# What to do if your Hav is attacked?



## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Lincoln and Scout's mini-Australian shepherd friend Shinobi was attacked tonight.

(Photos of them with their friend from a previous thread:
http://havaneseforum.com/showpost.php?p=212728&postcount=1)

My friends were walking Shinobi. There was a lady across the street walking two dogs, and one of them broke loose when he saw Shinobi, ran towards him and started attacking. The lady screamed, "Pick him up!" to my friend, but it was too late. He and the lady were able to separate the dogs eventually, but Shinobi was bleeding, bitten and bruised. They took him to the vet and he will be okay. The attacking dog had a gentle leader on which helped to limit his ability to bite, otherwise who knows what would have happened.

I cannot imagine watching this happen to either of my babies. What is the best thing to do in a case like this? Do you grab the attacking dog? The victimized dog? Kick the attacker? There is never a hose in sight (you always read about spraying the dogs with water) when you need one.

I'd like to think through what I'd do if this happened since it would be hard to think clearly in a crisis.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Oh, Jane, how awful! Poor Shinobi!! That woman shouldn' have her dogs out if she can't control them or they are aggressive! 

There was a thread on here a couple weeks ago about this, and I think it was Meeko (or Meeka) that had some very interesting insight from herself, as she was raised in Alaska around sled dogs and some wild dogs.

I'm glad Shinobi will be okay physically, but bet he is nervous now around dogs like the one that attacked him. How sad!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

Jane, that's terrible and so sad. I'm glad the dog will be okay. I remember a thread, http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=7535&highlight=attack, where Meeka commented in post #18 about what to do if a dog attacks yours. She went into detail about how to pick up the attacking dog by one of the hind legs to get it to let go of the victim. I hope others have advice as well. What a scary thought!
Gina


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

What a sad story - I am so glad that he will be ok, but I am sure he wont be too fond of other dogs for a while. 
That really is something we all should sit down and practice in our heads as it could happen to any of us at any time! It would be interesting to see what one of our dogs dones, when they are rough housing with each other, if we pick up their hind leg. I may try it when the time is right and see what the dogs do. 
Tell your friend that we are thinking of Shinobi and that he heals quickly!


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## LuvCicero (Mar 31, 2008)

What a sad post. I'm glad that with some time Shinobi will heal, but may never be the same dog. I think just like humans being attacked, there is some fear that lingers. We had this happen years ago and I can tell you there was no way to get close enough to grab that vicious dog by the leg...and take a chance on getting attacked ourselves. It is something I think about and usually carry a small air horn in my pocket with the hope that it will startle a dog enough to turn away. I think it is better to have a plan...water gun..something that you can use because even good dogs can attack.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Jane I'm glad to hear Shinobi is going to be physically OK. 
I also know Oliver still hates the dog up the street that attacked him 4 years ago. I don't trust that dog or it's owner.That dog has attacked other dogs since and the owner always blames the other dog??????
I make sure they are now where around when we go out. I carry a small air horn when we walk


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

I only had the one incident and my first thought would probably be to pick them up to get away but I do understand why that would be wrong. I had all 3 of mine on a walk and that dog charged out and I hit it the face. It just stunned him and he backed off. It was one of those things I didnt think about it, I just wanted to protect my babies and I couldn't pick up all 3.


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## sweetlotus (Nov 26, 2008)

That is just awful Jane. I am so glad to hear Shinobi will be all right. I haven't taken Mochi out for a walk yet, but it's a good thing you are preparing yourself JIC. There are a lot of dogs my the neighborhood and I never even considered that one of them may attack. Thank you.


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## mckennasedona (Feb 20, 2007)

Oh Jane, I'm so sorry to hear about Shinobi. I'm glad he will be okay. I can't imagine the fear that your friend went through.
I'll admit my heart pounded a bit when I saw the title of your thread and the fact that it was from you. I was scared to open it for fear something had happened to Lincoln or Scout. 
It is just sad that we fear taking our dogs for walks these days. I know I never walk mine together anymore unless Steve is with me.


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

Oh, that story really scared me. I wouldn't be able to pick my two up in the event of an attack.
Where could I buy a small air horn?


