# Commence Bell ringing...



## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

So, Tillie has been doing really good with potty training and I decided to start teaching her to ring the bell. We started this morning... she is already ringing it to go out... every 10 minutes... LOL smarty pants. How long does this incessant bell ringing last!?? I let her out every time she rings so she knows that's what will happen when she rings it, BUT I am getting exhausted! LOL


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

TilliesMom said:


> So, Tillie has been doing really good with potty training and I decided to start teaching her to ring the bell. We started this morning... she is already ringing it to go out... every 10 minutes... LOL smarty pants. How long does this incessant bell ringing last!?? I let her out every time she rings so she knows that's what will happen when she rings it, BUT I am getting exhausted! LOL


That's one of the side effects of bell training ,and one of the reasons I'm not a fan. It can be fine once housetraining is solid. There is a current thread related to this http://www.havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=12801&highlight=bell+ringing . Here is another article from Karen Pryor's site why this method may not be such a good idea at this stage especially. Based on my experience with the Yahoo Doghousebreaking Group ( http://www.groups.yahoo.com/group/doghousebreaking ), these are indeed real problems. I must stress two things:

1. Your dog must be housetrained BEFORE teaching this behavior. Bell training is NOT an effective housetraining method for many reasons. It is only useful after your dog is housetrained.

2. If your dog is prone to offering "insignificant requests" then you will not be able to use this procedure. It is possible to teach a dog not to make insignificant requests, but it requires a more thorough understanding of the theory than I care to elaborate upon here.

I don't think that an owner not being present will cause any significant problems IF the dog is housetrained before bell training is undertaken. The owner being present becomes a stimulus condition, i.e the behavior will not be reinforced if the owner is not present and the behavior will be reinforced if the owner is present.

Regards,

Aidan


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Housetraining article . Takes some work. But it works. http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/errorless-housetraining If you are being successful, stick with it. There's no easy autopilot or escape from being being consistent and observant.


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## Ellie NY (Aug 27, 2010)

So, we started bell training about 5 days ago. Nothing. He just doesn't get it. In all fairness, I did not watch the DVD that came with it. I followed the printed instructions. Take his paw, ring the bell, say potty time, and rewarded his accomplishments. <Sigh> I guess I need to watch the DVD.

I'm so frustrated. We haven't had an accident free day in a long time. Just a few minutes ago he was standing near me and his "exit" looked a little large. I thought to myself, time to go outside. I set down what I was holding, turned around and he was gone. He ran down the stairs and left me a little present to find in the dark. I know it may not be logical but I think he understands I want him to go outside since I've profusely praised every effort he's made for the last 7 or so weeks. He sees that I get upset when he goes inside and I tell him no ('cause he runs to hide immediately). I know that he's a puppy and it will take time. Hopefully, the bell will work soon.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Ellie NY said:


> So, we started bell training about 5 days ago. Nothing. He just doesn't get it. In all fairness, I did not watch the DVD that came with it. I followed the printed instructions. Take his paw, ring the bell, say potty time, and rewarded his accomplishments. <Sigh> I guess I need to watch the DVD.
> 
> I'm so frustrated. We haven't had an accident free day in a long time. Just a few minutes ago he was standing near me and his "exit" looked a little large. I thought to myself, time to go outside. I set down what I was holding, turned around and he was gone. He ran down the stairs and left me a little present to find in the dark. I know it may not be logical but I think he understands I want him to go outside since I've profusely praised every effort he's made for the last 7 or so weeks. He sees that I get upset when he goes inside and I tell him no ('cause he runs to hide immediately). I know that he's a puppy and it will take time. Hopefully, the bell will work soon.


 To be honest,like my post above says, he's not ready for bell training. But one rule ,is not to get upset with him when he makes the wrong choice. If you become upset with him ,he will learn to go and hide to do his business.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

thanks for the reading material! I'll go read right now!
Tillie is doing really well in house training, and I'm not pushing the bell, just ringing it when we go outside to go potty, She hasn't had an accident in over a week!
I will read what you linked! 
thanks!!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

TilliesMom said:


> thanks for the reading material! I'll go read right now!
> Tillie is doing really well in house training, and I'm not pushing the bell, just ringing it when we go outside to go potty, She hasn't had an accident in over a week!
> I will read what you linked!
> thanks!!


