opinion before you decide to go with surgery.

Linda, your new boy looks beautiful. Hope he's the perfect addition to your family.

What a great happy ending for everyone!


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

prairie said:


> I am very happy also for a happy ending. Yes I have a house guest. Her name is Bente Bejorneset and she is from Norway. She is taking home a Havanese and she brought me a new boy. His name is Iwo. Here is a picture of him outside at the airport in The Netherlands. And the other one is of Bente boarding the plane for the US


Welcome to both Bente and Iwo! And I hope that now that you've started posting here, you will still continue to participate. The input and expertise of our serious breeders is always valued!


----------



## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

That's great news!!! I use a coupler to walk my 2 boys.

I bet you won't run into any problems down the road with the patellas. They say not to do surgery unless the dog is lame for more than half the month. You can add supplements to her diet and keeping her at a nice lean weight will help. Good luck with her!!


----------



## Pipersmom (Jul 27, 2009)

Yay Debbie! I'm so happy it turned out this way and it sounds like Riley is too! I know it usually takes a while for the first dog to accept the second one so what a treat that he likes her so much right off the bat.

Congratulations!


----------



## dbeech (Jun 16, 2009)

Here are pics of my two furbabies. Tawney weighs 10.5 lbs and Riley is over 17 lbs (yes, he is on a diet!). It is so much fun watching them together.


----------



## kudo2u (Mar 7, 2009)

Beautiful pair! I'm so glad they are getting along. Thanks for the photo!


----------



## clare (Feb 6, 2010)

Tawney will help Riley with his diet all that RLH!


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Aw Debbie. He looks proud, like Adam finally got his Eve. They look so cute together.


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

dbeech said:


> Here are pics of my two furbabies. Tawney weighs 10.5 lbs and Riley is over 17 lbs (yes, he is on a diet!). It is so much fun watching them together.


She's just adorable!


----------



## motherslittlehelper (Mar 18, 2010)

Tawney and Riley look beautiful together! So happy to hear all is working out and that Riley is so accepting and happy with her!  Sounds like a great match! Best wishes to you and your family, Debbie.


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

trueblue said:


> Linda, they look like twins!
> 
> oh...never mind. i obviously didn't get enough sleep last night. same dog. doh.


LMBO!!!! Bwahahahaha!


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

prairie said:


> I am very happy also for a happy ending. Yes I have a house guest. Her name is Bente Bejorneset and she is from Norway. She is taking home a Havanese and she brought me a new boy. His name is Iwo. Here is a picture of him outside at the airport in The Netherlands. And the other one is of Bente boarding the plane for the US


Ahhhh he's so cute!!!!


----------



## Flynn Gentry-Taylor (Jan 17, 2008)

Darling, glad it worked out.


----------



## trueblue (Jan 22, 2008)

Tawney has such a sweet face, and I love her coloring and the awesome end to this story. But I think you should start another thread because it isn't a sad update anymore


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Norway*

Thank you everyone for you kind postings about Tawney and my new boy Iwo from Norway. It is very interesting to go places with Bente and explain what things mean here and about the different food we have here in the restaurants.


----------



## Ditto's Mom (Apr 29, 2007)

trueblue said:


> Tawney has such a sweet face, and I love her coloring and the awesome end to this story. But I think you should start another thread because it isn't a sad update anymore


 I second Kim's post!


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

I was thinking that the other day, I vote for a new, happy Tawney/Riley - Debbie thread.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Linda, have fun with your houseguest. I'm sure there's a lot that Bente will find strange about the ways of our world, much as I suspect we would feel if were were there. Looking forward to hearing more about Iwo in the future.


----------



## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

Yes, a new thread!!!!!! Tawney and Riley will keep each other busy. As for Riley needing a diet, the exercise should help, but I have notice that my Havs need less food then my Shih Tzu or Lhasa, My Lhasa eats about 1 cup of dry and 1 small can of wet plus treats and he is not over weight at 14lbs. Yogi who is 17 pds he is taller eats 1/2 cup dry and 1/3 small can of wet. Yet the Havs are very active.


----------



## holt24 (Jan 21, 2011)

I was thinking just change the title to Happy Tawney update, so we all know They are cute together, yes I was just getting good at walking 2- now we have Vana- that is a true challenge


----------



## prairie (Nov 12, 2010)

*Norway*

You will find this one funny. My house guest Bente seen a sign in my town for a Monastery. She wanted to know if that is where all the dead people go, LOL I said no that is where the priests and nuns live. She is amazed at all of our food here and that people go out so often to eat. To eat in a restaurant in her area Aalesund would cost $100 for a simple meal. We have it so easy here in the US



pjewel said:


> Linda, have fun with your houseguest. I'm sure there's a lot that Bente will find strange about the ways of our world, much as I suspect we would feel if were were there. Looking forward to hearing more about Iwo in the future.


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Linda, that made me LOL. I can't believe the cost of a meal in Norway. I do think people here eat out a lot more than many people in other countries.


----------



## LilyMyLove (Jul 11, 2009)

I am so glad to hear about this happy ending. Enjoy your beautiful babies!


----------



## Mom2Izzo (Jul 1, 2009)

prairie said:


> You will find this one funny. My house guest Bente seen a sign in my town for a Monastery. She wanted to know if that is where all the dead people go, LOL I said no that is where the priests and nuns live. She is amazed at all of our food here and that people go out so often to eat. To eat in a restaurant in her area Aalesund would cost $100 for a simple meal. We have it so easy here in the US


That's funny! 
Can't get over the cost of a meal out in Norway but I guess that would be easy to do here as well. DH and I LOVE to eat out. Guess that's why we rarely go on vacations- LOL!!!!


----------



## petepdx (Jul 29, 2011)

*re: to Lfung5/Linda's reply*

...Honestly, I would have a hard time sending the dog back myself....

I have no choice, my pup was found on the street. She's was given 25% chance of living but after quite a few $'s she survived. Now about to year later has a Luxating Patella.

But even if I bought her, I would still keep her.

Just my 2 cents.

-pete

Early Pictures


----------



## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

She's a cutie, Pete! Welcome to the forum!


----------



## Flynn Gentry-Taylor (Jan 17, 2008)

petepdx said:


> ...Honestly, I would have a hard time sending the dog back myself....
> 
> I have no choice, my pup was found on the street. She's was given 25% chance of living but after quite a few $'s she survived. Now about to year later has a Luxating Patella.
> 
> ...


Pete, such a sweet and trusting face..your photos are wonderful..I so enjoyed watching her transform and become at home with you...you are both lucky to find each other..thanks for sharing and glad you are here!!!


----------



## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

She's a lucky puppy and absolutely adorable. I suspect you were just perfect for each other.


----------