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Jane,

How horrifying. I can't imagine the terror your friend felt at the moment of the attack. I would agree, there's no way you can get to an attacking dog and grab its leg without risking injury to yourself or your dog. I wonder about the efficacy of the air horn (unless very loud) or the amount of water you could get out of a water gun. I wonder what the experts suggest.

I am so sorry Shinobi was hurt and hope for his quick recovery physically and a return to normalcy, if that's possible.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

In an attack situation, it is going to be pretty rare for you to be able to grab a hose. Likewise, I'm sure not going to bother with trying to lift legs off the ground of an aggressive dog. I go for the nose of the attacking dog and have had to do it twice. One time was with a very aggressive AmStaff (pit bull) that was out of control, and it was sufficient, thankfully. 

Each situation is going to need to be handled differently, but I would NOT pick up my dog unless it was a smaller dog attacking. A large dog is going to latch onto my arm by mistake, or worse yet, go for my face. I block my dog(s) and stand firm against the attacking dog. Use your knee to whack the nose of the attacking dog if possible. 

If the dog is extremely aggressive, there may be no way of both of us getting out of it uninjured.

An airhorn may startle or ward off a less intense dog (and I do carry one with me), but more than anything, it may alert someone to your need for help. Pepper spray is usually useless with a dog that is out of control. If the dog is simply showing aggression I have used it to my benefit (guarding & threatening), but not in the case of an attack. Besides, pepper spray is illegal to carry in many areas and if you use it incorrectly (like in the case of wind), you or your own dogs may be the ones suffering from it.

This is probably a good reason to carry a bully stick (not a dog treat) on walks.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

I saw the small air horns at a party store counter and bought a few. I really have my air horn with hopes that it would alert someone.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Thanks, everyone, for all your input and well wishes for Shinobi. I too hope he will be okay, emotionally. Time will tell. My friend is eager to have him play with Lincoln and Scout again soon ("friendly dogs"). But I am thinking he should heal first from his injuries - so my dogs don't annoy or upset him? What do you all think? What should they be doing to help their dog recover emotionally?

Kimberly, maybe it is good then that my friend's wife didn't pick up Shinobi - she could have been attacked herself. She tried to get between the attacking dog and her own, and ended up with her hands getting bitten (but the skin wasn't broken, thankfully). 

It is good to hear everyone's ideas - at least then, you have an arsenal of ideas if and when something like this happens.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Jane, how do your two play with Shinobi? If they are too rough, I'd be inclined to hold off, but if they play gently, then the sooner the better, IMO.

By the way, please tell me that your friend reported this other dog to Animal Control (or the police). That owner needs to be responsible and that dog needs to be held accountable.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Havtahava said:


> Jane, how do your two play with Shinobi? If they are too rough, I'd be inclined to hold off, but if they play gently, then the sooner the better, IMO.
> 
> *By the way, please tell me that your friend reported this other dog to Animal Control (or the police). That owner needs to be responsible and that dog needs to be held accountable*.


Yes get in on the record! In our case I was the only one one that wanted to follow it up so .................:frusty:


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Havtahava said:


> By the way, please tell me that your friend reported this other dog to Animal Control (or the police). That owner needs to be responsible and that dog needs to be held accountable.


This is the awful part of the story. My friend realized later that he didn't get the owner's name or info :frusty:


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## Lunastar (Feb 9, 2009)

An air horn is a good idea. What a horrible story. We don't walk ours as we are afraid of the bigger dogs in the neighborhood. Most seem nice but who really knows.

I think the pet stores have the canned air horns for difficult to train dogs.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Oh Jane my heart skipped a beat when I read this... I am so glad Lincoln and Scout are ok. Poor Shinobi! any word how she is doing tonight!


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

So sorry to hear this story! I may need to get a bully stick, just in case it is needed. I would be very afraid to touch an aggressive dog. 

I could really make lots of noise though to distract the dog!


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I do not *let *the attacking dog get to my dog. I block it by putting my body between the two animals and use my knee as it tries to get my dog. Using my knee wouldn't work if the other dog had already gotten to mine. If the animals managed to make contact and it is a small/equal size dog to my Hav, I'd pick it up by the tail to separate them, which I find to be a lot easier to grab than legs. If it is a large dog was able to get to my dog, I know what I'd do, but I'd never post it lest someone else try it that wasn't prepared.

