# Nose-to-Tail Grooming Conundrum



## cloe's_mom (Aug 21, 2009)

Hi Folks - Just reading the book Nose to Tail and have come across a potential conundrum that maybe some of you can help me with. "There are two rules for successful grooming of the Havanese: Never brush a dirty coat and never bathe your Havanese until you have brushed the coat well." Can anyone resolve this tautology? I for one can't see how you get from point A to point B without breaking one of these rules.:juggle:-Thanks


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Hey, there, Chloe's mom. Yeah...that would be hard to accomplish!  

Well, I don't know what they are talking about when it comes to not brushing a dirty dog...they must have something in mind that would make sense of that. I haven't noticed that part. What I do is ALWAYS brush/comb before a bath, otherwise you end up with a "felted" coat which is way harder to get the mats out of. I believe that is what everyone on the Forum will tell you, too.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

cloe's_mom said:


> Hi Folks - Just reading the book Nose to Tail and have come across a potential conundrum that maybe some of you can help me with. "There are two rules for successful grooming of the Havanese: Never brush a dirty coat and never bathe your Havanese until you have brushed the coat well." Can anyone resolve this tautology? I for one can't see how you get from point A to point B without breaking one of these rules.:juggle:-Thanks


Perhaps the answer is NOT to let your dog get dirty! :laugh: Let me know if you figure out just how to do that. I haven't been so lucky!


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

Now.....How are our pups suppose to get dirty if they are getting bathed 1x week? :ranger: But, I know....there are those days that the pups go crazy on us! 

I always use a mist to comb/brush out Dexter.


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

good buddy said:


> Perhaps the answer is NOT to let your dog get dirty! :laugh: Let me know if you figure out just how to do that. I haven't been so lucky!


Exactly.
The key is to keep your dog(s) brushed so that they are never in a stage of getting matted. If they play rough and get dirty, then you bathe them immediately since you haven't let them get matted in the first place, right? Never bathe a matted Havanese and don't brush out a dirty dog. If you keep them brushed before you let them get dirty, you've found the way into the inner grooming circle. 

And I'll give you two more tips I've discovered... use the CC #005 comb instead of a brush when your dog is dirty. Start at the ends and work your way into the roots (reverse of teasing hair) combing each hair into place. It takes a long time, but you save the coat.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Havtahava said:


> Exactly.
> The key is to keep your dog(s) brushed so that they are never in a stage of getting matted. If they play rough and get dirty, then you bathe them immediately since you haven't let them get matted in the first place, right? Never bathe a matted Havanese and don't brush out a dirty dog. If you keep them brushed before you let them get dirty, you've found the way into the inner grooming circle.
> 
> And I'll give you two more tips I've discovered... use the CC #005 comb instead of a brush when your dog is dirty. Start at the ends and work your way into the roots (reverse of teasing hair) combing each hair into place. It takes a long time, but you save the coat.


Aha, I always comb out Tucker before I brush him. Maybe that is what the book refers too, and I generally tend to use either "comb" or "brush" interchangeably for the process involved in grooming. But, especially when my dog is RLHing in the mountain weeds, he's gonna get dirty. Only way to stop that is to not let him run, and what fun is that for him? Of course, I'm not showing him, either.


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## DAJsMom (Oct 27, 2006)

My dirty dogs say I haven't read the right books!

I generally comb my dogs rather than brushing. They are only clean the first couple of days after a bath, so I guess I comb them dirty all the time! 

Definitely make sure they are combed out before a bath!! Wet mats are not a good thing. That said, Dusty has a thing for going outside dirty and uncombed and deciding to lie down in a puddle or play in the hose, and I haven't had to shave her yet.

Indie is really dirty right now--bath day Wednesday!--and I was just thinking that, even dirty, and needing to be combed out, she has a really pretty coat. I haven't ruined it yet either.

My advice is to not worry too much about all the details. Once you have Chloe, you'll find out which of all the different tips and tricks will work for you.


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

DAJsMom said:


> That said, Dusty has a thing for going outside dirty and uncombed and deciding to lie down in a puddle or play in the hose, and I haven't had to shave her yet.


I have one of those too! Marley will burst out the back door when I go to turn of the sprinkler and run like crazy all through the spray! When I try to catch him, he jumps across the garden beds and then back out onto the lawn. At that point, brushed out or not, it's time for the bath.


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## Sheri (Oct 11, 2008)

Joelle, Dusty is such a classy dog, sitting in the middle of a puddle! Makes me smile!

And, Christy, we definitely need video of Marley showing us how to escape, and then RLH through sprinklers and garden! That makes me smile, too!

:biggrin1: These Neezers are priceless in the entertainment department!


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

I agree with you, Joelle. I must be brushing/combing my dirty dogs all the time, because they certainly don't stay clean forever. Of course, I'm not bathing every week either. Way too much work, though in the rainy season, it will be more often than now. 

Cloes' mom, good catch on that conundrum! lol


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

HavaneseSoon said:


> Now.....How are our pups suppose to get dirty if they are getting bathed 1x week? :ranger: But, I know....there are those days that the pups go crazy on us!
> 
> I always use a mist to comb/brush out Dexter.


