# My Dog Won' Bite



## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

How many of us have said this? This story rang a bell for me. http://dogstardaily.com/blogs/hes-just-scaredbut-he-would-never-bite 
Two years ago at the beach I watched as one man with a Rottie approached another man with a Rottie. They didn't know each other.( Right in front of us. ) The two dogs seemed to be fine with each other as theiy stood there talking for about five minutes. Then this guy decides he's going to play a little with the other guy's dog. Right away the red flags went up ,and neither owner saw them. The dog that the guy was trying to "play" with showed at least four signs of fear with this character. And me being outspoken decided to say something. LOL . All I said was that " I don't think that dog likes what you're doing.". And the owner of the dog tried to reassure the other guy that his dog was "fine" with the other guy. They both looked at me like ,mind your own business type look. 
Well this guy kept fooling around with the other guys dog, and I turned to Gwen and said, "here's an accident waiting to happen". I had no sooner said this when the Rottie bit the guy right on the chin. He was bleeding like a stuck pig. Needless to say ,the owner of the dog that bit the guy started yelling at his dog. Long story short, neither one of them even looked at me as they parted their ways with the victim's beach towel soaked in blood. I tried not to laugh as I thought ,boy he's got at least an hour to the nearest hospital to get stitches.


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Yeah--I can just imagine that scene. So many people say "my dog won't bite" and maybe never has.....but a dog is a dog and there are so many factors that go into it. 

When my daughter certified Vinnie and took him to school with children for the reading program......the biggest surprise I had was not the children,but the adults! Teachers would walk up to him and grab his muzzle and lean into his face.....literally nose to nose. I stood there just shocked! Have you ever known an adult (who should know better) to do this? They had never interacted with him or seen him before and in a matter of seconds walked up quickly,grabbed his muzzle and leaned down for a kiss or nose nuzzle or something. It was wierd. I had went with my daughter and Vinnie the first week or so to meet the kids and watch Vinnie for any signs of stress etc. I called my daughter out on this and told her that was a big "NO". I don't think Vinnie cared,but I sure did and I wouldn't tolerate that. Thank goodness nothing happened......and the strange part was adults did that over and over and over again....despite my objections and my daughter's as well. I could just imagine......here we have this great dog who has started this reading program and if he growls or bites we have a sue job coming. Funny as it sounds----we had children who were very respectful and boundaries they abided by and adult teachers who broke all the rules. My daughter did a great job of watching Vinnie for signs and applying the rules for months. The reading program was a huge success and she even made a binder about how to start a canine reading program.


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## FancyNancy (Oct 7, 2009)

Julie and Dave - I read with so much interest your comments about this. What were the "signs" you were seeing Dave? And what "signs" were you looking for Julie? My dog is friendly to everyone and because he is little and so darn cute (we are talkin CUTE here), everyone comes up and wants to cuddle him. What should I be looking for?


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

One night, at the library, 2 new girls from the READ program ran into the room, squealed, and excitedly got into Chico's face. Before I could do much, he jumped at one of them, in her face, sort of saying, "back off". For a minute, my heart dropped and I thought he had bitten one of them, but he hadn't, he was just telling them off for their behavior.
I have always been very careful, but now I have a standard rule, one child at a time can greet him. The Goldendoodle who "works" with us at the library is super laid back and lets the kids do anything to her, but my guy is not like that and I have to be clear with the kids. Chico likes school-age kids, but not when the "attack" him.
The handler's (owner) first job, is to protect the dog.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Julie , you said "Have you ever known an adult (who should know better) to do this?" LOL , yeah all the time. I can't believe how people that even own a dog do this sort of thing. I run across it all the time. And the kids don't know any better. It's the parent's responsibility to teach them ,but very few do. I am forever trying to teach kids especially, how to greet a dog. And the small dog owners like ourselves probably see a lot more of this than with larger dog owners. People are much more likely to approach a small dog recklessly than a GSD or something. It should be taught in schools like my friend does. She started Doggone Safe with another person and they go around to schools educating students about dog safety. They have a world recognized program. It is scary how little people know and how they let their kids run up to dogs freely. I just had this happen last time camping . The owners stood there as their four year old started running up to Molly. Hard to blame the kids. Good for you, for getting involved with the reading program. Great stuff


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

FancyNancy said:


> Julie and Dave - I read with so much interest your comments about this. What were the "signs" you were seeing Dave? And what "signs" were you looking for Julie? My dog is friendly to everyone and because he is little and so darn cute (we are talkin CUTE here), everyone comes up and wants to cuddle him. What should I be looking for?


Hi Nancy, yeah , first off, cuddling or hugging with a stranger is a no no. A lot of dogs don't like close hugging ,some even with their owner. 
In this case the guy within twenty seconds of "playing" with this dog, was right in his face ,trying to give him somewhat of a hug. The dog immediately exhibited a couple of calming signals, ie. looking away , and lip licking. I could see whale eye ,which is the corner of the eye being white. But after he started a second round of "playing" , I could see the dog tense up stiff legged. He scratched himself and his eyes went hard. Mouth closed. And he now was just starting retract the corners of his mouth when this guy leaned in closer , and bango, right on the chin. This dog probably was previously reprimanded for growling in the past I figured. He skipped the typical warning signal of growling and went straight for the bite. That's why I tell everyone not to punish growling. Had he growled this dummy might have got the hint.

