# Changes and Respect



## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

It seems lately there have been a few members who have not been around as much. And we ALL miss them. It got me to thinking... and this place has grown really fast. We are so lucky that we have so many great CARING members!

I want us ALL to think about how we treat each other. At times we will disagree, its going to happen! And its impossible to have rules that say "Be Nice".. how hard is it to police that? Lets try to have respect for each other.

Before you type something that you KNOW might be in a controversial thread.. or even maybe taken the wrong way.. read it back to yourself out loud. Ask yourself... if you are another person who may not agree with you, how does your remark sound? It's hard to always know someones tone and intent through the written posts. However as posters, we can try and have RESPECT for our readers. That doesn't mean putting smiley faces after saying Go Screw yourself makes it ok... hahahaha

I am not even going to beat around the bush in this example.. Lets take the thread with Kristi and the puppy she didn't keep. I did not know the history of the situation as I had been MIA. I did not even READ ALL the posts. I only went there because I was told it was getting heated. I made a post that was really meant to be a general statement and not taking up for anyone, or directing it to anyone in particular. I should have read more and asked more questions and had others feelings in mind.. before making a general statement. Bad Melissa! However, that ONE thread... with a BRAND NEW MEMBER.. drove so many apart. So we have to ask ourselves why? Why were we so adamant to take this new persons side and turn our back on own forum members who we have grown to know and love? I think SO MANY things could have been handled different.

That NEW MEMBER even asked to be deleted. Instead of begging this new member to stay, we should have had our thoughts and concern with others who have been here for a LONG time and done many things to help needy dogs and needy people! They were only worried about this dog and wanted to help.. as they have in the past! Some of those people really felt insulted and looking back I KNOW WHY!

*So lets show some love for our members who are here, both new and long term and tell them we appreciate them!! Just the ones that are taking a break.. look how much they have done for others since they have been there. I'm not going to name them, don't want to risk embarrassing someone or forgetting someone. Rescuing dogs, donations, quilts... there are so many things...

*So before you post something.. just ask yourself... could someone be offended by this? It doesn't mean walk on egg shells and only post some happy lovey dovey stuff. Just use COMMON SENSE! We all appreciate everyones expert advice.. just remember not to belittle others when your giving it.

AND I hope this thread doesnt offend anyone. ound: Because that defeats the entire point! I have been guilty before.. and if I ever truely have a beef.. Im going to pm you before Ill post something. I usually am just in a hurry if I ever sound short. But I will be better.

OK PEEPS.... SHOW SOME LOVE!


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Melissa,

You have my vote and I love you for that post. Thank you . . . on behalf of all those people I care so much about.


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## Guest (Apr 8, 2008)

Melissa..

Well said!!

I for one would like to extend my apologies, if, at anytime I have said anything to offend or hurt anyones feelings. I would also like to encourage each and every person who has dropped off due to disagreements or hurt feelings to come back and give us one more chance...:hail:


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

Perfectly posted Melissa! Thank you so much saying that!
You expressed how I, and I'm guessing, so many others have been feeling recently.
No one expects us to always agree on everything, how boring would that be? But treating each other with respect isn't asking too much, for this particular group IMHO.

I'm so proud of this forum. How it's grown since I joined! I think there were 25members or so when I first joined. This is the one place where Havanese lovers of any kind can come for information, community and puppy fixes! I'm glad to leave the drama to the "other" lists!
Thanks for all your hard work Melissa (and Dawna!)

Beverly


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## Tom King (Aug 2, 2006)

I participate on several different forums.

A golf forum has these stats:
Our members have made a total of *934,505* posts
We have *47,670* registered members
Most users ever online was *10,078* on *Apr 5 2008, 04:01 PM*

*A horse forum has these stats:*
Threads: 23,462, Posts: 891,955, Members: 35,676

You might see why I hate elists so much with that many people to converse with.

Both of those forums have had everything dumped and started over several times.

This one is the tamest by far. You wouldn't believe some of the flame wars on the big forums. It's always good to reread what you are about to post before you hit the button and ask yourself if you have made an assumption and jumped to conclusion.


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## HayCarambaMama (Dec 8, 2007)

OK, so I'm a newbie and I stayed far away from those particular heated threads, but I did finally read through them. By far, the long-er term members bent over backwards with their compliments and support of the new member and her situation. They were ONLY concerned for the puppy and what might become of it. Why the new member chose to be insulted, I cannot understand. Maybe I feel that way because I have seen some REAL flame-war threads on other boards.
I have to throw a vote of confidence behind you for this thread, Melissa. Very, very well said. I must say, I came out of lurking because I'd seen such warmth on this board. Even though I'm new, I miss those older members. They were awesome.
Please forgive me if I've overstepped myself.


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## DAJsMom (Oct 27, 2006)

I couldn't agree more, Melissa. Another suggestion is to be willing to apologize or "kiss and make up" so to speak, when disagreements or misunderstandings happen. I can't remember which thread, but a couple of forum members were willing to do this within the last week, and a small misunderstanding was kept small because of it.


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## ivyagogo (Sep 11, 2007)

I'm so happy you posted this Melissa and I too, want our old friends back.

Tom - interesting statistics. Here are the two other boards I belong to:

Duran Duran Message Board
Total Members: 1,631
Total Topics: 12,446
Total Posts: 160,112 *Us Duranies like to talk!*
Most users online was 211

Mugglenet (Harry Potter Message Board)
Total Members: 84,050
Total Topics: 12,585
Total Posts: 1,091,475 *Harry Potter fans REALLY like to talk!*
Most users online was 3,566


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## Leeann (Feb 28, 2007)

Melissa what a wonderful wonderful thread! I dont think it could have been said any better.


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

I agree with Melissa!!! I may have disagreements but I will keep them to myself becasue I do not like conflict at all.....just ask some of my friends. They think I am crazy at times. I hope people come back..I love this place and all the post people have!!! Hugs to all!!!!


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## HayCarambaMama (Dec 8, 2007)

ivyagogo said:


> I'm so happy you posted this Melissa and I too, want our old friends back.
> 
> Tom - interesting statistics. Here are the two other boards I belong to:
> 
> ...


Duran Duran board?? No way!!! Please tell me whatever happened to Roger Taylor!!


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## Suuske747 (May 9, 2007)




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## Diana (Oct 23, 2007)

Melissa,


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Thank you Melissa.....well said and so true! eace:


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

I'm glad you addressed this Melissa. I do hope with some time the other members will come back.It would certainly be a shame to let a few people run off our long term forum members,with hearts of gold,knowledge to pass out freely,help and encouragement.

I think an apology/acknowledgement would go a long way in helping this situation,but it takes a swallow of pride first..and that can be difficult sometimes.

I hope the main players in that thread follow--

I'm going to take the first step--

To my friends from the forum who were insulted and hurt in that thread:
I'm very sorry I did not post and stand up for you at the time.Those of you who know me well(and maybe others)know I'm very outspoken and have not been afraid to post a different opinion or thoughts on any matter. I thought it nothing short of a miracle that day it erupted,I was gone......however when push came to shove and I was able to catch up,I tried to remain quiet for the best interest of the puppy. My deepest apologies for not taking a stand when I should of.....

:hug:I am truely sorry:hug:


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## ivyagogo (Sep 11, 2007)

Donna, Roger's been back with the band since the Astronaut album a few years ago. He had left the band after Live Aid in '85 and bought a farm. He stayed out of the limelight for many years. He just remarried about 3 years ago and his son from his prior marriage is HOT!

Yes, I know WAY too much about Duran Duran. John is my guy.


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Melissa, it would be so easy for you to just throw this forum out into the ether and let it just run. Thank you for not doing that and taking the time to author such a right-on note. Perfectly said. I love everyone here. And I really hope some of my favs who are taking a break come back.


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

Excellent post, Melissa! I couldn't agree with you more.

