# 8 month old - matting like crazy!



## Zenith360 (Mar 17, 2019)

My pup, Sam, is 8.5 months old. His coat has started matting like crazy. Every day, there are tangles that threaten to form into mats. Unless I really keep on top of it, he gets matted super easily now, unlike before. Is this the stage my breeder warned me about-- going through puberty and having a coat that mats easily? If so, how long does it last????  Does it get easier? Do you have any tips for surviving this stage?

Thank you!!!
Bailey


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Yup. This is blowing coat. Some are easier some are harder. My easiest was pretty easy. She hd a couple of easy to get out mats if I didn't comb her out every couple of days. My hardest required full comb-outs twice a day, EVERY day, and baths every 4 days to keep him in full coat through the worst of it. But I was determined. Some are harder than that. Some are much worse.

Do NOT feel that you HAVE to keep up with it unless you are showing or plan to. There is NO shame in putting your dog in a shot puppy cut to get through this phase, even if you choose to let them grow out again afterwards. It is much better to cut them down BEFORE they get matted to the skin than have to have them shaved because it has gotten away from you. Hair grows. 

It depends on the dog how long blowing coat lasts. USUALLY they are pretty much over it by 18 months. Some sooner. Some go on as long as about 2 years. Very few go longer than that. If it's longer than that, it's probably just a generally hard to manage coat. And there are those too.

_YOU_ do what is best for YOU and HIM!


----------



## Zenith360 (Mar 17, 2019)

Thank you for the info! 10 months is a long time-- puppy cut here we come!

Also, why do people call it "blowing the coat"? I used to have high-shedding breeds, and this is the term we used for seasonal shedding. What's actually happening to Sam's coat here?

Bailey


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Zenith360 said:


> Thank you for the info! 10 months is a long time-- puppy cut here we come!
> 
> Also, why do people call it "blowing the coat"? I used to have high-shedding breeds, and this is the term we used for seasonal shedding. What's actually happening to Sam's coat here?
> 
> Bailey


It's kind of the same thing. They are "blowing" the puppy coat, which is like the undercoat on a high-shedding breed. The problem is, on a "non-shedding" breed, this undercoat and puppy hair likes to wrap around the shafts of the long adult hair that is supposed to stay attached to the dog. If it isn't combed out completely and often, it tends to mat. left much longer and it starts to felt. once it felts, you are pretty much dead in the water. That's when the dog ends up shaved to the skin.

They still need to lose all this stuff even if they are in a puppy cut, it's just that it slips off over and between the shorter (cut) hair much more easily without wrapping around.

As I said in my first post, it's REALLY depends on the dog how bad it gets. Panda really wasn't bad a tall. She has a light undercoat and any mats she gets are easy to coax out. Kodi was manageable because I REALLY wanted it. Pixel SORT of was too, but her coat is VERY soft and made TINY little mats that slipped right between the teeth of the comb. We know she was not going to be showing, so around her first birthday, decided to put her in a puppy cut "for a while". She was so darn cute in the puppy cut that we've just kept her in it! it just suits her small frame.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

I love this thread because I've not had the horrible matting some have described. At one time, I had what I considered more matts than usual, at which my groomer complained. Since then, I've been diligent in combing, not going more than two days. Some days twice a day. 

Patti is now 1yr 10mos and her white hair is mats more easily but NOT at the skin level. As I comb the matts around her legs and stomach (mostly white hair), I'm finding hair in the comb, which I've not had in the past.

Her black hair is not as fine and has a little more texture. The white hair seems to be matting more.

Is this Blowing Coat at this age???


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Mikki said:


> I love this thread because I've not had the horrible matting some have described. At one time, I had what I considered more matts than usual, at which my groomer complained. Since then, I've been diligent in combing, not going more than two days. Some days twice a day.
> 
> Patti is now 1yr 10mos and her white hair is mats more easily but NOT at the skin level. As I comb the matts around her legs and stomach (mostly white hair), I'm finding hair in the comb, which I've not had in the past.
> 
> ...


It's very late, but I suppose it's possible... I think it's more likely that she may be one with an easier coat, like my Panda, and because you've kept her in a puppy cut all the way along, you've just missed most of it. Lucky!


----------



## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

If you don’t already have a good comb, it will be so useful to you now! Also, some kind of grooming spray. I also keep cut up treats in a container in my grooming bin, even still at 2 years old. At one point my puppy would spontaneously lay down for grooming, hoping for a treat  

I found a little here and there was better than skipping a day in a pinch. I kept a little wooden brush next to the back door where i keep his harness and leash for potty trips. On busy days especially I would take 10 seconds and brush around his chest and armpits when I took off his harness. I also kept a mini spray and brush in the car and would do his face or ears or something while waiting for DD piano lesson, etc. i always use a comb for real grooming sessions but the little brushes are useful this way. 