 Yeah you can use it, just don't count on it.


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## jcarol (Mar 20, 2010)

Rikky has done well with the bell although he was almost completely housebroken before we introduced it. He went through a stage of ringing it anytime he wanted to go out for every little thing, but now that has subsided and he mostly rings it when he's got to go potty. He also uses it as a way to let us know our other dog or the cat is waiting by the door to come in. We take the bell with us when we travel to other places. He doesn't seem to have a problem using it wherever we stay. Of all the gadgets I've purchased since Rikky's arrival, the bell has been well worth it's cost. It has become a way of communication for Rikky.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

TilliesMom said:


> So, Tillie has been doing really good with potty training and I decided to start teaching her to ring the bell. We started this morning... she is already ringing it to go out... every 10 minutes... LOL smarty pants. How long does this incessant bell ringing last!?? I let her out every time she rings so she knows that's what will happen when she rings it, BUT I am getting exhausted! LOL


ound:ound:ound:

OOOPS!!!!

I forgot to tell you about THAT phase...ound: And yes, you do have to keep getting up, take a xanax...drink a glass of wine..but trust in the fact that they will eventually BORE and only use it when they want to pee/poop or play  and it'll be cold soon, so the first two only  hah

Ellie, you probably don't need to watch a video (I'm kinda shocked they sell bells with a video, now...I had to make mine from ribbon and bells at Michaels, because they weren't popular a few years ago.)
but you just have to put something or someone that he wants on the other side, you...a steak...a favorite toy, etc.. I would stand outside and coax her to ring to come to me and it only took a day or two, but if you arent' out there, or something he wants more, he will want to stay inside next to you 

Kara


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## puppyinmyyard (Aug 24, 2010)

Hi Ellie-Our dog Chloe and Eli are about the same age. We are crate training her so she is confined to her crate (usually at night only) or her ex pen. She doesn't bark in her crate or ex pen any more unless she has to go outside to potty, or really wants to play. She gets a lot of outside time, a walk, rides in the car, and play time in the house *after* she has pottied outside so I'm pretty sure it's safe. And then I set the timer so I remember how long it's been! And she gets a lot of lap/cuddle time in the evening or as the kids are doing school work. She is not by any means neglected  I know my children are disappointed that she can't run around the house with them, but they understand that we are training her now so that we can trust her later. It is getting easier by the week, and I really think she has settled into a routine with us. I am resigned to the fact that house training is a several month process, and in the end we will have a companion we can trust in the house, and to travel with us. Good luck! They are such wonderful puppies!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

puppyinmyyard said:


> Hi Ellie-Our dog Chloe and Eli are about the same age. We are crate training her so she is confined to her crate (usually at night only) or her ex pen. She doesn't bark in her crate or ex pen any more unless she has to go outside to potty, or really wants to play. She gets a lot of outside time, a walk, rides in the car, and play time in the house *after* she has pottied outside so I'm pretty sure it's safe. And then I set the timer so I remember how long it's been! And she gets a lot of lap/cuddle time in the evening or as the kids are doing school work. She is not by any means neglected  I know my children are disappointed that she can't run around the house with them, but they understand that we are training her now so that we can trust her later. It is getting easier by the week, and I really think she has settled into a routine with us. I am resigned to the fact that house training is a several month process, and in the end we will have a companion we can trust in the house, and to travel with us. Good luck! They are such wonderful puppies!


 Great stuff, that's what it's all about. :whoo::whoo::whoo::whoo::whoo::whoo::whoo:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

TilliesMom said:


> thanks for the reading material! I'll go read right now!
> Tillie is doing really well in house training, and I'm not pushing the bell, just ringing it when we go outside to go potty, She hasn't had an accident in over a week!
> I will read what you linked!
> thanks!!