Even though Benjamin Franklin meant this as fire-fighting advice, I think it applies to our dogs as well, "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure," and that is why I rarely walk my dogs in the neighborhood or in other places where there is potential for a surprise attack. I have a six-foot fenced yard where they play and we choose other areas that have limited access to unwanted visitors.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

I think it would also be hard to grab the legs without sacrificing your dog(s) as well cause you kind of have to get behind the attacking dog to get to it's legs especially if it is big? I just have the one time had a dog run out after mine but I had all 3 on 4 foot leashes and I guess I could have dropped my leashes to go after the other dog but my instincts pulled them back with one arm and put myself between the attacking dog. and I used my hand to hit the dog's face. I guess it could have easily bitten me but it was just what kicked in at the time. The worst part is the dog is on invisible leash there. I dont walk that street anymore but I haven't seen him out in the last month or so.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Exactly, Amanda. I assume that when people talk about grabbing the rear legs, the attacker has already gotten ahold of your dog, but I hope to never let it get to that point.

My daughter was only a young teen when she had one of our puppy Havanese in a class and an adult AmStaff broke loose from his handler to attack him. She instinctively kneed the dog in the nose and the pit bull immediately retreated (plus the handler ran over and grabbed his collar). My daughter was apologizing profusely because she would never intentionally hurt a dog and knew she had wounded him in the process, but she did the right thing. The dog trainer came over to reassure her that she did the right thing (and banned the AmStaff from returning). Thankfully, the puppy had run behind her when the AmStaff charged at him or it probably would have been a whole different situation.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

I know dogs need to "accustom" to all types/sizes of dogs but in a case like the above with your daughter what do you think about "small dog only" classes? I know one small dog could attack another but.............
PS-glad your daughter was OK and knew what to do


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I understand what you are saying, but I am a firm believer in having my dogs exposed to dogs of all sizes & breeds and I encourage my puppy families to do the same. However, I do think it is good to start socialization between puppies, who are less dangerous to each other.

Our trainer had been good about meeting each new dog up until that night and he was running late and let that dog in without the usual greeting or he would have asked them to leave. That trainer never did skip meeting another new dog after that. Most good trainers will evaluate the dogs and the way they behave and keep an eye on things so they cannot get out of control.


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

Jane, I am so sorry that Shinobi was attacked. I am glad that he would be okay physically. Playtime with Lincoln and Scout would be helpful when Shinobi is ready.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

I totally agree with you Kimberly! It was a "human" error! Thankfully no one was hurt and the trainer realized what his full job is! 
I hope all dog owners do research their "trainers/class first!


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

My friend said that Shinobi is still limping, but seems to be recovering. I don't know if they've walked him since then, or if he's encountered other dogs since the attack. 

I think I would also be hesitant to try to pick up the attacking dog's legs, etc. My friend was trying to pull the attacking dog off of his own dog, but since they were entangled, Shinobi ended up getting dragged along the ground. It just sounded horrible - the whole thing. 

Wow, Kimberly. Now I am intrigued about what you would do to a larger dog! The dog that attacked Shinobi was larger - a shepherd-mix.

I don't walk my guys very often - maybe once a week. But now I'm thinking that is okay. I'm looking forward to having our yard redone to be dog-friendly so they can get some more exercise. I am happy to have playdates with safe and friendly dogs!


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## maryam187 (Jul 18, 2007)

Ugh Jane, I feel nauseated reading this thread, especially the


> Shinobi ended up getting dragged along the ground.


 part. Poor Shinobi


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

I'm sorry, Maryam! I actually left out other gory details on purpose. 

I just couldn't help but imagine my boys in Shinobi's place. The thought still horrifies me.