I actually have more problems with mats now than I ever did when he was blowing coat because now that he’s older and his coat is a little easier it’s also easier to forget grooming for more than a day. Mine does have a fluffy, dense undercoat as an adult and if his coat is short I can skip a day but that’s about it, otherwise combing takes 45 minutes instead of 10. Right now his coat is pretty long and I really can’t skip at all but it gets past me sometimes.


----------



## chocohavapup (Apr 18, 2019)

We've got Ferdie in a puppy cut but we want it to grow back so we'll be doing our fair share of brushing!! Question about flea prevention! We've been using the seresto collar on Ferdie cause I've always had that on my old lady maltipoo, but now with the grooming requirement, I'm wondering what we should use since the collar does require some oomph to get off and on. It's just so much cheaper than any alternative!!


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

chocohavapup said:


> We've got Ferdie in a puppy cut but we want it to grow back so we'll be doing our fair share of brushing!! Question about flea prevention! We've been using the seresto collar on Ferdie cause I've always had that on my old lady maltipoo, but now with the grooming requirement, I'm wondering what we should use since the collar does require some oomph to get off and on. It's just so much cheaper than any alternative!!


First, If you want to grow your pup's coat back out, I think you will find that keeping ANY collar on them all the time will cause matting. Mine only wear collars when they are outdoors. But on top of that, Havanese are a chemical-sensitive breed, and I would be very leery of using a Seresto collar on them anyway. My vet does not recommend them for small breed dogs. It really depends on where you live, how bad fleas and ticks are in your area, and how you choose to manage them, but I find that with careful, regular bathing and grooming and washing of all bedding regularly, I can get by with just using Advantix II once or twice a season. And that is USUALLY just before camping vacations.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

We found treating our yard for fleas and ticks helps a WHOLE lot. Oral flea and tick medication only works after they bite the dog.


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Mikki said:


> We found treating our yard for fleas and ticks helps a WHOLE lot. Oral flea and tick medication only works after they bite the dog.


Yes, this is another reason we like Advantix II when we HAVE to use something. Kodi has a TERRIBLE reaction to tick bites... even when they are not diseased ticks. Advantix II is one of the few topicals that is a repellent, where the tick or flea does not need to bite for it to work. (we just don't like to use ANY of these chemicals more often than we absolutely need to)

Our dog yard has a large buffer area of mowed grass between it and any wooded area or stone walls, so we've been lucky that we seem to really have no flea or tick activity inside the fenced backyard area, even without treating it.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

krandall said:


> Yes, this is another reason we like Advantix II when we HAVE to use something. Kodi has a TERRIBLE reaction to tick bites... even when they are not diseased ticks. Advantix II is one of the few topicals that is a repellent, where the tick or flea does not need to bite for it to work. (we just don't like to use ANY of these chemicals more often than we absolutely need to)
> 
> Our dog yard has a large buffer area of mowed grass between it and any wooded area or stone walls, so we've been lucky that we seem to really have no flea or tick activity inside the fenced backyard area, even without treating it.


Good to know Advantix II is a repellant because Patti has a reaction to flea and tick bites. We have a large buffer between the yard and wooded areas, but still have a problem if we don't treat the yard about twice a summer. Well...depends on how much it rains. Last summer it rained constantly and the yard needed to be treated twice. A repellent may change that.


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Mikki said:


> Good to know Advantix II is a repellant because Patti has a reaction to flea and tick bites. We have a large buffer between the yard and wooded areas, but still have a problem if we don't treat the yard about twice a summer. Well...depends on how much it rains. Last summer it rained constantly and the yard needed to be treated twice. A repellent may change that.


I think it TOTALLY depends on where you live... We live so much further north than you do, I'm sure that has an effect on the flea and tick population too.


----------



## Melissa Woods (Feb 21, 2019)

Mine is matting like crazy too (will be 1 next week). I cut a few really bad ones out today and spent an hour and a half combing. I gave him so many treats he finally fell asleep. But still my groomer is not going to be happy. I’m aiming to avoid shaving. It’s definitely from his harness as it’s all around that area. His white fur is more cottony than the brown. He doesn’t have curly hair but the white hair is so fine it tangles easily. I hate to do a short puppy cut in winter, but I don’t see any other way out.


----------



## Turnberry (Apr 17, 2019)

I'm going through the same thing with my 9 month old Sancho!