I, too, extend my apologies to anyone whom I may have hurt by either posting something I shouldn't have or by not standing by you and posting something I should have, whether it was in the "Kristy" thread or elsewhere.

I'm certainly hoping this is not "too little, too late". I am *so* missing my long time Forum friends. *Please come back!*


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## Sissygirl (Aug 8, 2007)

This is such a wonderful forum and a lot of caring people who love their havs like I do.
Sometimes things get heated but I hope we can remember that common love as pet owners. I really appreciate all the information, love and caring support I have received from all of you!!


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Well said, Melissa. I don't belong to any other forums yet since I don't think I'd have time to keep up!

My son learned in school a few "rules" about deciding whether or not to say something....kind of a personal "gab" filter:

1. Is it true?
2. Is it kind?
3. Is it necessary?

I thought those were good general guidelines just to take your own though process through. Of course, if everyone followed #3, it would be a _silent_ world out there, LOL!


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## Dawna (Aug 3, 2006)

ooooh I LIKE those guidelines Jane!


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## MopTop Havanese (Sep 25, 2006)

Jane~ Awesome guidelines...but I also think if more people followed #3 maybe there would be less conflict. I think alot of times people stick their noses into situations where it's not necessary for them to do so~


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## Doggie Nut (Oct 20, 2006)

Thanks Melissa for keeping all of us on the "straight & narrow" here on the forum! I agree whole heartedly! I never did agree with Ryan O'Neal who said the famous line in the 70's movie "Love Story"....."Love means never having to say you're sorry".....it is the opposite....that is what Love does! I missed out on "that" thread taking care of family but i am sure I have had "foot & mouth disease" on many other occasions, so for those times....I AM TRULY SORRY! PLEASE FORGIVE!


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

I should add my apologies as well as I was not informed enough to even make comments about the situation.....I had no idea some of my favs on the forum where being hurt....so BIG APOLOGIES and lets start over fresh!!!! :biggrin1: You guys are sorely missed....


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## Moko (Dec 11, 2007)

Judy A said:


> and lets start over fresh!!!! :biggrin1: You guys are sorely missed....


OMG! :jaw:

What if they're not lurking?
How will they know we miss them?


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Yall could pm them and tell them you miss them.  They will get it in Email! 

Thank you everyone for these nice words and positive feedback. I am so happy understands.


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Melissa, thank you so much for your eloquent post.

Rest assured those that are MIA now know of this thread.

I personally wasn't one of the ones 'thrown under the bus' on the infamous Kristy thread but I have been in contact with them. You are right, there are a couple people that deserve an apology from key people.

I have been taking a break because the ugliness and nastiness toward such loving, kind members shocked, disillusioned, and disheartened me enough to make me question whether I wanted to be a part of the forum. It certainly wasn't possible for me to go on as if nothing had happened.

This thread goes a long way to restoring good feelings. I'm not very good at expressing my heartfelt feelings in print and there's a lot left unsaid, and perhaps that is the way it should be. 

I will forever be grateful for my friends here who helped me so much when I first brought Tessa home, several going so far as to call me on the phone to encourage me. There is a lot of good will and wonderful people who are part of this community. So let's stand together and show some loyalty to each other in the future!


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## Lilysplash I (Jul 19, 2007)

Melissa, Very well said and what I personally noticed is how you stated it with humility. Humility is a necessary characteristic for good relationships but is most often the one missing. Your thread is an excellent example!

The only thing that caught me by surprise, although understandable under the circumstances, was your feeling the need to apologize if your thread offends anyone. GOOD GRIEF!!! if your post offends then we are all in trouble!:suspicious:

I think your advice to PM the person is good as well as using common sense & sensiitivity when replying. I would also add: *Do not be so quick to take offense or ascribe the worst motivations.* Give a person the benefit of the doubt unless found to be otherwise & try to see where they are coming from. I perceived that the ones under attack with Kristi were really concerned for the puppy.

I too don't want to feel like everyone is so sensitive that one needs to walk on eggshells and cover one's head over the inevitable incoming attack.:brick:

Anyway, for what it is worth these are just my honest thoughts.


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## gelbergirl (Jun 9, 2007)

Here are the stats for the Purse Forum:

Threads: 249,280
Posts: 5,764,004
Members: 113,908

Things can get pretty wild on that forum as well depending on the specific sub-forum.
My dad belongs to a gambling forum, that gets wild as well!

I enjoy it, especially the pics! And how well everyone takes care of their fur babies, the advice I've gotten in the past ain't bad either!


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Oh MY goodness.. Purse forum.. Duran Duran forum.. this is too much, I LOVE It, It calls for a new thread.

I want to keep this at the top.. its important for everyone to see. I really ENCOURAGE everyone to post their support here. Thank you so much, I love all the feedback.

Lilysplash.. thank you! Thats a huge compliment. I know I have been guilty of everything! haha. I have a short temper and in the past used to be a hot head. Now, through life experiences I have learned we are all human. If I didn't give people the benefit of the doubt, second chances, loyalty, or understanding, I wouldn't have ANY friends!!! We all screw up. If we hold each other to higher standards than we hold ourselves, we are going to be very lonely!

Here is my cheesy moment of the day... but think about it... look at the world around us.. do we really want to bicker with each other? We are all here for the same reason!


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Ok I have come back twice to watch the video. I am a HUGE Sheryl Crow fan. HUGE. She solves all problems. I have had girlfriends break up with her songs, make up.. you name it. One time my friend and her boyfriend broke up, we watched the Sheryl Crow DVD, threw down a couple of bottles of wine.. then made a plan to get even. HAHA.. They are now married with a child. She took her Sheryl Crow DVD to the hospital when her first daughter was born... she solves all problems with her lyrics! 

Is there a Sheryl Crow forum? haha.. combine that with the purse and car bomb forum.. I am in Heaven..


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Thank you for this thread, Melissa, and for your words of wisdom. I am grateful that you have this forum and that there are so many caring, wise, compassionate people on here. It was such a shame that things turned ugly in that particular thread and I agree that it was because everyone, really, had the puppy's interest at heart and were simply following their emotions and trying to help. 

I have written several of you, but I would also like to apologize here for arriving late on the scene and not reaching out to those that were hurt and felt attacked, until later on. I could see how both 'sides' had valid reasons and points and it isn't right that some of our members felt like they could no longer feel comfortable posting here anymore.  I hope you all don't feel that way for long and know that this place isn't the same without you and you are missed. (((hugs)))

Sometimes I reread my posts 3 and 4 times before I click 'reply' and of course I write waaaaaayyyyyyy too much !!! :biggrin1:

Melissa, you're a nut! lol Just read your last past. ound:


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Marj.. thank you for your post! I think we need Sheryl Crow to write a song apologizing and begging our members to come back. I bet she has one already, since she solves all problems! I will find it.


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

As we age, we realize just what you are saying, Melissa. I have tried to teach my kids to be more tolerant and that if they aren't, they'll end up very lonely!! I have a few really close friends.....there are things about each of them that drive me nuts! BUT, I've learned to accept them, warts and all, as they have me. If we didn't learn to overlook a few faults, then, like you said, we wouldn't have any friends. I think my daughter is beginning to "get it", but she's only 24. 
So, this is another of life's hard lessons......but an important one...TOLERANCE, FORGIVENESS, and UNDERSTANDING...bring it on, forum friends, it's time for a :grouphug:


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## Jane (Jun 2, 2007)

Judy A said:


> BUT, I've learned to accept them, warts and all, as they have me. If we didn't learn to overlook a few faults, then, like you said, we wouldn't have any friends. I think my daughter is beginning to "get it", but she's only 24.


I agree, Judy and Melissa! It took me 30 years to figure that one out!

