# simple idea for new puppy owners and everyone really



## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Just watched this kikopup video, Why newbies FAIL using treats and toys to train dogs. I wish I'd seen it when Shama was little. Makes perfect sense and will still help me get Shama interested in treats, toys, and people.


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## pgraham (Apr 4, 2020)

Thanks so much! This is really helpful :smile2:


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Such a REALLY, REALLY important concept for people to understand!!!


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## Dexter and Reia’s mom (Feb 20, 2020)

Thank you for sharing! Was a very informative video...


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Some good Tips here. 

I have a problem with Patti if she gets out the front door or out of the fenced yard. She takes off and if you go after her she runs away. Once she ran all the way to and across the street, which is a long way from our front door.

When delivery people come to the front door we have to make sure to have eyes on her before opening the door. 

Yesterday, I thought Patti was secured behind a closed door in my bedroom when a I opened the front door for a take out dinner delivery guy. From out of nowhere Patti burst through the front door and down the sidewalk. 

For some reason the delivery boy thought he could get her, but I insisted he come inside the house which he finally did. When he came inside Patti came back and followed him inside. 

Whew!!! 

I've told family numerous times ... Don't go after Patti if she gets out ... Call her and walk away. She'll follow and she does ... but sometimes not as quick as I'd like. :frown2:


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## stephsu (Apr 27, 2020)

That is great!! I just followed Kikopup on youtube and will watch a bunch while we try to wait for our eventual puppy!! Thank you SO much for sharing that!!


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## ShamaMama (Jul 27, 2015)

Mikki said:


> I have a problem with Patti if she gets out the front door or out of the fenced yard. She takes off and if you go after her she runs away. Once she ran all the way to and across the street, which is a long way from our front door.
> 
> When delivery people come to the front door we have to make sure to have eyes on her before opening the door.
> 
> ...


Hopefully someone smarter than I am will respond to your problem. You have my sympathy. Shama has never run out the front door or out the gate of our fenced-in back yard, but we are paranoid that she will. If the doorbell rings, we either pick her up or plunk her in her pen.

The closest thing to running away has been when she has run out of the agility ring, but that hasn't happened for a while.

Does anyone have advice on the topic of running out the front door? I suppose it deserves its own thread ...


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

ShamaMama said:


> Hopefully someone smarter than I am will respond to your problem. You have my sympathy. Shama has never run out the front door or out the gate of our fenced-in back yard, but we are paranoid that she will. If the doorbell rings, we either pick her up or plunk her in her pen.
> 
> The closest thing to running away has been when she has run out of the agility ring, but that hasn't happened for a while.
> 
> Does anyone have advice on the topic of running out the front door? I suppose it deserves its own thread ...


We do exactly what you do if the doorbell rings ... we pick up Patti or plunk her behind a gate. And...careful if we are going in and out the fence gate. She usually stands back because she knows she's not suppose to go out.

Not chasing after her works, if I move the other way she'll eventually turn around to follow.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

ShamaMama said:


> Hopefully someone smarter than I am will respond to your problem. You have my sympathy. Shama has never run out the front door or out the gate of our fenced-in back yard, but we are paranoid that she will. If the doorbell rings, we either pick her up or plunk her in her pen.
> 
> The closest thing to running away has been when she has run out of the agility ring, but that hasn't happened for a while.
> 
> Does anyone have advice on the topic of running out the front door? I suppose it deserves its own thread ...


All I can say is work, work, WORK on reliable recalls!

You are both right... NEVER chase them!!! That's a game you can't win. Another "trick" that will work as long as it's not abused, is to "find" something "yummy" in the grass. Get down on your hands and knees. Make a HUGE big deal of how FANTASTIC whatever you've found is. Dogs are INCREDIBLY gullible, curious, and they LOVE to share "found stuff". Make SURE you have something yummy for them when they get there. Make SURE you do NOT immediately GRAB them. Skritch them as they eat their "found" treasure, share the "moment" with them, then gently pick them up and bring them back in the house while tou celebrate your wonderful adventure together.