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

My 11-yr-old son is the one who usually Marble for a walk every day. After reading this thread, I'm starting to feel like I should be the one walking the dog, as I know my son couldn't handle an attack from another dog. The air horn sounds like a good idea, so I will keep my eye out for that.
Gina


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

How about both of you take the dog for a walk-------great time for conversations etc


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## maryam187 (Jul 18, 2007)

Jane, sorry, I didn't me to blame you for TMI. I just meant that my heart goes out to Shinobi and the owners for having to witness something awful like that. Despite being a doctor (with surgical aspiration) I can't seem to cope well with injuries when it comes to our dogs. I have never felt nauseated when I saw e.g. someone who slipped with a chain saw and it landed in his face. But when I cut Pablo's nail too low the other day and one single drop of blood came out, I felt nauseated for three hours.


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## tuggersmom (Oct 16, 2008)

If you watch the dog whisper, (and even if you don't like what he has to say, he is very familiar with aggressive dogs) he says to do exactly what you have said, Move infront of your dog and stand your ground with the attacking dog. Your message is, this is MY dog from My pack and under my protection. If you pick your small dog up apparently it can trigger an attack as the little dog is now being put in a threatening postion to the attacking dog. 

I hope that I never have to be in that situation though. I don't know if I would be calm enough to do much of anything. I have been through a couple of fights with my German Shepherd and my sister's boxer and I know that once they start to engage in a fight there is very little you can do by yourself to break it up. Your first instinct is to grab your dog but you will get bit if you do this sometimes by your own dog. I have also heard about if you have two people you can each grab a dog by the back legs and separate them by turning in circles you can break up the fight. But, you do need two people. Hope it never happens again!


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

maryam187 said:


> Jane, sorry, I didn't me to blame you for TMI. I just meant that my heart goes out to Shinobi and the owners for having to witness something awful like that. Despite being a doctor (with surgical aspiration) I can't seem to cope well with injuries when it comes to our dogs. I have never felt nauseated when I saw e.g. someone who slipped with a chain saw and it landed in his face. But when I cut Pablo's nail too low the other day and one single drop of blood came out, I felt nauseated for three hours.


No problem at all, Maryam! :hug: And I'm sure you'll be a fine doctor/surgeon - I can see how if would be different detaching emotionally from a patient during a helpful medical procedure vs. a vicious attack on our beloved sweet Havs!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

mintchip said:


> How about both of you take the dog for a walk-------great time for conversations etc


That's a good idea, and we have started doing that in the evenings!
Gina


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

maryam187 said:


> Ugh Jane, I feel nauseated reading this thread, especially the part. Poor Shinobi


I had a nightmare after reading this thread the other night, where my dogs were being attacked, it was terrible. This is one of my biggest fears... is to have one of my dogs attacked. I have so many loose dogs in my neighborhood at sometimes, it just makes me so mad.

I like to walk my dogs as part of my exercise program and the dogs love it. I am thinking of giving up walking them around the neighborhood, which will mean walking them less. It just is not fair...


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

After the scare of our neighbor's Husky coming at us, Tori isn't walked in our neighborhood anymore. Instead, I drive to our very doggy friendly downtown area known as "The Village", or we go over to "the colleges" and walk on the campuses, in both areas the leash laws are _very_ strict.

I'm beginning to think she enjoys walking in those places much more than in our neighborhood, though. Folks always admire her and often ask to pet her. She totally loves the extra attention she receives from so many. Especially those eating in the outdoor cafes who'll ask me if they can give her a treat. You should see the faces when I tell them one of her favorite treats is carrots!


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

I've had this happen where another dog came at me and my dogs and it all happens so fast it's hard to do so many of these things! I used my "I'm in charge" voice and told the other dog to "stay"! I was right at the end of my driveway finishing our walk and was able to continue up the driveway and get the dogs into the house. I don't think the other dog knew "stay"-I think it was my voice that held him off, but it was still an eye opener for me. 

Getting between the dogs like Ceasar wouldn't have worked for me because Rufus pulled towards the other dog! Having both Marley and Rufus made it worse becasue they were both tangling around each other. I couldn't have grabbed the other dogs' anything without bending down and putting my face in the bite zone. I thought to kick out with my foot, but my leg would only be as long as the leash length that my boys were pulling at.  