Well, hugs all around! :grouphug:


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

I'm bumping this up,hoping that the *people involved in *that thread read it......and that *the people involved* in that thread have read what Melissa said,and that the *people involved in *that thread have the opportunity to apologize,or receive an apology.

eace:


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## Doggie Nut (Oct 20, 2006)

Thanks Melissa for the video! As you get older you realize life is too short to get offended & then stay offended! On forums like this where the majority of the members are FEMALE there is always the risk of some hormone overload taking place!:biggrin1: When I have days like that my hubby says " Oh I see Hormona is here today!" :croc: I've found on days like that if I compare my current "issues" with others problems in my world and the world around me they seem sooo piddley! Hey is that a word? Oh well, you get the picture! Here in Texas we have signs on the roadways that say "DRIVE FRIENDLY".....I say "POST FRIENDLY"!! Cheers to all you wonderful ladies (& gents!)


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## Guest (Apr 9, 2008)

Julie said:


> I'm bumping this up,hoping that the *people involved in *that thread read it......and that *the people involved* in that thread have read what Melissa said,and that the *people involved in *that thread have the opportunity to apologize,or receive an apology.
> 
> eace:


I am also hoping that everyone can just turn back and start over, as every single person who has left the forum over this issue will surly be missed,
leaving unmended regret...

Having been on both sides of the fence in my life, I know that "SAYING" I'm sorry for an offense can be equally as hard as "ACCEPTING" an appology when hurt.

Below is one of my favorite Bible verses...

I Corinthians 13:4-7

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.


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## Posh's Mom (Dec 20, 2007)

*Where Everybody knows Your Dog's Name...*



> Making your way in the world today takes everything you've got.
> Taking a break from all your worries, sure would help a lot.
> 
> Wouldn't you like to get away?
> ...


eace: Thanks Melissa for creating such a wonderful, highly addictive place for me to "get away."
eace: Thanks to special forum members that always go out of their way to make new people feel welcome (Kara, Amy, Kimberly, Diane, Jan, Beverly, Marj, Amanda, Ryan, Vicki, Leslie, Julie, Lina, Maryam, Leeann, Karen, Poornima, Geri, Kim, Cheryl,Missy, Lisa, Cindy, Jane, Jacklyn, Julia, Marie, Susan, Maureen, Shelly, Jeanne, Sandi, Judy, Jill the list goes on and on and I know I will forget someone...but honestly, you people are just stinking awesome!)
eace:To the members that were hurt by the "puppy" thread. It is much easier to say nasty things to people via internet. Being in the wedding biz, I've had a few potential clients say some really nasty things in an email, and then when I've called them they couldn't be jerks to my "face." I hope I haven't hurt anyone on this forum, because you have always brightened my day with compliments and truly caring and wonderful advice.
You have given me support and advice, which I need as a new Hav owner, and fulfilled a role I had anticipated my very reputable breeder would play-I think she's just really super busy...I hope.:behindsofa:
Love, love, love this place.
I just wish I were closer to you guys so we could have play dates whilst drinking car bombs! I bet you're all dying to come to Minneapolis?! :grouphug:


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

Diane~ That sums it up nicely :biggrin1:


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Bravo Julie!! I don't think there is a reason on this thread for people to apologize for everything they MAY have said at one time in their life that MIGHT have offended someone. Good heavens.

And I am going to take the liberty to speak for the group who left when I say this went far beyond having some feathers ruffled or taking offense at a perceived slight. 

Please don't trivialize what happened and do not think for one moment these women are sitting at home nursing a grudge, refusing to "forgive" a little "disagreement". Nothing could be further from the truth. 

Anyone who has read that thread surely must realize that it revealed a dark underbelly and a strange turn of events where long time members were viciously accused of having malicious intentions while a new member (who by the way made it our business by posting her threads) who was rude and divisive received unbelievable support and accolades.

Those who left aren't "mad", they are disillusioned at the direction the forum has taken. These are not petty, unforgiving women. As Melissa mentioned they are some of the most loving, kind, generous women I've ever had the privilege of knowing.

And I, for one, hope they come back here to a place where what happened is never tolerated again. It would be wonderful to see some support for them that took that direction.


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## Guest (Apr 9, 2008)

Jan,

I think everyone would agree that all of us are just trying to find the right words to mend this unfortunate turn of events and draw EVERYONE back together again..


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Ditto Diane.....


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

I am kind of disappointed more members have not taken the opportunity to post here and clear the air. Thanks to all the great people who have! Isn't it nice to have such an encouraging thread. 

I agree, Jan that it should not be trivialized. Maybe others who were involved with that thread will take the time to say they are sorry. But maybe not. I can assure you, both Dawna and I will be posting a lot more and make sure that "turn" was just temporary. 



Melissa


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Yes what Diane said... not trying to trivialize anyone or saying they are not being forgiving. I think other peoples tolerance, not just those missing members could have been improved in that thread.


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## Beamer (Jan 29, 2007)

So, whos buying the booze and the appz? 

*Melissa* - Have you ever thought about doing a Town Hall in live chat? Might be interesting! Alot of forums and other groups do that sort of thing monthly or quarterly. Just a though....

Ryan


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Melissa Miller said:


> I am kind of disappointed more members have not taken the opportunity to post here and clear the air. Thanks to all the great people who have! Isn't it nice to have such an encouraging thread.
> 
> I agree, Jan that it should not be trivialized. Maybe others who were involved with that thread will take the time to say they are sorry. But maybe not. I can assure you, both Dawna and I will be posting a lot more and make sure that "turn" was just temporary.
> 
> ...


:whoo: :whoo:

Ryan, LOL! If everyone comes back I will buy the booze :biggrin1:


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## Dawna (Aug 3, 2006)

I agree Diane.


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

OK, I have to put my 2cents in here since I am someone who "left". 
I pm'd Melissa with some of my thoughts and a thank you for this thread. I also want to thank everyone who has posted here. However, it is falling on deaf ears, and thank you Julie for noticing that.

JanB, thank you for your liberty taking. Your words were spot-on. But, I *was mad *and that's why I have been away for a little while. Mad, because people I consider friends were slammed - these wonderful, caring people that wanted to help a Havanese find the right home, and it was unjustified. The reason we all came to this forum was for the love of our dogs. We have helped each other get through some pretty rough times, had plenty of laughs (thanks to Ryan), don't forget the playdates, and what about our great day at Westminster! We can't let this incident ruin all we have done to help Havs - calendars, quilts and rescues.

I'm sure this won't be the last time this happens. But I hope we can all try to respect each other. We will not always agree, but that's OK. We can do it in a civil way, not by bashing people. If you have a bone to pick with someone, you can always do it privately with private messages. I hope my friends decide to come back, because we miss you.


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## Brady's mom (Dec 1, 2006)

I just wanted to say that I am glad to see a few of you back posting. You were sorely missed.

I am sorry I didn't get involved in that thread to voice my opinion one way or another. I saw it starting to turn ugly, and I stopped reading. I tend to avoid conflict. It is just who I am. I am glad to see some of you back and hope you stay around. I want you to know that I certainly think that you were treated unfairly and I am sorry I didn't say so at the time.


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Melissa, I couldn't agree more with your post.

For the record, I am not mad! or holding a grudge, or anything like that. I'd say there were a few days I felt a bit sad and disillusioned is probably good word (thanks, Jan!) But, I've moved past that and put everything into an objective perspective. I know we all aren't going to agree on everything all the time, but I think it is essential to give people basic respect on their opinions and/or beliefs here in this tiny corner of the internet, just like we would in the real world...and I think there are alot more than a 'few' wonderful people here at this forum with character and kind, loving hearts. And it did upset me to see some of those I adore.. hurt and broken.  But even before any of this 'puppy' thread erupted, we had lost a long time member, who helped me immensely when I first came here  So it just was a double whammy and I was trying to make sense of it all...so, yes.. I took a break to clear my head.

Some people love and LIVE for drama and controversy, and I'll just say those people are my polar opposites. I avoid it like the plague. When I get upset, I get physically ill (headaches, nausea, etc.) I wish I was tougher in that regard, but I'm not. And that's just the thing..