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## Dexter and Reia’s mom (Feb 20, 2020)

One of the things we’ve done with Dexter is work with the command Wait. He has to wait at any doorway or other type of door ( ie car door) to be released to go out. We’re still working on it being a default behavior, but he will do it with the wait command. That might help? We used a long lead attached to our waist when teaching it to him at the front door in case he bolted😉. Just another idea to help her from running in the first place... Our recall isn’t as good as the wait command so we’re still a work in progress on that one!


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

I need to spend a couple of sessions with a trainer on Reliable Call Back.

Patti does readily respond to a call back command within the home or the confined fenced area. Unless there's something more interesting. That's often the time you want them to *Come ... Right Now!*

If she accidentally gets out of the fence and discovers a rabbit I shudder to think she might end up in a wooded area in the briar patch. OTOH ... rabbits are quick and will probably outrun her and she'll lose interest in trying to follow. I hope.

As she's gotten older Patti has gotten better about coming when called. 98% of the time I have a Treat because* I want her to Come! *when called.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

kshpenn said:


> One of the things we've done with Dexter is work with the command Wait. He has to wait at any doorway or other type of door ( ie car door) to be released to go out. We're still working on it being a default behavior, but he will do it with the wait command. That might help? We used a long lead attached to our waist when teaching it to him at the front door in case he bolted&#128521;. Just another idea to help her from running in the first place... Our recall isn't as good as the wait command so we're still a work in progress on that one!


Yes! This is another good one! We also have a "back" cue, so they will back away from the door if we are carrying in large packages.

And yes, our "default" for the car, just like for crates, is that you never, EVER leave the car (or crate) without a verbal release. It's just too dangerous. They are almost always crated in the car, so it becomes the same thing...


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Mikki said:


> I need to spend a couple of sessions with a trainer on Reliable Call Back.
> 
> Patti does readily respond to a call back command within the home or the confined fenced area. Unless there's something more interesting. That's often the time you want them to *Come ... Right Now!*
> 
> If she accidentally gets out of the fence and discovers a rabbit I shudder to think she might end up in a wooded area in the briar patch. OTOH ... rabbits are quick and will probably outrun her and she'll lose interest in trying to follow. I hope.


Unfortunately, a couple of sessions are really unlikely to give you a reliable recall. That comes from months and months of practice, with increasing levels of distraction, with heavy rewards for success. So the HABIT becomes returning to base. (the handler) It's really similar to potty training in that way. It's just that most owners aren't as motivated to make it happen. Even then, it needs to be maintained with regular practice. ESPECIALLY in the face of really attractive distractions like rabbits and deer!



Mikki said:


> As she's gotten older Patti has gotten better about coming when called. 98% of the time I have a Treat because* I want her to Come! *when called.


98% of the time you SHOULD have a treat so that those few times that you DON'T you have "money in the bank". You just don't TELL her you have a treat until after she has arrived, and you pat her and make a fuss over her for coming back. Then it's a reward rather than a bribe. 

And... For SEVERAL years with Kodi when he was younger, we STILL had our "emergency recall", which was "*WANT CHICKEN?*" ound: THAT works for everything other than horse poop. I am afraid there is still a glitch in his brain that interprets a recall command in the face of horse poop as "EAT FASTER!!!" The only GOOD thing is that horse poop always roots him to the spot. there is no worry of him running away. You just have to run TO him and pick him up so he doesn't eat the entire thing!!! <sigh> We had to put chicken wire on the outside of all the paddock fences when we got Kodi to keep him out of the paddocks and away from the delightful breakfast bar. :frusty:


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

krandall said:


> All I can say is work, work, WORK on reliable recalls!
> 
> You are both right... NEVER chase them!!! That's a game you can't win. Another "trick" that will work as long as it's not abused, is to "find" something "yummy" in the grass. Get down on your hands and knees. Make a HUGE big deal of how FANTASTIC whatever you've found is. Dogs are INCREDIBLY gullible, curious, and they LOVE to share "found stuff". Make SURE you have something yummy for them when they get there. Make SURE you do NOT immediately GRAB them. Skritch them as they eat their "found" treasure, share the "moment" with them, then gently pick them up and bring them back in the house while tou celebrate your wonderful adventure together.


We don't really have a problem with ours getting out, but that's in part because the few times he has were HUGE dramatic events we wanted to prevent repeating. We are always really good about recall games for a couple if weeks after an "incident." It seems like it's been at least a year, but it feels like I might be forgetting something.

