# Conditioner w/whitening shampoo



## Kimm (Mar 13, 2018)

I haven't been here in awhile - since I got my first Hav puppy in May. You can click on my profile (under statistics) to see my intro posts on the forum if you want. Don't know why I haven't been back, just busyness, I guess!

Since I got Maisy, I've just been using a puppy shampoo and conditioner that I already had, and it's been fine so far. She's nice and soft, but her white is starting to look dingy, so I'm going to order some White on White and try that. What I'm wondering is which conditioner I should try. I'm looking at *Spectrum 10* or the *Ice on Ice detangling conditioner.* I also want to try the Ice on Ice grooming spray for everyday brushing.

I'm wondering if any of you have used these conditioners and have a favorite, especially in conjunction with the White on White shampoo. Maisy is 6 months and hasn't started blowing coat yet. So far, her coat has been easy to care for, no matts at all. But I know that's probably about to change, and I want to be prepared.

Here is the latest picture of her. I try to clip or band her bangs up out of her eyes, but it never stays, LOL. I don't want to cut it though. I'd rather it grow out so it doesn't have to be trimmed all the time. I think it just needs to get a little longer, and then maybe it will stay better.

P.S. Are there any other whitening shampoos you would recommend?


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

I use either CC White on White or Biogroom Super White. They both cost about the same and do an equally good job, but the scent of the Biogroom is stronger. I ALWAYS use Spectrum 10 as a conditioner after bathing with any shampoo without a built-in conditioner, (neither of these do) and Kodi needs it no matter what shampoo I use. 

Ice on Ice is a great product, but it's not really a conditioner. It's a grooming spray. I use it every day when I comb dogs out, but I still use Spectrum 10 with baths. Sometimes I make a combination of Ice on Ice concentrate, Spectrum 10 and water for my grooming spray.


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## Jeanniek (Mar 20, 2018)

krandall said:


> I ALWAYS use Spectrum 10 as a conditioner after bathing with any shampoo without a built-in conditioner, (neither of these do) and Kodi needs it no matter what shampoo I use.


How do you know his coat needs it? Is it a look or a feel?


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## Kimm (Mar 13, 2018)

Thanks so much, Karen. I ordered the Spectrum 10 but decided to try Lillian Ruff whitening shampoo since it's tearless and it has good reviews. And I got the Ice concentrate for brushing and also a Lillian Ruff waterless shampoo for between-bath touchups. Haven't tried them yet but can hardly wait.

Anyone else used Lillian Ruff products?


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Jeanniek said:


> How do you know his coat needs it? Is it a look or a feel?


If I don't use a good conditioner, he mats more. Heis older (9 1/2) and has a very long, thick, mature coat.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Kimm said:


> Thanks so much, Karen. I ordered the Spectrum 10 but decided to try Lillian Ruff whitening shampoo since it's tearless and it has good reviews. And I got the Ice concentrate for brushing and also a Lillian Ruff waterless shampoo for between-bath touchups. Haven't tried them yet but can hardly wait.
> 
> Anyone else used Lillian Ruff products?


No, I've never even heard of Lillian Ruff. I have used CC White on White and Biogroom Super White since Kodi was a small puppy, though. Although they don't specifically bill themselves as "tearless", I have never seen the least bit of evidence that it bothers their eyes in all this time, and I do use it on their faces and around their eyes.(of course I do rinse thoroughly)

Oh, and I'm not a fan of "waterless shampoo". IMO, especially on a coated breed, without really washing with shampoo and thoroughly rinsing, you are just smearing dirt around.


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## katscleancutdogs (May 18, 2016)

Love the ice on ice. Only way my Bichon Frise will let me brush her (she bites). I don't use a whitening shampoo on her. I've been using Bobbi Panter soothing shampoo which is totally tearless, salt free, ph balanced for dogs. And she is White. Whitening shampoos don't actually make a dog whiter they just reflect the light wavelength that makes them appear whiter or brighter and I agree with not using a dry shampoo it's like glue and attracts more dirt (At least it did when I was using it in my hair and I'm not that close to the floor)
The best way to make your white white is to get it clean. I wants had one of my clients ask what are used to get her English golden retriever so white&#8230; I told her that I used the regular shampoo and just made sure she got clean 

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## katscleancutdogs (May 18, 2016)

Just realized how rude that sounded. I didn’t mean to imply that you aren’t cleaning your dogs just that whitening shampoos don’t actually clean any better that regular shampoo but I’m not a fan so that came out.. snotty. I’m actually allergic to the blueing agent (the whitener is actually a blue dye) and lollipop is allergic to life so we don’t use one and she still gets snowy white. 