This is a "Happy place" for me. My dog is what brings me JOY in life, and love. She is the one that helps keep a smile on my face! And she's there to lick the makeup off my face when she feels I've done a poor job applying it. (like today!)lol....She IS my HAPPINESS, and this forum is a place for me to celebrate that with people that understand that....

Again, thanks for all the great emails (some of yall are too funny!) i am still catching up on responding.

Melissa and Dawna, Thanks.

And thanks to everyone for all the wonderful words of wisdom here!

:kiss:
Kara


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## Jacklyn Weeks (Dec 23, 2007)

YAY! I am soooooo happy to see you guys back! It is a truly wonderful thing when people can forgive and forget.


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## abuelashavanese (Mar 26, 2007)

MoJo was missin' Gucci !


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

I don't think I've forgotten the pain involved here and the people hurt, that's still very real. But I hope to see some wrongs made right. You can sort of analogize it as a wound, it hurts for a few days and then starts to heal, but there's still a scar. 

Time will tell.

K.

PS. Gucci thinks Mojo is hot.


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

Michele and Kara, :welcome: back! I was really missing you guys! :hug::kiss:


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

*It's Kumbaya Time*

Hey Gang, I've decided it's time to stop lurking and jump back in. So Ryan, honey, are you ordering those apps and cocktails yet? arty: The MIA people are returning to the Forum Fold, so let's all party and sing another chorus of Kumbaya! :grouphug Sorry, it's my Left Coast upbringing, I guess  )

Seriously, thanks to all of you who wrote me kind and supportive emails. I was really so taken by surprise by that. What a lovely group of caring, special people. I honestly had no idea you even knew who the heck I was! Is there a blushing smiley? Yep, there is!:redface:

Now I will shoot straight: I hope we can put the unfortunate Kristy thread behind us, and not permanently divide into two rival camps. Of course, certain people are going to have special things in common and gravitate toward others with whom they align and become more friendly, which is completely understandable; 
but I hope we can try to avoid the blind loyalty and reflexive rivalries of junior high cliques, which was so in evidence in that thread. I have already apologized in that thread, but want to do so again. I tend to be passionate and very very honest, but I will pause to reflect, or PM the person, before I hit the post button in the future. I'm hoping that others will come forward, too, who were involved, though so far the silence has been deafening. But, whatever, I am only responsible for myself.

I think we do have something VERY very special and unique here. So let's not blow it, and let's go forward and share more wonderful Forum times together. EVERYONE has something UNIQUE to contribute to this Forum. Everything from new litters and puppy pictures to enjoy, to the latest in Hav couture, to American Idol critiques, to helping each other through tough times with our beloved Havs---this Forum is just so much fun and so heartwarming. So let's value each one of our different contributions. I am SO grateful to Melissa for starting this forum and putting up with all of us, especially when we are quarreling or bitching. Melissa, you are going straight to heaven, girl. :angel: You're the best. xoxo amy r.


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

I haven't posted on here yet because I just wasn't sure what to say. I have talked to a lot of you over PMs and most of you know how I feel about that whole Kristy thread. I do have to say that I didn't AT ALL blame any of the old members for thinking what they did about the whole situation as I did think the same way. I actually am still not sure that there wasn't some weirdness about the whole thing and to tell you the truth, I'm not sorry that Kristy decided to leave the forum as I didn't wholly trust her. Go ahead and flame me for saying that, but it's what I truly believe. If I have to pick between some older members who I KNOW are caring people and lovely people who were just trying to help and someone I don't really know, well, that's a no-brainer to me. I'm sorry that so many of you felt like you had to take a break, but I'm very glad to see you back. If I didn't say something at the time it was because I was hoping the whole thing would just die already. I hope none of you were offended by my inaction on that thread, as I seriously was trying to get my own break from it (although not from the forum - I'm way too addicted, LOL).

I love all you guys and am so glad to see some of you (and I hope eventually ALL of you) back and posting! :hug:


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## Guest (Apr 9, 2008)

...but we've lost Kristy...And what about Kimberly?


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Kara, if you don't mind me asking, who was the first member that left before the puppy thread? You don't have to tell me if you don't want to, I'm just honestly curious.


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

It is SO GOOD to see some of these recent posts and posters and the sentiments expressed!! Michele, Kara, Amy, :hug: :kiss:

Lina, you won't get flamed from me. I totally agree with your assessment of the Kristy situation. And besides there won't be any more flaming, right? I think that is why some of those of us taking a break are ready to come back. :biggrin1:


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## Guest (Apr 9, 2008)

..so what you're saying, Lina is that your friendship is conditional. What if you're assumptions about Kristy are wrong. Why can't we just be all inclusive, put down all the matches and combustive materials and move on...that means to accept EVERYONE back into the fold and just agree to disagree and move on with kindness..


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Diane, that would be wonderful in a perfect world. However, it's not a perfect world and I'm not a perfect person. I hold grudges. I am a VERY understanding person. It's VERY hard to lose my trust or my good will, however, once it's lost, it's lost. Period. I'm sorry, but that's the way I am. Will I treat Kristy like crap if she comes back? No, I will be totally civil... I don't start fights. Do I want her to come back? Not at all. And if you want to judge me for that, go right ahead, but I can't say much else in that regard.


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

Well said ladies, and welcome back to you that were taking a breat! I certainly did miss each and every one of you!

Diane, I didn't get that impression from Lina's post at all....it seemed to me that she was saying that she will give her trust and support to anyone, but once that's taken advantage of, she won't offer it again. (fool me twice, shame on me) Lina, I apologize if I'm putting words in your mouth, and will edit this if I'm wrong.
Let's keep this thread positive, that's how I know I'm going to try and keep my posts.

Beverly


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Beverly, you've got it exactly right!


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

I promised myself that I would defend my forum friends, so....anyone who knows Lina and has followed her posts knows she is kind, supportive, and never rude nor is her friendship conditional. She did not deserve that accusation. 

The timing seems odd, now that we have some members returning.

Do we really have to stir the Kristy pot again? The thread stands for all to see and figure it out for ourselves.


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## Guest (Apr 9, 2008)

Lina,

I'm just asking, not judging. You were the one that said you hold grudges if someone lost your trust and respect... So I guess that means that someday I may accidently say something that could land me in the same boat..as I am surly a flawed person...


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

BeverlyA said:


> Let's keep this thread positive, that's how I know I'm going to try and keep my posts.
> 
> Beverly


Amen and well said!


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## Guest (Apr 9, 2008)

Yeah, Jan..let's all be civil in the threads and leave the flaming to PM's...

I'm outta here. You seasoned members can decide who to roast...


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## Moko (Dec 11, 2007)

Hey, Lina!

We've never met, but I gotta' tell you, Girl! I like your Posts! 

Actually, I haven't actually met ANY of The Forum peeps or Havs, but I do feel like I'd miss you guys if you went away! 

There was a piece on one of the talk shows recently , that "analyzed" people who Post on Threads; it suggested that anonymity makes for "safe" relationships...

Well, I am really looking forward to meeting so many of you, and can't wait for Laurie's playdate so the anonymity is ka-put! :biggrin1:

I've learned SO much from all of you! :whoo: Thanks MUCH!


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## Moko (Dec 11, 2007)

And...JAN B....

Can't WAIT for our playdate...(Can you believe my contractor-butt-crack is STILL ruling my life??!!)

And (oh, boy! Maybe I'll get smacked around for this...) *JUST TAKE IT [/B]FROM WHERE IT COMES! :suspicious:*


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

You have to be kidding me. This thread is not GOING there. We did lose, Kristy, she ASKED to be deleted and remember She DOESN'T have a havanese. We don't need her here and I will say it, I didn't like her attitude or trust her totally either. Why would I?