I was very flustered afterwards and haven't walked the dogs in my own neighborhood since. I drive into town and walk them through our little shopping section, or go to the big park where we feel safer! It sucks though when you can't walk your dogs in your own neighborhood. My neighborhood isn't a bad one, it's just that some people aren't being responsible dog owners.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Lynn, I am so sorry that this thread gave you nightmares!  :hug: 
While a horrible attack _can _happen, and I want to think about different ideas about how to handle it so I'm prepared (the best that I can be), the reality is that it doesn't happen _that _often. So, there is some comfort in that.

Leslie and Christy, what a great idea to walk your dogs in a place that is not your neighborhood! I'd never thought of that. We have a very dog-friendly outdoor mall here.

I might just go back to walking my dogs one at a time. Mine get tangled up too, just adding to the chaos  I'd feel more confident and be able to be more alert with just one of my crazy dogs vs. two :biggrin1: Plus, that would be double the amount of exercise for me, and I could definitely use it!


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Jane, I do think that this is one of the most frightening things for all of us! How is your friends dog? Is he ok? Fearful? I hope he is able to just forget what happened and not be frightened on walks.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Laurief said:


> Jane, I do think that this is one of the most frightening things for all of us! How is your friends dog? Is he ok? Fearful? I hope he is able to just forget what happened and not be frightened on walks.


Thanks for asking, Laurie!

He said that Shinobi is still limping, but seems to be in good spirits. I asked him (in email) if they've walked him since the attack, but haven't heard back yet.

He said that several dogs seem to "hate" Shinobi when they see him, and he can't figure out why. He has the most beautiful steel blue eyes - I wonder if that gets interpreted as somehow confrontational in the dog world?


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

I found something that is an alternative to pepper spray that you can carry on a walk to protect against dog attacks. It's a citronella spray rather than pepper spray. I've never heard of it before. Does anyone have experience with it?
I found it at http://www.premier.com/View.aspx?page=dogs/products/behavior/sprays/sprayshield/description

Gina


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Gina-I think citronella is used in the "No Bark" collars


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

I have used the citronella in the no bark colllar - I dont think if you had an angry dog running up to you that it would make one bit of difference. It is annoying, but not powerful enough for them to stop charging.


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

Laurief said:


> I have used the citronella in the no bark colllar - I dont think if you had an angry dog running up to you that it would make one bit of difference. It is annoying, but not powerful enough for them to stop charging.


You're probably right. I can't imagine an angry pitbull getting intimidated by a blast of spray in it's face. It won't sting the eyes like pepper spray, so it might not allow time to get away.

Gina


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

Gina, there is a theory out there that even pepper spray won't stop a dog that is totally out of control. It reminds me of how it has been described that a person that is whacked out on drugs doesn't feel pain in a car accident. I don't know if it is the adrenaline or what, but I've read it enough times that I wouldn't even bother spraying anything at a dog that is going berzerk.


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## Leeann (Feb 28, 2007)

Jane I am so sorry to read about Shinobi but glad he is ok. I can't imagae how scary that was. We are having a big problem with pitbulls in my town so I won't walk the boys by my self anymore. There has been some issues with underground dog fighting going on, pitbulls running around off leash and numerouse attacks on people and dogs (over 10 on small dogs alone last year that were reported) My town is currently trying to pass a law that all pitbulls must wear a muzzle when outside or inside in the summer if your windows are open. My mouth dropped when I read about the windows, obviously there has had to been some issues for them to add that to the law. It makes me so sad that good pitbull owners are going to have to obey these laws as well but something has to be done.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Leeann, I guess it's safe to say we are having trouble here too. I haven't heard of fighting, but there was a newspaper article this week about 5 goats killed by dogs ON MY STREET!! :O These goats were 150 to 200 pounds each! The same size as a grown man.  The article said animal control was going to add two more people in an effort to find these dogs.

**just a note that I'm a little bit country...so my street isn't like a normal city block. But STILL !!


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Havtahava said:


> Gina, there is a theory out there that even pepper spray won't stop a dog that is totally out of control. It reminds me of how it has been described that a person that is whacked out on drugs doesn't feel pain in a car accident. I don't know if it is the adrenaline or what, but I've read it enough times that I wouldn't even bother spraying anything at a dog that is going berzerk.


There is more of a chance of the spray getting you as well!