Just wanted to warn you though... not having an accident in "over a week" is FAR away from being reliably house trained.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

I love the bells. Tucker was housetrained before we started using the bells, if I remember correctly. (Seems like he was about a year old, or nearly so.) I didn't have a CD, just used his paw or nose to ring the bells before going out the door. I didn't use an incentive to get him out, but would just do our regular "potty-party" outside after he went. Ringing the bell and having the door open to the outside was enough reward for him. It took about two weeks before he was consistent with it, and our cat caught on just by watching him and also rings the bells to go out. Tucker did use them way too much for a period of time because it was fun to get out, but that quickly eased off. 

Tucker also rings the bells when our cat wants back inside and Nitro is just sitting out there waiting. He's such a little gentleman! Ha!

I also take our bells with us when we travel, hang them on/by the door I want him to use, and show him where they are. He adapts fine to that, knows right away to just ring them wherever they are when he needs to go out. Works great.

I should also mention, I work outside the home, and he seems to be smart enough to know that the bells only work when I (or another person,) is in the house. That hasn't been an issue at all. He's 100% trustworthy in the house to not potty.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

Ha ha! thanks Kara! 
Ya, it is rainy and wet here now and Tillie did NOT enjoy it... she went outside, potty'd like a foot from the front door and was ready to go back in the house! LOL
And, yes, I know a week is FAR from being trust worthiliy potty trained, but it's a start, right!??  besides, she totally had an accident today! LOL


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

TilliesMom said:


> Ha ha! thanks Kara!
> Ya, it is rainy and wet here now and Tillie did NOT enjoy it... she went outside, potty'd like a foot from the front door and was ready to go back in the house! LOL
> And, yes, I know a week is FAR from being trust worthiliy potty trained, but it's a start, right!??  besides, she totally had an accident today! LOL


great stuff. When they go outside like that in the rain, that's a good time to bring out the BIG rewards.... real meat. LOL


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Havanese HATE getting their paws wet...LOL 
What's up with that? IDK..but I am always thrilled (and miffed) when Gucci weathers the rain to go pee (especially without a human..her thinking is, If SHE has to go get soaked, than WE had better come shower with her..ound

Progress in a week is great, though. If you go through the threads here..there seems to a regression that happen around 9-10 months and then again around 1.5..(teenage rebellion?  ) IDK..but regressions are just having to go back to basics.

It has been months since we've had an accident ....*knock on wood*, and she's been on free roam since she was 6 months old.

Other dogs seem to like to piss in my house though...don't even get me started on that....:frusty:

I haven't tried the bells on vacation but I think I will next time, I'm curious to see if she'd ring them else-where.

Kara


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## Ellie NY (Aug 27, 2010)

puppyinmyyard said:


> Hi Ellie-Our dog Chloe and Eli are about the same age. We are crate training her so she is confined to her crate (usually at night only) or her ex pen. She doesn't bark in her crate or ex pen any more unless she has to go outside to potty, or really wants to play. She gets a lot of outside time, a walk, rides in the car, and play time in the house *after* she has pottied outside so I'm pretty sure it's safe. And then I set the timer so I remember how long it's been! And she gets a lot of lap/cuddle time in the evening or as the kids are doing school work. She is not by any means neglected  I know my children are disappointed that she can't run around the house with them, but they understand that we are training her now so that we can trust her later. It is getting easier by the week, and I really think she has settled into a routine with us. I am resigned to the fact that house training is a several month process, and in the end we will have a companion we can trust in the house, and to travel with us. Good luck! They are such wonderful puppies!


We are accident free two days and counting! Like Chloe, Eli is in a crate at night and in an X-pen most of the day while I'm working. We're more relaxed on weekends when we're all home and many eyes are watching.

Anyway, after I posted this message _I_ decided to get serious. So, I began regulating water a bit more - with meals, after walks or play, but not all day/any time. Also, I got out the dry liver treats. Yep, that's right, I took out the big guns! So far so good. Two-days is not a house training make but it's a start.


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## Sissygirl (Aug 8, 2007)

We taught Sissy the bell ringing and she caught on immediately. Sissy will be 6 yrs. old in December and she has not had any accidents in the house since she was abouy 16 weeks old.