Kimberly is still here, she is choosing, I guess, not to post on this thread. 

This entire thread was about respecting our current members not wanting ones who ASKED to be deleted back. If you want to rehash that particular thread, go post in it. 

Melissa


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

I haven't posted here either because I also haven't been sure what to say - and really still don't. I carry a card in my wallet that is my mantra of how I will live my life - "Happy, healthy, wealthy, balanced, peaceful, active life - lived to the best of my ability with integrity, purpose, patience and understanding." (OK, I'll also admit to carrying a second card for they type of life I want me dogs to have. :redface While those words are my daily goal and I try to live them consciously I don't always succeed - especially the patience part that frequently leads directly into the understanding piece. 

I know that I may speak words in the heat of an argument that I regret later, and that I have spoken words who's meaning is misunderstood. If that has occurred on this forum, I apologize. 

Melissa, kudo's to you for starting this thread. Stepping up to try and resolve hurt feelings is not easy. And kudo's for all who have taken the risk of exposing themselves and are willing to put aside any pain/anger experienced and continue on - isn't that what relationships (in person or in this type format) are all about? I believe that holding on to anger takes way more energy than it's worth (take it from someone who's immediate family hasn't spoken to me in 10+ years!)

In the scope of life's difficulties I hope we can find our way back to having patience with each other, accepting differences in beliefs/opinions and living happily in the moment. 

I'd say this is another situation where our dogs can be our best teachers - they rarely hold a grudge and are always ready to greet you, with a wagging tail and kisses upon your return - no matter what went on before.

I'd say drinks and hors d'oeuvres are definitely in order - have dog seats, will travel!!!

My two cents, for what it's worth....

Jill


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

It's worth a lot, Jill.....that's why it's called a forum..a medium of open discussion or expression of ideas....and I pray we can all come together once again to do just that!


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Well I think this thread had good intentions but now people are leaving again!   

Don't make me post another Sheryl Crow video.. I will do it!!!.


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## Leeann (Feb 28, 2007)

Lina I had to go look up your birthday to see if you are a Taurus and yup you are LOL It is very very hard to anger a Taurean but when you do they do not forget, we are mostly very even tempered so this does not happen very often.

I have always said I am not the best with my words when writing, but I am not afraid to admit that I suck and at least try. I really hope I have never offended anyone and if I did I am sorry. If I ever do write something and someone is not sure how to take it please let me know or just send over a dope slap and I will try and fix it. It is very hard for me to express my feelings in words, this is the first and only forum I am on. I love it so much that I try to be involved even if I cant truly express myself very well. Now Melissa if we could just get spell check maybe I could do a little better LOL


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Well,isn't that the way? I leave and the action starts! I'm always a day late and a dollar short!ound:

That is a shame Diane that you were upset,but I have to agree with others that said you should really read the threads.....both of them to get a perspective and decide for yourself if you feel she was being truthful,honest and forthright. We all embraced her Diane,as hard as it was,and still she turned and bit the very hands trying to help her. Times change and people change,so one day if she comes back that's fine,but if she stays away,it brings a breath of fresh air,at least for the time being.That's the nicest way I know how to say it.


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

Melissa, if you post another Sheryl Crow video, I am leaving! :doh:


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Michele, here is a video for you!


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

This is for everybody from DAWNA.... 
Im going to keep posting videos until everyone loves each other.


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

UNCLE, UNCLE. :yieldlease no more videos! I promise to be good, anything you want!


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Jillound:ound:ound:


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

ound:ound:ound:ound:
Now that's the forum I know and love.


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## Doggie Nut (Oct 20, 2006)

oooh Honey, let the good times roll!:whoo:


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

I love Aretha 

I ALSO love love love Sheryl Crowe! I've been pouring over my CD's trying to find just the right one of her songs for our forum theme song! 

Beverly


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## Sissygirl (Aug 8, 2007)

Glad to see all my forum friends posting. I miss the good times!


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Melissa-----
Does this mean I can't whip out my fish?:fish:
I SO..OOO LOVE whipping out my fish! ound:


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Hmmmm, Julie, I didn't know you were that kind of gal.....:redface:


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Beverly, I am so glad you love Sheryl Crow too! She is awesome. 

OK I guess I deserved a fish whoopin!  
Good times ARE back if Julie is beating me with the fish. Oh that sounded bad!


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

You know Melissa----
it's pretty hard to fish smack someone and "play nice" ound:

Judy--I don't think I am "that kind of gal".....ound: There's just something about that smilie I just love........:suspicious:


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## MaddiesMom (Apr 1, 2007)

I just read this thread from start to finish. I never realized that Michele, Amy, and Jan were gone! :Cry: I've had some stuff going on, and haven't kept up to date as I've should. I purposely didn't read the puppy thread, as it seemed too heated and I had nothing to offer. But I am *SO* glad that you guys are back! Don't *ever* leave us again! Welcome back!!


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Thanks Maureen, I enjoy your posts too! 

Leeann, yup, I'm a Taurus to the T. LOL. I'm not much of a believer in Zodiac signs, but I always fit the Taurus personality completely. Makes you wonder, huh? 

Melissa, you crack me up with those videos! But I think you forgot one...


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

:hug: Love that Lina! :hug:


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

HOLY SCHMOKES....I just left for book club and look what happened! 

:drama: 

So glad to see a return to levity though. Melissa and Lina, love the videos!


eace:


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Boy, this thread has been going up and down, left and right, and all around, but I think the main feeling here is one of respect, positive thinking, forgiveness and tolerance. I miss many of the people who left for a bit, but I feel it is up to them to decide if and when they feel comfortable enough to post here again. I hope they do. I see some of you are back which is really nice to see!  ((hugs))

I was flamed over a stupid misunderstanding in a very large Fibro support group many years ago and it hurt like hell. The one great thing that came of it, though, is that I found out who my true friends were and they are still my friends to this day, 7 years later.  We've visited, called, wrote and of course emailed each other over the years and are very close. It is totally o.k. to get along with some members more than others. It's only normal. But there does have to be respect and humility and caring for a group to function well. We are that group! 

As one of the Yakking Queens here, I say "Let's yak, people, and leave the bickering to others!" :whoo: I love a good debate and love to question and be questioned, but there are constructive ways to do that.

Melissa, I have yet to see the videos you've posted because it's always late and everyone's in bed when I get to read this thread! But please...... hold off on adding any more, will ya? You're scaring people off!!! :brick:


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

You guys and your videos crack me up. LOL And Amy, Kumbaya time? LOL. you are taking back to my days as a Girl Scout.

Lina, you definately have Taurus traits! I'm an Earth Sign too (Cap) and some of my bestest friends are Taurus. I have a friend real BIG into astrology, and he did an 'chart' for me, based on the time/place I was born and...WOW. I could not believe how accurate it was. Even to some MAJOR life events that aren't common to most people.

Kara


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## ivyagogo (Sep 11, 2007)

Kara, I'm so glad to see you back and I love the new picture of Gucci.


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

Lina, your video could be added to Kumbaya! ound:

Melissa, I loved your Motown video. That's one of my hubby's favorite karaoke songs.


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## Leeann (Feb 28, 2007)

Julie I may need a fish slap also, I love watching music videos

Melissa thumbs up to Cheryl
Oh and the Aretha one, Love it.

I think we need a full range of music here so I will add a little Buckcherry.


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## ivyagogo (Sep 11, 2007)

Okay fine. It doesn't necessarily chime into the theme of the thread, but I like it!


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

You guys crack me up. I dont listen to music much but love all your choices. They are all very fitting.

Lina - I got your back!!!

Melissa, Jan & Julie - YOU ROCK!!! 

Thanks for the smiles I am getting reading this thread!!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Ok-- 




Love you guys!!!


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Laurie IS in the HOUSE! :kiss:

Thanks Ivy! The Pampered Princess looks so stuck up in that picture. lol

Kara


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## trueblue (Jan 22, 2008)

Did anyone ever come up with a plan for drinks??

