# Long time Havanese Owners, I need Help



## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

*We all have opinions but I need experience on this one.* My girls shed hair. Always have, year round. I know this is supposed to be a non shedding breed but, mine shed. Smarty is a cotton coat, she never sheds on you but she sheds within her under coat causing little cotton balls that become bunches of cotton balls to form a mat. Galen is a very thick, mostly straight silk coat (no real under coat) but she sheds more than Smarty with loose hair everywhere.

Their diet has always been the best foods. Because of itching we were on non grain foods, and then were raw with additives until about 3 or 4 months ago when we change to EVO. Now I have them on TheraCoat as an additive.

My dogs are bathed with IOD products. They are brushed almost daily and the brush is full of hair. The weather is not a factor as they do this winter and summer. If they were in puppy or clipped coats it would not be noticeable but both are in full Havanese coats.

My questions:
What do you feed?
How do you maintain what is suppose to be a non shedding coat?
What am I doing wrong if your dogs do not shed?

Thank you for your experienced answers&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;


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## Narwyn (Jan 24, 2010)

I tell people who haven't owned a "non shedding" breed that all dogs shed. Some just less than others. I have longer hair - a little bit past my shoulders - and when I vacuum the hair in the roller is about 50/50 red human hair and white Hav hair. LOL. 

The lack of under coat is probably your problem - not what what you are or aren't doing. Without that thicker, more textured undercoat to "catch" the hair, it's just sliding right out. The only thing you can really do (aside from things you have all ready tried) is brush often.

~K


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## CapotesMom (Apr 3, 2007)

Havanese shed.. they just don't shed like normal dogs do.. Capote sheds in his undercoat too to cause mats.. that's what they're supposed to do. That's why some Hav's you can cord their fur; because they mat so easily. 

If Galen doesn't have much of an undercoat there's probably no way for the fur to collect and 'not shed'..so that's why it's everywhere. 

I wouldn't worry about it.. I think you're doing a good job.


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## RikiDaisyDixie (Apr 15, 2008)

*Riki is the same...*

Riki has a cottony coat. He does the same you describe. He is soft around the face and the legs, but his back where he is silver is very cottony and also a lot comes out in the comb.

He eats the best of the best. Always has.

Daisy has a silkier coat and much, much less comes out in comb unless she has a mat. I think it is a condition of the cottony coat.


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## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

Rikidaisy said:


> Daisy has a silkier coat and much, much less comes out in comb unless she has a mat. I think it is a condition of the cottony coat.


I clean up more of Galen's coat than Smarty's.


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## RikiDaisyDixie (Apr 15, 2008)

*got me there Sandy...*

What is it with our sweet dogs and itching! Its summer again and both of mine are scratching. Riki more on his feet, and Daisy just all over. Last year I clipped her all the way down she was matting so much because of her saliva. And not a flea on either one of them!

We have the excuse of Southern California air...but I read that "white" dogs tend to have more allergies. And what can we do, my dogs eat raw food! Best supplements...and you are using one of the nicest shampoos.

And some dogs don't itch at all, white or not...and don't lose as much coat.

This is a wonderful and strange breed!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Hi Sandi, here is what I got from Sabine....

Fish oil's main benefits are that it supports the immune system and contributes greatly to skin and
coat health. It also has strong anti-inflammatory properties. Especially the omega 3 fatty acid
DHA is vital in brain development of puppies, and has been shown to affect trainability
My product of choice is "Seapet" (available at http://www.seapet.com/seastarrstore/ ), since it is
the highest quality product available in a bottled format that I've found so far. All their fish oils are
manufactured from wild-caught fish, molecularly distilled, cold-processed, completely tested and
surpass all standards for heavy metals, PCBs, dioxin and other toxins
Vitamin E is a powerful antioxidant, supports a healthy skin and coat, is important for the
formation of red blood cells and helps the body to utilize vitamin K. Also, wherever essential
Omega 3 fatty acids (e.g. from fish oil or flax seed) are added to the diet, the body's requirement
of vitamin E increases slightly, so we must compensate.
What to look for:
Please only use natural vitamin E supplements, as synthetic ones are by far not as effective.
Vitamin E from natural sources is labeled as "alpha tocopherol", "d-alpha tocopherol" or "mixed
tocopherols". DL-alpha tocopherol indicates a synthetic product.
Make sure the vitamin E supplement does not contain any other ingredients, especially not
vitamin A, since this could lead to an overdose of vitamin A. Capsules are mainly available in 400
and 1,000 IU dosages, 100, 200 and 600 IU are far less common but can be found. Which
product you choose depends on the daily amount you are supplementing, and whether your dog
refuses to take capsules. Liquid products are available, which are more convenient and easier to
dose for small dogs and puppies.