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

This is true. "Whitening" shampoos tend to offset any yellowing (from grass, food, etc.). We use bluing on horses for the same reason. They don't do anything to "bleach" out the stain. But unless there is an allergy, as in your case, there is also absolutely no harm in using them, and they DO make white dogs (and those with lots of white around the edges) LOOK nicer.

Anything that would actually bleach the hair is a really bad idea, because it is also very bad for the hair.


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## Kimm (Mar 13, 2018)

katscleancutdogs said:


> Just realized how rude that sounded. I didn't mean to imply that you aren't cleaning your dogs just that whitening shampoos don't actually clean any better that regular shampoo but I'm not a fan so that came out.. snotty.


That's okay! I didn't take it as rude or snotty at all. I just appreciate all the help and info I can get. 

Thank you both so much (kat and krandall) for all of your help! Gotta go for now but will be back later to reply more.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

From what I understand, most people don’t have a problem with using their usual conditioner (Spectrum 10 is ours) after the whitening shampoo. I noticed our puppy’s coat did feel dry, though. I’m not sure if it’s because he’s blowing coat or because our climate is really dry, or maybe because I use it full strength, but it helped a lot to do an additional diluted conditioner rinse with a slightly heavier conditioner (avoiding his ears because they tend to look limp faster). Conditioner that is too heavy normally seems to be okay diluted after the whitening shampoo for me. I only use whitening shampoo occasionally and use Spectrum 10 the rest of the time and I really like it. 

I bought multiple waterless shampoos and they all disappoint me. I love ice on ice for grooming but it doesn’t work well for me on dirty spots. I use the “wettest” leave in spray I have for spots that seem dirty and it seems to make any dirt and grime actually comb out better. Actually, lately I’ve been using my own salon leave-in just on dirty spots, but I don’t necessarily recommend buying one for that purpose. I just found by accident that human leave in conditioner sprays seems to have more of a wet slip and less of the ultra lightweight silicone feel that works so well for brushing, so they seem to clean better. I think they have a little more weight, though, so it’s a trade off. I don’t have time for a bath more than once a week right now, and dirty spots seem to cause more mats, so I do wish I could get a waterless shampoo to really do the trick.


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## Kimm (Mar 13, 2018)

Well, you're right – I HATE the waterless shampoo! Just had to try it since I had it. 🙄

Haven't tried the shampoo and conditioner yet. I'm waiting to bathe her until Monday because she's getting spayed Tuesday and probably can't be bathed again until she's healed.


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## Kimm (Mar 13, 2018)

I bathed Maisy last night in her new shampoo and conditioner (Lillian Ruff whitening shampoo & CC Spectrum 10), and I LOVE them both. She came out sooo soft and silky, and smelled delicious.  I couldn't stop petting her all night until bedtime. 

I like the Ice on Ice too, but she sure does hate being sprayed. I've tried spraying it on my hands and rubbing it on her or just spraying the comb, but I'm afraid it's not enough. How damp does the coat need to be for brushing/combing?


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Kimm said:


> I bathed Maisy last night in her new shampoo and conditioner (Lillian Ruff whitening shampoo & CC Spectrum 10), and I LOVE them both. She came out sooo soft and silky, and smelled delicious.  I couldn't stop petting her all night until bedtime.
> 
> I like the Ice on Ice too, but she sure does hate being sprayed. I've tried spraying it on my hands and rubbing it on her or just spraying the comb, but I'm afraid it's not enough. How damp does the coat need to be for brushing/combing?


If you are planning on keeping her coat long, you really need to get her used to being sprayed. Just rubbing it on the top layer with your hands doesn't accomplish much. If she will be in a puppy cut, it doesn't matter so much.