I'm just glad to see the old members (and I'm NOT referring to your age...lol) back!


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Laurie!!! :whoo:

I guess I will soon have to make good on the promise to buy the drinks, eh??

Love the new videos too - the Bonnie Raitt one was PERFECT!

And add a shout out to a couple more people.....

Kara, no, she looks like a young lady instead of a puppy - so beautiful!


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

Here's my contribution


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## irnfit (Nov 21, 2006)

Too bad it's not working - it was really cute. I'll have to try again.


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Michele, I am sitting her crying like a baby at my desk!!! That is my favorite of all time!!!

It worked for me!!


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Michele, it worked for me too - loved it, such precious pictures and of course the sentiment is perfect.

I have to say I love the direction this thread took with the music videos


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## Leeann (Feb 28, 2007)

Got me too Michele. I love everyone's choices, I may just have to make a cd with all of these.


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Michele,

That was *so* cute! Awww!


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## suzyfrtz (Nov 12, 2007)

I have been reading this thread for a couple days, wondering if I should put my two cents in, but since I got myself involved with Kristy in a limited way, here goes.... 
Kristy got us all involved by telling us the sad story of Puppy and even posting photos of her, so that it tore at our heartstrings. I was ready to drive to Wisconsin to get Puppy! Yes, Kristy got us all involved by her own choice, yet did not kept us posted on what was going on. I suppose she felt she had no obligation to do so, but yet, she had drawn us all into the story and made us care. In all fairness to the forum, the right thing to do would have been to tell us that she had to buy Puppy and that she was now seeking a good home for her by advertising, to recoup some of her expenses. Since no one except later, Kimberly, had the skinny on the story, people made assumptions. Thus the brouhaha began, all on behalf of a little Havanese. I do think Kristy was stressed out to the max with her family and pets. I made a couple posts that were sympathetic to her, because I remembered my own stress and shortcomings as a young, overworked Mom. I certainly didn't mean by my posts to take sides!

This is a forum where everyone is invited to talk about their wonderful little furbabies. It is easy to take electronic communication out of context. This IS a cyberspace forum, after all. 

I'm glad to see sweet Gucci and Biscuit again, along with the other sweet Havs. I am terribly distressed that Diane Murph. is upset. There are a few exceptions, but we only know each other by our electronic postings!!! We even make up our names...I am Suzanne, not really Suzy in everyday life...

My sweet Hav Cazzie is the reason I'm here. I have learned and laughed. Cazzie is the reason I'm staying here. There have been a couple posts that insulted me (not going into that) but I ignored them. The stress isn't worth it! There is stress enough in my real world.

I am going say bye for this morning, I've got to feed Cazzie, and myself, and go shopping. In the real world.

I love you all! I love you Murph! Come back!

Suzy AKA Suzanne, normally called Sue


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

Ok I am with Leeann on not doing a good job at getting what is in my head to screen. I hope I did not offend anyone and I have have please except my apology. I do not like conflict at all....it makes me sick to my stomach. I remeber as a kid I would hide in the closet when my parents would have a argruement. I do not have much of a back bone either. I am glad to see you all back. Kara I love Gucci's new picture. I hope we all can continie to enjoy this forum like we all do. I hope all this makes sense. I am going to go and my waffles I am hungry after reading all the post!!! Smile everyone it increases your face value Hugs to you all!!!!!


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

I'm glad you posted Suzy!:hug:

I think you summed up the whole ordeal with Kristy in a nutshell!


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

See I am not good at all I forgot some key words in that post...and if I have please except my apology.....and I forgot to put I am going to EAT my waffles....this is why i do not post alot of thoughts..i think faster than I type!!!! Sorry all!!!


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## SMARTY (Apr 19, 2007)

Michelle, your video gets my vote, but I enjoyed all of them.

I am a Leo, very blunt, say what I have to say and then go about my business. If I ever offended anyone on this forum I am truly sorry. That would never be my intention. I did not get into the first Kristi thread, because I feel if you have to ask if you should or should not do something, you already know the answer and just want someone to give you a reason to do it. I read the entire 2nd thread, enough said about that.

I am hooked on this Forum, check in almost daily to see what is happening and get my daily laugh. If I have an opinion, can give support or have knowledge of the situation I post but the forum has gotten so large I do not have the time to post to all of the threads. 

Sending big hugs to everyone, August is getting closer and I am looking forward to meeting many of you in Virginia.


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## Leslie (Feb 28, 2007)

Ditto, Julie.

Suzy AKA Suzanne, normally called Sue ~ You summed it up nicely.

I am with you on this, too:_ "I am terribly distressed that Diane Murph. is upset. ... I love you all! I love you Murph! Come back!"
_


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

I can't wait to meet you all this august as well....little worried about airline tickets though!!!!!


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

Murph I hope you come back....I love your post and your green little guy!!!! hugs to all!!!!


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## dboudreau (Jan 12, 2007)

I am reminded of a saying I heard somewhere.

"The more I learn about people, the more I love my dogs"


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Oh, Debbie, I love that! Thanks for making me smile before I even had my coffee.


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

SMARTY said:


> Michelle, your video gets my vote, but I enjoyed all of them.
> 
> I am a Leo, very blunt, say what I have to say and then go about my business. If I ever offended anyone on this forum I am truly sorry. That would never be my intention. I did not get into the first Kristi thread, because I feel if you have to ask if you should or should not do something, you already know the answer and just want someone to give you a reason to do it. I read the entire 2nd thread, enough said about that.
> 
> ...


Sandi,

I'm a Leo too so I guess the attributes can be ascribed to me. Nobody ever has to wonder what I mean because I say exactly what I mean. I leave mystery and intrigue to Pisces (and I only say that because I dated a Pisces for a very long time and mystery was definitely part of the equation). Even though I am open, honest and sometimes blunt, I will not post a message I think will hurt someone else unless really pushed, and even then I'll think twice. I got some very good advice from my mother-in-law many years ago. She said "always think before you say anything, because once you utter the words you don't own them anymore and you can never take them back." Those few pearls of wisdom have served me very well all of my adult life.

As I've said before, I've always been amazed by this place and the lack of enmity that is so often found in other places. I've learned a lot here. I've made what I believe to be "friends," even though I haven't yet met most of them and I've cried with you about your own problems, and the illnesses faced by our four legged friends. I treasure this forum and would hate to see it turn into those other places.


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## casperkeep (May 16, 2007)

I remebered a sermon once from a long time ago....the analogy was with toothepaste. Once you squirt it out and you can not put it back in...just like our words we may say to someone we can not take them back!!!


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## Missy (Nov 6, 2006)

Sue, (if I may call you that?) I think you said it perfectly. I am really glad people are coming back. Diane, please don't go.

Kara, Gucci looks like a lovely young lady in your avatar. The home cooking is obviously doing her well. 

I don't always word things right either-- so I would ask that if I ever say anything to tick anyone off-- please pm me. I rarely intend to. So if I do please point it out to me so I can learn from it.


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## Me&2Girls (May 11, 2007)

*Bubbly- Colbie Caillat*

There is just something perfect about this song for this thread. The video isn't anything to watch but the lyrics...well...they just make me smile. So stay for a while, wherever you go, always know you make me smile.







Okay?


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

I want to apologize, as well, for anything I may have said to hurt anyone on this forum. I think I can be a bit shallow about all of this as I don't always "catch" what is being said or what people may read between the lines. Anyway....I'm a Leo too....and it seems I'm in some pretty good company!
I love all the video's and am SO glad to see some of you coming back......I hope the rest will too.


