# Diets For Liver Problems



## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

Needless to say Gizmo has been through quite a bit for the past 2 weeks.Yesterday we found that 1 of his liver enzymes are up and kidney level low (neither one very bad) but still a concern. He's on a motility drug & antibiotic along with Iams vet canned food. The ingredients are terrible, I was hoping there may be better food for liver problems. Gizmo has been on Wellness, I am concerned about this food. I would appreciate any input. Thanks, Teresa H,


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## DanielBMe (Nov 25, 2007)

You might want to look into Dr Pitcairns Complete Guide to Natural Health Care for Dogs. In it he has recipes for various ailments. Also do a search on the internet. You'll find lots of good stuff.


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

I am sorry to hear about Gizmo. You say you are concerned about the Wellness food, may I ask why? Do you think the Wellness caused his enzymes to be off?


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

No I'm not afraid of Wellness..it"s the Iams vet diet the dr has him on that I don't like.


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

Ahhh- I understand!
I have a girl that has a compromised liver. Not sure exactly what she has, but it's not a liver shunt, and not MVD. But she did have a liver biopsy last year and she def has 'something' off with her liver- and she does have a daughter with MVD. 
I feed Wellness Super 5 Mix and she is doing fantastic. She is a good weight, her coat is soft and she has lots of energy etc. She doesn't get any suppliments or vitamins. By looking at her, you would never know something is wrong. 
Did you vet say what they suspect is wrong with his liver? Did he have a Bile Acid test done?


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

right now blood work he's on a motility drug & antibiotic. If no improvement the bile acid test is next. Right now I'm following rules as I am very worried.


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

I'm going to have to check wellness website to see canned food. I want to check labels..not sure if it's higher or lower protein for liver.


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

Do you give him any treats, chews, jerky etc?
I know first hand how worried you must be. Hang in there until you can get more answers. 
What symptoms is/was he having that you suspected something was wrong?


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

on 3/16 got his distemper & rabies, 3/20 hurt his leg, 3/27 vomiting in am from hunger & was increasingly not himself, not playing with toys etc. on 3/27 went to Dr put him on chicken & rice. Talked to same vet (who is new to practice) on 3/30 no vomiting still not himself..called yesterday he had vomited and just wasn't any better. I was able to see the regular Dr. and blood work was taken. I was disappointed when blood work wasn't done last friday. Never had a problem before this.


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

He got both the distemper and rabies at the same time? Oh no!
Sounds like maybe he is having a reaction to the shots, which is why it's usually recommended that they do only one shot at a time, with rabies done seperately a couple weeks later. Sometimes doing more than one shot at a time is just too much for their little bodies, and they have reactions- also I believe shots can make their bloodwork a little wacky-
I hope you get answers soon!


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Hi Teresa, welcome to the forum. Your Gizmo is so darn cute! How old is he? His age may be a factor into what his problems are. Young pups with high liver enzymes may have shunts or other things. When the dog is a bit older, it all depends.

What is a "motility drug"? I think you should take him off the Iams food as soon as you can. It's crap. No offense..... The vet should know better, but unfortunately most vets know squat about nutrition.  I work in a health food store for cats and dogs and I've been researching nutrition for 1.5 yrs. My Ricky had a liver 'attack' back then (Nov. 07), his ALT was 1200 and he had to stay in the ER overnight. It's a very long story (here: http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=2411&highlight=Hugs+Ricky ) , but it was a trying year with many tests, food changes, supplements, expenses and surgery to finally end up with him not being a "liver dog", but rather having a toxic reaction to vaccines.

Basically, you will have to limit meat protein until you know just what Gizmo's problem is - if he has one. It could very well be that his "norm" liver enzyme result is a little on the higher end. It is not uncommon. Since he may have a kidney issue as well, you will have to find out more to be certain that his diet is appropriate. Look for healthy ingdts., low-ish protein, but not too many grains. Adding dairy products to his diet is a good way to help the liver - things like low-fat cottage cheese, plain yogurt, ricotta ... - as is using chicken and/or white fish.* Fromm's* has a *Whitefish and Potato* formula that I trust would help Gizmo.

Check here for analysis and reviews of pretty much every dog food on the market: www.dogfoodanalysis.com

Try to avoid buying any food from Hill's, Pedigree, Medi-cal, the stuff most vets sell. It is horrible! Just check them out at the above-mentioned site and you will see for yourself. It's an eye-opener!

Did Gizmo get his shots recently? Or flea/heartworm medication? Could he have eaten something outdoors or in the home that is toxic?

