# A Breeding question



## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Hi, I was just trying to look up A Havanese that is in Zoeys pedigree and also have been wondering what line breeding is. Zoey has a couple of Los Perritos in her blood line. I ran across this dogs pedigree although it didn't copy right In Naughty's Pedigree their is a Havanese named Patty cakes If someone has the time to look up Los Perritos Havanese and look at Naughty's Pedigree and tell me why Patty cakes is on the pedigree twice.
I'm woundering if that is what line breeding is?

NAUGHTY'S PEDIGREE

KATRINA'S CHARMER 
OF MANFRED

CH LOS PERRITOS LUIGI

TI-ARA'S PATTY CAKE

CH LOS PERRITOS WEE 
PANTALOONS

A MAIDEN EFFORT'S 
JAZZ-UP

BORGIA'S EVITA OF 
ROMANIJO'S JOY

A MAIDEN EFFORT'S ICE 
SUGAR

CH MISHCHIEF'S 
NAUGHTY BUT NICE

DESTINY'S GO FER THE 
GOLD

CH LOS PERRITOS 
RE-FRIED BEANS

KIMBRIEL'S MAXIMUM 
DIVIDEND

CH LOS PERROS LIMA 
BEANIE BABY

KATRINA'S CHARMER 
OF MANFRED

CH LOS PERRITOS A 
PIECE OF CAKE

TI-ARA'S PATTY CAKE


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## The Laughing Magpie (Aug 20, 2009)

Suzy it depends where the name is. Do you mean it is in both the Sire and Dam's line or is it twice in one line?


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## rdanielle (Sep 2, 2008)

Suzi, can you post a link or picture of the pedigree as it it is hard to read it the way it is posted.

Line breeding is breeding Grandfather to granddaughter, Grandmother to grandson, Uncle to niece, Aunt to nephew, Cousin to cousin.

Here's a link that goes more in depth about line breeding versus inbreeding:
http://arpeggiopoodles.tripod.com/inbreedingvslinebreeding.html


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

The Laughing Magpie said:


> Suzy it depends where the name is. Do you mean it is in both the Sire and Dam's line or is it twice in one line?


 It was twice in one line and I don't really know how to read sire and dam I get confused. This is all new to me I think the top is the sire right?


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

The terms "inbreeding" and "linebreeding" have no fixed, commonly used definition even though the terms are thrown around all the time. One saying goes,"If it works it's linebreeding, if it doesn't, it's inbreeding".

Geneticists use the term Coeficient of Inbreeding. It's seen referred to as F, or CI, or COI.

http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=3367

For a dog's pedigree, it needs to be displayed as a family tree in order to tell anything important about it.

All purebred dogs at one time or the other, used inbreeding and linebreeding. Most breeders still use it. For instance, our line uses the linebreeding of two dogs. It's how you lock in things you want, but along with it comes some factor of risk. Playing the risks is the real art of a good breeder. Most just throw the dice haphazardly, and will try a little of this and a little of that without letting it play out over generations until you know what you really have.


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Thanks that makes sense. I have a feeling Havanese have a lot of line breeding in their bloodlines because of the small family that started here. I can understand why breeders would want to either keep their own gene pool and developed it them selves or get very involved in studying other breeders lines in that case you would almost have to have a really good relationship with the choice breeders almost like a partnership.


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

rdanielle said:


> Suzi, can you post a link or picture of the pedigree as it it is hard to read it the way it is posted.
> 
> Line breeding is breeding Grandfather to granddaughter, Grandmother to grandson, Uncle to niece, Aunt to nephew, Cousin to cousin.
> 
> ...


 Okay here it is, 
www.losperritos.com/ - I just looked again and patty cakes is in the middle of two other Havanese and also on the bottom does that mean that the litter had two fathers? Naughty's Pedigree was the one I was looking at. Zoey has some of Los Perritos Luigi Rom and I think Patty cakes I like that name.


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## rdanielle (Sep 2, 2008)

No its not possible to have 2 fathers. Naughty is a linebreeding between a niece & a nephew.

CH Los Perritos Luigi & CH Los Perritos Piece of cake are full siblings

hope this helps!

Here's an easier way to see the pedigree:
http://www.havanesegallery.hu/pedigree_en.php?id=21950


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## Suzi (Oct 27, 2010)

Thanks for the help I'm starting to understand better. It is fun to look up your dogs pedigree my problem is I get side tracked and get off track


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