Well... Kodi gets bathed about once a week,:bathbaby:and manages to get pretty gross SEVERAL times a week. :laugh:

Between walks in the woods, playing at the lake, or even just going out to pee first thing in the morning in the dewy grass, life gets pretty messy... and Kodi is snow white on all the parts that are likely to get dirty. (his head is black, and he's got a black spot on his back, but otherwise he's solid white)

I've found that he often needs foot and belly baths in between full baths. When possible, I try to just rinse him off in between baths, but if he's been on a muddy trail in the woods with his German Shepherd friend, sometimes I still need to shampoo his feet in between regular bath days.


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## cloe's_mom (Aug 21, 2009)

Hi Everyone - I so appreciate your input and candidness. It's just so nice and reassuring to know that such beautiful full- coated dogs (and they are all stunning!) live with actual - non-perfect, non-full-time-grooming drones as their humans. I was starting to wonder if having a full coat on Chlöe would eventually restrict her fun for my selfish enjoyment of how she'll look. I see from your photos and responses that one can have fun and a full coat too. 

On a separate and unrelated note, sorry but I can't seem get the Forum gods to let me correct the misspelling of my username - my fault. I've tried emailing the "contact us" people as well as directly to Melissa Miller – but thus, no response. Any ideas? – it just bugs me :frusty:that I’m faced every time with my own incompetence and can’t fix it. –thanks
Chlöe’s Mom - Pamela


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Here;s a photo of Kodi at the beach... you can see that we get VERY messy. It can take a little clean-up afterwards... if only to the point that I'm willing to let him walk around the house:laugh: but it's worth it because of all the fun we have together. 

One thing that I've found can help avoid daily baths for a very active puppy is that when we get back home from a wet walk, I put him in his pen with a couple of dry towels to lie down on. When he's dry, a lot of dirt can just be brushed out, particularly if you spray a little conditioner on the brush. If he's still really gross after that,:yield: we go for the foot and tummy bath.

... Now I have to get off the computer and go clean up the mucky puppy that came back from this morning's walk.:wink:


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

Sheri said:


> Hey, there, Chloe's mom. Yeah...that would be hard to accomplish!
> 
> Well, I don't know what they are talking about when it comes to not brushing a dirty dog...they must have something in mind that would make sense of that. I haven't noticed that part. What I do is ALWAYS brush/comb before a bath, otherwise you end up with a "felted" coat which is way harder to get the mats out of. I believe that is what everyone on the Forum will tell you, too.


Not me....I throw them in the bath and then comb them out after the conditioner is in. My comb slides right through
The conundrum: Dirty hair has grit in it, which can break off the coat.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

JASHavanese said:


> Not me....I throw them in the bath and then comb them out after the conditioner is in. My comb slides right through
> The conundrum: Dirty hair has grit in it, which can break off the coat.


Glad to hear you say that... When Kodi and I got home this morning, he was a mud ball AND had weed seeds stuck all through his coat. I tried brushing them out, but they were holding on tight. It would have been hard to get them out, and probably uncomfortable as well. I washed him, put extra conditioner in his rinse water, and most of the seeds fell right out under the sprayer. The ones that didn't, were easy to get out with a flea comb once he was dry.

Good thing, I was afraid he'd turn into a Chia Pet the next time he got wet! :laugh:


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## cloe's_mom (Aug 21, 2009)

"Mucky Puppy" hahaha! Love it. It sounds like the best advice is to take it as it comes, do your best, stay on top of it, use your brains along with your tools and products and most of all, don't stress - it's only hair and it will grow back. 

This is all theoretical at this point - 5 days to go before she comes home :biggrin1:, and she'll have puppy easy coat for at least a while after that. Thanks


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## kelrobin (Jan 21, 2008)

cloe's_mom said:


> On a separate and unrelated note, sorry but I can't seem get the Forum gods to let me correct the misspelling of my username - my fault. I've tried emailing the "contact us" people as well as directly to Melissa Miller - but thus, no response. Any ideas? - it just bugs me :frusty:that I'm faced every time with my own incompetence and can't fix it. -thanks
> Chlöe's Mom - Pamela


Pamela . . . try contacting Melissa again. I did the same thing when I first signed up, and eventually she did fix it for me. Melissa is very busy, but she will get to you in time . . .


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## cloe's_mom (Aug 21, 2009)

*username typo*

Kathy, will do. Thanks for the suggestion.

Chlöe's Mom-Pamela


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

krandall said:


> Glad to hear you say that... When Kodi and I got home this morning, he was a mud ball AND had weed seeds stuck all through his coat. I tried brushing them out, but they were holding on tight. It would have been hard to get them out, and probably uncomfortable as well. I washed him, put extra conditioner in his rinse water, and most of the seeds fell right out under the sprayer. The ones that didn't, were easy to get out with a flea comb once he was dry.
> 
> Good thing, I was afraid he'd turn into a Chia Pet the next time he got wet! :laugh:


I'll give you a tip I found out the hard way. If you use a lot of conditioner to get a mat out of one area, dry it after you do. I didn't dry it once and had 10 times the mat when it dried!
Hubby washed the dogs when I had to stay in a motel for 10 days.....oh my the mess I had on my hands! I think one of them is just plain getting shaved down as she hates being groomed. The standard poodle is still a work in progress but all I have left is to do the leg bracelets. <whew that was a chore!> Another one took me 3 days to comb out. He's such a doll but really stinks at bath time. Guess it's time to show him what the conditioner looks like :biggrin1:


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

Pamela, lucky you living in Cave Creek! I LOVE it there!