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Leeann and Christy, that would be very unsettling to have that going on so close to home! I hope animal control will be able to help. I haven't walked my boys in a couple of weeks now...


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Jane said:


> Leeann and Christy, that would be very unsettling to have that going on so close to home! I hope animal control will be able to help. I haven't walked my boys in a couple of weeks now...


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

Jane, I haven't walked them locally at all.  I've been taking turns lately taking them into town for my son's flute lesson, or brief shopping trips and trying to fit in a walk then too. I *have* been running them all over the yard though and they've been bouncing through the house like crazy trying to burn off the wigglies! Going for walks is still much better!!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

Havtahava said:


> Gina, there is a theory out there that even pepper spray won't stop a dog that is totally out of control. It reminds me of how it has been described that a person that is whacked out on drugs doesn't feel pain in a car accident. I don't know if it is the adrenaline or what, but I've read it enough times that I wouldn't even bother spraying anything at a dog that is going berzerk.


That is depressing! I really wouldn't know what to do then.I'm shocked at how many of you can't enjoy a walk with your dogs because of the loose dogs. I can't believe these people could own a dangerous dog like that and not be more responsible by keeping it inside. I think I mentioned in a previous post that a friend was walking her Lhaso Apso in front of her house when the neighbor's pit bull slipped out the front door and attacked. The Lhaso was nearly killed but survived because another neighbor intervened. Very scary!
Gina


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Shinobi seems to be in good spirits. He has played with other dogs since the attack. He hasn't been walked though, since he is still limping a bit. He'll be coming over this weekend to play with Lincoln and Scout


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Jane, Give Shinobi a hug and tell him he's brave. I'm glad he'll have Lincoln and Scout to play with and have fun. Poor guy....!


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

Glad Shinobi is doing better and playing with other dogs!
Gina


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

Jane said:


> I'd like to think through what I'd do if this happened since it would be hard to think clearly in a crisis.


If you don't have enough time to get between the dogs you can lift an attacking dog by the tail for a couple of seconds. For some reason getting it's back legs off of the ground stops the dog. I really don't like putting this here but if it came to saving my dog, I'd ram my fist down the attacking dogs mouth. A dog will attack what's going away from them faster than what's coming at them. 
Remember the dog that was so full of pepper spray that animal control had a horrible time getting to the dog once the attack was over? Pepper spray won't stop an out of control dog but it sure will drive animal control nuts having to deal with a dog loaded in it.
As a side note, we took a trip to Florida when we still had my Pom. The car was broken down and we were at the old time gas station that was connected to .....I think it was Universal Studios. Anyhow they were shooting a country western video there so I stood with my Pom out on the street way away from them to watch. All of a sudden a large dog came running right at us and I was so stunned that my first thought was to save my Pom and deal with the dog coming at us. She was on leash and I jerked her up so hard that she went flying up in the air and I caught her then got ready to do battle with this big dog running at us. The dog got right in front of me and it's HANDLER came out from BEHIND me. The dog was in the video and instead of them telling me they were going to have a big dog come out of nowhere and right at us, this is what they did. I blew like they've never seen a woman blow before. They thought it was funny until they had to listen to me scream at them for a very long time.


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

Jan, what a crazy story! I would have done the same thing out of fear even though I know you're not supposed to pick your dog up. 
Gina


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

marb42 said:


> Jan, what a crazy story! I would have done the same thing out of fear even though I know you're not supposed to pick your dog up.
> Gina


I didn't even pick her up, I jerked up on the leash so she went flying up in the air yanked by her neck. Dang, I could have broken her neck! I was so stunned that I did that but with that big dog running right at us all I could think of was to save her and I'd deal with the dog. I watched the country video show for over a year to try to find out who the singer was and never did see it on there. I reeeeeeally wanted her name. It still makes me angry thinking about it.


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## marb42 (Oct 19, 2008)

JASHavanese said:


> I didn't even pick her up, I jerked up on the leash so she went flying up in the air yanked by her neck. Dang, I could have broken her neck!