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

davetgabby said:


> Hi Sandi, here is what I got from Sabine....
> 
> Fish oil's main benefits are that it supports the immune system and contributes greatly to skin and
> coat health. It also has strong anti-inflammatory properties. Especially the omega 3 fatty acid
> ...


Bold mine. I tried the website several times but it looks like there is some problem as it doesn't load up. I saw Seapet 200 on Amazon. Is this the same product? 




I would like to try it and want to make sure I get the correct product that Sabine is recommending.

Thanks for sharing the info.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Yeah same thing. Yeah there is something wrong with their site. And if you decide to order it, get the smallest bottle. It lasts forever. Molly gets one quarter of a teaspoon daily.


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Keep in mind that the Seapet mentioned contains Vitamin E already ,so there is no need to add vit. E.


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## Kathie (Jul 31, 2008)

Sandi - Abby is three now and she has always shed, too. When I comb her I get a huge pile of hair but I only do it about once a week. Her hair is not that thick so it is pretty easy to care for. And I keep a lint roller for my black pants.....lol I never saw this much hair with my poodles.

Linda - I love your beautiful artichoke plant! At least I guess that's what it is - we don't have them in south GA!!


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

davetgabby said:


> Yeah same thing. Yeah there is something wrong with their site. And if you decide to order it, get the smallest bottle. It lasts forever. Molly gets one quarter of a teaspoon daily.


Thank you, Dave!


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## davetgabby (Dec 29, 2007)

Sandi , I asked Sabine about TheraCoat . Here is her response. 
TheraCoat I would not recommend, not enough information on what's really in it, and most soy-based products are made from genetically modified plants heavily sprayed with pesticides. I also do not trust ANY product that is advertised as a "miracle anything". The main ingredient seems to be lecithin though, which, if it is of good quality, can be very useful to help fat metabolism.


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

Sandi, I feel like I could have written what you did. Vinny has such a thick undercoat it matts terribly. It's not fair to him to have to get matts constantly combed out. This past month I have been using a finer tooth CC comb and after he is all combed out I use it to remove some of the undercoat. This is not a popular idea, I KNOW, but it sure makes life easier for Vinny and me.
Lulu has the cottony coat and I find very fine little hairs everywhere! But, the good thing is matts comb out easily. Just hair everywhere!
Luckily Gabby's coat doesn't matt much but they aren't easy to get out. She seems to shed very little.
Anyway, my shedless dogs leave hair everywhere. I just ordered the Fish Oil Dave recommended.
Good luck and when you find out the answer, let me know, lol.


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## juliav (Nov 21, 2006)

Add me to the list of the hair-hair everywhere club!!!! Bugsy's hair isn't perfuse by any means, nor is it too thin. He is mostly cottony with silkier spots and this shedless dog sheds quite a bit!!!! He doesn't leave hair on furniture much, but I do find it on my clothes, especially after brushing. I brush and comb him daily and quite a bit of hair comes out. As long as I brush/comb daily, any mats that appear are pretty easy to comb out. My daughter and I have long hair and my vacuum brush is 50-50 dark and white hairs. My poodles on the other hand do not shed, leave no hair on my clothes, furniture or on my vacuum brush. The only hair that comes out is when I brush them, but that doesn't get airborne for some reason like Bugsy's hair.


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

Narwyn said:


> I have longer hair - a little bit past my shoulders - and when I vacuum the hair in the roller is about 50/50 red human hair and white Hav hair. LOL.


Exactly - only my hair is blonde!

They're not "shedding" in the typical dog way, they're just casting off dead hairs that are no longer necessary, just like humans do. Since they have SO MUCH hair, it's inevitable that they will lose some on a daily basis. I have extremely long hair - down to the middle of my back - and I have to vacuum my bathroom every 3-5 days of blow drying and brushing my hair. Same thing for the pups. Roscoe loses more hair than Stella...but then again, his hair is waaay longer.

So, Sandi, I guess my answer is that I don't think you're doing anything wrong. Even the absolute healthiest coat/hair is going to lose individual hairs no matter what! I would be more concerned about BREAKAGE - if you are finding half-length hairs, that's reason to feel that the coat is likely not as healthy as it could be.