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## Guest (Apr 10, 2008)

Lina said:


> Diane, that would be wonderful in a perfect world. However, it's not a perfect world and I'm not a perfect person. I hold grudges. I am a VERY understanding person. It's VERY hard to lose my trust or my good will, however, once it's lost, it's lost. Period. I'm sorry, but that's the way I am. Will I treat Kristy like crap if she comes back? No, I will be totally civil... I don't start fights. Do I want her to come back? Not at all. And if you want to judge me for that, go right ahead, but I can't say much else in that regard.


Lina,

I want to apologize if my question came across as accusing. Your comment took me aback, and I was only wanting (asking, not accusing) to know what you meant.

I am opting to discontinue my participation on this forum, as I am a bit weary of people wanting to set me staright via the avenue of PM's.

I hold no grudes or ill feelings towards anyone and whole heartidly wish everyone the best...


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

I have stayed away from this thread but think I should post too as I know even this thread is making people feel indifferent. Sorry some of you felt you were being beat up and some feel left out, attacked, etc. I am saying this to everyone- including Kristy, some chosing to not post on this thread, those leaving because of this thread, and some coming back because of it. I think I have the attitude to try to always see the good in people and not jump to conclusions about anyone. So while I didn't stick up for anyone, it is because I didn't have enough information to truly judge. I also think of this as a happy place to go to and hope old and new forum members get treated with the same respect as well. I also was a bit hurt with so many people being involved in the thread, when HRI is at a big need for foster homes so I truly hope those who have room in their hearts and homes get involved.

Welcome back and I hope the rest of you stay put!
Amanda


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## Leeann (Feb 28, 2007)

Did anyone catch "The Last Lecture" on ABC last night? I didn't even know it was going to be on and bummed I missed it.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/LastLecture

I did watch this lecture a few months ago and it is amazing, if you have a spare hour I would highly recommend watching it.


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Amanda,

Just want to respond to a small part of your post. You've brought up fostering a number of times before and suggested that we get involved in that. For myself, I don't think I could because temperamentally I'm not geared to falling in love with anything and then relinquishing it. I've always rescued animals who then spent the rest of their lives with me, but fostering . . . I have to leave that to the people who are better suited. They have a special gift.


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

ama0722 said:


> I have stayed away from this thread but think I should post too as I know even this thread is making people feel indifferent.
> 
> *
> Really? Indifferent? That's kinda sad........*<-----Julie's words
> ...


I'm just talking for myself---but you can not even FIND a havanese in Iowa at any shelter,let alone foster one.....instead I've chosen other means to help----such as the forum quilt,purchasing forum calendars,and offering up a home when it was needed.


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## ama0722 (Nov 28, 2006)

Fostering a dog is a lot of hardwork and it isn't for everyone- I am not doing it right now. It is just something I thought that maybe a lot of the very passionate people would want to be involved in and I know that thread did encourage one of them to sign up 

Amanda


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## RCKNROB (Nov 27, 2007)

I was not in on the drama, but I want to be invited to the drinking and food.

I agree with Melissa, we need to respect others and be respected. If there is drama going on, we will not accomplish what the forum is really for. It is about how happy our Havs make us and how funny and beautiful they are.

I look forward to meeting you all at the National.

xxoo
Robin


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

pjewel said:


> Amanda,
> 
> Just want to respond to a small part of your post. You've brought up fostering a number of times before and suggested that we get involved in that. For myself, I don't think I could because temperamentally I'm not geared to falling in love with anything and then relinquishing it. I've always rescued animals who then spent the rest of their lives with me, but fostering . . . I have to leave that to the people who are better suited. They have a special gift.


I agree with this, and I also am the same way. Plus, if I brought a troubled animal in who tore up the house or was not as laid back, my other half would not wanting me to have ANY dogs. SO its easier to give with time and money sometimes.

But I agree.. if people can do it, GO for it!


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## Doggie Nut (Oct 20, 2006)

Michelle....You win the VIDEO PRIZE! Thanks, I loved it!!:whoo:


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Diane, thanks for clearing that up. I did think your post was accusatory and I'm glad you came to tell me otherwise. I have NO problems with someone stepping back and realizing they may have hurt someone and trying to apologize for it. If this had happened with Kristy, I probably would not feel the way I do now. That is what I meant by losing my trust and respect. You coming back to clear up a misunderstanding is very commendable. I really appreciate that. And I'm sorry too if my post was harsh.


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## Lina (Apr 26, 2007)

Amanda, I wanted to add that I am going to try and volunteer for HRI (not as a foster home - I just don't have the space nor the time). I probably will have to wait until after the wedding as my life is too hectic right now, so I currently prefer to give monetary support rather than time, but eventually I hope to be at a place where I can put in the time and perhaps even eventually (maybe years down the road) foster a dog.


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## Gracie's Mom (Sep 7, 2007)

My life has its ups and downs with craziness. I have had a lot on my plate, and I honestly just found this thread today. . . that is why I have not posted. I apologize if anything I posted offended anyone as I was supporting Kristy throughout this. Though it may have not come out in my posts - I DID understand where the others were coming from. I believe everyone who posted had and STILL have a good heart. I believe everyone wanted the best for "puppy". Anyway, no need to rehash it all, but I agree written format is not always the best medium for understanding the heart of people. I know everyone that posted on that thread has a good heart. Please forgive me if I wrote something to offend people. I tend to speak my opinions and don't mean to hurt feelings, but it is definitely a characteristic of a Taurus and that is what I am as well. I appreciate EVERYONE here - it doesn't matter if we agree or disagree - I believe most of us have the best interests here. And I love what this place is - thank you, Melissa!


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## Lo01 (Jul 22, 2007)

Thumperlove said:


> Melissa, I couldn't agree more with your post.
> 
> For the record, I am not mad! or holding a grudge, or anything like that. I'd say there were a few days I felt a bit sad and disillusioned is probably good word (thanks, Jan!) But, I've moved past that and put everything into an objective perspective. I know we all aren't going to agree on everything all the time, but I think it is essential to give people basic respect on their opinions and/or beliefs here in this tiny corner of the internet, just like we would in the real world...and I think there are alot more than a 'few' wonderful people here at this forum with character and kind, loving hearts. And it did upset me to see some of those I adore.. hurt and broken.  But even before any of this 'puppy' thread erupted, we had lost a long time member, who helped me immensely when I first came here  So it just was a double whammy and I was trying to make sense of it all...so, yes.. I took a break to clear my head.
> 
> ...


Kara very well said. Although I don't post much, I do miss all of the regulars including you, Amy, Michele, et. al. 

It cannot be emphasized enough...thank you so very much Melissa and Dawna for providing us this wonderful medium through which we can share our love and joy for our Havs.

All the best,
*'Lo*


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## marjrc (Jan 13, 2007)

Hey Laurie, I missed you! That avatar of yours always makes me smile. I've told you before and will say it again, this place wouldn't be the same without you.


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## Jan D (Mar 13, 2007)

marjrc said:


> Hey Laurie, I missed you! That avatar of yours always makes me smile. I've told you before and will say it again, this place wouldn't be the same without you.


DITTO


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## havaluv (Oct 15, 2007)

I only found the Kristy thread very late, after it had already gone on a while so I didn't post there as I felt I didn't know the whole story. I guess, I've held off posting here because I haven't felt I had anything to add.

What I would like to say is I have been involved in other communities and it seems like there is always something happening at some point that tears the group apart and ends up hurting people. This forum is the one place I have felt safe posting again after some bad experiences on other forums. 

I have been impressed at the cohesiveness and caring in this group. I've never seen anything like it anywhere...and I'm a computer geek. I met my husband on the internet, I run my business on the internet...I'm on all the time so I've seen a lot of forums. Yes, there has been a major bump in the road and many were hurt. 

I think Kara is right when she says those wounds heal, but sometimes a scar remains. The older I get, the more scars I have. I think we learn from them, unfortunately, we also probably hold ourselves back because they are constant reminders of how delicate we can be...like kids discovering gravity, they don't jump with quite as much abandon once they've fallen a time or two......but still.....they jump. And experience the joy of a moment of flight. 