You're right, it's a lot of common sense and learning as you go. There is so much helpful information here and so many people here that are willing to give advice so you don't have to make mistakes that they've made that you will be just fine once your little one arrives!

Have fun!

Beverly


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## fibtaylo (Jan 14, 2009)

krandall said:


> Good thing, I was afraid he'd turn into a Chia Pet the next time he got wet! :laugh:


ound: Too funny!!

My 2 have found the waterfall in the backyard. Put up a little fence, they go over. Stopped running the waterfall, they still find just enough water from the sprinkling system to make themselves a wet dirty mess and they love every minute of it :evil: Thank goodness I am not showing!


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## cloe's_mom (Aug 21, 2009)

*Loving Cave Creek*

Thanks Beverly, this is the first place that we've lived (NYC, San Diego, Louisville) that I'm not always anxious to get away from - it's just too nice here at home - besides all my stuff is here:wink:. DH offered to take me to Paris for our 25th in Nov.- I turned him down in favor of getting Chlöe and the related shopping spree that she (and this forum, frankly) has inspired. Chlöe will bring us joy for way longer than a week in Paris.

I think we're finally done with the 110* days:amen:, but you never know. We're looking forward to when the creek starts flowing again and the ducks and herons come back. Maybe Nov-Dec - we need some rain first.


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

cloe's_mom said:


> Thanks Beverly, this is the first place that we've lived (NYC, San Diego, Louisville) that I'm not always anxious to get away from - it's just too nice here at home - besides all my stuff is here:wink:. DH offered to take me to Paris for our 25th in Nov.- I turned him down in favor of getting Chlöe and the related shopping spree that she (and this forum, frankly) has inspired. Chlöe will bring us joy for way longer than a week in Paris.
> 
> I think we're finally done with the 110* days:amen:, but you never know. We're looking forward to when the creek starts flowing again and the ducks and herons come back. Maybe Nov-Dec - we need some rain first.


The money will probably even out...you will be real surprised in all the stuff you will buy your pup.


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## Metchosin (Jun 29, 2009)

I just ordered this book (Nose to Tail) yesterday and I'm really looking forward to getting it in the mail. I've had to learn a lot of things the hard way, so I hope it does have lots of helpful grooming advice. 

There IS lots of great advice in this thread, though! Thank you! 

I find, at different times of the year, different problems crop up. Right now, it's those little 'burrs' that stick like glue, especially with the fall dew getting his legs wet. 
I also put Tucker into a corral to dry after he's been outside running around in the long grass. Once he's dry I can locate those little rascals and get them out. 

Last time, when Tucker was at the groomer's, she didn't get his butt area trimmed out enough. I've now clipped it a bit more, but I don't think I've got it right. That's one area I really WANT to learn how to do myself. With a long coat, I find I need to check after every pooper. It seems kind of rude of me to do that to the poor little thing, but he's a good sport :redface:

ps: My dog loves to roll in dead worms. They are the worst when they dry. I don't suppose the book will have any advice about that one, though.:wink:


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## RikiDaisyDixie (Apr 15, 2008)

*The answer:*

I was at a grooming seminar on havanese. The dog was just glorious. I asked his trainer and groomer how he kept up such an amazing coat...how he kept the feet so nice...what happens when the dog gets wet?

His answer, the dog never goes outside! What!

I wonder if that dog wears a mask when he eats and drinks too!

Well that is AN answer, but probably not the one any of us are looking for.

I remember this when I see some dogs looking so perfect and my Riki and Daisy looking well looking "dog" like! LOL

You can use a conditioning spray when brushing a dirty dog, the same one you use when brushing them anyway. I find the coat is nicer when I do this properly. The dogs hate the conditioning spray, they like to smell like dogs...


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## Metchosin (Jun 29, 2009)

My dog likes to smell like eau de dead worms with notes of bird poo.


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## RikiDaisyDixie (Apr 15, 2008)

*eau de worms...*

I don't know what the heck mine are rolling in and I don't want to bend down to find out!

My sister's dog found a deer carcass to roll in, smelled for weeks. I think the dog was proud of it! Hey mom, look how tough I am...


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## Metchosin (Jun 29, 2009)

Linda, love the agility pic for your avatar! Isn't agility fun? (Really, really love your dog's names!!!)


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## HavaneseSoon (Nov 4, 2008)

You will love the book! 

I took 6 stickers off of Dexter the other day! Those things hurt!

I don't remember reading anything about worms in the book..  But, you will hear contradicting advice on the form. You do what works for your Hav. 

As for the butt area, just trim it up a little (I like to use thinners)....around the anal opening and some of the hair going down from the rectum....whatever you think is going to get hit from runny stools.


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