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## Scooter's Family (May 23, 2008)

If I only brush Murphy once a week I get a huge ball of hair from him. He's cottony underneath and very soft and silky on top and mats so easily. Scooter is curly and we rarely find his little fur balls around. Gracie is very silky and her hair is everywhere. Even in the laundry which I hate! When I brush her I do get hair in the brush but I can see it floating around and my eyes are irritated when I'm finished.

I used to have them on fish oil and just didn't reorder when it ran out. Honestly, I hate the smell because it gets into the hair on their faces. Guess I'll have to reorder.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Sandi- I don't think any amount of supplements will keep a dog from shedding. I would only be concerned if you saw a lot more suddenly than you did before. 

But then again, I would also take into consideration how much activity they are doing. My Dora has one of the easiest amazing coats, but she still sheds and sometimes the hair is 8" plus long. But from doing agility and wearing a cooling coat one weekend, I was brushing her out and she had way more hair and matting then she has ever had. I know you are now doing this weekly in a field and the humidity, moisture, etc kills the coat. Dash has a lot of breakage and a few months ago I had a full blood panel done and everything was in line. The advice I got, just keep letting him be a dog 

P.S. I still believe they lose more hair in the spring just like their shedding cousins!

P.P.S. My only dog on supplements is Isabelle. She is getting older (even if she doesn't act like it) and her patella.


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## Evye's Mom (Dec 16, 2008)

mellowbo said:


> Sandi, I feel like I could have written what you did. Good luck and when you find out the answer, let me know, lol.


Another hair-hair everywhere member. I posted a very similar situation a while ago when I was finding so much of Evye's hair everywhere. I panicked and made a vet appointment with full panel of blood work. All normal. She doesn't have a heavy, thick undercoat either where Bentley does and he sheds so little in comparison. I think it's a little less than it was in the winter but I still get a good sized clump of hair when I comb.

I have been using SeaPet Omega 3 with E for about a year now.


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## Poornima (Jun 29, 2007)

I belong to the same "hair everywhere" club. Benji's silky hair is often airborne while Lizzie has cottony coat and her hair is only where her coat rubs frequently mostly carpeted stairs going up and down and on my clothes!


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## good buddy (Feb 20, 2007)

SMARTY said:


> *My dogs are bathed with IOD products. They are brushed almost daily and the brush is full of hair. The weather is not a factor as they do this winter and summer. If they were in puppy or clipped coats it would not be noticeable but both are in full Havanese coats.
> 
> My questions:
> What do you feed?
> ...


*

I feed Wellness Core, one of the top rated foods. I used IOD or Pure Paws and Coat Handlers. I comb every other day and bathe about every 10 days. My NON-shedding dogs leave lots of hair everywhere! (also, one of my hairless dogs has hair!) My vacuum gets a workout at least twice a week and in between I can run a shedding picker-upper type brush on the couch, the floor or a dog bed and find, you guessed it, hair! Give a couple days between vacuuming and I can find a hair tumbleweed hiding behind the kitchen table gently drifting towards the refridgerator. (Be sure you vacuum those out once in awhile)

When I comb through the coat I use three combs from very wide tooth down to medium and then fine trying to capture all the loose hairs. Most days I get a mousie sized hairball--not a "feeder" mouse, but a nice well fed fattie mouse lol! The main differnce is the hair doesn't weave into the carpet or couch like a typical shedding breed. They lose it exactly the same as I do and I find lots on mine on the bathroom floor after blowdrying and combing all week too. I don't think you're going to stop that hair from dropping with supplements.

Remember when they were puppies and barely shed at all? I love when I see the new members with little pups chiming in how their dogs don't shed. Yeah, mine didn't either WHEN THEY WERE PUPPIES. *


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

What a shame they can't keep those carefree puppy coats their entire lives, eh? 

Tori's shedding is pretty much confined to the brush/comb. I don't find much, if any, on things. Even after holding her for a long time I won't find but maybe a few hairs on my clothes. She has always gotten a fish oil supplement and for about the last year, has been eating commercial raw food. She has a very soft, fine, profuse cottony coat.


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## Kathy (Nov 9, 2006)

Havanese have hair not fur. Like humans with hair, they will shed hair just as we do, but typically it is removed by brushing, just like ours. I don't get any more hair around the house then I do from us humans living in the house. When one has gone from Golden Retrievers to Havanese, you sure notice a HUGE difference. <grin>


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## Pattie (Jun 25, 2008)

Right on, Kathy. In my case, going from Newfoundland hair shedding to Havanese is an IMMENSE difference. LOL.


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## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

Thank you, everyone. It is nice to know I’m not alone. I tried the fish oil for a while and Galen rubbed her face so much to get the smell and oil off I didn’t reorder.