There are some of us that have been through all this, so don't hesitate to give us more info and ask questions. We will try to help as best we can, Teresa. 

EDITED ------- Just read your above post, so never mind about my questions.


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

Hi Teresa- I'm sorry to hear about Gizmo's problems. My first Hav had confirmed (by biopsy) liver disease. Her liver enzymes were up and her BUN was very low (a kidney test) which is common in liver ailments. A high BUN can indicate kidney trouble, a low BUN can indicate liver problems. The diet for a confirmed liver disease dog is low protein, but quality protein. If you are looking for a kibble, you might look at Solid Gold Holistique Blendz which has a lower protein content. High protein puts a strain on the liver. Also, the supplements of sam-e and milk thistle (combined in a supplement called Denamarin) is useful and can be bought online. 

You mentioned Gizmo having recent vaccinations. At least one dog on the Forum (I'm thinking Marj's Ricky?) began having altered liver enzymes after vaccinations. There are several on the Forum that have had their dog's liver enzymes come down after a change in diet and/or supplementation. There are so many different possibilities for altered liver enzymes, so don't panic. Get a bile acid test on Gizmo for further liver information. Once you get all his test results, let us know and those of us on the Forum who have had dogs with liver issues will help you in any way we can. :hug:


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## Cheryl (Mar 17, 2007)

Theresa--Gizmo is adorable. I love the name. My last dog was named Gizmo and will always hold a special place in my heart.

I think the elevated liver enzyme and illness may be from both vaccines given at the smae time. Was the liver enzyme his ALT? How high? Was his BUN or Creatinine (kidney test) off? What was it?

Roxie is the daughter of the dog that Katie mentioned who has liver disease. As she is running around the house right this minute you would never know that anything is wrong with her. The goal with a liver disease diet is low protein and no red meat. Roxie eats Solid Gold Holistique kibble which is 18% protein. Wellness Super 5 Mix Just for seniors has comparable chicken protein. If you look at canned food, it looks like it has less protein, but it is so much water that it is usually higher in percentage. (I can't remember the conversion at this time.)

There are a couple yahoo groups that are very helpful. Here is one.

http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/canineliver-d/

How old is Gizmo? Roxie never had any sick symptoms but was very small so I checked her Bile Acids prior to her being spayed. They were elevated. At 2 years old her liver enzymes have never been elevated, but she has been on this diet since 10/07.

PM me with any questions you have or post here. I'll check back later.


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

Gizmo is 15 months I am familiar with food as my girlfriend owns a Pet Bakery & carries quality dog food. Many years ago I read the API what's really in dog food in the newsletter that was delivered to her store. I will be calling her soon. I really wanted to get some ideas first though. I knew better than to give both shots, but was talked into it as he did not have any problems last year. The doctor will never attribute any problems he's having to shots as I have mentioned it in all 3 visits. It was the bun that was low & 1 of the liver tests that was high. She was not going to worry until I talk to her tomorrow to see if there is improvement. Gizmo weighs 18.6 lbs..not really little . He had no problems prior to the shots. It was a week after the shots that everything started to go down hill. So I'm looking for lower protein..my problem is that Gizmo is very picky eater like many other forum members. I tried the wee bit Solid Gold & he didn't like it. I was just trying to get ideas. The vet & I have very different views regarding food. She likes Iams..I hate it. Please keep the suggestions coming..I really appreciate it.


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

Any one familiar with canine cavier for special needs?


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

One of the other people can confirm this, but I think that salmon is one of the other proteins you are supposed to avoid for dogs with liver problems. It seems like white fish is okay, but not salmon.


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

Havtahava said:


> One of the other people can confirm this, but I think that salmon is one of the other proteins you are supposed to avoid for dogs with liver problems. It seems like white fish is okay, but not salmon.


Yes, I was told white fish such as cod was good. I don't think salmon would be a good protein source for a dog with liver issues. The Solid Gold Holistique is white fish, although I think there is a small amount of salmon oil for the skin added. You just want a lower protein food, so always check the protein percentage on kibble. You don't have to go to extremes, but just keep the protein content on the lower side until you know what is going on. You can also do a homemade diet, which is what I had to resort to at one point. I often used low fat cottage cheese and eggs for good protein sources. Home cooking for a dog isn't easy (you need supplements added), but its an option. Also, feed several small meals instead of 1 or 2 large ones to lessen the stress on the liver. You can get some great diet tips at the yahoo canine liver disease group http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/canineliver-d/ once you join.