----------



## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Melissa Woods said:


> Mine is matting like crazy too (will be 1 next week). I cut a few really bad ones out today and spent an hour and a half combing. I gave him so many treats he finally fell asleep. But still my groomer is not going to be happy. I'm aiming to avoid shaving. It's definitely from his harness as it's all around that area. His white fur is more cottony than the brown. He doesn't have curly hair but the white hair is so fine it tangles easily. I hate to do a short puppy cut in winter, but I don't see any other way out.


Do remember that even if he gets cut short, it will grow back, and if he has to wear a coat when he goes out for a while, it's not the end of the world!


----------



## jbarton (Oct 24, 2019)

At what age can I get a professional puppy cut for my puppy; he is just 3 mos. old now! I PREVIOUSLY asked about getting a pup while already having a lab, and to those who responded, they are doing greAT!


----------



## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

We started mine at the groomer pretty much right away. The first time was just a bath and brush, next few were bath & sanitary area. Now he’s starting to be clipped (keeping him at about 3 inches of length). Going early gets them used to new people, new environment, the equipment, etc. Also let’s you scope out the place and make sure it’s the right place for you 

My groomer owns a shop, but also grooms out of her house and does competitive grooming as part of the Mastergroom Canada team. So he gets to check out both locations. 

She wants my next pup to be black so she can compete with them .. she doesn’t like competing with light dogs because they’re harder to keep clean on competition days as they travel all over the world with the dogs (she competed with our last wheatie briefly). So we’ll see what happens. Lol.

On another note.. I normally brush/comb Denver out every 2 days. I missed a day and his front legs are a matted mess. He’s coming up 7 months old next week... so guess I need to step up his brushing schedule to daily!!


----------



## jbarton (Oct 24, 2019)

Thanks for the info; very helpful. I had a trusted groomer who had to quit due to health issues. I had a mini schnauzer who passed from cancer before getting Cooper. Cooper is sooo furry already and I am not used to this! I will eventually want a short cut and I don't even know how to describe a cut to a groomer. Any suggestions? This is first Havanese puppy!


----------



## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

Look online and find pictures that you can show them... it makes it so much easier! 

Search for things like “Havanese puppy cut” or “Havanese teddy bear cut” as those are shorter cuts. Or check out the photos people have posted here on the boards  once you find a few that you like the looks of you can show them and go from there.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

jbarton said:


> At what age can I get a professional puppy cut for my puppy; he is just 3 mos. old now! I PREVIOUSLY asked about getting a pup while already having a lab, and to those who responded, they are doing greAT!


My Dog Photo on the left is right after Patti had a puppy grooming at or before 3-months. They cut her toenails, cleaned up her behind, trimmed her mustache, trimmed around her feet and basically fluffed her up. It's good to get them started early even you just have them bathed.

Patti's birthday is Feb 26, 2018. I joined the Havanese Forum May 2018 and this photo is right after she was groomed.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Melissa Woods said:


> Mine is matting like crazy too (will be 1 next week). I cut a few really bad ones out today and spent an hour and a half combing. I gave him so many treats he finally fell asleep. But still my groomer is not going to be happy. I'm aiming to avoid shaving. It's definitely from his harness as it's all around that area. His white fur is more cottony than the brown. He doesn't have curly hair but the white hair is so fine it tangles easily. I hate to do a short puppy cut in winter, but I don't see any other way out.


If you are not using thinning scissors to cut through the matts, get some. It makes cutting through tough matts a WHOLE LOT easier and quicker. You can buy them at lots of places such as Ultra, Sally's Beauty Supplies if you're in the United States.


----------



## Melissa Woods (Feb 21, 2019)

Mikki said:


> If you are not using thinning scissors to cut through the matts, get some. It makes cutting through tough matts a WHOLE LOT easier and quicker. You can buy them at lots of places such as Ultra, Sally's Beauty Supplies if you're in the United States.


I'm going to give this a shot. I'm really afraid he's going to need to be shaved.  I know it's just hair and it will grow back but uggggh.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Melissa Woods said:


> I'm going to give this a shot. I'm really afraid he's going to need to be shaved.  I know it's just hair and it will grow back but uggggh.


Melissa, if you're not doing this - before trying to comb a mat, work it by pulling it apart with you fingers. This especially works well when you cut through a thick mat with thinning scissors. I've found combing Patti is easier if I do it after I've taken Patti for a 2-4 mile walk, which is about 1 hour to 1.5 hours. She's more willing to lay down and isn't so wiggly and wanting to play. > There's a tool that combs through mats but it's more for tangles in the middle or end of the hair and not close to the skin, and I've found it's easier to just pull those apart and comb them out.