I would have managed to panic in some terrible way, so don't feel bad. It all turned out okay.
Gina


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

Jan, I've done the same thing (pulling the dog up by the leash and then catching them mid-air). It's such an instinctual reaction there isn't even time to think about it. I had 3 Jack Russels escape out of their front door and come for me and my previous dog. I had Gabby up near my neck before either of us even realized what was going on. The JRs were jumping up, barking and snapping. I was trying to back them off with my knees/feet and yelling for their owners like a banshee. By the time it was over my legs were a mess of scratches and Gabby's tail was bleeding. I know you're supposed to leave your dog on the ground but if I had, it would have been much worse. Gabby was seriously fear aggressive and there's no way I could have controlled the situation with her and the 3 JRs. At best, at least one of the 4 would have been seriously injured. I too worried that I might have hurt Gabby by yanking her up (she had on a harness) but I really didn't have any choice at the time.


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## swtxsweetie (May 16, 2008)

wow how scary!! i usually have momo on a harness and i would totally just pull on the leash, catch momo in mid air and RUN. Well...that or kick the other dog. I think that would be my natural reaction.

I don't think the harness would hurt him too much if I yank him into the air. If he's on a collar, I would worry much more.


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

Even with all of the horror stories, I'm not willing to stop taking my dogs for walks. I've walked 2x a day for 11 years - thats about 8,000 walks with less than a dozen bad encounters. With those odds, I just can't give up the benefit we get from walking. I'll have to trust that when a bad situation comes up, I'll find a way to handle it. Sort of my philosophy on life...


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Jill, 

I would of done the same thing you did. 

Please do not run away from an attacking dog! Just keep your back to the dog with arms crossed. No eye contact. I haven't tried it ....but, heard it works.

I am always on the lookout for bad dog behaviors. Since little Dexter looks like a fluffy rabbit....I do not want him attacked.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

*Update *

We had Shinobi over last night and he is doing just great! He seems to have recovered from the attack pretty well. No more limping and he played very well with Lincoln and Scout. Lincoln was unusually hyper, but everyone got along well.

What's interesting to me is that I just discovered that Shinobi doesn't have a tail - they dock them on the the Australian Shepherds, apparently (and the minis too). But, he has a skirt of hair along his bum which hangs down, so I'd never noticed it - I just thought he always had his tail tucked very submissively underneath. Now I'm wondering if the dogs who show aggression towards him mistakenly read his lack of a tail as fearfully submissive dog body language, motivating them to pounce on him.

Hold those tails high, Havs!


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## RikiDaisyDixie (Apr 15, 2008)

*helping another owner in need*

I was driving with Riki and Daisy in the car the other day. I saw a lady with a golden on leash trying to get another dog off-leash to leave them alone. I u-turned, and got out of the car. The lady with the golden went into a school yard and shut the fence. I tried to see the tag on the dog so I could take him home but he wouldn't let me near him. I told him to go home but he kept going back to the fence. Finally, he went across the street and probably back to his home.

The lady with the golden thanked me...and I told her I know how she feels. It was this thread that made me more aware.

Also today I was walking the dogs and had to turn around because there was a german shepherd off leash playing with its owners. On our way back, I warned a guy walking his two bigger dogs that there was a dog off-leash. You never know when a dog will charge your dogs...and he, too, thanked me. So we can keep each other informed at least.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Jane- that is an interesting observation and could very well be the case. We were just talking about the local dog park (it is about an hour away) and dogs there at my training class. There is a lady with a rescue who is working on socializing her dog and she cries whenever she sees Dasher. We watched her body language and while she is aggressive with big dogs, she gets down low and sniffs Dash. I don't let them interact too much as I have seen her be aggressive but she wags her tail low with him (high with the newfy, and it usually turns into being nasty). We were talking about how body language is everything with them. And my experience with Belle who is usually the smallest but often the bully, she goes in with her chest up, tail totally up and rules the place for 2 mins and then goes to hang with the humans. She also has the habit of picking on the most submissive dog there. It takes her nanoseconds to pick him/her out just before I find her and remove her from the situation.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

That is interesting, Amanda. I hope to meet Belle someday - she sounds like a character! 

Linda, that was really generous of you to get involved in both situations. You could have very well prevented a couple of ugly occurrences! :hug:


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