This forum has the most amazing souls on it. You all have brought such joy into my world. I hope everyone can eventually make their way back here and take the chance to share again. 

People who love dogs are a tough lot. We have to be. We say goodbye to our furbabies much too soon, but we find the strength to love again. I think that says a lot about the courage of our members. 

:grouphug:


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## Melissa Miller (Aug 2, 2006)

Shelly, that was a GREAT post, thank you!!!!


And when I said I was disappointed more members did not post in this thread, I was referring more to those who were heavily involved in that thread/situation. Not everyone here. Should have been more clear.. don't want anyone feeling bad.


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Shelly, beautifully said!


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## BeverlyA (Oct 29, 2006)

Shelly, what a lovely post! Thank you so much for taking the time to write that and share with us all.

Beverly


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## Thumper (Feb 18, 2007)

Shelly, that is exactly what I was trying to say! Good heavens, of course I've made mistakes, but I take them and learn from them and I don't forget them, because they are life's lessons. 

Karen, you do not owe me an apology. You are as sweet as can be! I know it was a restore peace effort, and I do understand that direction it took. It is just human nature, sociology 101, that happens in 'groups' alot. I wasn't directly insulted like a few were, but as a group with malicious intent? No way. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Believe me, If I had a crystal ball and knew that all that would've happened, I would've thought twice about even checking to see if the owners had Puppy for sale yet, there were lots of PM's and emails floating around here and 3 or 4 people that had their hopes WAY high to adopt her and were checking their emails waiting to hear back, etc. I knew that was going on, even though the other thread was quiet for awhile, there was lots of curiousity and concern from those that offered a 'home'. 

I took a class at A&M called "Logic and Reasoning", and that's basically coming to conclusions based on the facts you have. We do it all the time, deductive reasoning. 1+1=2. We could not, obviously, come up "3" because we didn't have but the facts in black in white.

Kara


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## Judy A (Jan 13, 2007)

Shelley you are very good with words.....thank you. Well said.


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## pjewel (Apr 11, 2007)

Shelly,

That was so beautifully said, and so true. Thanks for putting it out there.


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## luv3havs (Jul 27, 2007)

Shelley and Kara,
Great posts.
Melissa, regarding your disappointment about apologies for healing purposes, I've followed the entire thread and when I saw the apologies, I did expect to see another one or two that have not yet been made.

But I'm glad that people have returned.
This is a great forum and I've learned so much.


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

Leeann said:


> Did anyone catch "The Last Lecture" on ABC last night? I didn't even know it was going to be on and bummed I missed it.
> 
> http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/LastLecture
> 
> I did watch this lecture a few months ago and it is amazing, if you have a spare hour I would highly recommend watching it.


Leann -

I'm glad you mentioned this here. I saw most of the show and have been thinking a lot about it since - especially as it relates to the hurt, anger, disappointment, etc. that has been expressed here and on other recent threads. For those that don't know about "The Last Lecture", it's a book that just came out this week by Randy Pausch, a Carnegie Mellon professor dying of pancreatic cancer. He's married with 3 young children whose time left in this life is very limited. He has an amazing attitude about life and living and has been sharing his beliefs through lectures. I've been wondering, if we each found out we were going to die tomorrow, would all that has been said here really be so important?

and Shelly - Wonderful sentiment, beautifully expressed!


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## Jill in Mich (Feb 24, 2008)

Now that I put that last post out there I'm concerned that people may be offended. I considered just keeping these thoughts to myself - and perhaps, as one of the lessons we've been discussing, if I had any doubts I should have. The last post was not directed at anyone. While what has happened here has been difficult, it's also offered many good lessons that I've been thinking about personally. What do I say that others may interpret differently than I meant? How often have I taken offense when none was meant? We all hear/interpret things based on our own life history. No one may know the difficulties I'm going through but doesn't that mean I also don't know what others may be dealing with? And if I knew, might I feel differently about them? Most importantly, I don't know how long my life will be, so, even if I live to be 100 (God forbid!), wouldn't my life be so much better if I lived like today was my last day?

So please, don't take offense, my last post was directed at myself, and only posted to share ideas, not give opinions.


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## Julie (Feb 8, 2007)

Jill,
Don't worry.....I think we need to just be ourselves. :hug:

If we are all so paranoid about what we say,or how we word it,no one will post.


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## Laurief (Nov 7, 2006)

Jill, I have seen the lecture and he is an amazing man!!! I dont find it offensive at all to remind us that there are worse things than just hurt feelings. You are absolutely right, after my nephews horrendous scare with cancer last year, I look at each thing, and compare it to that. My life is easy, compared to many!!! I know we can all come together again, in time! 

Thanks to all for your support!!
Laurie


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## RCKNROB (Nov 27, 2007)

HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THE SONG BY JOHN MYER "SAY" sorry, my cap lock is on. He is a great singer and the words to this song are great. If you get a chance since I don't know how to upload videos or music, pull it up and listen to it. Also STOP THIS TRAIN is a great song to hear. If anyone can explain to me in short message how to upload music I would appreciate it.


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## Amy R. (Jul 1, 2007)

Shelly, I'm just catching up on this thread and have just read your post. You are so eloquent and perceptive. Beautifully said.


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## RCKNROB (Nov 27, 2007)

I spelled John Mayers name wrong. wuups


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## JanB (Oct 26, 2007)

Suzy, I don't think you have a thing to apologize for!

And Leeann, thanks for reminding us of the lecture. I too saw the video a long time ago and he is an exceptional human being with a lot to teach all of us!


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## Havtahava (Aug 20, 2006)

I'm late to this topic, but wanted to respond to the initial post. Sorry for not replying to all the following comments, but I can't even begin to respond to Sheryl Crowe videos, inspiring lectures, etc. 

This forum is a pretty fabulous place full of some amazing people.

It was obvious to me that everyone wanted to help that puppy, and it's sad that there were so many feelings hurt over it. That happens so often online. (I've been running a message board since 1998, and my main haunt [another forum] has over 6000 members and allows politics, religion, and anything else, so you can imagine the controversies that come up there.)

At any rate, I am sorry that I couldn't share the details of what I knew, but it wasn't my place. When people tell me things, it is important to me that it stays here and doesn't go elsewhere unless I have permission. As I got that [permission], I shared some of it and hoped that would be enough. I don't want to beat a dead horse and I can only hope that everyone will understand with all that I had going on that week I was also only trying to do the best I could to help that puppy find a home.

I always try to remain respectful of everyone on this forum but I am sure with the amount of posts I do make, something has been or will be taken the wrong way. If anyone ever feels I am not respectful of them, please do not be afraid to contact me directly and privately so it can be resolved.


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## mckennasedona (Feb 20, 2007)

Wow, I go away for a week and come back to some interesting threads. (Took the girls to the Grand Canyon, among other places).
I'll add my apologies if anything I said on the "puppy" thread was taken wrong. My only thoughts were for that little puppy at the time. I still think of her and hope that she is thriving and happy. 
I love this forum and I truly appreciate EVERYONE who participates. I'm so glad to see Kara and Amy, Laurie and Michele and everyone else who has taken a break. I think our love for Havanese shines through. They are what bring us together.


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## JASHavanese (Apr 24, 2007)

Well heck, I got busy with life and hav things and missed all the bad stuff. What a great time to be busy!
Sometimes it pays to be a forum ditz. I wouldn't even know how to find the thread in question. This ditz hat isn't so bad after all! :biggrin1:
A flat screen with words on it can be hard to understand at times. We don't see the persons face or hear their tone of voice so it's really hard to judge some things said. I remember having this 'really nice' person at my house from another forum and she got on my computer to post to that forum and spoke her post out loud as she typed it. Holy cow, the sarcasm in her voice sent chills down my spine but to read what she said looked so sweet. I learned a lot that day just watching her.
That said, I really think most people are nice and want to care about others


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