These little guys and gals are very High Maintenance when it comes to their hair and there's a learning curve if you've never had a Havanese. I've had poodles and their hair is no where near the maintenance of a Havanese. A short or long puppy cut makes things easier and I found a weekly bath makes the hair easier to maintain. I'm lazy and take mine to the groomer to be bathed once a week and keep telling myself I'm going to start doing the bath. I haven't figured out how the groomer gets her hair so smooth, soft and silky after a bath, which has discouraged me from bathing her.

Their hair grows fast but I, too, hope you don't have to have you little guy shaved.


----------



## Melissa Woods (Feb 21, 2019)

The corn starch works way better than spray conditioner too


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Melissa Woods said:


> The corn starch works way better than spray conditioner too


How do you use corn starch? I haven't found spray conditioner does much of anything, even on non-matted hair, but I give it spritz when combing it.


----------



## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

A lot of the sprays I’ve used for combing don’t really work well for mats. I think it’s the silicone sprays that work better, but there are some non-silicone plant based and other sprays that are more slippery that work better, too. I’m sure it depends on preference, too. With regular combing I think the purpose is more to lightly dampen the hair so that the ends don’t become broken and over-brushed over time. I use lots of different sprays for that, and I mix them together, and pretty much anything will get the job done, although I have my favorites. Removing a mat is a little different, though. If it gets too wet then I find it harder to remove, so I prefer the products that feel almost like a dry oil and sit on top of the hair. I’ve used a few different human leave in and shine products and they all get the mats out quite well (Kenra, Biosilk, argan oil, or whatever I have around) but they’re all heavy and tend to attract more grime so they’re better before a bath. That’s what I do if I’ve left him with a sitter for a few days (they try but we know how hard it is). 

I really, really like the Ice on Ice Ultra for mats. It’s in a pressurized spray bottle and isn’t diluted. The mist is very fine and it seems to get in between all of the little hairs. It has removed mats I thought I’d have to cut. I spray it on the mat and let it soak in while I’m combing and then go back to it a few minutes later. It was kind of a gamble because the reviews were very mixed and it was newer when I first ordered it. My guess is it works better on some textures over others. I can’t compare it to cornstarch, which I have meant to try but I never remember. I might go put cornstarch in my grooming bucket now so it’s ready for next time because if it works better it would be a lot less expensive than the Ultra!


----------



## Melissa Woods (Feb 21, 2019)

I massage it into the mat, leave it for a while, slowly detangle it with my fingers, and then comb through it. It’s still a process, but I’m getting them. His white fur is very fine and tangled easily, but now I can tell it’s the puppy coat thing because I’m pulling out tufts of hair. I literally have someone feeding him treats while I work! After I get as much as I can, I do spray him and do a regular comb through. He gets these little mats so small they slip through the comb but those are less important to me at the moment. I’m definitely going to try one of those sprays you mentioned, Elizabeth! I could not get any mats out after his bath or by wetting it. But I spray the leave in conditioner on after because I know I’m probably breaking hair in general. I just want to get rid of those mats that are to the skin so the breeder can do a short puppy cut. Last week I swore he’d have to shave him. I still think he might have if I hadn’t been working on it. It’s been taking a couple of hours over the course of 2-3 sessions for me to get them out. He’s better than I am of course, but I still think it would take him longer than the hour or two he has him in the van!


----------



## Wulfin (May 3, 2019)

I’m in the same boat. I had food poisoning this past week and Denver is a mess. I’ve been working on the ones on the front of his feet and leg from his surgery. But yesterday I did a full brush/comb except those places and today he’s got a GIANT mat near his arm pit. Wasn’t even a teeny one there yesterday. And same thing, I have small tufts of fur coming out. But I’m hoping it’s not cuz of me pulling it out (ouch!). I’m going to try cornstarching it tomorrow and have hubs distract him to get it done.

I have until Jan 16 to get him in shape. Might ask for a shorter cut to get me through this... lol.


----------



## Mikki (May 6, 2018)

Separate mats with your fingers and tease with a comb and pointed scissors to loosen the mat. Or, cut through the matt with thinning scissors, separate with your fingers and comb out. If it's so bad you can't tease and comb out the mat, then cut it out using thinning scissors. Don't use a comb to pull the mat out, which hurts and make will make your little one afraid to be combed and brushed.

I've never used cornstarch ... and it's worth a try.

If the mat is large under the armpit, just cut it out. I found thinning scissors work the best . 

A groomer is not going to spend time getting mats out. They'll have shave or cut them out.


----------