But if you want to read up on this stuff , check out Doggone Safe. on the web. and for a few bucks you can buy On Talking Terms with Dogs ,Calming signals by Turid Rugaas.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

luv3havs said:


> One night, at the library, 2 new girls from the READ program ran into the room, squealed, and excitedly got into Chico's face. Before I could do much, he jumped at one of them, in her face, sort of saying, "back off". For a minute, my heart dropped and I thought he had bitten one of them, but he hadn't, he was just telling them off for their behavior.
> I have always been very careful, but now I have a standard rule, one child at a time can greet him. The Goldendoodle who "works" with us at the library is super laid back and lets the kids do anything to her, but my guy is not like that and I have to be clear with the kids. Chico likes school-age kids, but not when the "attack" him.
> The handler's (owner) first job, is to protect the dog.


Right on Nan. But the owner of the Goldendoodle shouldn't let the kids go nuts. They then think they can do it with any dog. Good for you.


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## Flynn Gentry-Taylor (Jan 17, 2008)

Good information here, I am always amazed when a dog is labeled "aggressive" when a 3 year old mauls the dog and the dog bites...then usually the dog is put to sleep..
Usually young children don't listen to the parents about "leaving the dog alone" and later you hear "I value my children more than my dog" excuse when the put the dog down. Makes me angry. JMHO


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

I hear you there Flynn.


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## lfung5 (Jun 30, 2007)

Great article Dave. I am guilty as charge. Freddy is afraid of certain people I pick him up and let them pet him! i will stop and do what this article suggests. Thanks!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Linda, the only thing wrong with picking up Freddy and having them pet him, is that he might feel trapped. It's always best to let Freddy approach them ,on his own discretion. Freddie's still a great dog. I like Freddy.


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## dbeech (Jun 16, 2009)

Children are a big worry with my dogs. I don't have small children at home and my dogs are wary of little kids. Both my dogs will growl as warning if they are in an uncomfortable situation. Thanks to advice from Dave, I never discouraged growling. So far they have never growled at children, but I definitely sense their apprehension. Whenever I am out with the dogs, children are always drawn them. They want to pet or hug the dogs. I tell the kids that my dogs aren't used to little kids and ask the the kids just to let them smell their hands. About this time the parents tell me how gentle their kids are with dogs...blah, blah, blah. I reiterate that my dogs aren't really comfortable around small kids and they usually leave in a huff.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

yeah Deb, hear you there.


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## FancyNancy (Oct 7, 2009)

Thank you Dave for such an enlightening response. I am mightily impressed by your ability to observe and understand all the non-verbal signs that are the language of our dogs. I will definitely read the article and the website. Let me also say that I read almost everything you write for this forum and you are always so helpful. I'm a proud Davegabby stalker! It is very appreciated.


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

My daughter and I came up with "rules" that she enforced with the children in her reading program she started.

One child at a time,petting and most interaction came as a reward and AFTER they had read to Vinnie. They got to give him a piece of kibble and pet him etc.Vinnie initiated most of the interaction with the kids,by laying his head on their leg etc. My daughter only had 2 kids that Vinnie didn't really warm up too....and we don't know why,but he would decide how he layed on his rug (shared with a child and my daughter)and turn accordingly. It sounds kinda dumb...but these 2 particular kids he would give his back too. It was a very rewarding program that my daughter started at school and we hope that one day another will come along and continue on with the program. She wrote a manual with photos about how to start a canine assisted reading program.

I did not read the link Dave posted,so my apologizes if this is repetative---
I work at a vet clinic where I am in contact with strange dogs every time.You are taught to approach a dog from the side.(you turn sideways)...never straight on...and to avoid direct eye contact.I always let them smell my hand when I first arrive (this is through the bars on the door) and then after a bit..my job is to move them from the indoor kennel to the outdoor kennel to potty etc.This requires an approach and looping them with a lead. This is done "matter of factly"..as if you show nervous or fear they can sense that. Several times I had to walk away for a bit and come back,especially at first because of my nervousness. I think most of the dogs I come in contact with(that are scary) are not aggressive-but rather fear biters.So far-I have never been biten. I had a close call once from a dog that is scared of the leash and she snapped and I had a pit bull that absolutely hated the ground I walked on.....that one I refused to interact with.I decided I needed my thighs,more then a paycheck.She was nasty,nasty,nasty to everyone but 1 lady and we let her care for this dog.

For Vinnie--I watched his body language,lip licking etc. I really can not imagine him ever biting anyone,but I have never lost site of the fact that he is a dog and sometimes a dog bites.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Good for you Julie, sounds like a great program.


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## Flynn Gentry-Taylor (Jan 17, 2008)

I can honestly say there is so much good advice on this forum and that I am so glad I am able to be a member. Dave and Julie above, and so many others I don't have room for the names...this is a gold mine for anyone who cares about their dogs...thanks to everyone who contributes...ya'll are right good!!!


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