She did ring the bell constantly at first - we ALWAYS took her out. It slowly ran it's course and she now only rings it a few times a day.

My son-in-law (now) was dating our daughter at the time and he saw us taking her out all the time and he said "I don't want to teach our dogs bell ringing" - they now have two beagles in the house and they are four years old and still having accidents in the house. Guess who should of taught the bell ringing!!!

If we are visiting my mom for the day she will ring them at their house, too! She has her own set at Nanie and Papa's.

(A little disclaimer - I am home all day so I could jump at her every need and back when I first got her if I had to leave I hired a sitter - neighbor girl, a lady at our church or nanie and papa would sit. If I went to bible study on Thursday morning - she had a sitter.) She now has roam of the house and doesn't need a sitter. I only will leave her 4 hours before I have someone check on her.


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

Yay! Glad to hear the bell ringing every 5 minutes stage doesn't last forever!
I was just going to come onto post that Tillie is doing great with bell ringing! She has about an hr in the morning where she rings it like every 2 minutes and then in the afternoon she will ring it more often, but she actually goes potty 1/2 the times she rings it AND she really rings it good when she needs to go poopy! rings it, goes out and poops right away!
okay, seriously though, I have gotten up 4 times during this message to let her out/in.... sigh..... she's ringing it again! LOL gotta GO!


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## jacqui (Aug 7, 2007)

I guess I have been fortunate with the bell ringing. Phoebe and Maxi did overuse at first but now they get it.

Funny story--When Phoebe first learned to use the bell she realized my two English shepherds would run to the doorwall as well when they heard the bell. They like to go outside too! 

Tell me this is not deductive reasoning...when one of the two big dogs had a toy or a bone Phoebe wants she will ring the bell. The dog will drop the aforementioned toy and run to the door. Then, Phoebe runs back into the room and grabs the toy!


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

jacqui said:


> I guess I have been fortunate with the bell ringing. Phoebe and Maxi did overuse at first but now they get it.
> 
> Funny story--When Phoebe first learned to use the bell she realized my two English shepherds would run to the doorwall as well when they heard the bell. They like to go outside too!
> 
> *Tell me this is not deductive reasoning...when one of the two big dogs had a toy or a bone Phoebe wants she will ring the bell. The dog will drop the aforementioned toy and run to the door. Then, Phoebe runs back into the room and grabs the toy!*


LOL!!ound:

Whoever said that dogs cannot reason has not owned a havanese, DH and I are Still blown away with her adult like behavior (like the trickery to get the bone!) or manipulation skills, which she has used on other dogs as well. That is so clever, and sooo funny.

Tillie's mom, she WILL get bored with it, eventually...I swear! lol She is building her deductive reasoning skills, Gucci doesn't like the really cold weather/especially windy and cold..or rain, so maybe the cooler months will slow her down if she prefers the warm house 

Kara


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

HA HA HA... I can TOTALLY see Tillie doing what Phoebe did with the toy! 
It does really surprise me how smart these dogs are, I mean I know that we wanted a Have because of it's intelligence, but seriously!? LOL sometimes I worry she is gonna out smart me!
She has slowed down ringing the bell and totally gets it, when she rings the bell she goes out and she does NOT enjoy the cold/wet weather, so that will help her understand, only ring the bell when you REALLLY need to go out, otherwise mama will let you out anyway and you WON'T enjoy that! 
I have a friend who has a lab/golden retirever puppy who is 8 months old and she was AMAZED that TIllie learned to ring a bell to go out.... LOL she wanted to know how I trained her to do that and if she could, I told her how and that it was super easy, she laughed and said, who am I kidding, we can't do that, she'll EAT the bell! ha ha!
My husband got to see the bell in action (ringing it, letting her out, her going potty and coming back in in less than a minute) and he was TOTALLY impressed! GO Tillie!!!


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Oh, this is just the beginning! lol......The bell is the lightbulb in their little brains that tells them they can manipulate you to do things,...ound: We just THINK we are in control here, ehh....not so much! 

Kara


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## TilliesMom (Sep 30, 2010)

ha ha, yup! It amazes me how much she is just like a toddler in her behavior! LOL


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