So my food is fine, my shampoo is fine, more brushing, fish oil, no wear and tear on the coats seems to be the only answers. 

At our Rescue event the other day I almost choked when people ask if they were a non shedding breed. I guess we should define no shedding.


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

Poornima said:


> I belong to the same "hair everywhere" club. Benji's silky hair is often airborne while Lizzie has cottony coat and her hair is only where her coat rubs frequently mostly carpeted stairs going up and down and on my clothes!


This is EXACTLY Roscoe and Stella! He is silky and his hair is evvvvverywhere. Stella is cottony and I haven't really noticed her losing much hair yet, but she is still a baby...


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

I just wanted to chime in about the fish oil that may or may not help shedding but sure is good for them. I couldn't stand the smell of the sea pet or any other liquid either. So I give them a capsule daily wrapped in a tiny drop of cheese (they are supposed to get it twice a day but I forget the 2nd dose most of the time) and they swallow it whole. but you could use turkey or ground beef. Because there is not enough vit E in the capsules I also give them a 200E capsule daily. The Brand Sabine recommended in capsule form was Now Foods Ultra Omega.

http://www.luckyvitamin.com/p-4518-now-foods-ultra-omega-3-500-epa-250-dha-180-softgels

Oh and mine shed too...Cash mostly into his coat or on my white chair. Jas' hair is everywhere just like mine.


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

My boys have been on fish oil every day for a year - I haven't noticed a difference in the amount of hair I vacuum up every week 

When we only had Lincoln, I noticed less hair on the floor, couches, rugs. After we got Scout, there would be huge tufts here and there because when they would RLH and play bitey-face and wrestle together, their hair would just go flying....all over everything!


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

Jane said:


> My boys have been on fish oil every day for a year - I haven't noticed a difference in the amount of hair I vacuum up every week
> 
> When we only had Lincoln, I noticed less hair on the floor, couches, rugs. *After we got Scout, there would be huge tufts here and there because when they would RLH and play bitey-face and wrestle together, their hair would just go flying....all over everything! *



Same here just replace the names with Oliver and Comet


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## brugmansia (Dec 6, 2007)

My two shed also, especially in the spring I find. I'll have hair on me after combing them out. I find myself trying to comb/brush them out everyday now. Luna has a silky coat and Dickson's is much more thicker and curlier, and mats a lot more. He could be a candidate for cording, but I won't be going that route. I'll use three different size combs, especially on Dickson. And they eat very high quality foods - TOTW & NV raw.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

SMARTY said:


> Thank you, everyone. It is nice to know I'm not alone. I tried the fish oil for a while and Galen rubbed her face so much to get the smell and oil off I didn't reorder.
> 
> So my food is fine, my shampoo is fine, more brushing, fish oil, no wear and tear on the coats seems to be the only answers.
> 
> At our Rescue event the other day I almost choked when people ask if they were a non shedding breed. I guess we should define no shedding.


I call them "low shed, low allergy" dogs when I'm talking about them to other people. Nothing with hair doesn't shed SOME hair, and there's no dog that SOMEONE isn't allergic to... their just much better than most when it comes to allergies.


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## krandall (Jun 11, 2009)

Missy said:


> Oh and mine shed too...Cash mostly into his coat or on my white chair. Jas' hair is everywhere just like mine.


Most of Kodi's hair gets caught in the brush and comb, but he's very careful that when he DOES get hair on me, that the white hair goes on the black pants, and the black hair goes on the white blouse.

... YOU could have avoided that problem with two dark ones or two light ones.:laugh:


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

krandall said:


> Most of Kodi's hair gets caught in the brush and comb, but he's very careful that when he DOES get hair on me, that the white hair goes on the black pants, and the black hair goes on the white blouse.
> 
> ... YOU could have avoided that problem with two dark ones or two light ones.:laugh:


and yet I am lusting for silver or red brindle as my third just to make sure hav fur is apparent on every piece of furniture and clothing I own.


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

mintchip said:


> [/B]
> Same here just replace the names with Oliver and Comet


And Roscoe and Stella...:Cry:


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## mellowbo (Aug 12, 2007)

I HAV to admit that when I look back on my Lab and cat days, Havs don't shed, lol.


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## mintchip (Apr 19, 2007)

mellowbo said:


> I HAV to admit that when I look back on my Lab and cat days, Havs don't shed, lol.


:rockon: and our malamute


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## galaxie (Dec 1, 2009)

mintchip said:


> :rockon: and our malamute


And my dobermans!


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