Just keep getting her used to the spray. Just put plain water in the sprayer, and spray it, first at a distance, as you give her treats. Get it closer and closer over time until she realizes it's really no big deal. It doesn't hurt, and it's not loud, so she should adjust to it without too much trouble.


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## Kimm (Mar 13, 2018)

krandall said:


> If you are planning on keeping her coat long, you really need to get her used to being sprayed. Just rubbing it on the top layer with your hands doesn't accomplish much. If she will be in a puppy cut, it doesn't matter so much.
> 
> Just keep getting her used to the spray. Just put plain water in the sprayer, and spray it, first at a distance, as you give her treats. Get it closer and closer over time until she realizes it's really no big deal. It doesn't hurt, and it's not loud, so she should adjust to it without too much trouble.


I'm hoping to keep her hair kind of in-between, not full length, but not a short puppy cut either. We will work on the spraying. I don't know why it freaks her out so much. Thanks for the tips on how to do it!


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Kimm said:


> I'm hoping to keep her hair kind of in-between, not full length, but not a short puppy cut either. We will work on the spraying. I don't know why it freaks her out so much. Thanks for the tips on how to do it!


There's no accounting for what they will object to. Pixel thinks you are dying if you sneeze, and comes RUSHING over to make sure you're OK. Poppy, (the female whose puppies I posted about the other day) RUNS if someone sneezes! I sneezed while she was delivering a puppy, and she looked at me like "How COULD you at a time like this!!!" LOL!

Just get her used to it slowly, with lots of patience and cookies, and she'll come around.


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

I don’t like the spray bottle that Ice on Ice came in. I actually transferred it to an empty spray bottle from waterless shampoo. It’s a trigger type spray bottle, and it’s sort of a cross between a mist and a directional spray, so it saturates a little better and there’s less overspray.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> I don't like the spray bottle that Ice on Ice came in. I actually transferred it to an empty spray bottle from waterless shampoo. It's a trigger type spray bottle, and it's sort of a cross between a mist and a directional spray, so it saturates a little better and there's less overspray.


I still use my original bottle... because it was free. LOL! But it's a back-up. The main bottle I use is one of these:

https://smile.amazon.com/Segbeauty-...-4&keywords=continuous+mist+spray+bottle&th=1


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## katscleancutdogs (May 18, 2016)

That’s like the one CC sells for it. I love it the most is fine and it’s easy on your hand 


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## EvaE1izabeth (Nov 14, 2017)

krandall said:


> I still use my original bottle... because it was free. LOL! But it's a back-up. The main bottle I use is one of these:
> 
> https://smile.amazon.com/Segbeauty-...-4&keywords=continuous+mist+spray+bottle&th=1


That is the fanciest spray bottle I have ever seen! My husband just bought an oil mister like that, I never would have even thought to look for that kind of a spray bottle. Can you control how much it saturates or is it more for misting?

I do like my free waterless spray bottle, it works surprisingly well, but I actually think I'd really like a continuous spray bottle for my own leave in conditioner!



katscleancutdogs said:


> That's like the one CC sells for it. I love it the most is fine and it's easy on your hand


I didn't even know they sold spray bottles. I looked before because Precious Drops comes in a trigger spray bottle, but not Ice. I finally just just found them on the CC website. I'm not sure I buy into the teal "double action" bottles, i'm getting a gimmicky vibe, but the CC version of the continuous spray is interesting.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

EvaE1izabeth said:


> That is the fanciest spray bottle I have ever seen! My husband just bought an oil mister like that, I never would have even thought to look for that kind of a spray bottle. Can you control how much it saturates or is it more for misting?
> 
> I do like my free waterless spray bottle, it works surprisingly well, but I actually think I'd really like a continuous spray bottle for my own leave in conditioner!
> 
> I didn't even know they sold spray bottles. I looked before because Precious Drops comes in a trigger spray bottle, but not Ice. I finally just just found them on the CC website. I'm not sure I buy into the teal "double action" bottles, i'm getting a gimmicky vibe, but the CC version of the continuous spray is interesting.


Yes, they are completely controllable. My hairdresser uses them and I use them for misting plants too. There are several similar options on Amazon.


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