I tell my kids all the time not to pick him up immediately after "luring" him. The other day I was impatient and irritable and I impulsively scooped him up when he took the bait. He was trying to lure ME upstairs to play and I was busy and distracted and trying to get him behind the doggy gate so he would stop running up there. He looked at me so betrayed, and stayed like 4 feet away from me for the next 2 hours. I felt SO guilty afterwards. Never again! to think I TRICKED him when he just wanted a little attention


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## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

I COULD HARDLY BELIEVE IT ..but Daddy opened the front door this morning without thinking and Patti Zipped out Like a Flash down the walkway into driveway.

I said .. DO NOT GO AFTER HER!! Come inside the house. Of course, he had to keep checking on where she was darting back and forth. I told him to come inside and let me do it. DON'T GO AFTER HER!!!

Karen ... Your trick of getting down and finding something really interesting in the grass worked. I had treats and Patti came running to see what I'd found ... although she would not get close enough for me to touch her ... she started looking and found treats in the grass. I didn't try to touch or pick her up. *THANKS! FOR THAT SUGGESTION*

I got up and hurried inside the front door acting excited I found some good treats and she followed. I was able quickly shut the door. Didn't try to pick her up. Of course she got an extra special treat

I'll be training with ... *WANT CHICKEN*, a treat Patti can't resist.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Mikki said:


> I COULD HARDLY BELIEVE IT ..but Daddy opened the front door this morning without thinking and Patti Zipped out Like a Flash down the walkway into driveway.
> 
> I said .. DO NOT GO AFTER HER!! Come inside the house. Of course, he had to keep checking on where she was darting back and forth. I told him to come inside and let me do it. DON'T GO AFTER HER!!!
> 
> ...


LOL! They ARE gullible! You just have to make sure IT PAYS!!!


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## JaJa (Jun 28, 2020)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> We don't really have a problem with ours getting out, but that's in part because the few times he has were HUGE dramatic events we wanted to prevent repeating. We are always really good about recall games for a couple if weeks after an "incident." It seems like it's been at least a year, but it feels like I might be forgetting something.
> 
> I tell my kids all the time not to pick him up immediately after "luring" him. The other day I was impatient and irritable and I impulsively scooped him up when he took the bait. He was trying to lure ME upstairs to play and I was busy and distracted and trying to get him behind the doggy gate so he would stop running up there. He looked at me so betrayed, and stayed like 4 feet away from me for the next 2 hours. I felt SO guilty afterwards. Never again! to think I TRICKED him when he just wanted a little attention


Be careful EvaE1izabeth, that mommy guilt can be crippling! You assessed what was happening and vowed to change. You're obviously a senior member because you care and love all your kids. It's also definitely easier to train a new dog when there is another trained dog in the house. I switched my E-mail alert to a doorbell sound when we first got our youngest last year. I did have to be ready to respond immediately to the dogs but within a week they had it. Now I just say "stay back" and still reward them with praise each time.
Kudos to you for being an astute momy❣


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

JaJa said:


> I switched my E-mail alert to a doorbell sound when we first got our youngest last year.


That is so smart! The wheels are already turning on how I can use this...

I always tell my kids, strengths and weaknesses are linked, but I missed it in this case. The fact that mine believes every sound on the tv is real is sometimes a huge pain, but it could become a real advantage!


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## bpentino (Mar 23, 2020)

We also use the Wait command trying to use it every time the door is opened. Another command we use is "Curb" which is a sit & wait. Our trainer also suggested having a place they go to by the door. We have a little mat. When the bell rings we say "Place" and point to the mat. Then we give the hand signal for "Down" & "Stay". We reinforce this in training sessions ringing the doorbell, answering & pretending someone is there to talk to. Now when we say "Place" the down & stay follow. We practice this when some of us come back to the house and the one who stays behind has him go to "Place". 

That said we did have an acquaintance come to the door and conversation was a little longer. He did go out the door. Luckily, he was interested in the person and stayed close. So, we'll continue working & training "Place". ;-)

Oh, the Place mat also happens to be close to the steps that lead up to the upstairs & our bedrooms. We have a gate there that we can step over but prevents him from going upstairs. "Place" comes in handy when you are carrying something up or down and want to make sure he is out of the way.


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