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

That's one of the things we're working on. 4 smaller meals all day although Gizmo has always been a grazer. The information out there is overwhelming. Gizmo is still pretty lethargic today with minimal improvement although there is some. My anxiety level is extremely high & I don't know if his treatment is the right one especially the food he's on. I'm very careful on what is fed to my dog.


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Because I strongly suspect (as do you) that Gizmo's situation is caused by his vaccinations, would you consider getting advice from a homeopathic vet? I have never seen one, but I do know quite a few people that have. I'm wondering if maybe you could find some type of detox remedy for Gizmo. ... ?

I would take him off the Iams asap. Many sugg'ns have already been made about alternative, healthier diets so hopefully, you can find some near you.


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Cheryl mentioned calculating the amount of protein in canned food. You can find out how to calculate it here: http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+1661&aid=662

I will bump a thread on protein in dog food so if anyone wants to read through that, they can.


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## NewHavMom (Mar 20, 2008)

Thanks for all info..I love the thread Marj..gizmo is slowly on the mend. Yes I do believe it's shots,,vet will never admit it though. I did talk to her this morning & I explained to her I didn't like the food & she was open to change & the only thing she wanted me to do is keep to around 22% protein. I did go see my friend who owns a pet food store & is very holistic. At the present I'm trying Canine Caviar special needs with wellness canned mixed in..so far he's not eating so the backup plan is the wellness mixed with sojo. We'll see..I may have to go to canned. I really not into raw diet.. I have another friend though that owns her own store as well and her dog is total raw and she does have a holistic vet..she even was able to persuade the dept health to accept titers as she is extremely against over vaccinating pets. Right now I'm trying to find a happy medium. It is imperative gizmo eats frequent meals. If I can't get him to eat it will be back to the drawing board. Also once gizmo has completed the antibiotic, I will be detoxing with Azmira detox.


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## Lynn (Jan 2, 2007)

Teresa,
How is Gizmo doing now? Did you find something for him to eat that he likes?


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## Lunastar (Feb 9, 2009)

I just saw this thread. Poor Gizmo, I hope he is on the mend.


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## swirl (May 17, 2010)

*liver problems*

What are some medical symptoms that can come with liver problems?


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Oh boy, that's a loaded question, 's'! lol Here are some links with more info for starters to see if that helps:

http://www.dogpro.com/canine-liver-disease.html

http://www.vetinfo.com/dliver.html

These are some liver threads in the forum that you might find interesting:

http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=4179&highlight=liver

http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=2411&highlight=liver

http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=3440&highlight=liver

http://havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=6363&highlight=liver

If you have any questions, you can add posts to any of these or other threads if you like. I'll bet many members haven't seen them and they could be quite helpful.


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## JetersMom (Sep 21, 2008)

MopTop Havanese said:


> Ahhh- I understand!
> I have a girl that has a compromised liver. Not sure exactly what she has, but it's not a liver shunt, and not MVD. But she did have a liver biopsy last year and she def has 'something' off with her liver- and she does have a daughter with MVD.
> I feed Wellness Super 5 Mix and she is doing fantastic. She is a good weight, her coat is soft and she has lots of energy etc. She doesn't get any suppliments or vitamins. By looking at her, you would never know something is wrong.
> Did you vet say what they suspect is wrong with his liver? Did he have a Bile Acid test done?


I'm going thru this with my dog now. I'm bringing her to Cornell University this Thursday. We know it's something to do with her liver but it's not shunts. Might be MVD. I was searching for lower protein dog foods without salmon ( low purine and low protein) and it looks like Wellness SUper5 mix Chicken meets all the criteria. Right now I'm making her a homemade recipe I got off the internet but hope I can switch to this. Glad to see it's working for your dog. I may be onto something with the Wellness. THanks


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## JetersMom (Sep 21, 2008)

Well it tooks months to diagnose my dog. Started having issues when she was 18 months old. ALways had difficulty with housebreaking. SOme vomiting but then started with these tremors ( seizures) - never lost consciousness but it would go on for an hour or more. Poor thing had toxins building up in her blood and I never knew it. I researched it ( after $500 my vet still had no diagnosis) and decided he needed to do a bile acid test. Her levels were off. Then a sonogram but no liver shunts so I'm off to Cornell Vet Hospital for a consultation. There is a vet there that specializes in liver problems in small dogs- DR. Sharon Center. I'm hoping she has answers. In the meantime I lowered the protein in her diet and she stopped with the seizures.


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